The NBA Stats Thread: The 15-year chain reaction that led to the NBA's current offensive explosion

The issue is that Presti should've kept Harden and moved Ibaka.
OR he shouldnt have signed perkins for as much as he did..

ibaka signed for 4 years 48 mill.. harden says he wanted the max that OKC could have offered, which was 4 years 60 mill.. the thunder offered him 4 years 55-56 mill
 
^ harden would have been a restricted free agent this summer.. so the thunder could have matched whatever offer harden would have recieved on the open market (see eric gordon)


thats my point he was going to get a huge offer from houston or the suns and OKC didnt want to go through that.

Can still do sign and trades thru that tho can't they? Or at worst, take the Klay deal over Kevin Freaking Martin. O)r the Beal one if it was real.

I get why they wanted to try and keep Ibaka, needed a low post defender more so than a 3rd ballhandler/creator. I get why they thought that way, but they rushed doing the trade, period. They should have waited, no matter what.
 
the wizards turned down the beal deal and golden state wanted OKC to take back RJ(20 million the next 2 years) or Andris Biedrins(18million the next 2 years)
 
The Thunder also reportedly contacted the Raptors and Jazz.
i saw something in simmons article about the raptors.. and them wanting valanciunas and getting turned down..

are there any other specifics that have come out about potential harden trades?
 
Tom Haberstroh:
Elite center's extinction myth

The reports of the center position's death are greatly exaggerated.

Many will remember this postseason as "The Stephen Curry Playoffs," and with good reason. The baby-faced 25-year-old has exploded onto the scene in his first playoff run for 25 points, 8.3 assists and a staggering 3.9 3-point makes per game. If there's anyone who can identify with a lanky underdog who loves to shoot from anywhere on the floor, it's the casual NBA fan -- or anyone who has ever picked up a basketball.

But are you seeing what the centers are doing in this playoffs?

You know, the position that the general public has declared extinct after a '90s era during which skilled 7-footers roamed the Earth and dominated the playing field. Patrick Ewing. Hakeem Olajuwon. David Robinson. Dikembe Mutombo. Rik Smits. Alonzo Mourning. Brad Daugherty. Go ahead, throw Shaquille O'Neal into the mix if you'd like.

So where have all the elite centers gone? It's a common refrain, but you'll find some pretty darn good centers right here in the playoffs. Look around the league and you'll see that most of these remaining teams feature a big-time center anchoring both ends of the floor.

We have Marc Gasol, the reigning NBA Defensive Player of the Year who happens to be the best passing big in the game. He has scored at least 20 points in six of his past seven games. How in the world are the Memphis Grizzlies looking like the best in the West after trading their top scorer and go-to option in the clutch, Rudy Gay?

Look no further than uber-skilled Gasol, who iced the Game 4 win Monday night with a 15-footer with 22 seconds left as part of his 23-point, 11-rebound and 6-block performance. By the way, Curry and Gasol are neck-and-neck on the playoff PER leaderboard (22.7 and 22.1, respectively).

Then there's sharpshooting Chris Bosh, who just dropped 20 points, 19 rebounds, 4 assists and 2 blocks in a Game 3 win over the Bulls. The Heat have the best defensive efficiency of the playoffs with Bosh anchoring the team's back line. (Playing the Bucks and the Bulls helps.) Bosh may not look or play like a traditional center, but he's averaging two blocks per game this postseason and (psst) he's actually taller than Dwight Howard.

Prefer a back-you-down-and-lay-it-in center? Try Roy Hibbert on for size; the 7-foot-2 big man was practically built for the brutally slow-paced '90s basketball. If you're nostalgic for some skilled post moves, pull up some video from Hibbert's 24-point Game 3 against Tyson Chandler, whom the coaches just voted to first-team All-Defense. Hibbert put on a back-to-the-basket clinic on Chandler, using either hand for a delicate hook shot that seemed transplanted from a different era.

Oh, and the Pacers' defense was the best in all the land this season with a 96.6 defensive efficiency. Hibbert was at the center of it all, which makes it all the more baffling how he failed to receive more votes for All-Defense than Kobe Bryant this season.

Elsewhere, the Chicago Bulls would have left the playoffs weeks ago if it weren't for Joakim Noah, who admitted recently to having a tear in his plantar fascia in his foot. Despite that debilitating injury that reportedly feels like running on a bed of nails, Noah has been his hyperenergetic self and as much of a double-double lock there is in this game. As an All-Star and two-time All-Defensive team recipient, Noah already goes down as the best center in Bulls history since Artis Gilmore.

