Official 2013 NBA Draft Thread

I see more Westbrook in Oladipo than Wade when comparing them to their college careers.

Of course he doesn't handle the ball as well as Russy, but they were both considered some of the best athletes in college, lock down defenders and kinda out of control at times. Oladipo probably will never be put in a position to be a go to scorer either, but I can see the same intensity from him and Westbrook.

Some things I think that will be FACTS about Oladipo when drafted:

1 ) He will be one of the best rebounding guards in the league
2) He will be in the top 10 in steals
3) He will be a top 3 perimeter defender
4) He will be one of the most exciting players in the open court

May be wrong, but I definitely can see those things becoming reality.
 
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Drummond, Noah, M. Gasol, , N. Vucevic, G. Monroe, R. Hibbert. D. Jordan, B. Lopez and J. Noah have all slipped a little bit in the draft and were not top 5 picks. Yet those guys have shown to be such valuable pieces because size is such a commodity in this league. The college game is geared for guards that why you have burke, kemba, fredette and little guys dominating every year.

Look Nerlens is the #1 but he couldn't even carry a talented (albeit) young Kentucky squad anywhere. It's really hard for big men to dominate the college game in the same way guards do. NBA is different. Drummond was such a non-factor at UCONN but look how great he was in his 1st year. If you were to redo the draft he would be the #2 pick now. Centers in college need talent a PG around them generally that can get them the ball and make them a factor.

Did Len get pushed around? I guess but as he fills out that won't be as much as an issue. Especially considering the small ball up and down nature of the league right now, a guy with his motor and coordination is ideal in a lineup where you can plug him at center and then a stretch four next to him.
 
Comparing Beal and Vic will be fun down the line.

Both rebound extremely well for guards. Oladipo is better developed defensively, but Bradley is no slouch on D either. Beal is better developed offensively, but Vic is improving offensively especially with his outside J.
 
worldbeefreeg said:
Drummond, Noah, M. Gasol, , N. Vucevic, G. Monroe, R. Hibbert. D. Jordan, B. Lopez and J. Noah have all slipped a little bit in the draft and were not top 5 picks. Yet those guys have shown to be such valuable pieces because size is such a commodity in this league. The college game is geared for guards that why you have burke, kemba, fredette and little guys dominating every year.

Look Nerlens is the #1 but he couldn't even carry a talented (albeit) young Kentucky squad anywhere. It's really hard for big men to dominate the college game in the same way guards do. NBA is different. Drummond was such a non-factor at UCONN but look how great he was in his 1st year. If you were to redo the draft he would be the #2 pick now. Centers in college need talent a PG around them generally that can get them the ball and make them a factor.

Did Len get pushed around? I guess but as he fills out that won't be as much as an issue. Especially considering the small ball up and down nature of the league right now, a guy with his motor and coordination is ideal in a lineup where you can plug him at center and then a stretch four next to him.
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Who would you take Drummond over, Lillard or Davis?

Can't wait to hear this one.
 
Neither.

Lillard and Davis are the only two players in the class I'd take over Drummond.

I'm tempted to take Drummond over Davis, but AD is already developed defensively and improving on the offensive end.
 
Not Davis of course but Lillard maybe. Lillard is going to be 23 next season, I'm not ever sure he'll be an all-star PG. For someone, who is as polished as he Lillard, I suspect that he isn't very far from his ceiling.

Meanwhile, Andre was really rebounding and defending the rim at an extraordinary level at just 19. He is still just getting comfortable with his frame but a guy that large and coordinated just does not come along very often. Meanwhile the league, is over-saturated with good PG's.

Look at the ECF.

Your PG's:
- Chalmers
- Hill
- Conley
- Parker

Your C's:
- Duncan
- Bosh
- Gasol
- Hibbert

You need elite bigs in this league, PG's not really. I think Andre Drummond has the potential down the line to be the best center in this league so yes, I would say if I was a team with a no. 2 pick that wasn't close to contending anytime soon, I would take Drummond.
 
I would def take Drummond over Lillard.

and Elite big man is more devastating than an elite PG
 
bhzmafia14 said:
I see more Westbrook in Oladipo than Wade when comparing them to their college careers.

Of course he doesn't handle the ball as well as Russy, but they were both considered some of the best athletes in college, lock down defenders and kinda out of control at times. Oladipo probably will never be put in a position to be a go to scorer either, but I can see the same intensity from him and Westbrook.

