Official 2014-15 Memphis Grizzlies Season Thread: 26-11, Grizz Acquire Jeff Green from Boston

[pmatic]

Good win tonight. But why didn't memphis foul tp9 before he get the ball up the court in those dying seconds of the 4th

Because Lionel Hollins trusts his gut before math equations.

 

[memphisboi55]

Making dumb plays.

Rudy getting ripped when tony wide open..

Conley 5 seconds



Lord. The hell is up with my team!

Was up 17 against the Bulls , how we end up in OT



Got a Win.. a ugly one, but a win.

 

[bhzmafia14]

The only bench players I trust are Q and DA. Q is out for at least another 2 weeks, so yea

Memphis needs to find a way to upgrade their starting SG position without moving a starter, if they are serious about contending. There are multiple reasons why our offense has been so bad, but one fix could be adding an average two way player next to Conley and bring TA off the bench. Pondexter would actually be a nice fit in the starting lineup, but then we would have no true SF backing up Rudy.

So, that's one of the problems. The other problems deal with 8 out of top 10 players shooting career low %'s from the field, since their rookie year. The next problem is Conley/Bayless over dribbling again and not executing the offense fast enough. It may have to deal with some people not knowing the plays. From what I've heard several times, Lionel tells the team to push the pace constantly, shoot the ball when open, etc. Yet, we do the same **** every time. We are not taking enough 3's, we are holding the ball til the shot clock gets in the red and we are not taking open shots.

There is an easy stretch coming up with the next 20 games. 15 of our next 20 are against non playoff teams. Memphis needs to take advantage and find a way to improve their weakest position on offense rather than trying to mess the team up RIGHT now.

 

[memphisboi55]

No use making trades and ish for less caliber players and draft picks right now. Just let the season ride out and do that in the summer.

 

[memphisboi55]

Lost Speights, Wayne and Selby and a 1st round pick for some no name random bum.



:x


Makes me want to cancel my nba channel subscription.

We going backwards, spent all summer to find a shooter to just give him away.

We may nake 2nd round, if that in playoffs.

 

[memphisboi55]

Looking good so far against Lakers

 

[memphisboi55]

Z.Bo making all-star team

 

[memphisboi55]

Grinding out a W against Philly

 

[Ruck13]

Guess I'll need a new avy..Rudy and Juice...gone

 

[bhzmafia14]

Several articles talking about the trade...

http://accuscore.com/sports-betting-system/nba-analysis/rudy-gay-trade-impact?ref=twt

Recently hired John Hollinger was tasked with saving the team money and avoiding the luxury tax. He accomplished this earlier in January with a minor trade, but still went through with sending away Gay and his $16+ million yearly contract. The simulations show that Memphis made improvements as well to their roster, and should be able to easily replace the production lost through the additions of Prince, Daye, and Davis.

Gay is shooting a career-low 40.8 percent from the field this year, and was not living up to his hefty contract which is ultimately the reason he was shipped out. The trade rumors may not have been helping his mental state, but the bottom line is that he has not been producing on the court and the Grizzlies save plenty of cash in this deal.

From Insider:

The Memphis Grizzlies' longest-tenured player in franchise history is moving on.
As reported by ESPN's Marc Stein, the Grizzlies have agreed upon a deal that will send small forward Rudy Gay and backup center Hamed Haddadi to the Toronto Raptors in exchange for point guard Jose Calderon and power forward Ed Davis, according to league sources. Calderon will be sent to Detroit for forwards Tayshaun Prince and Austin Daye. The Grizzlies are also said to be receiving a second-round pick from Toronto.
How did each team do? Here are the grades.

Toronto Raptors: C-



Toronto general manager Bryan Colangelo must really, really like Haddadi. That's the immediate reaction to the Raptors sending their starting point guard and a promising young forward in exchange for one of the least productive "max contract" players in the league.
Gay remains the "Exhibit A" counterexample to the argument thatLeBron James is all athleticism and zero skill. A freak athlete, Gay scrapes the rafters on dunks, but he's not a reliable shooter, doesn't move the needle defensively and doesn't attack the rim like someone at his level of athleticism.
And at 26, this is pretty much what we're going to get.
Advanced stats are pretty "meh" on Gay. His player efficiency rating this season is a slightly below-average 14.3, but he's being paid like someone rated in the 20s. However, his numbers aren't just lukewarm by the standards of current Memphis VP of Basketball Ops and former ESPN Insider John Hollinger's metrics. Regularized adjusted-plus minus (RAPM) considers Gay to be an average player in the league and ESPN Insider Kevin Pelton's system sees Gay as being worth just 1.2 wins above replacement (WARP) this season, despite playing almost 36.7 minutes per game.
(It's worth pointing out that Davis, whom Colangelo sent to Memphis, has been worth twice as many wins this season -- 2.5 WARP -- than Gay in significantly less playing time.)



