Baseball Hall of Fame Thread

RyGuy45

RyGuy45

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the hall of fame is a joke.

without him doing what he did, best believe that baseball is on nhl status right now.

the man saved baseball, and this how the salty sportswriters reward him? the sportswriters should be replaced, because they obviously don't know what they're doing. why are they the authority on who gets it the hall anyway? it should be the players who decide who gets into the hall of fame. having the sportswriters do it is beyond dumb. just like the idiot sportswriters who vote on the nba mvp.
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First off, Mac didn't "save baseball" and nor did Ripken during his streak or anyone else. I know that's a popular media term but let's face it, baseball has always been around and the fans come out no matter what black eye baseball is currently going through. So he needs no reward.

Second, IMO the sportswriters (especially baseball) are probably the one group who SHOULD be voting this award. Humans are biased....players are, managers are, everyone.
Writers are salty? About what? Mac being a drug user who was aided in god knows how many of his HRs? If anything you think they would be overly nice to him because he was the big white paul bunyan. And don't think that if the players did the voting that they wouldnt be huddling up with their buddies either. Writers at least do a fairly good job with selections, and I would argue they are often too lenient.

Lastly, what kills Macs case beyond his roid usage, beyond his failing to own up to what he did, and beyond his falling off the face of the earth for the past 3 years is the fact that despite his nearly 600 HRs he also has quite a few flaws on his resume for someone who is an "all timer."

He only has 1,626 career hits.
He owns a career .263 BA.
He struck out every 3.87 ABs
He has a career .217 postseason BA in 42 career games.

That is all not to say Mac's numbers are not hall-worthy, rather it only aids in him not being there. He's not Bonds.
 
Jim Rice fell short again...
indifferent.gif

Big Mac too
roll.gif

The goose made it tho.
 
being that the other thread is locked.....


[table][tr][td]RyGuy45[/td] [td]
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Posts: 10299

01/08/08 4:20 PM
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the hall of fame is a joke.

without him doing what he did, best believe that baseball is on nhl status right now.

the man saved baseball, and this how the salty sportswriters reward him? the sportswriters should be replaced, because they obviously don't know what they're doing. why are they the authority on who gets it the hall anyway? it should be the players who decide who gets into the hall of fame. having the sportswriters do it is beyond dumb. just like the idiot sportswriters who vote on the nba mvp.
Click to expand...

First off, Mac didn't "save baseball" and nor did Ripken during his streak or anyone else. I know that's a popular media term but let's face it, baseball has always been around and the fans come out no matter what black eye baseball is currently going through. So he needs no reward.

Second, IMO the sportswriters (especially baseball) are probably the one group who SHOULD be voting this award. Humans are biased....players are, managers are, everyone.
Writers are salty? About what? Mac being a drug user who was aided in god knows how many of his HRs? If anything you think they would be overly nice to him because he was the big white paul bunyan. And don't think that if the players did the voting that they wouldnt be huddling up with their buddies either. Writers at least do a fairly good job with selections, and I would argue they are often too lenient.

Lastly, what kills Macs case beyond his roid usage, beyond his failing to own up to what he did, and beyond his falling off the face of the earth for the past 3 years is the fact that despite his nearly 600 HRs he also has quite a few flaws on his resume for someone who is an "all timer."

He only has 1,626 career hits.
He owns a career .263 BA.
He struck out every 3.87 ABs
He has a career .217 postseason BA in 42 career games.

That is all not to say Mac's numbers are not hall-worthy, rather it only aids in him not being there. He's not Bonds.
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i still think that if he doesn't hit number 62, baseball is on nhl status. seriously. it would be on life support.

these are the same sportswriters who have never unanimously voted anyone into the hall of fame, and the same ones who aren't letting andre dawson in.

you bring up good stuff, but i think just because of 73 he should be in the hall. but he's not getting in. do you really think that they're going tolet barry is going to get in? i don't. at least not for awhile.
 
^ I hear you no doubt.

Ive just always been a believer that the fans come out. It's not about "MLB" its about baseball. Being outside. Going to games with your kids orparents. America's pastime. Etc. And that's why fans show up, that's why in an age where the MLB is almost a laughingstock we still have recordnumber of people attending games. They just love baseball. In my view Mac didnt save it. But that's just my view.

I agree there are writers who probably are laughable. And no they have not voted anyone in at 100% of the vote. But I think overall, as a whole group, they areprobably worthy of their situation. Every group is going to have their bias.

Do I feel Bonds is getting in? I did at one point last year even, but now with this trial Im not sure. However I have heard more than one voter stateBonds' numbers are, a) so large he almost has to be in, and b) HOF-worthy before he even started with the roids. So I expect many to be voting for him.Maybe not right away but in due time.

And while I would never sit here and state Dawson should no way be in the HOF, you can't really assume it's such a no brainer that he should be in.Numbers are only part of the story but let's face it, he only had three seasons where he hit 30HRs, and four seasons where he had 100RBIs. Yes he has hisawards and certain numbers. But I dont think sportswriters should be blasted for not putting him at the top tier so far. To me he is in that Jack Morris, DonMattingly, Alan Trammel group. Nice, all star players in their day...but not Hall of Fame.

I did hear an interesting stat today though....Nolan Ryan is the last starting pitcher to be voted into the Hall based on time he played. That's almost awhole era of starters we are not seeing getting in yet, or ever.
 
I agree with the Sportswriters.

So what Big Mac hit 62?

His career... which is comprised of more than 1, 2, or even 3 good seasons... is not HOF worthy.