Some things I think that will be FACTS about Oladipo when drafted:

1 ) He will be one of the best rebounding guards in the league
2) He will be in the top 10 in steals
3) He will be a top 3 perimeter defender
4) He will be one of the most exciting players in the open court

May be wrong, but I definitely can see those things becoming reality.
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so the only thing him and westbrook do the same is the same intensity? cause there games are nothing alike at all

Oladipo will be this years MKG
 
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JJ Watt said:
I would def take Drummond over Lillard.

and Elite big man is more devastating than an elite PG
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so you have Drummond becoming a great big men the next few years? because Lillard showed this year he will be in the running as a top 10 PG for years to come. Drummond just showed in spurts what he could do in the future
 
Everyone knows I love Drummond's potential. Been hyping him in the NBA thread for months. But over Lillard? Not so fast. He's already polished. Developed offensively. Does need more weapons in Portland. That team lacks depth.
 
Bigmike23 said:
so the only thing him and westbrook do the same is the same intensity? cause there games are nothing alike at all

Oladipo will be this years MKG
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Are you thinking about the way Westbrook is now or the way he was during his sophmore year?

As we've mentioned before, Oladipo's intrigue as an NBA prospect starts with his abilities as a perimeter defender. An elite athlete with a chiseled frame and solid size and length for an NBA shooting guard, Oladipo combines his outstanding physical tools with a relentless motor, often overwhelming players at the college level as an on-ball defender and causing havoc off the ball.

Oladipo makes his presence felt all over the floor defensively, playing with tremendous intensity and always finding ways to get his hands on the ball for deflections and steals, or flying in from out of his area to block a shot or come up with a rebound, thanks to his seemingly endless energy and outstanding speed, quickness, and leaping ability.

Oladipo ranks second amongst all players in our Top 100 Rankings in steals per forty minutes, using his athleticism and anticipation skills to play the passing lanes, and also his quick hands to strip his man off the dribble. He has excellent lateral quickness and is able play his man very closely on the perimeter and still stay in front of him, while also being able to recover quickly in the event that he gets beat.

With the ability to guard up to four positions at the college level, Oladipo projects to be able to defend all three perimeter positions at the NBA level, depending on matchups. He has the speed and quickness to cover point guards, and his athleticism, strength, and toughness should enable him to guard most small forwards as well. Coaches will likely value the flexibility Oladipo gives them on the defensive end, as they can cross-match and hide weaker defenders while putting Oladipo on the opposing team's top perimeter threat, regardless of position.

While Oladipo's calling card as a prospect is his defense, it's the progression in his offensive game that has been the primary reason for his breakout season. After making only 18 of his 74 3-point attempts (24%) in his first two seasons at Indiana, he's connected on an excellent 19 of 37 so far this season (51%) from behind the arc, which ranks second among all top-100 prospects who attempt at least one 3-pointer per game.

Oladipo's shooting numbers are likely a bit inflated at this stage with such a small sample size, but it's clear that he's put in the work to improve his jump shot. He looks more fluid and comfortable with his release than last year, and the ball seems to come off of his hands softer, with better rotation and arc on his shot.

He's also done a very good job knowing his limitations as a shooter, as 74% of his jumpers this season have come off the catch with his feet set, and the pull-up jumpers he has taken have been good, open looks for the most part.

NBA teams will likely want to see more evidence that his early season shooting is not a fluke, as well as see how he might adjust to the longer NBA 3-point, but his improvements are very encouraging and should suggest that the potential is there for him to become an adequate spot shooter in time, assuming he continues to put in the work.

Oladipo still does much of his damage offensively when he can get out in the open floor, as over 28% of his used possessions this season have come in transition. He's an absolute blur leading the break with the ball in his hands or filling the lanes, where he's capable of finishing with highlight-reel dunks.

In the half-court, Oladipo is primarily an opportunistic scorer at this stage, utilizing his athleticism and energy to make plays off of cuts and offensive rebounds (his 3.4 offensive rebounds per forty ranks first amongst all shooting guard prospects in our database). Over two thirds of his shot attempts come in the basket area, and he's converting on an outstanding 71% of those attempts, as he attacks the rim very aggressively and uses his good body control and excellent elevation to finish
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There might not be a more improved player in the country over the last year or two than UCLA sophomore guard Russell Westbrook. Considered a mid-major recruit leading into his senior year of high school, drawing scholarship offers from schools such as San Diego, Wyoming, Creighton and Kent State, Westbrook benefited from a late growth spurt that saw him shoot up from just 5-10 to 6-3 late in his prep career, and is now a key cog on a Final Four contending team and one of the hottest draft prospects in the country as of late. Obviously a late bloomer, Westbrook remains a raw prospect as far as his skill-level is concerned, but has just about as much upside to continue to improve as any guard in the NCAA not named Derrick Rose.

