R.I.P Trayvon

In the court of law where only 1 person is alive to tell the story, in a backwards *** state.... He is clearly going to get off

If you use COMMON SENSE... This paranoid man initiated a confrontation and killed an unarmed person. It's clear as day. Lawyers are paid to mind **** people and argue. If you really just sit down and think about what happened, it's beyond obvious.




People like to play devils advocate and some people simply enjoy the back and forth of an argument. But.... C'mon he did that ****. Just like OJ did that ****. Just like Casey Anthony did that ****.
 
Shady said:
Elpablo21 said:
problem is he shouldnt follow anyone (regardless of race) and call the cops (and not the non emergency line) if he believed a person was up to something serious
Click to expand...
Zimmerman had every right to follow and verbally interact with Martin that night. There are absolutely ZERO laws against those actions, and neither following, nor verbally interacting with Martin pushes the situation up the force scale.

Could it have made Martin nervous? Sure, but had both men acted maturely, the fight would not have happened.

From the point of view of the law, SOMEONE threw a punch. We don't know who it was, but its the only thing that really matters here. Had Zimmerman punched Martin first, Zimmerman would be guilty of at least manslaughter, if not outright murder.

BUT, if Martin threw the first punch, then Zimmerman is guilty of nothing but self defense, and under Florida law is immune from all criminal and civil prosecution.

Once again, we don't know who threw the first punch, and as such, we don't know who is at fault.

What everyone flat out arguing for Martin does not understand is that the only thing that matters is what happened from a legal perspective.

We all have heard from the media what might have happened had Zimmerman been in the wrong... yes, he might have killed martin in cold blood, but there are alternate narratives based on the evidence, one of which in fact is what Zimmerman has claimed all along.

Lets look at the last one though that nobody seems to be talking about.

Lets say that Martin does understand the laws, and realizes that if he attacks Zimmerman, he will be in the wrong. He still wants to make sure that Zimmerman is not some creeper, so he doubles back and confronts Zimmerman head on. Once again, Martin knows the laws and realizes that he can't just attack Zimmerman unprovoked, so he identifies himself, uses as much strong language as he likes, but eventually Zimmerman figures out that Martin lives where he does, and Martin figures out that Zimmerman is just trying to protect everyone in the neighborhood. Both men walk away unharmed, and the gun never comes into play.

The law is VERY cut and dry... very binary. It leaves absolutely no room for morals or ethics.

Once again, I know that nobody likes hearing this, but the Law is the only thing that matters here. It basically boils down to this: "if you are the aggressor, and your actions could cause grave bodily harm or death, then you are taking your life into your own hands, because the person you are attacking has every right to do whatever is necessary to defend themselves. That includes taking your life."

Neither you, or I know who threw the first punch that night. But... given that head injuries are disorienting, and given that pounding a head on concrete is fully capable of killing someone, then Zimmerman would very likely have been "scared for his life" as is required by law to justify lethal force. If he initiated the use of force... not the encounter, but use of force, then he would be guilty of at least manslaughter, if not murder.

If Martin initiated use of force, then sadly the law says that Zimmerman is justified in taking Martin's life.

Also, for race discussion people may want to refer to this page and duly note the parents have withdrawn by their lawyer that this case is not about racial profiling:http://www.nydailynews.com/news/nat...cution-star-witness-grilled-article-1.1384074
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but the law doesnt require a physical altercation to start for you to feel threatened for your life

How come being chased by an unknown grown man not apply to TM to eventually "stand his ground" is my question?

I understand your POV, because  this case seems to be basing the guilt on who was the physical initiator first, and you're right nobody knows who truly threw it first..

but nothing in the law says you need to be punched first to then feel like your life is threatened as well
Zimmerman had every right to follow and verbally interact with Martin that night. There are absolutely ZERO laws against those actions, and neither following, nor verbally interacting with Martin pushes the situation up the force scale.

Could it have made Martin nervous? Sure, but had both men acted maturely, the fight would not have happened.
Click to expand...
Lets look at the last one though that nobody seems to be talking about.