And we haven't even gotten to Tim Duncan yet, who's playing almost exclusively at the 5 now that Tiago Splitter is hurt. Duncan has become the first player to average at least 19 points and nine rebounds in the playoffs after turning 36 years old (minimum 100 minutes). Ewing, Olajuwon or Robinson have never done that, and neither did Kareem Abdul-Jabbar.

So again, where did all the good centers go?

That's five of the remaining eight teams with centers playing a monster role in their playoff efforts. And that's before we get into Andrew Bogut (averaging 11.8 rebounds in just 28.7 minutes per game) and Chandler, who's clearly limited by a bulging disk in his neck. The only person who hasn't realized that Serge Ibaka -- who put up 17 points, 14 rebounds and three blocks on Monday -- is the Thunder's best center is his coach, Scott Brooks, who inexplicably still plays the offensively bankrupt Kendrick Perkins 20 minutes a night while Kevin Durant desperately searches for scoring help.

It's no coincidence that six of the top seven defenses this season are still alive in the playoffs, and they all boast a two-way anchor in the middle (Indiana, Memphis, San Antonio, Oklahoma City, Chicago and Miami). Centers are more vital than ever. With spread offenses, an array of high-flying point guards and an explosion of analytical information in the sport, two-way centers, who can both protect the paint and score on the other end, have become the greatest commodity in the game.

You can look beyond the current conference semifinals field to see talented centers everywhere in the league. Dwight Howard, Kevin Garnett, Brook Lopez, Larry Sanders and Al Horford helped carry their respective teams into the playoffs. Toss in Al Jefferson, LaMarcus Aldridge, Pau Gasol and Nene Hilario. Greg Monroe, Andre Drummond, Anthony Davis, Jonas Valanciunas, Nikola Pekovic and DeMarcus Cousins are well on their way. (Here's a long list of efficient giants, curated by Grantland's Zach Lowe.) The number of good centers in this league is striking.

So next time someone complains that elite centers are a dying breed, tell that dinosaur to watch a minute of these playoffs first because he obviously hasn't been paying attention. If he did, he'd know the purported extinction of the great center is nothing but a myth.
 
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"I'm fully confident in myself, I knew (Anthony) wasn't just going to have his way," George said. "I think I can match up with any wing, shooting guard or point guard in this league."

The numbers illustrate confidence. According to data compiled by ESPN Stats & Information, Anthony is shooting 18-of-57 (32 percent) with George on him in the series, his length and quickness preventing Anthony from getting time or space to execute as he's used to.

It's gotten to the point where you can visibly see Anthony rushing his shots when he gets any hint of separation from George, knowing he doesn't have his preferred time. And this from a player who has one of the quickest releases in the league. George is just all over him.
But if you need statistical evidence, here it is. When any of the other Pacers are guarding him, Anthony is shooting 20-of-36 (56 percent). During Game 4, Anthony was 4-of-16 with George on him and 5-of-7 facing anyone else.

By the way, ESPN Stats & Information says Smith is 3-of-16 (19 percent) when George is on him and 15-of-48 (32 percent) when other Pacers, usually Lance Stephenson, are on him.
Link
 
Jason KIdd, playoff man amongst boys.

3-24 shooting.
3-17 on 3's.
4.2 rebounds
2.3 assists
11 steals, 11 fouls, 11 points.
13 turnovers

0 points in the last 8 NBA playoff games, in 177 minutes.

Dude has 11 points, in 10 games. Hasn't made a 2 point shot in this year's playoffs.



:lol:
 
My main man PG24 :pimp:

I thought he would be pretty good coming out of the draft, but not THIS good. He's one of the best two way players in the league.
 
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CourtVision: Gravity's Rainbosh

Less than 90 seconds into Monday’s Game 4 between the Bulls and Heat, something seemingly uneventful happened. Dwyane Wade had just received an entry pass down on the right block, where he was doubled by Nate Robinson and Carlos Boozer. Joakim Noah was also interested in stopping Wade, and he had strayed from Udonis Haslem to camp out alone at the crown of the restricted area. Suddenly, one of those non sequitur whistles sounded and play abruptly stopped.

1t3lw1.gif


Joakim Noah was called for defensive three seconds, which results in a technical foul. This call established early on that the refs were not going to tolerate Noah’s cheating toward the basket, thus denying the Bulls a vital tactical advantage.