Physically, Westbrook is especially impressive, despite his tweener status. He has solid size at 6-3, an excellent wingspan, and huge hands, and is one of the most explosive players you’ll find anywhere in the country. Featuring an outstanding first step and terrific strength once in the lane, Westbrook’s ability to elevate off the floor has made his highlight reels the stuff of Youtube legend.

Offensively, Westbrook’s biggest source of production (nearly 30% of his offense) curiously comes in transition. He plays a fairly small role in UCLA’s half-court offense (only 8% of his offense comes from either pick and roll or isolation plays) , mostly as a complimentary piece—moving off the ball trying to find holes in the defense to get to the rim with his tremendous strength and leaping ability, or shooting wide open jumpers. It’s pretty clear when breaking down his footage that he lacks quite a bit of polish on this end of the floor, even if he is extremely effective at the few things he does well.

Westbrook’s ball-handling skills are fairly limited, as he has the ability the beat players off the dribble with his tremendous first step going left or right, and is solid getting to the rim in a straight line, but he struggles when trying to do much more than that. He lacks the advanced dribbling skills needed to create his own shot and change directions sharply in the half-court (for example at the end of a shot clock), and thus often looks a bit out of control when dribbling in traffic, forcing him to flip up some awkward shots at the rim. It’s not uncommon to see him called for various violations in the rare occasion that he tries to go out and make something happen on his own, be it traveling calls, palming or offensive fouls.

As far as his jump-shot is concerned, Westbrook is mostly a catch and shoot player, hitting only 18 3-pointers on the season (on a 34.6% clip), usually on open looks, in rhythm and with his feet set. His release is not the quickest or most fluid around, and he lacks accuracy when rushed or forced to shoot off the dribble. He has the potential to improve here, but his touch at the moment looks fairly average. In terms of his mid-range game, Westbrook doesn’t show great polish here either, as his shot is a bit flat, and he doesn’t always take advantage of his terrific leaping ability to create separation from his defender with his pull-up jumper. He seems to be showing more and more sparks as the season moves on here, though.

To Westbrook’s credit, these flaws are not always very noticeable, as he is a very smart player who knows his limitations and has no problem fitting in and being just another cog in UCLA’s very efficient offense. He plays within himself, rarely forcing the issue, and thus has done a very good job of not exposing his weaknesses within his team’s system. The fact that he has other highly efficient and extremely unselfish teammates like Kevin Love, Darren Collison and Josh Shipp has also helped him a great deal.

As a point guard, Westbrook is not an instinctive playmaker, but is very much capable of bringing the ball up the floor and getting his team into its offense. He is smart, patient, and highly unselfish, and possesses the court vision needed to find the open man without hesitation, picking up quite a few assists just by getting the ball to the right place in UCLA’s half-court sets. He lacks some creativity when it comes to improvising outside of his team’s offense, though, and it’s here that his inexperience running the point guard position, along with his average ball-handling skills, seem to show the most. It should be noted that despite his very high assist totals (4.6 per game on the season, compared with just 2.7 turnovers), when taking into account only the most competitive games UCLA was involved with (the eleven which finished within a 10 point margin), his assists per game drop to 3.2, while his turnovers remain at 2.7.

Defensively, Westbrook is nothing short of outstanding, as evidenced by the phenomenal work he did locking down the three top scoring guards in the Pac-10 this season, O.J. Mayo, Jerryd Bayless, and James Harden. He is long, strong and very fundamentally sound, getting into a terrific defensive stance on every possession, moving his feet incredibly well, and being absolutely tenacious getting after his matchup. His wingspan, combined with his huge hands and outstanding anticipation skills make him a terror in the passing lanes, and this is a big factor why he spends so much time in transition offensively.

Westbrook is going to have a very difficult decision to make at the end of this season, as there is a tremendous amount of NBA draft hype surrounding him at the moment—to the point that he might struggle trying to live up to it considering the still-early stage of development he’s in. It’s clear that he could use another season at UCLA to refine his point guard skills, but he runs the risk of having many of his warts exposed once people start breaking down his game and notice his not-so-obvious limitations. UCLA also has two and a half McDonald’s All-American guards (Jrue Holiday, Malcolm Lee and Jerime Anderson) coming in next season, which further complicates his decision.

It’s still not quite clear what position Westbrook will play in the NBA, even if it could probably be said that his upside is so high that he can just figure that out down the road. He lacks significant experience at the point guard position, and probably isn’t a good enough shooter/ball-handler/shot-creator to be considered a starting caliber shooting guard, particularly since he lacks size for the position at 6-3. Considering his physical tools, intangibles and how much he’s improved over the past two years, though, a lot of teams would probably have a hard time passing him up in the 10-20 range, since he truly has home run potential if he can improve on his weaknesses in time. He might ideally be suited coming off the bench playing a Leandro Barbosa type role, which would still be worthy of a very high pick.
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Midas whale just swap their names in each report because it pretty much says the exact same thing. I wish people would stop acting like Westbrook was a for sure fire stud coming out of college that was going to be a top 5-7 player in the league.
 
