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Washington Wizards 2012-2013 Season Thread - Thanks for a great season! Draft will be held on... - Page 3

Poll Results: Will the Washington Wizards make the playoffs this year?

Poll expired: Oct 31, 2012  
  • 26% (7)
    Yes
  • 73% (19)
    No
26 Total Votes  
post #61 of 1131
^I only came in here cause of that roster link you posted...sick.gifsick.gif my goodness. Juwan at 27, Rip Hamilton (pimp.gif), Christian Laettener, Mitch Richmond, Popeye Jones laugh.gif...wow
Edited by Peep Game - 10/17/12 at 3:13pm
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post #62 of 1131
It was a modern day miracle a 40 year old MJ even got those scrub squads close to .500. Tyrone Nesby.....Tyrone freaking Nesby!? You serious? Jahidi White and Popeye Jones? An old disinterested lackluster Mitch Richmond (Who we traded Chris Webber in his prime for)?


Stop the horror....the memories.
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post #63 of 1131
Webber for Richmond was the worst trade ever. EVER.

(Don't say Kwame for Pau because they got back Little Gasol too)
post #64 of 1131
We can't forget the gem that was the #5 pick (Rubio) for Foye and Miller.
post #65 of 1131
ESPN The Magazine's NBA preview puts the playoff chances at 0%.
post #66 of 1131
Quote:
Originally Posted by JesusShuttlesworth34 View Post

It was a modern day miracle a 40 year old MJ even got those scrub squads close to .500. Tyrone Nesby.....Tyrone freaking Nesby!? You serious? Jahidi White and Popeye Jones? An old disinterested lackluster Mitch Richmond (Who we traded Chris Webber in his prime for)?


Stop the horror....the memories.

GxTnK.gif?t=1344800837

How in the world did that happen???
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post #67 of 1131
Thread Starter 
Quote:
Originally Posted by Peep Game View Post

Quote:
Originally Posted by JesusShuttlesworth34 View Post

It was a modern day miracle a 40 year old MJ even got those scrub squads close to .500. Tyrone Nesby.....Tyrone freaking Nesby!? You serious? Jahidi White and Popeye Jones? An old disinterested lackluster Mitch Richmond (Who we traded Chris Webber in his prime for)?


Stop the horror....the memories.

How in the world did that happen???

 

That was after Webber's arrest in 1998.  

 

The club needed to break up the Howard/Webber duo once their partying became a PR issue and the team failed to meet expectations.  They'd signed Juwan Howard to an impossibly stupid $100 million contract back in '96, after nearly losing him to the Miami Heat.  (The deal had already been signed, but the league invalidated it as a violation of the salary cap.)  Given his production, no team in the league would touch him.  It took years before they were finally able to dump him off on Dallas.  That left Webber as the only player left they could possibly move. 

 

Mitch Richmond was considered one of the best "under the radar" players in the league.  (The guys on NBATV's "Open Court" acknowledged as much in a recent episode.)  MJ himself thought highly of him, and prevailing wisdom held that Richmond would've been a superstar had he only played in a major media market.  He was also a model citizen.  

 

The Wizards' logic - and, granted, it's stupid - was to dump a "knucklehead" and bring in a franchise-caliber player who the organization and the city could be proud of.  The Kings' motivation was obvious, but bear in mind that Webber was still considered something of a risk at that time.  The Kings felt that the dearth of nightlife activities in Sacramento helped minimize that risk, which made them a more eager trade partner than most.  

 

It's impossible to believe that Richmond really was the best deal on the table, as it rarely makes sense to trade big for small, let alone young for old, but this was a very "image conscious" team and bringing in more young kids frightened the club's increasingly-conservative management.  

 

What they did was similar, in spirit, to Portland breaking up the so-called "Jailblazers."  They got worse - much worse - under the rationale that fans would prefer clean-cut losers to "thugs."  (This was only a few years before the NBA instituted its "professional dress requirements" to placate racist fans.)  

 

Everyone knew it was a lopsided trade and the Wizards were roundly lambasted in the press for it, but the local media also flipped out when it seemed the Wizards had lost Howard to the Heat.  (I remember Michael Wilbon, then a journalist, dashed out a particularly indignant rant on the subject for the Washington Post.)  The team was damned if it did and damned if it didn't, and management resigned themselves to failure.  Webber/Howard/Strickland never lived up to their billing, earning only a first round sweep at the hands of the Bulls - and they needed a tie-breaking win against the Cavs in the last game of the regular season to even accomplish that.  Rebuilding was inevitable and they likely wanted to at least have one true pro on the roster to help future picks progress. 