More From ESPN.com

Among Henry Abbott's six thoughts, he sees the Griz trade as not a franchise blowing up a contender, but one avoiding financial ruin. TrueHoop
• Grading the trade | 5-on-5
• SportsNation: Who Won The Trade?

It's no surprise that Colangelo targeted Gay, seeing how the Raptors' decision-maker debated whether to draft Gay or Andrea Bargnani No. 1 overall in the 2006 draft, as mentioned in Chad Ford's chat on Wednesday. Now he has both on his squad, and that's probably not a good thing.
In Colangelo's defense, this could be seen as a buy-low opportunity, since Gay has been shooting well below his career rate this season. Perhaps all Gay needs is a change of scenery after hearing his name swirl in trade rumors for most of the season. Raptors fans may not want to hear this but if you put Michael Beasley and Gay's per-minute numbers next to each other, you'll barely be able to tell the difference outside the turnover column.
Looking ahead, the Raptors likely will have about $54 million wrapped up in Gay, Bargnani,Landry Fields, DeMar DeRozan and Amir Johnson for 2014-15. Neither of those five players are good bets to sniff the All-Star team any time soon so big picture, it's hard to see the Raptors climbing out of the lottery anytime soon.
Still, you'd like to see more return for Calderon and Davis than a high-volume shooter who scores just 17.2 points per game.





Memphis Grizzlies: B



Though a potential Gay deal has been whispered about for weeks, this still comes as something of a surprise. The Grizzlies executed a deal last week to shed enough payroll to stay under the luxury tax for this season, which seemed to make Gay a safe bet to stick around through the trade deadline.
Apparently, the luxury tax penalties going forward for the small-market Grizzlies organization were prohibitive enough that the revamped front office decided they must move Gay's big-time salary now rather than risk fielding lesser offers this summer.
It's a pretty big leap of faith by the Grizzlies since we just don't really know what life is like without Gay around. With 631 minutes together, the Grizzlies' starting lineup with Gay, Mike Conley, Tony Allen, Zach Randolph and Marc Gasol is the fourth most-played 5-man lineup in the NBA. And they've won by 8.3 points every 100 possessions with that lineup, so they've seen great results.
But Tayshaun Prince, 32, should fill in nicely as a superior defender and comes at half the cost of Gay over the next two seasons. For a team starving for floor-spacers, Prince is a much more reliable, if less frequent, shooter from 3-point land, hitting 43.4 percent of his tries from downtown this season. But he's not capable of shouldering the scoring load like Gay did, which will put more pressure on Conley to create from the perimeter.
But the real haul here is Davis, who could be a Carl Landry-type player off the bench for Memphis this season and the successor for Randolph down the road. Though considerably raw at age 23, Davis comes cheaply on a rookie deal and is coming into his own in his third season with a 18.1 PER as a promising scorer and rebounder. With Gay leaving and Darrell Arthur's rising presence off the bench, you have to wonder if Randolph's days in Memphis are numbered.
This isn't a home run because it sheds only $8 million next season once Daye's contract expires and the haul doesn't pack enough punch to insert them in the title conversation this season. The Grizzlies needed to upgrade their offense in a big way if they wanted to contend for the title and they received two efficient players in Davis and Prince.
But rest assured, they'll be tested down the stretch without a clear go-to scorer on the perimeter. It feels like Memphis' new regime isn't done dealing.