Two of the best NBA nerds on Twitter had the following exchange:

@BKoremenos Was that defensive 3-seconds on Noah? If so, that was a really quick count.

@CoupNBA Going to really hurt him if they call it like that.

Regardless of whether it was a quick count or not, the call happened and Noah would have to “stay honest” the rest of the way. Noah’s presence near the basket is critical for the Bulls defense, a fact that is well known by Erik Spoelstra, Chris Bosh, Udonis Haslem, and the rest of the Miami Heat.

There’s a lot of talk about “spacing” in the NBA these days, but what that actually means remains ambiguous. It’s clearly a concept having to do with offensive feng shui, but beyond that when somebody says this team had “good spacing” or that team “spaces the floor well” it’s kind of an imprecise compliment. With that out of the way, let me say this: The Miami Heat space the floor very well.

While it’s sensible to discuss spacing in terms of where offensive players are, in the case of Miami it is just as instructive to think about it in terms of where they are not. The Heat adorn the perimeter with terrifying spot-up shooters, including Ray Allen and Shane Battier. This always stretches the opposing defense across the width of the scoring area, creating space inside. However, the role of Chris Bosh as a midrange spacing agent is also a huge element. The 6-foot-11 Bosh is commonly guarded by the largest opposing defender, and spends a lot of his time on offense away from the basket, outside the paint, beyond the elbows. In short, Bosh is positioned in spots that do not hinder his attacking teammates.

The combination of Bosh’s size and shooting prowess create a gravity that pulls opposing bigs like Noah or Larry Sanders away from their native defensive habitat, out to zones where they are much less dominant. But perhaps most important, this gravitational pull opens up corridors for the Heat’s two primary offensive forces: Dwyane Wade and LeBron James. Here’s a classic example of Bosh Gravity from Game 4 a few minutes after that defensive three seconds call.

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As James handled the ball along the right wing, Bosh slowly moonwalked down on the left baseline toward the corner. James attacked the basket, easily getting by Jimmy Butler and arriving at the rim before Noah, who’d followed Bosh, could contest. By rule (defensive three seconds), Noah is forced to either stay out of the lane or be actively manning an opponent.

Keeping Bosh away from the basket doesn’t cost Miami much on offense, but it does often cost their opponent something significant on defense. In this next example, Bosh again draws Noah far away from the lane, and sets up a hockey assist for James, who easily scores around Butler on the right block.

2whnzab.jpg


Opponents follow Bosh deep into jump-shooting territory for good reason; he is perhaps the most underrated midrange shooter in the NBA. Well over half of his shot attempts come in the midrange area, and he makes 48 percent of them, about 10 percent higher than the league average. He’s particularly lethal behind the elbows, where he performs at levels akin to Kevin Garnett and Tim Duncan, two surefire Hall of Famers who have a similar affinity for that exact scoring space.

grant_e_Bosh01jr_1152.jpg


In the current series he’s serving as both a catch-and-shoot threat and as a Noah magnet that compromises the ideal shape of the Chicago defense. In turn, Bosh is providing several “spatial assists” and creating lots of more accessible scoring opportunities for his teammates near the basket. As if James and Wade needed any additional assistance near the hoop, Bosh’s abilities as a shooter regularly force the opposition’s most imposing defensive players to migrate far from the basket. NBA highlights packages won’t be featuring Bosh’s spacing anytime soon, but it is often the hidden cause in many of the Heat’s most spectacular plays.
Link

Keep this post in mind when the Heat likely face the Pacers (Hibbert), Grizzlies (Gasol) and/or Spurs (Duncan/Splitter).
 
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You can look beyond the current conference semifinals field to see talented centers everywhere in the league. Dwight Howard, Kevin Garnett, Brook Lopez, Larry Sanders and Al Horford helped carry their respective teams into the playoffs. Toss in Al Jefferson, LaMarcus Aldridge, Pau Gasol and Nene Hilario. Greg Monroe, Andre Drummond, Anthony Davis, Jonas Valanciunas, Nikola Pekovic and DeMarcus Cousins are well on their way. (Here's a long list of efficient giants, curated by Grantland's Zach Lowe.) The number of good centers in this league is striking.