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Or he just got the most playing time (and shots) due to the limited depth on the team (well besides being talented).

Just another way to think about things.
 
Their roles were nearly identical, their style of play was nearly identical, the way they were evaluated as prospects were nearly identical. I can go and find even more scouting reports about both players that say the exact same thing. You can't let what Westbrook is now blind you as to what he was during his sophmore season at UCLA. Oladipo may not end up being nowhere near as good of a player as Westbrook, but they were very similar coming out of college.

Comparing Oladipo to MKG is just being lazy because both players were considered great defenders at the collegiate level. One thing that will hold Oladipo back is that he will not get the same opportunity Westbrook did when drafted more than likely. That's why I made the argument a while back about Westbrook possibly be drafting by Memphis. There's a very good chance he wouldn't be the player he is today, and that's okay. That's not a knock on him, but just shows that systems and coaches are a huge part of developing players oustside of their individual work ethic.

I guess since mike watched UCLA so much, he knew Westbrook would be a star :lol:
 
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i would love to get oladipo in this draft..

if okc can somehow trade up for him using reggie jackson and 12, i would.. pick up a backup pg for the future later on in the draft (our pick or the bobcats 2nd) and hell bring back fisher for a year

thabo has a year left on his deal and oladipo could step into the starting lineup after that.. then we would still have lamb off the bench and could use a 3 guard lineup of russ/oladipo/lamb when we went small (with kd and ibaka or collison)
 
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Comparing Oladipo to MKG is just being lazy because both players were considered great defenders at the collegiate level

im talking about the impact both would have 1st years on a team, they both scream roll players but get drafted how because people think both can or will become good/great on offense.

nothing about Oladipo the last 2 years at IU said damn he reminds me of RW at UCLA.
 
Bigmike23 said:
so you have Drummond becoming a great big men the next few years? because Lillard showed this year he will be in the running as a top 10 PG for years to come. Drummond just showed in spurts what he could do in the future
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Every year someone is becoming a top 10 PG
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as a GM you draft for ceilings and potential.

Who has a higher in both of those between Drummond and Lillard.

ill take the 19 year old 7 Footer over the 22 year old PG
JJs07 said:
Not over Anthony Davis.

If I'm rating rookies off of last year it goes Davis, Lillard, and Beal.
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where does Barnes and Drummond fall into that?
 
Bigmike23 said:
Comparing Oladipo to MKG is just being lazy because both players were considered great defenders at the collegiate level
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im talking about the impact both would have 1st years on a team, they both scream roll players but get drafted how because people think both can or will become good/great on offense.
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That's fine, because I don't think Oladipo will end up having the same opportunity as a Westbrook per say to be a huge impact player offensively. He's not going to be a guy that has the ball in his hands enough to do that. Who are you to say if Westbrook remained off the ball at the start of his career that he would be similar to how he was at UCLA? He and VO both had high usage in transition and didn't spend much time making plays in the halfcourt.

I don't expect whatever team that VO goes to will make him a PG. I do think he will end up being better than MKG, though. My main argument is that, Westbrook was considered the same player coming out. If you can give me a reason why he was not, then its fair game. The only thing you've been saying is that they were not the same player. I didn't watch Westbrook every night in college, but I saw a good portion of his games during his sophmore year.

As for the Wade comparisons, I just don't see it at all. The only thing that makes VO compared to Wade is the fact that they attack the rim relentlessly. Wade was considered the #1 option on that Marquette team and had a more polished offensive game.
 
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JJ Watt said:
Every year someone is becoming a top 10 PG :lol:

as a GM you draft for ceilings and potential.

Who has a higher in both of those between Drummond and Lillard.

ill take the 19 year old 7 Footer over the 22 year old PG


where does Barnes and Drummond fall into that?
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Forgot about Drummond...

All things considered...Davis, Lillard, Drummond, Beal, Barnes.

*You can easily make a case for Drummond over Lillard, IMO.
 
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JJs07 said:
Forgot about Drummond...

All things considered...Davis, Lillard, Drummond, Beal, Barnes.

*You can easily make a case for Drummond over Lillard, IMO.
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Your opinions are ridiculous, seriously.

Drummond over Lilliard? :lol:
 
AD, Lillard, Drummond, and maybe Beal could/should all reach elite status as cream of the class (crop).
 
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