Detroit Pistons: A-



Calderon's a solid return for Detroit and they did well to unload Prince's swollen contract that will pay him $15 million over the next two seasons. Their depth chart is a little more balanced now with Prince and Daye heading south, freeing up more minutes for veteran wingCorey Maggette and Kyle Singler, who feels more like a 3 than a 2.
As an elite shooter and passer, Calderon has always been a poor man's Steve Nash and should help Detroit's 29th ranking in assist-to-turnover ratio right away (Calderon leads the league in that category).
Calderon is an expiring contract, but doesn't figure to have a long-term home in Detroit with Knight and Rodney Stuckey in the picture through next season. However, Stuckey could be waived in the offseason as he is owed just $4 million of his $8.5 million due in 2013-14. If nothing else, Detroit hopes that Knight can learn a thing or two from Calderon about how to control the ball.
Getting out of Prince's deal should free up some cap space this offseason, but overpaying mid-tier players to come to Detroit is precisly how GM Joe Dumars got into this mess in the first place.

http://www.cbssports.com/nba/blog/e...-land-their-franchise-cornerstone-in-rudy-gay

With the Memphis Grizzlies trading Rudy Gay to Toronto, which sends Jose Calderon to Detroit and Ed Davis to Memphis as the Pistons send Tayshaun Prince and Austin Daye to Memphis, we examine the results for all three teams and grade it out.

Toronto Raptors: C+


Let's pretend we live in a world without money. Where goods and services are just provided for everyone and players are paid in, I don't know, video game points or something. The Raptors just landed the player who will be the best player on their team. Anytime you land the best player in the deal, and gain the best player on your team (given Kyle Lowry's struggles this season), it should be a win, right?

But we don't live in that magical world. Santa Claus is not real, and Rudy Gay makes a mind-blowing amount of money. He's an isolation-heavy wing who isn't a magnificent shooter and hasn't developed a post game. Gay is arguably now the best defender on the Raptors, but given they're the 25th-ranked team in defensive efficiency, we're not saying much. If you want to understand the economic impact of this team, here's one for you.

Rudy Gay plus Landry Fields plus Linas Kleiza plus Terrence Ross equals $96.39 million dollars over the next five years. That's just a huge amount of money for a team like Toronto, which needs to overspend to pull in free agents.

It's mostly that the Raptors spent their best trade chip to get Rudy Gay, which is kind of like breaking open your piggy bank you've been saving for three years to buy the mid-size luxury car.

I like the boldness of making the move, I like the player and his fit with coach Dwane Casey. I like not getting stuck and having to waste Calderon's trade potential. But you just can't look at this move as anything but sideways, unless Gay is able to blow up and live up to his contract. If that happens...



Memphis Grizzlies : A-


There's this perception that what Memphis did was break up a championship contender. Let's be clear. Gay was not what was standing in Memphis' way of a championship. He was a huge part of their success over the past four years. But he was just that, a part, and not nearly a part worth the money that was paid. Year after year, Memphis would hope that this would be the year that Gay would explode, put it all together, push his game further. But it just never came.

And in the meantime, fans turned on him. The 2011 playoff run was the best thing that has ever happened to the franchise, and it is also the worst thing that could have happened to Gay with the fans. No one remembers the lack of a wing creator and defender vs. Oklahoma City, whose presence might have enabled the Grizzlies to shock the world twice in one playoffs. All they remember is that the farthest a Memphis team has ever gone was with Rudy Gay on the shelf. That's not fair to Gay as a player, a teammate, but it's how the perception developed.

This will be overlooked by national voices, and should not. There will be sad fans in Memphis with Gay gone, but there will also be a resolute belief the team is better, just without Gay. That's not necessarily true. We'll have to see how the new pieces work, and it's very much no fault of Gay's. It's just perception.

And had the Grizzlies simply money-dumped him, that might have been the case. Losing Gay's contract isn't really helpful for Memphis in a meaningful way. The Grizzlies still have huge money tied up in Zach Randolph, Mike Conley, and Marc Gasol. This doesn't free them up for big addition. Had they simply tossed him for cap filler, it would have been a loss.

But instead, Memphis got three pieces back which will have an impact for the team.

Ed Davis is the best value player in the deal. He's emerged for the Raptors this season as a versatile forward who can rebound, defend, and attack the basket in sets. The Grizzlies' bench has been a nightmare for years, and was missing a component when Marreese Speights was traded to Cleveland. Davis provides the fourth big along with Darrell Arthur that they need.

Tayshaun Prince's contract made no sense for Detroit when they signed him to it. They were rebuilding, going young. They didn't need his experience or that money on the books. But the Grizzlies instead get a veteran who fits very much into what they do, can produce on the perimeter off the dribble (a key piece they needed to get in return for Gay; the idea that they could just get back shooters and bigs put their system in limbo), and is an excellent defender.

Austin Daye has been a project for years. He's shown some things this year, and while it's unlikely Lionel Hollins can pull anything out of him, we've been wrong on that before, with Speights, Tony Allen, and others.