 

It'll go down as one of the worst trades in league history, but it is helpful to place it in its proper context.  It was a bad decision on every level, but it wasn't strictly a basketball decision.  

post #68 of 1131
Ahhhh I didn't even think about Webber and Howard still partying and stuff like they were back in college, and i pretty much had forgot Webber had all those charges against him. Wow, guess that really was a move they had to make no matter what, and still to this day they haven't recovered. Thanks for that info. Looking at some of the other players on that roster along with the years before Webber was traded....George Muresean, Lorenzo Williams, man, these are guys I haven't heard from in years.
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post #69 of 1131
I remember Juwan & C-Webb ran a train on some broad and she tried to claim sexual assault. laugh.gifmean.gif

Case got dropped.
post #70 of 1131
I remember reading all the trouble Webber was getting into in the Washington Post....and I still believe now the same thing I did back then. You keep Webber and get rid of Howard if you have to make a choice. I always liked Webber's game and that's why I rooted for him to win out there in Sacramento.

I thought Wes Unseld and the Wizards front office made a knee jerk reaction. The Lakers didn't trade Kobe when he had his rape case. I know a young unproven Webber is not Kobe Bryant, but I am all for sticking by your players during off the court issues.....or at least waiting for the dust to settle and for the facts to be present.




Don't even get started on the multitude of other dumb decisions the Wizards had made.......

-Stackhouse for Rip Hamilton
-Ben Wallace.......Rasheed Wallace
-Courtney Alexander?



There are reasons I get skeptical with each move. I didn't like the Okafor and Ariza moves last year.....and I don't like them now.
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post #71 of 1131
Quote:
Originally Posted by RDFM View Post

ESPN The Magazine's NBA preview puts the playoff chances at 0%.

that sounds about right
post #72 of 1131
Got tickets to a Heat game in December from work in section 432. IS IT EVEN WORTH GOING WITH THESE SEATS? Never been in the Verizon Center so let me know. Thanks.
post #73 of 1131
Quote:
Originally Posted by jumpmankb View Post

Got tickets to a Heat game in December from work in section 432. IS IT EVEN WORTH GOING WITH THESE SEATS? Never been in the Verizon Center so let me know. Thanks.

Bring your binoculars.
post #74 of 1131
Quote:
Originally Posted by jumpmankb View Post

Got tickets to a Heat game in December from work in section 432. IS IT EVEN WORTH GOING WITH THESE SEATS? Never been in the Verizon Center so let me know. Thanks.

These seats are obviously upper level, but they are also only two sections off center court. What row are you in? You can see decently well from these seats, especially in the lower rows. I'd say it's still worth going.
post #75 of 1131
Thread Starter 
Quote:
Originally Posted by RDFM View Post

Quote:
Originally Posted by jumpmankb View Post

Got tickets to a Heat game in December from work in section 432. IS IT EVEN WORTH GOING WITH THESE SEATS? Never been in the Verizon Center so let me know. Thanks.

These seats are obviously upper level, but they are also only two sections off center court. What row are you in? You can see decently well from these seats, especially in the lower rows. I'd say it's still worth going.

And honestly, the atmosphere in the 400 level during a big game is pretty good.  

 

I usually sit in the lower bowl and there it's 90% corporate.  You'll sit next to idiots on cell phones the entire time, or people who show up midway through the second quarter, don't even follow the game, and are there for no discernible reason. 

 

I've been in second row seats to watch Michael Jordan and I've been in 400 level seats practically up against the wall to see the Heat play, and there's more energy in the 400 level - hands down.  I'm not going to sit here and say I prefer nosebleed seats to floor seats, but I think you'll have a good time. 

post #76 of 1131
Quote:
Originally Posted by jumpmankb View Post

Got tickets to a Heat game in December from work in section 432. IS IT EVEN WORTH GOING WITH THESE SEATS? Never been in the Verizon Center so let me know. Thanks.


I know this may sound cliche, but there really isn't a bad seat in the house at the Verizon Center.


I have sat just about at every level having worked in the Suites Department. From right on the court to Player's Club. I prefer a seat with a slightly elevated vantage point, now the 400's are up there but I have sat there many times and it is cool.



I'll share a story about when I sat there about 10 years ago to see Mike play against Paul Pierce and the Celtics.