Switch sports*: someone has no championships, 2 scoring titles (including one year where he averages 43ppg), one 81 point game... and that's really all(except for like 8 or 9 All Star games). Do you consider that HOF worthy?

I don't. No way. It's a nice career, but not the BEST... of the BEST.

*I know people love to say, "Terrible argument. Basketball isn't the same as baseball." Anyone ready to type something like that: exercise yourability to see alternate comparisons, and realize it's not meant to be a literal parallel. So don't make it one.

*edit* Alright, I forgot about McGwire the Athletic. 'Cardinal' sin, I know... but it still doesn't change the gist of my argument. His numbersaren't strong enough to get him in on stats alone, a 62-HR season, and a championship.
 
Originally Posted by RyGuy45

^ I hear you no doubt.

Ive just always been a believer that the fans come out. It's not about "MLB" its about baseball. Being outside. Going to games with your kids or parents. America's pastime. Etc. And that's why fans show up, that's why in an age where the MLB is almost a laughingstock we still have record number of people attending games. They just love baseball. In my view Mac didnt save it. But that's just my view.
Click to expand...

Hardcore baseball fans cannot support MLB baseball alone financially. Period.

The homerun race brought all the casual fans back and in turn brought back 'Baseball' as a form of entertainment.

It's not just a game. They saved the BUSINESS of baseball.
Most of these fans don't give a crap about steroids and the purity of the game. They just want to be entertained. But they're the same peoplethat allow your local sports cable channel to broadcast every game on television. They're the same people that force local retailers to hold your favoriteteam's apparel.

Face it. You know you can't change the channel from a Barry Bonds at-bat. Steroids or not, you just want to either see him strike out or blast one intoMcCovey Cove. Love or hate, you're still watching.
 
Originally Posted by 23ska909red02

ore than 1, 2, or even 3 good seasons... is not HOF worthy.

Switch sports*: someone has no championships, 2 scoring titles (including one year where he averages 43ppg), one 81 point game... and that's really all (except for like 8 or 9 All Star games). Do you consider that HOF worthy?
Click to expand...

well what's his career ppg?

and did he get an MVP that year he avg. 43ppg? I dont see how he couldnt.

If he did get that MVP and his career ppg is like 27 then yea, you have yourself a HOFer
 
It's the Hall of Fame....not the Hall of Very Good. I don't think anyone in this years class really deserved to get in IMO.
 
^ In one line, that's basically what I was trying to say; it's not the Hall of Very Good.
 
its also not the hall of greatness.

its the hall of fame which means means a completely different thing.

but i dont think juice mcgwire should ever get in.
 
Originally Posted by Bastitch

Originally Posted by RyGuy45

^ I hear you no doubt.

Ive just always been a believer that the fans come out. It's not about "MLB" its about baseball. Being outside. Going to games with your kids or parents. America's pastime. Etc. And that's why fans show up, that's why in an age where the MLB is almost a laughingstock we still have record number of people attending games. They just love baseball. In my view Mac didnt save it. But that's just my view.
Click to expand...

Hardcore baseball fans cannot support MLB baseball alone financially. Period.

The homerun race brought all the casual fans back and in turn brought back 'Baseball' as a form of entertainment.

It's not just a game. They saved the BUSINESS of baseball.
Most of these fans don't give a crap about steroids and the purity of the game. They just want to be entertained. But they're the same people that allow your local sports cable channel to broadcast every game on television. They're the same people that force local retailers to hold your favorite team's apparel.

Face it. You know you can't change the channel from a Barry Bonds at-bat. Steroids or not, you just want to either see him strike out or blast one into McCovey Cove. Love or hate, you're still watching.
Click to expand...

Real-Talk.

laugh.gif
@ Goose getting in, they are scraping the bottom of the barrel.
 
serious question.....are kurt warner and steve nash hall of famers?

seriously?

warner won 2 mvps, a super bowl, and a super bowl mvp. however, i doubt that he's getting in because the rest of his career is pedestrian. nash has twomvps, and i KNOW that he's getting in. probably first ballot.

whatever though, i don't think the validation means as much as it once did. hall fame or not, you can't deny what he did, and that's what reallymatters.
 
^ He's not talking about NBA or NFL; he's making a point about the mockery that is MLB HOF, and he's using a couple examples from other sports tobuild his point.

Nothing wrong with that. I did it earlier. Actually, he's probably responding to me doing it earlier.
 
Apples and Oranges, the NFL and NBA's Hall of Fame isn't a "good ol' boys" club. Plus this thread wasn't about comparing sports, youturned it into that.
 
^ Actually, no offense, but that's pretty simple-minded. of you to see the discussion as a comparison.

Like I already mentioned earlier:
I know people love to say, "Terrible argument. Basketball isn't the same as baseball." Anyone ready to type something like that: exercise your ability to see alternate comparisons, and realize it's not meant to be a literal parallel. So don't make it one.
Switching venues is common in any debate; that doesn't mean topics are changing, or that the new venue being discussed is meant to be acomparison. No one said, "See, this is just like the NBA, where they do this." That's... a comparison. But saying,"Let me switch gears. Take Warner, for example. See how he's getting robbed? That's a tragedy, right? He's not getting the credit he deserves,but someone like Nash, we all know he's going to be a first ballot-er. Take that same dynamic, and see if it fits in the MLB's current HOF.Discuss," is not a comparison at all.

At all.

If you don't know that or can't see that, all I can suggest is that you step your debate game up. Because it's not a comparison, and seeing it asone is pretty simple-minded.
wink.gif


switching venues to make a point =/= comparing the current venue with the new venue
Click to expand...
 
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