Revisiting the 2004 NBA Finals, Lakers Vs. Pistons What Happened?

Was devean george not the whackest starter ever? I know dude was looking at the starting line ups every game like "damn i suck". 4 hof'ers , one scrub.
 
dang...watching that video.....i miss old #8 so bad man. and that hairline!!!!
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was that Doc talkin??
 
basically the lakers had so much drama within the team because of shaq and kobe. then malone had a nagging knee (i think) injury. and then the pistons were hungry and got along as a team. basically it was the lakers championship to lose and the pistons to steal it
 
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[font=Arial, Helvetica, sans-serif]Kobe was gunning for Finals MVP that year, but shot a horrible percentage(38%)and took way too many bad shots with Prince playing great Defense. Outside of the clutch shot he hit in Game 2, he was off the entire series. IMO that's the top reason The Lakers lost as you could tell he and Shaq weren't on the same page, and no role players (other than Walton in Game 2) stepped up. Losing Malone was a big factor as well. [/font]
Pistons played Great though, gotta give them credit. Chauncey Billups just picked The Lakers apart
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[font=Arial, Helvetica, sans-serif]ding ding ding! kobe wanted finals MVP so bad.....shaq had a great series despite kobe chucking up shots left and right.......explain how the great kobe got out played by rip and billups?  dude had his worst series of his career.......put MJ at is worst on that lakers team no way they lose[/font]
 
Originally Posted by thejrob

That series was when every Laker fan should've known that there was only one option:

KEEP KOBE

dude got left hangin by that whole squad including Shaq and is the only reason we won 1 game
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Wow, this is so backwards. 
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Shaq averaged 27 and 11 and shot 63% in that series. He was abusing Ben Wallace, who had one of the greatest defensive seasons ever, and anyone else who tried to guard him.

Kobe took 29 more shots than Shaq despite shooting just 38% in the series. He was blatantly gunning for the Finals MVP and it ended up costing them.
 
Originally Posted by thejrob

That series was when every Laker fan should've known that there was only one option:

KEEP KOBE

dude got left hangin by that whole squad including Shaq and is the only reason we won 1 game
Kobe was only chosen over Shaq because he was younger and Shaq was asking for too much money. You really think Dr. Buss would have chosen Kobe over Shaq if Shaq was 26 and not on the wrong of 32? Kobe may have won us 1 game but he lost us the series, dude was straight chucking out there. Even Lakers fans during that series were
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wondering why Kobe decided to play hero ball on the biggest stage only to fail miserably. Shaq played well but not his dominant self but Kobe was *@*$$@$ horrible outside of game 2. There were periods where it looked like he was playing 1 v 5 out there on the offensive end. A lot of things can be blamed for the Lakers' collapse, Pistons peaking, Malone hurt, GP showing his age but Kobe was the main reason we got smoked that series.
 
Really not that complicated even though I was shocked at the time. Malone was hobbled and Grant went down as well, so as others have said we were decimated at PF. Shaq flat refused to step out on screen and rolls, and him and Kobe were feuding. Tayshaun Prince did a tremendous job defending Kobe and gave him trouble with his wingspan and Kobe settled for difficult shots as usual against great D. I believe he shot 35-37% for the series.

If Malone wasn't injured and everybody was getting along I think it would have been a much more entertaining series, though I'm still not sure the Lakers would have won given the matchup issues with Tayshaun on Kobe and Shaq's staunch refusal to play D.
 
Originally Posted by Krazyrodzilla

Originally Posted by ChipToothSmile

From what I remember. Billups killed lakes. Payton couldnt stop him. Malones injury. It would of been a sweep if it weren't for Kobes buzzer beater.

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@ Luke Walton being on the court with the game on the line. Who fouled out for that to happen?

That was a good play with that much time left and knowing LAL had to take a 3, DET probably wins if they don't switch. Should've just doubled Kobe once he took it that far out from the 3pt line.
 
Originally Posted by CAFinest23

Man to this day I hate the Pistons for that. My father is a Pistons fan and every time I talk about the Lakers he says "Well in the Finals we are undefeated against the Lakers." And I have no come back because it's the truth.

your pops must've never told you about the 1988 finals
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   next time you talk basketball with him bring that up.

regarding this series it was a combination of things, and as a Laker fan I don't like making excuses for it because the Pistons earned that title. Perhaps the Lakers win if Kobe and Shaq get along and perhaps they win if Karl Malone is healthy but seeing how the Pistons spanked them in games 1,3, and 5  they pulled away late in game 4, and the Lakers were a miracle Kobe 3 from being swept I have my reasons to think the Pistons win regardless.

they were playing their best basketball at the right time and defensively shut down a real good Pacers team in the ECF, they really came together at the right time and peaked at the best possible time. Milwaukee played em tough for a 7 seed in round 1, and the Nets had their chance to close Detroit out in 6, after the Nets blew that game 6 up 3-2, Detroit coasted the rest of the way to a title, and a dyfunctional Laker team was the perfect matchup in the Finals.

they should've went to Shaq more, but 2004 Ben Wallace was no slouch defensively and while Shaq was still dominant, he wasn't has dominant as he was during 2000-02,  his slow decline between 04-05 to 06-07 shows he was starting to decline even though it wasn't as evident in 2004

kobe was acting like a douche and so was shaq between their back and forth drama all season long where both parties goofed.

outside of Kobe, Shaq, Malone, and Payton those Lakers really didn't have anyone while that Pistons team was deep.

sad thing is that I thought after Fisher hit 0.4 and the Lakers dethroned the Spurs and avenged their 2003 loss to them that they were for sure going to win the title that year.

looking back though losing in 04 was a blessing in disguise if that's ever the case when you lose in the finals.