I find it hilarious that they just lump all the Power Forwards and Centers into this so-called 'elite center' category :lol: Might as well throw Melo into the mix, he plays PF alot, which is one step away from center
 
Grizz blogger Chris Herrington on OKC-MEM Game 5:


3. "Clutch Defense:" The Grizzlies' 3-1 lead can be largely attributed to late-game execution. Overall in these three wins, the Grizzlies have scored at a rate of 101.7 points per 100 possessions while yielding 94.5 points per 100 possessions. That's good. But in "clutch" situations — defined as in the final five minutes of the fourth quarter or overtime, when the scoring margin is within five points, and 19 of a possible 20 minutes in these three games fit that description — the Grizzlies offense has ticked up slightly (106.7) while the defense (64.2!) has been dominant.

This is a different definition of "clutch" than we're used to, and one that's fitting for this particular team. The Grizzlies have shot only 9-27 in this span, though they have, crucially, taken care of business at the free-throw line (18-22). But the big-time winning plays late in the game — as detailed in my Game 4 post — have by and large been defensive ones. The Grizzlies' success has been less about clutch shots than clutch steals, clutch blocks, clutch charges taken and shots contested and touches denied.

Over three otherwise tightly contested games, the Grizzlies have outscored the Thunder 37-21, held them to 21 points in 19 minutes, on miserable 5-25 shooting.

64.2 points per 100 possessions in the final five minutes or overtime :x
 
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No no according to Laker fans if player can't be given the ball to score in a close game then he is not clutch.
 
@tomhaberstroh Kendrick Perkins finished with a NEGATIVE PER in the playoffs. -0.7 = worst ever with 200+ mins. http://bkref.com/tiny/78uvJ
Durant held in check by Tayshaun Prince

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The Memphis Grizzlies took out the Oklahoma City Thunder in five games to advance to their first Western Conference Finals in franchise history.

Kevin Durant scored 21 points, his 37th straight playoff game with more than 20 points (the 4th-longest such streak in NBA history), but it wasn’t enough. Durant shot 23.8 percent from the field (5-21), the 3rd-worst field-goal percentage in his postseason career.

Durant is a combined 4-22 on field-goal attempts with nine points in the fourth quarter and overtime of the last three games.

Tayshaun Prince guarded Durant on 67 percent of his field-goal attempts the last two games of the series, after sharing a near 50-50 split the first three games. Durant was unable to score inside the paint the last two games, scoring a total of 10 points after averaging 12.0 paint points during the first three games of the series.
 
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Haberstroh:
Grizzlies, Heat NBA Finals bound?

And our NBA Finals matchup is set:

"Grit and Grind" versus "Pace and Space."

Wait, the Memphis Grizzlies and the Miami Heat aren't locked into the championship round yet?

Not quite, but it sure feels we're headed that way, doesn't it?

If this postseason has taught us anything, it's that we shouldn't let ourselves be prisoners of the moment. That thing we like to call momentum? Yeah, it's a fickle and fleeting beast.


Remember when the Lakers were widely picked as dark horses after a strong push into the playoffs? How'd that work out? They were swept. And one minute, the Thunder look like Heat-threatening juggernauts; the next, Russell Westbrook tears his MCL, out for the season. Stephen Curry and Klay Thompson look virtually unguardable and then suddenly, they appear demonstrably vulnerable.

Did we forget about the Spurs last season? They looked like they were going to steamroll their way into the Finals after sweeping both the Utah Jazz and Los Angeles Clippers in the first two rounds and then going up 2-0 against the Thunder in the Western Conference finals. They won 10 straight games, and could do no wrong. Yeah, momentum didn't matter so much after all.

The lesson: These things can change fast.

But even so, the Grizzlies and the Heat look like the favorites to meet in the Finals after wrapping up their respective series in five games. We might not figure out their conference final foes for a while as both the San Antonio Spurs and the Indiana Pacers are trying to win the Game 6 clincher on the road at Golden State and New York, respectively.

How do the Grizzlies and Heat get there? What stands in their way? Let's break it down.

How the Grizzlies get to the Finals

Remember when Memphis' offense was doomed without Rudy Gay? Well, the Grizzlies just faced two top-10 defenses and destroyed them both en route to the franchise's first-ever Western Conference finals. That's the real story here for the Grizzlies. They have scored an above-average 104.4 points per 100 possessions in the playoffs, up from their regular-season offensive efficiency of 101.7 and 100.4 before sending Gay to Toronto. It's not a grind anymore.