Lets say that Martin does understand the laws, and realizes that if he attacks Zimmerman, he will be in the wrong. He still wants to make sure that Zimmerman is not some creeper, so he doubles back and confronts Zimmerman head on. Once again, Martin knows the laws and realizes that he can't just attack Zimmerman unprovoked, so he identifies himself, uses as much strong language as he likes, but eventually Zimmerman figures out that Martin lives where he does, and Martin figures out that Zimmerman is just trying to protect everyone in the neighborhood. Both men walk away unharmed, and the gun never comes into play.
Click to expand...
I could easily say Zimmerman should have kept himself away from TM, just like the many other calls he made against suspicious activity,What did TM do differently for him to give chase this time around when he did not pursue in the same instances before?

Had he acted in a more mature manner, the fight may have not happen either..he could have kept his distance, or like I've said before stayed in his car, called the authorities and never let this happen. The "if" game gets neither side anywhere at this point
 
I tried to stay out of here but the arguments are beyond belief....
So it's not against the law to follow somebody
So you telling me somebody is following you to your home and you have no idea of their intentions, you are just going to turn around and have a rational discussion with them like an adult
FOH with this non sense...
Yes this is an emotional case because people fail to see a black mans life ain't worth ish
This kid did nothing wrong, he wasnt casing homes, this "boy" was going home to chill and some entitled nitwit took it upon himsel to play a character out of the movie kick-***
Why can't people see this for what it is??
Yes TM parents say this is not racial but they are being politically correct because anytime a person of color says that, instantly we are crying wolf, it's all in our heads and we live in a post racial non sense is spewed...
These people want justice for their child so it's better for them to say this in hopes of an conviction ....
Stop playing devils advocate and fake Perry Masons' because none of your points are logically or hold any substantial meaning because guaranteed some of you have been drinking the kool aid and smashing different ethnicities of chicks got you feeling comfortable in life
Facts:
Kid was just minding his business
GZ is clearly a low life racist prick( next people are going to say the phone call was doctored...smh)
All of this could have and should have been avoided, none of this had to happen just like Oscar Grant and other individuals these past few years
I guess the kid in the car in the parking lot that was shot by a white man for not turning down loud music deserved that too
GZ will walk simply because the justice system does not favor black people
Yeah I said it
They build prisons to keep us in
Destroyed our family structure
Perpetuate stereotypes through bogus media propaganda
And monolithically paint brush all black males as over sexualized, thugged out beast( we don't help or cause by selling our souls for that dead, green white man paper)
Don't give a flying**** about being flamed but this thread truly shows me that no matter what I will always be guilty for being born a proud black man and if I chose to fight the system or move into a nice home I better walk around we my deed, hoa fees and title so I won't be killed by a wanna be community watch captain
Though with this....
 
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And u can't start a fight lose, and shoot someone

Or I guess you can. That's the funny part about all of this. It essentially says, start a fight, take a few hits, blast away
 
Something else that comes to mind....If gz is a neighborhood watchmen...how can he be effective if he doesn't know the name of the streets in HIS neighborhood? Also in particular where the incident took place, claiming he couldn't give them a street name and address, to which the street he lives on.

Im sorry it can be pitch black raining...but if im walking in my neighborhood, i would recognize my street. For him to not know the name of the street he lives on. I wonder why didn't the prosecuters address this.
 
ohmygosher said:
^

What would addressing it prove?
Click to expand...
that the story is being embellished if not outright a lie. To the poster below me...they touched on it barely. If im the prosecutors, im str8 up asking how can one be an effective neighborhood watch captain, when they do not know the names of a 3 street neighborhood, in which the main road which leads to the other 2 streets, btw you LIVE on.

It would imply that he isn't much of a neighborhood watchperson at all. And he did not take his job serious at all, or that his so called titled position was just that a title.
 
Yeah I wasn't buying the "I have a really bad memory" he used to justify him not remembering three street names. Meanwhile, dude remembers where his hands were, where Trayvon's hands were, etc. That was hard to swallow.
 