Shaq's Laker years will always be appreciated by me but he had a habit of being lazy and not in the best shape. Had they won in 04, it's realistic to believe that his decline would've came faster then it did as he would've got his contract he wanted and had no incentive to come to camp in shape, it took him to be traded to the Heat for him to be motivated to be in shape strictly to try and stick it to the Lakers and even with that, by 05-06 you could tell his best years were behind him. It's sad that he didn't keep in shape as well as he could've because he probably could've prolonged his dominant years had he kept in shape.

It's a shame the Shaq Kobe Lakers couldn't make the transition the Kareem Magic Lakers did with that team making the switch to Magic as the main option as Kareem got older. both Kobe and Shaq wouldn't allow it to happen.  Kobe wanted it to soon, and Shaq's ego wouldn't allow it to happen as Kobe was hitting his peak.

That said, had the Lakers won in 04, I think that's their last title as Shaq stays and declines and the Lakers are in salary cap during Kobes peak years and aren't able to bring in anyone else aside from him and an aging Shaq. Perhaps they make a run in 05 but the Spurs were a great team, the rest of the west was getting better, and the Pistons were a force in the east. they wouldn't have been the dominant Lakers of 2000-02 anymore.

To me they did the perfect rebuilding job, 4 years after trading Shaq they were back in the Finals and 6 years later they were back to back champs
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Kobe/Shaq drama and Malone injury

That's not to say Pistons didn't have a UNBELIEVABLE series, They wanted it more.. Billups, RIP and Sheed were playing at the high level all series

But yea if Malone didn't get hurt.. i think it would've been at least game 7

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Originally Posted by CAFinest23

Man to this day I hate the Pistons for that. My father is a Pistons fan and every time I talk about the Lakers he says "Well in the Finals we are undefeated against the Lakers." And I have no come back because it's the truth.

Your father is a liar
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And Lakers > Piston

Kobe >
 
1. Karl Malone and Gary Payton were old, injured, and pretty much done. But they had major roles in which they failed.

2. Kobe was Kobe

3. They Pistons played D and had better, longer, more hungry players at every position except SG and C. 
 
eam Basketball... Believe it or not the Pistons had the better team

And the Lakers were all kinds of dysfunctional by the finals...

Also Kobe didn't play close to as well as he did the previous 3 titles of the Lakers, his shooting was pretty bad... Shaq defensively was bad, and by bad I mean atrocious.. Malone was hurt... And Gary Payton was 87 years old (his numbers were Derek Fisherian circa 2010 NBA finals).. And after Shaq and Kobe the Lakers didn't have any options.... Pistons 5 guys with 10+ points.. Lakers 2.


Game 3 was pretty pivotal where both Shaq and Kobe stunk it up after they came up big to win Game 2. Pretty much ruined all momentum, killed the Locker room and any chances the Lakers would have had to win.
 
Originally Posted by epox12

Originally Posted by Charles Schwag

2004 Pistons were a fluke. One hit wonder. Got lucky for 1 year.

Similar to the 06 Colts.
I hear a lot of people say this but they went back to the Finals the next year and lost in 7 games. Not a fluke. 
They also made six straight ECF appearances in a row (2003-08). People act like that one title deserves an asterisk because they didn't win a second one. So you have to win multiple titles to not be a fluke? I guess we can toss out Boston's 2008 title as well. I mean, they didn't make the playoffs for two years before the Big Three, won a title, and haven't made it past the second round since.
 
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 My dad has been lying to me all these years. I didn't even know that. I was born in 87' and never bothered to look it up.
 
When he was tearing up the league that year.  Mid 2002 leading up to 2003-2004 season
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From what I remember, I think Payton and Malone had a hard time adjusting to the Triangle.
I remember Fisher and Fox? asked Phil to replace Payton and Malone in the starting 5 during the last few games of the Finals.

Their season was also plagued with injuries.
I think Payton was the only one who played the whole season, so they didn't get enough playing time to get used to the system/each other.

They wouldn't have even passed the 2nd round if it weren't for Fisher's 0.4 shot.
They were a stacked team, but not enough team work and cohesion.
Lakers were more talented but Pistons were the better team, they deserved it.
Yeah, and also Kobe and Shaq just weren't having it with each other
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Originally Posted by dmbrhs

Originally Posted by epox12

Originally Posted by Charles Schwag

2004 Pistons were a fluke. One hit wonder. Got lucky for 1 year.

Similar to the 06 Colts.
I hear a lot of people say this but they went back to the Finals the next year and lost in 7 games. Not a fluke. 
They also made six straight ECF appearances in a row (2003-08). People act like that one title deserves an asterisk because they didn't win a second one. So you have to win multiple titles to not be a fluke? I guess we can toss out Boston's 2008 title as well. I mean, they didn't make the playoffs for two years before the Big Three, won a title, and haven't made it past the second round since.

that Pistons team was legit,  if Rasheed Wallace doesn't let Robert Horry be left wide open in game 5, perhaps they repeat.  If Larry Brown doesn't leave they at least make it to one more finals as well.
 
Pistons deserved it, clearly. I'll tell you this (even tho y'all heard it before) Jordan has never lost a finals. This should be enough for the KB vs MJ comparisons. Stop it already.
 
The series was not lost between Kobe and Shaq. They had their problems, but that wasn't anything new. Lakers lost because of the role players unable to step up. Shaq/Kobe were allowed to be as aggressive as they wanted, efficient or not, without letting the others get into it. Pistons played them perfectly. Malone was injured and that did have an effect. Payton was a non factor all year.
 
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