In all, the Grizzlies got rid of a player who too often ran isolation, had developed a poor relationship with fans through no fault of his own, and whose contract was a gigantic anchor threatening to drown a new ownership group who just had to pay all the expenses of buying a franchise. In return they landed a value big on a rookie contract, a veteran who can space the floor and play defense, and a project wing with potential.

The only reason this isn't an A-plus is because Memphis' success has been based on its locker room chemistry. The Grizzlies play exceptionally well together. What happens when that feeling is disrupted and new personalities are introduced? That uncertainty is all that keeps this from being an all-out win for Memphis.


Detroit Pistons: B


As I said above, Prince made no sense for this team. Lawrence Frank wanted him because a veteran coach never wants a team with nothing but upside. But Prince was not part of the team's long-term future. He was a relic of the past, the leftover from the 2004 championship team. He'll always be a Piston at heart. But Detroit needed to sever ties just to commit to the future.

Calderon can be a mentor to Brandon Knight, something he hasn't had at the point guard spot. He can space the floor and throw lobs to Andre Drummond. His expiring contract gives them flexibility to add to the core next summer, and signals that Detroit is finally, mercifully, ready to move forward with the young core. This is Greg Monroe's team now.

 

[bhzmafia14]

I'm excited about Ed Davis and obviously the front office is too. What's weird is that Hollinger had Davis rated in the 50's a few years ago . I'm assuming he's sees something and wasn't going to do the deal without him included. I know he's tied for 1st in the league at % around the rim at 78%. Prince should fit in very well with the starters and Daye is a wildcard. I'm really not sure what to expect out of him.

 

[memphisboi55]

So we said we had too many bigs, being reason for dropping Speights, just to get Davis..

Davis is a better all around big than Speights,


hope this work out.. we have no wing play. All paint, defense will just clog down the lane and stop us.. hope im wrong.

 

[alphawolf]

Y'all gon regret this trade.

There are no iso player left

 

[bhzmafia14]

So we said we had too many bigs, being reason for dropping Speights, just to get Davis..

Davis is a better all around big than Speights,


hope this work out.. we have no wing play. All paint, defense will just clog down the lane and stop us.. hope im wrong.

Better shooting, better ball movement. I guess we just have to factor in would isolation work well with two all star bigs, or better ball movement and shooting?

 

[lynchpin33]

I was saying a couple of years ago when the Grizz had the deep playoff run that Rudy should have been traded then. I think that it will hurt them now because O.J. is gone as well and there is no perimeter scorer. But, also it was painfully noticeable last year against the Clips when Conley went to the bench the backup point position was TERRIBLE. Hopefully Calderon can help in that regard.

 

[memphisboi55]

I was saying a couple of years ago when the Grizz had the deep playoff run that Rudy should have been traded then. I think that it will hurt them now because O.J. is gone as well and there is no perimeter scorer. But, also it was painfully noticeable last year against the Clips when Conley went to the bench the backup point position was TERRIBLE. Hopefully Calderon can help in that regard.

Calderon ain't staying in Memphis, he is going to the 3rd team... I believe.


We got Bayless balling good now and Wroten finally getting playing time and he hooping.

 

[memphisboi55]

About time ya'll start posting in here again....

 

[bhzmafia14]

About time ya'll start posting in here again....

Grizz have a good amount of perimeter scoring. If Bayless can continue to play his role as being our off guard scorer, he will do just as well as OJ did here. He's already showing signs of that now. Wroten adds much needed playmaking ability for us. We may end up having a better overall oustside shooting team than that 2011 team.

I still want us to add another player though.

 

[bhzmafia14]

It wasn't just Vernon and his followers. Most people in the city don't listen to Chris Vernon. It was primarily Geoff Calkins, who has eviscerated Rudy regularly in the Commercial Appeal for years. Last year's playoffs was an absolute low point for Calkins, who took it upon himself to explain to the world why Rudy was to blame for the Grizzlies losing to the Clippers, despite plenty of evidence to the contrary. Calkins also thought that he could somehow motivate Rudy by talking about how he didn't deserve the salary he was making and hasn't lived up to expectations. And, of course, after this AWFUL trade, Calkins immediately wrote a column defending it as much as he possibly could. Because he's been agitating for this for years, helping create a situation in which people would want to see him gone, and helping depress his trade value.