There was this one fan/heckler from Boston who was the loudest fan I have ever heard who was just giving it to Mike and the fans around him all night......picture the biggest NT troll and multiply it by a million. He spewed out history of MJ and how he would travel city to city just to see him lose. The Wizards were winning the majority of this back and forth contest and were up by 2 or so at the end of the game. Celtics ball with some time on the clock left. This fan was screaming that everyone in DC would be in tears and that MJ was washed up.....and sure enough Paul Pierce drains a 3 with time expiring and the Celtics win. This arena was crushed and this one fan look like he just climaxed all over the upper level.

The outcome sucked but it was a memorable experience in the 400 level.


Another time folks Miami Heat fans brought brooms when they swept the Wizards in the 2nd round of the playoffs back in 2005.


In short.....go, never turn down tickets.
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post #77 of 1131
To expand on what I said earlier and piggyback on Meth and Shuttlesworth's comments, I too have sat all over the Verizon Center and think you will have fun wherever you sit. I've literally been on the floor and against the wall at the top.

I also couldn't agree more with what Meth said about the difference in atmosphere between the 100 and 400 levels. I think more fans that actually care about the game, are knowledgeable about basketball, and are there to actually watch the world's best players compete vice showing up for the hottest social event in the city that night (granted, a typical Wiz game probably ISN'T the hottest social event in the city nowadays unless the Heat or Lakers are in town) sit in the upper level. Even though Wizards tickets can be found at pretty extreme discounts anymore, close seats are still relatively expensive for a lot of people.

I was in grad school when Jordan signed with the Wizards in September 2001. Now I was a HUGE Jordan fan growing up and I knew I would never have the opportunity to experience Mike in person for a season again and would always think "what if" if I didn't get tickets, so I called right when he made it official and got season tickets. My tickets those two seasons were in section 403. While I got lower level seats for a number of games over those two years, I experienced the majority of the Jordan era from the upper deck and and I thoroughly enjoyed the experience. Honestly seeing all 82 home games of the Jordan era live is something I'll never forget, even if the on-court results were disappointing and he missed a handful of those games due to injury, distance from the action notwithstanding.

After the Wizards fired Michael and him leaving the Verizon Center garage in his SL with a scowl on his face was on the cover of nearly every newspaper in the country, I swore I'd never give the Wizards another dime. However, they had my money for the playoffs that never were in 2003 and that money could only be applied as a credit, not refunded. It's not like I could resist NBA basketball anyway and, long story short, I never ended up cancelling my tickets. I am at a fairly low row in the lower level now and, while the view sure as heck beats my seats in 403, it will actually be the upper level seats that will always be more nostaglic for me. Most of this is because that's where I experienced the Jordan years, but what Meth says about the fans in the lower level cannot be more true. It is clearly people that got tickets through work and don't care about basketball more often than not. Most people around you don't know any of the players' names outside the stars. People routinely get up and leave with five minutes to go in tied games. The people next to me have had their seats for years, but show up in the second quater and leave in the third more often than not when they bother to show up at all. And, since I can't make every game nowadays, what I'm seeing is generally the fans' behavior and experiences for the more desirable half of the schedule. It's even worse when they're playing the Bucks or Bobcats on a randon Tuesday or Wednesday night in February.


.
post #78 of 1131
yea the the rock was the man in sac but was 33 when he went to washington. but at the time webber was my favorite player. it killed me when the warriors traded him to the bullets for wally cleaver. i was so excited that i could see webber play live again even though it was with the kings laugh.gif

good lord air max cw while he was on the bullets. damn those kicks were the biz

in a world where guys like derek rose say they care about the community and kids killing kids atleast a guy like webber stood for what he believed in and left nike because he wasnt having it with the the price tag on his kicks
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post #79 of 1131
Im liking the history lesson taught in here
post #80 of 1131

WIZARDSpimp.gif

post #81 of 1131
glad i came in this thread, can't wait for the season to begin
post #82 of 1131
Quote:
Originally Posted by hypebeast5 View Post

Im liking hating the history lesson taught in here

Fixed.

Bad times, man.

Anyway, Trevor Booker looked good from what I saw of the preseason game yesterday. Seems to have developed offensively, but we'll see.
post #83 of 1131
Ha....I remember that picture of MJ dipping out of the Verizon Center in the Green AMG looking heated. He had that Denzel look in training day when he realized Jake wasn't giving him the money.


