Official DragonBall Z Thread. R.I.P Akira Toriyama. You will be missed

[jays25]

So is it...


King of All

Whis Family

Gods of Destruction

Hit / SSG Goku / SSG Vegeta

Golden Freeza

Buu

Kai'oshins

Imo. Put some respek on their name, especially my man Vegeta.

Plus Hit mentioned that he had no one to help him improve in his Universe, so technically his power level is stagnant. Goku should exceed him quickly and they've pitched fairly often Goku = Vegeta.

Tried to add a new line to the spoiler but couldn't; Gotenks should be above Buu and fusion can definitely wash the Kai's.

Well of course, since the Kais are trash Super has honestly just made them look even worse with the Gods of Destruction coming into play. Now we know its not that all Gods are trash in Dragon Ball. It's just specifically the Kais

Agreed that we could throw Gotenks in above Buu. But then we could also throw Vegito in above a few people as well, especially with the amazing boost he'd get from SSG and SSB.

 

[Top Boy]

That was only because of the Kaio Ken x God power up. Will admit, Vegeta has no answer for that and off the boost from that alone Goku > Vegeta if he used it. 

But Whis and Beerus have already stated that Vegeta = Goku multiple times, even remembering them mention Vegeta was slightly ahead at times.

Manga explained why Vegeta got washed by Hit, alongside the obvious of having no clue what Time Skip was.

 Agreed that we could throw Gotenks in above Buu. But then we could also throw Vegito in above a few people as well, especially with the amazing boost he'd get from SSG and SSB.

I only consider Gotenks as his own entity because Goten and Trunks are still nonfactors.

And Vegeta said he'd never do the fusion again, but that usually changes in a pinch

 

[everysingletime]

Even before the Kaio Ken x ssb power up, Goku lasted way longer against Hit then Vegeta did. Goku is just a better fighter. Maybe Whiz and Beerus mean to say that their potential is the same. But Goku is doing more with his.

 

[Top Boy]

That's because Goku was tipped off about time skip before his fight even began and also got to analyze what he could from Hit's fight with Vegeta.

Vegeta going SSB fighting the mini-Saiyan also weakened his SSB against Hit.

Spoiler: Warning: Spoiler!

I got that heat for you b

Put some respek on the Prince's name

 

[everysingletime]

The mini Saiyan weakened Vegeta?

LOL he spent most of that fight training his opponent so he can go super saiyan!

Vegeta going ssb that fight meant nothing.

Goku is just better. He's always been one step ahead. That's not even arguable. That's just fact.

 

[thekid3456]

The mini Saiyan weakened Vegeta?

LOL he spent most of that fight training his opponent so he can go super saiyan!

Vegeta going ssb that fight meant nothing.

Goku is just better. He's always been one step ahead. That's not even arguable. That's just fact.

This is how I know you do not watch dragon ball super. It was clearly stated that transforming ssjb drains a lot of your energy. It was stated that Vegeta would of beat hit if he didn't fight 3x in a row. He was tired and exhausted. Which is why ssjb is only used in die hard situations.

 

[thekid3456]

This is how I know you do not watch dragon ball super. It was clearly stated that transforming ssjb drains a lot of your energy. It was stated that Vegeta would of beat hit if he didn't fight 3x in a row. He was tired and exhausted. Which is why ssjb is only used in die hard situations.

My post was for amel223

 

[Top Boy]

The mini Saiyan weakened Vegeta?

LOL he spent most of that fight training his opponent so he can go super saiyan!

Vegeta going ssb that fight meant nothing.

Goku is just better. He's always been one step ahead. That's not even arguable. That's just fact.

They wanted to delete my screenshot to spare you the ether

You know what I said to they? Not today

I dont want to hear one ounce of disrespek towards Vegeta

Spoiler: Warning: Spoiler!

 

[Chill Bill]

Jay  Patt with the Screenshot Ether.

 

[thekid3456]

Thank you Jay Patt. You proved my statement with that screenshot. People like you and me know dragon ball.

 

[frenchbreadbuilds]

 

[everysingletime]

If that's the case then Vegeta was dumb as hell to go ssb against the kid. Guess he just likes taking L's.

I do watch DragonBall super. I even remember Whiz lecturing Vegeta on some 'Do you know why Goku is always your better? Because you think too much. You're too tense.' or something to that effect. Sorry I don't have a screenshot for that scene. *smirks

Even if Vegeta didn't go ssb against the kid he would've lost. At the end of the day he didn't have that ssb x Kaio Ken that Goku had. It's not something he could've done even if he thought about it cuz Goku explicitly said that was something he has been working on for Beerus.

Quit giving Vegeta excuses. Goku is just better.

 

[Top Boy]

 

[everysingletime]

I don't need help.

Thnaks Mike

 

[frenchbreadbuilds]

I'm also on the goku=Vegeta train. At the end of the day kaioken is a technique that supersedes the users strength. To say that goku is stronger than Vegeta because kaioken, than you'd have to say Krillin was stronger than vegeta in the Freiza saga because the distructo disk, or that Tien was stronger than piccolo in the cell saga because piccolo was able to evenly match android 17, but tiens tri-beam was able to push back second form cell.