CelticsFan9783 said:
Yeah I wasn't buying the "I have a really bad memory" he used to justify him not remembering three street names. Meanwhile, dude remembers where his hands were, where Trayvon's hands were, etc. That was hard to swallow.
Click to expand...
hell i smoke hella weed....hell im on kush cookies now but if you asked me to name my street i could easily do so... Unless he is suggesting he got hit so hard with a single punch that in a sense disoriented him or gave him a temporary memory lapse. And if that's the case how credible can his story be?
 
mugen81 said:
Stop playing devils advocate and fake Perry Masons' because none of your points are logically or hold any substantial meaning because guaranteed some of you have been drinking the kool aid and smashing different ethnicities of chicks got you feeling comfortable in life
 
Click to expand...
Originally Posted by mugen81

I tried to stay out of here but the arguments are beyond belief....
So it's not against the law to follow somebody
So you telling me somebody is following you to your home and you have no idea of their intentions, you are just going to turn around and have a rational discussion with them like an adult
FOH with this non sense...
Yes this is an emotional case because people fail to see a black mans life ain't worth ish
This kid did nothing wrong, he wasnt casing homes, this "boy" was going home to chill and some entitled nitwit took it upon himsel to play a character out of the movie kick-***
Why can't people see this for what it is??
Yes TM parents say this is not racial but they are being politically correct because anytime a person of color says that, instantly we are crying wolf, it's all in our heads and we live in a post racial non sense is spewed...
These people want justice for their child so it's better for them to say this in hopes of an conviction ....
Facts:
Kid was just minding his business
GZ is clearly a low life racist prick( next people are going to say the phone call was doctored...smh)
All of this could have and should have been avoided, none of this had to happen just like Oscar Grant and other individuals these past few years
I guess the kid in the car in the parking lot that was shot by a white man for not turning down loud music deserved that too
GZ will walk simply because the justice system does not favor black people
Yeah I said it
They build prisons to keep us in
Destroyed our family structure
Perpetuate stereotypes through bogus media propaganda
And monolithically paint brush all black males as over sexualized, thugged out beast( we don't help or cause by selling our souls for that dead, green white man paper)
Don't give a flying**** about being flamed but this thread truly shows me that no matter what I will always be guilty for being born a proud black man and if I chose to fight the system or move into a nice home I better walk around we my deed, hoa fees and title so I won't be killed by a wanna be community watch captain
Though with this....
Click to expand...
Dispatcher: "What race is he?" Zimmerman: "I don't know, black maybe?"

The first and only time racism was brought up was by Trayvon Martin stating that there was a "creepy *** cracker".

Zimmerman is not even white he is Hispanic.

It seems most of NT has an ax to grind, so no point in trying to have a logical debate.
 
lol zimmerman is only "hispanic" by census. there's nothing "hispanic" about him. FOH w/ that.
 
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jecca650 said:
lol zimmerman is only "hispanic" by census. there's nothing "hispanic" about him. FOH w/ that.
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Mother Peruvian/Afro-Peruvian, Father is American of German descent. If you do not consider Zimmerman to be Hispanic than Obama cannot be considered black under your standard.
 
like i said "hispanic" by census. :wink:




i am 100% latino bruh and the latino community aint riding with this BAN..
 
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um but he is white..... no one is discussing his heritage or his family lineage. And white/black I don't really see the relevance of gz race.

But the evidence from the police showed he made several calls on suspicion of potential trouble to which all were black. I don't know the race ratio of that area, but the prosecutors are using this fact to paint a picture that gz thinks all blacks are potential trouble makers.
 
shoelyesses said:
that the story is being embellished if not outright a lie. To the poster below me...they touched on it barely. If im the prosecutors, im str8 up asking how can one be an effective neighborhood watch captain, when they do not know the names of a 3 street neighborhood, in which the main road which leads to the other 2 streets, btw you LIVE on.

It would imply that he isn't much of a neighborhood watchperson at all. And he did not take his job serious at all, or that his so called titled position was just that a title.
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More importantly, it implies that he is lying.
 
This is such a stupid argument.

George said he was white, the police said he was white, Trayvon obviously thought he was white. Everybody who is directly involved in this situation perceives this man as being white and if you polled the jury and lawyers I'm willing to bet they would to.