The buzz was something else when MJ was there.....the immense amount of hatred for DC Jordan has is unreal.
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post #84 of 1131
I'm gonna be in section F guys.
post #85 of 1131
Thread Starter 

Well, the preseason certainly ended on a sour note.  Beal logged his worst game as a pro:  zero points (0-6 from two, 0-2 from three, no FTA), one assist, one rebound, three fouls, and two turnovers in 19 minutes.  The rest of the team didn't look much better.  Thankfully, we can put all of that behind us now and wipe the slate clean heading into Tuesday's season opener against the hated Cavs.

 

I think AJ Price earned the starting nod, but who knows what Wittman's thinking for positions 2-4?  Ariza did absolutely nothing to earn a starting spot.  Webster certainly outplayed him, and received more minutes than Singleton in recent games.  Booker played well at times, so you  probably have to consider him the favorite to open the year at power forward until Nene gets back.  As sick as I am of Crawford's streak shooting, it's entirely possible that he'll be named the starting 2 on opening night, and they're more likely to try and wedge him into the point spot than they are to replace him with Beal outright.  

 

IF that were the case, we'd be starting:

 

Okafor

Booker

Webster

Crawford
Price

 

which is a lineup that strikes fear into the hearts of precisely no one.  

 

It could be a rough start until Wall and Nene get back. 

 

 

Quote:
Originally Posted by JesusShuttlesworth34 View Post

Ha....I remember that picture of MJ dipping out of the Verizon Center in the Green AMG looking heated. He had that Denzel look in training day when he realized Jake wasn't giving him the money.


The buzz was something else when MJ was there.....the immense amount of hatred for DC Jordan has is unreal.

 

1000

 

I'm still heated that they never retired #23.  MIAMI retired #23 for crying out loud. 

 

No class.  Jordan accepted a MINIMUM salary and donated it to charity.  He had to sell his shares of the team in order to do it.  That's how this organization repaid him?  

 

And Ted Leonsis - the guy who convinced MJ to become the president of basketball operations to begin with - is now the only one preventing the team from raising MJ's jersey to the rafters where it belongs.  There's no Abe Pollin to blame for the whole thing anymore.  He had the chance to at least TRY to salvage a little dignity for the organization and show respect to the greatest ever to play the game.  He didn't.

 

You wonder why players have no respect for this franchise.  If that's how they treat MJ, what do you think they'll do to you? 

post #86 of 1131
Didn't see anything posted, but both Shelvin Mack and Brian Cook were cut.

Final 15 per BF
Quote:
Here is your final 15-man roster.

John Wall
Nene
Emeka Okafor
Trevor Ariza
Bradley Beal
Kevin Seraphin
Trevor Booker
Jordan Crawford
Jan Vesely
Chris Singleton
Martell Webster
A.J. Price
Cartier Martin
Jannero Pargo
Earl Barron

Link


And the case for why Martell Webster should start over Trevor Ariza
Quote:
It really shouldn't be that hard of a decision for Randy Wittman to list Martell Webster's name on the starting lineup card for Tuesday's season opener against the Cleveland Cavaliers. That it is speaks to the politics of the league, where bigger salaries, psychology and management's hopes dictate lineup decisions more than merit. Still, if we're basing this decision solely on merit, Webster has earned the starting job over Trevor Ariza.

And if Wittman is serious about his talk of a meritocracy, he should give Webster what he deserves.

To be fair to Ariza, much of this is due to Webster balling out. Friend of the blog Kevin Broom, an analytics guy who once ran numbers for the team in a consulting role, noted that, in his system, Webster's preseason production was on par with LeBron James' regular-season production. There's no way Webster keeps that up in the regular season, but it does speak to just how well he played. He was also much better than I expected defensively, and while I'd still rate Ariza higher on that end, Webster did more to make up the gap than I expected.

Link
post #87 of 1131
Team is pathetic
post #88 of 1131
I feel if we were healthy this game would be a completely different story we are shooting like straight crap mean.gif
post #89 of 1131
How the hell we let this scrub varejoa grab 22 boards SMH this is gonna be a long season
post #90 of 1131
Quote:
Originally Posted by hypebeast5 View Post

How the hell we let this scrub varejoa grab 22 boards SMH this is gonna be a long season

He's not a bad player. As a matter of fact, I think he's very underrated.

For the game, I'm not too upset. This team was missing 3 of it's best players and stayed reasonably competitive. We need the horses back in the lineup. Also, both Price/Pargo HAVE to be better.
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