 

[jays25]

Pretty much. There's a reason that Vegeta's the only one who has consistently kept up with Goku, with SS3 being the only real barrier he never managed to pass. And of course in that instance he ended up gaining SSB anyways, making it a moot point. We saw way back during their original battle that even when using Kaioken Goku doesn't have what it takes to instantly stomp Vegeta and the immense amount of pressure the technique places on the users body still isn't really worth it in an extended fight.

 

[domogotsole]

Sometimes skill is even but the person with the better tools has an edge. That's what it comes down to to me. But keep in mind Goku's extra tool is very fragile.

 

[zs05wc]

My thing with Vegeta is that I've seen a lot of people say that his fighting IQ is higher than Goku but I've never really seen it. I feel like he's either stronger than his opponent or when he's starts getting pushed back against he kind of gets panicky and freaks out. Vegeta is my favorite character but I've never really seen him like formulate a strategy or anything.

 

[frenchbreadbuilds]

My thing with Vegeta is that I've seen a lot of people say that his fighting IQ is higher than Goku but I've never really seen it. I feel like he's either stronger than his opponent or when he's starts getting pushed back against he kind of gets panicky and freaks out. Vegeta is my favorite character but I've never really seen him like formulate a strategy or anything.

The same can be said about goku though. How often do we see goku thinking his way out of a situation? HIT was the first time in a long time where we saw goku do anything other than just be stronger than his opponent.

 

[zs05wc]

I've never seen anyone talk about Goku's fighting IQ though.

 

[jays25]

Goku doesn't make plans or think in fights because when he does you get **** like this

View media item 2121483

I think many people speak on Vegeta's IQ being higher for the simple fact that he doesn't come across as being as dumb as Goku. Same thing for Piccolo and Gohan as well.

 

[frenchbreadbuilds]

My thing with Vegeta is that I've seen a lot of people say that his fighting IQ is higher than Goku but I've never really seen it.

I've never seen anyone talk about Goku's fighting IQ though.

You drew the comparison between goku and vegeta's fighting IQ with your comment. Which is why I responded with what I did. You said you don't see Vegetas fighting IQ as being higher than gokus.

 

[everysingletime]

Man we don't even need to take him going Kaio Ken against Hit into account. Goku has always been one step ahead before that. First one to reach a level and Vegeta playing catch up. It's always been that way..

Lol in the hit episode when Goku went Kaio Ken x ssb even Vegeta himself said to himself, 'Why is he always one step ahead?'

I skipped the first 25 episodes of super, opting just to stick with the two movies, but whenever I ser Whis discussing Goku and Vegeta is either it's 'if you two work together, you can defeat beerus' OR 'Do you know why Goku is the better fighter, Vegeta?' I did not ever see Whis indicate Goku = Vegeta like you guys were saying last night. If there is, I'd like you guys to direct me to that episode and tell me where specifically that was said.

Because I can sure point out where Whis said 'Do you know why Goku is always better?'

As far as I can see, Goku has one weakness and one weakness only and it's that he's kinda soft and lacks a killer instinct and he's too merciful. He plays with his opponents too much. But at the end of the day he does his job because he's always the one to finish off the bad guy, so..

 

[frenchbreadbuilds]

Man we don't even need to take him going Kaio Ken against Hit into account. Goku has always been one step ahead before that. First one to reach a level and Vegeta playing catch up. It's always been that way..

Lol in the hit episode when Goku went Kaio Ken x ssb even Vegeta himself said to himself, 'Why is he always one step ahead?'

I skipped the first 25 episodes of super, opting just to stick with the two movies, but whenever I ser Whis discussing Goku and Vegeta is either it's 'if you two work together, you can defeat beerus' OR 'Do you know why Goku is the better fighter, Vegeta?' I did not ever see Whis indicate Goku = Vegeta like you guys were saying last night. If there is, I'd like you guys to direct me to that episode and tell me where specifically that was said.

Because I can sure point out where Whis said 'Do you know why Goku is always better?'

I think what you need to understand is that the show isn't static and neither are vegeta and gokus levels. Whis said what you mentioned before goku and Vegeta even hit SSB and essentially at the beginning of their training. Why would any of that still be relevant now that they've both gotten magnitudes stronger?

 

[everysingletime]

Of course I know nothing in static, otherwise how would they all be leveling up all the time. Don't be patronizing.

However, I still have not seen any evidence of Vegeta having caught up, like you seem to be saying.

Also you say at the time Whiz made the comment that they haven't reached the ssb form yet but they had. We just hadn't seen it. It was quite plainly obvious that the ssb form was not new to either Goku or Vegeta when they fought golden Frieza. They had quite obviously been training in that form for some time. They both made comments to golden Frieza on some 'Oh when you got that form you came here right away' type ish. 'You don't know how to regulate it' While in the meantime both Goku and Vegeta looked like ssb was old hat to them at that point. Did you see how both transformed into blue against Golden Frieza? It was as easy as going super saiyan lol. Like they've done it a million times before.

Just face it. Goku is just better [emoji]128557[/emoji]