I'm, honestly, furious at the way this went down. It's fair for people to have their opinions of players, right and wrong, but the city handled this with absolutely no class. And I'm talking about the CITY of Memphis. Us. Our fans, who bought tickets and sat in the arena game after game and b*tched at Rudy for four quarters, win or lose, whether the stuff that was happening was his fault or not. He ALWAYS shouldered an unfair share of the blame, from when he was drafted to when he was traded. And most of that was not his fault. He didn't bring it upon himself with a brash, cocky personality or a selfish attitude. Rudy was always an introvert who stayed out of the limelight, kept to himself and was largely a private public figure. He never made outlandish statements about himself or his abilities, never did anything publicly that could be considered arrogant or be interpreted as entitled. All of that was projected upon him, to the extent that it was, by people who looked at him, saw his god-like physical gifts, and set certain expectations for him, professionally and personally, and got furious when he pulled up for a contested mid-range jumper instead of running some b.s. "offense," whether under Iavaroni (when, yes, people were already ripping Rudy apart habitually) or Hollins (see TrueHoop from this week for an article ripping on Hollins' offense for how terrible it is, alluding to how poorly Rudy was used in the offense). And he just wasn't what people thought he was. He was a better person than that. And he was a humble player who struggled with motivation at times - he was a despised borderline All-Star. Ever seen that before in Memphis? Think we're NOT going to see it again? Wrong. Effing wrong. The next best young player to emerge in a Grizzlies uniform will surely see the same treatment. It's an established pattern now.

People only think this trade is "good," because of the $16.5 million number attached to Rudy that HE NEVER ASKED FOR. Not him, not his agent. Or because they unfairly blame Rudy for all of this TEAMS's shortcomings and would have been willing, as someone else on this board said, to "trade Rudy for a BigMac." And that's pretty much what we did. We didn't get anything back in this trade that really matters UNLESS Ed Davis turns out to be a stud - but how possible does that seem, with him being stuck on the bench behind Zach Randolph? Either Zach Randolph is also getting moved, or we traded Rudy for a bench player. It's ridiculous that guys like Chip Crain are out there with their opinions being published on ESPN saying this trade was good for us. No it wasn't. We drove Rudy out of town. Us. We, the unsatisfied fan base, combined with Heisley paying the guy more money than he wanted, creating a miserable personal situation for Rudy over the past two seasons. We drove one of our two best players out of town (along with a first round draft pick) and got role players in return. And people are calling it "good." Ridiculous.

Ed Davis better be really d*** good.

This was from a poster on the Grizz boards. This is about how I felt about the deal. Rudy was heavily criticized here and I think every "star" player we bring in here will be the same way. It happened with Pau, Rudy and it will happen to the next guy that doesn't fit in with the "blue collred" city.

I agree with most of it, but I don't think the move was necessarily bad for us. Bad timing though

 

[Ruck13]

About time ya'll start posting in here again....

I'm usually on #NT twitter *****ing about the grizz..

Hate to see Rudy go but I think the front office felt they had to make some sort of move to help out financially and unfortunate for Rudy, he had to go. I wouldn't mind picking up Lee or J.J. to help out.

 

[memphisboi55]

New Grizz starting 1-0


Prince gave us just as many points Rudy usually would, but off the bench... but shot well and only needed 11 shots... Rudy would of been 4-17 w/ 15 points, starting.


Rudy shined in T.Dot tonight tho, bittersweet

 

[pmatic]

 

[bhzmafia14]

I'm happy with the Prince addition, but less happy at the fact that Zach Randolph is the only player capable of putting us over the top and he's playing a little above average basketball.

Then, come to find out that Hollins only wants to play about 8 players in his rotation, which means Ed Davis, Austin Daye and Tony Wroten will just rot on the bench. This is why I'm tired of him as the coach and he's probably going to be on his way out this offseason.

There should be no reason why Marc should be playing 37 minutes a night.

 

[pmatic]

I still can't believe the Grizzlies gave up a(nother) first round pick in the Speights trade. If Hollinger was still at ESPN, he would be ripping them. They should have asked for a second round pick back at least since the Cavs have two early second round picks this upcoming draft.

 

[bhzmafia14]

I still can't believe the Grizzlies gave up a(nother) first round pick in the Speights trade. If Hollinger was still at ESPN, he would be ripping them. They should have asked for a second round pick back at least since the Cavs have two early second round picks this upcoming draft.

ikr

At least they got a 2nd round pick in the 3 way deal

From my understanding, they protected the pick very well as they see themselves in the playoffs the next 5 years.