When most people thought the Grizzlies offense would crumble without their top scorer, the opposite has happened: It has gotten better, much better. This was a classic case of addition by subtraction when the Grizzlies swapped out an inefficient, high-volume scorer and redistributed those valuable touches to healthier options in Mike Conley, Marc Gasol and Zach Randolph. In basketball, efficiency is and will always be king.

The can always lean on their grit-and-grind defense as long as Gasol and Tony Allen are on the team, but they'll need their offense to continue its upward trajectory in the next series -- especially in crunch time. The Grizzlies have gone 5-2 in playoff games that have entered "clutch situation" territory, defined as the final five minutes with the score within five points. No one has fared better so far in the playoffs during late-and-close situations thus far.

The Grizz don't seem to miss Gay's shot creation at all down the stretch. While people were quick to hail the Denver Nuggets as "proof" that superstar-less teams can't win in the playoffs, the Grizzlies are blowing up that theory as we speak. In 30 minutes of crunch time this postseason, the Grizzlies have shared the rock, with Gasol having taken 11 field goal attempts, Conley nine and Randolph six, per NBA.com's stats tool.

For comparison, Kevin Durant alone almost shot more than them combined (24 field goal attempts) in 39 minutes of crunch time this postseason. And which team crumbled down the stretch? The Grizzlies have gotten here by playing selfless, team-first basketball and they'll need to continue playing that way against the Spurs or the Warriors. The pressure will be greater than ever.

How the Heat get to the Finals

Contrary to popular belief, this won't be easy. Yes, the Heat are winners of 45 of their past 48 games (which, as I'm typing it, doesn't even seem possible). Yes, they crushed the feisty Chicago Bulls by 73 points in four games after dropping Game 1. Yes, their recent dominance makes it seem as though they're destined to repeat as champions.

But it's hard to imagine an easier road up to this point for the Heat. The Milwaukee Bucks entered the postseason as a broken, fragmented group that lost 13 of their final 17 games of the regular season. The Bulls were practically fielding a JV team with Derrick Rose, Luol Deng and Kirk Hinrich sitting out the series and Joakim Noah hobbled by plantar fasciitis.

So, should we be surprised that the Heat have gone 8-1 so far in the playoffs? Put it this way: I'd be stunned if they went 8-1 or better here on out. Most of that skepticism is derived from the Indiana Pacers -- the Heat's most likely Eastern finals opponent -- being a healthier, stingier version of the Chicago Bulls that exhausted LeBron James and the Heat. (Look at the Heat's postgame comments about needing 24 hours to recover. They were spent.)

It has been well documented that the Heat have had their regular-season issues with the Pacers, losing two of their three games against coach Frank Vogel's crew. And just like this current Knicks series, Paul George was at the center of it all, guarding LeBron and causing him to have as many turnovers as assists (14) in three games against the Pacers this season. If LeBron thought Jimmy Butler was a tough defender, add about three inches of height and a stronger, more athletic frame.

Rest assured, the Pacers are better than they were a season ago, when they took a Chris Bosh-less Heat squad to six games. The defense has been worlds better (No. 1 in the league) and despite a recession in offense, their point differential, which research shows as a stronger indicator of quality than record, has improved overall since last season.

The bottom line is that whether the Heat face the Knicks or Pacers, they'll need James and a limited Dwyane Wade to both raise their game. Both of their postseason player efficiency ratings have dipped from the regular season (minus 4.3 points and minus 6.4 points, respectively). The Heat are the safer bet to reach the Finals than the Grizzlies, but just ask the Oklahoma City Thunder about how fragile championship aspirations can be.
 
I have Heat-Grizz myself. I really like how the Grizzlies look right now. Have kind of a 2011 Mavs outta nowhere look to them.
 
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@ByTimReynolds In case you were wondering, the Jason Kidd scoring watch has now entered its 26th day.
@ByTimReynolds 187 NBA players have scored since Jason Kidd last scored. Including someone named Julyan Stone, who I swear I had never heard of.
@ByTimReynolds Jason Kidd shot 12 percent in the playoffs, missed his last 18 attempts and didn't score in his final 208:30 of court time.
@ByTimReynolds Jason Kidd had the third-worst postseason shooting percentage (minimum 25 shots) in NBA history. The two worst played in 1947.
@jphanned Knicks now -36 with Kidd on the court in the playoffs, +67 with him off. Hasn't scored in 208:30 and counting.
 
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Woodson's absurd loyalty and stubbornness with certain guys.
 
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