Fact is race in America is about perception.  Why do people like Obama and J. Cole consider themselves black, even though they're both technically half white and were raised by white mothers? Because THAT is how the dominate culture perceives them, they've been treated like black men, they've gone through many of the same experiences as black men, harassment, racism, etc.

We know Florida has a history of racism. The reason why race is even a factor in this case is because in the beginning charges weren't filed on Zimmerman and it seemed very suspect that a (perceived) white male killed a black boy and basically went home like it was all cool.  Why did ppl factor in race? Because (true or not) it appeared to be another case of white privilege and a lack of value placed upon a black boys life.  Lets be honest for a minute, if Trayvon and GZ switched races, would this case have gone the same way, would the same people have donated all that money for GZ's defense, would it have taken all those weeks to file charges?.....HELL NO.  Even if GZ looked like George Lopez would this situation be the same?..Probably not.

Race is and will probably always be a factor in this country, and it will ALWAYS be about perception, how does the dominate culture view you.  And for the purposes of this case GZ is viewed by the dominate culture as a white male and associates HIMSELF as such.  

Peace.

Edit: Last point, don't tell me anything about what the damn "census" says because anybody with common sense knows the census is extremely flawed.  Persons from the Middle East and North Africa are still considered "white" by the census and y'all know damn well DJ Khaled isn't perceived as a white man in this country 
laugh.gif
 
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RealLive301 said:
This is such a stupid argument.

George said he was white, the police said he was white, Trayvon obviously thought he was white. Everybody who is directly involved in this situation perceives this man as being white and if you polled the jury and lawyers I'm willing to bet they would to.

Fact is race in America is about perception.  Why do people like Obama and J. Cole consider themselves black, even though they're both technically half white and were raised by white mothers? Because THAT is how the dominate culture perceives them, they've been treated like black men, they've gone through many of the same experiences as black men, harassment, racism, etc.

We know Florida has a history of racism. The reason why race is even a factor in this case is because in the beginning charges weren't filed on Zimmerman and it seemed very suspect that a (perceived) white male killed a black boy and basically went home like it was all cool.  Why did ppl factor in race? Because (true or not) it appeared to be another case of white privilege and a lack of value placed upon a black boys life.  Lets be honest for a minute, if Trayvon and GZ switched races, would this case have gone the same way, would the same people have donated all that money for GZ's defense, would it have taken all those weeks to file charges?.....HELL NO.  Even if GZ looked like George Lopez would this situation be the same?..Probably not.

Race is and will probably always be a factor in this country, and it will ALWAYS be about perception, how does the dominate culture view you.  And for the purposes of this case GZ is viewed by the dominate culture as a white male and associates HIMSELF as such.  

Peace.

Edit: Last point, don't tell me anything about what the damn "census" says because anybody with common sense knows the census is extremely flawed.  Persons from the Middle East and North Africa are still considered "white" by the census and y'all know damn well DJ Khaled isn't perceived as a white man in this country 
laugh.gif
Click to expand...
Please stop you're being too real. 
 
DubA169 said:
In the court of law where only 1 person is alive to tell the story, in a backwards *** state.... He is clearly going to get off

If you use COMMON SENSE... This paranoid man initiated a confrontation and killed an unarmed person. It's clear as day. Lawyers are paid to mind **** people and argue. If you really just sit down and think about what happened, it's beyond obvious.




People like to play devils advocate and some people simply enjoy the back and forth of an argument. But.... C'mon he did that ****. Just like OJ did that ****. Just like Casey Anthony did that ****.
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the hyper-analyzing of the case is incredible. dudes zooming in too far to get a clear pic of what happened. 

from what i gather, 911 told him to mind his own business ---> confronted dude anyway ------> got whooped --------> killed a teen who had no weapon on him. Whats really to analyze? Did Trayvon break into his house? Did he try to steal Zimmermans car? There was no reason to confront him, let alone kill him.
 
RealLive301 said:
This is such a stupid argument.

George said he was white, the police said he was white, Trayvon obviously thought he was white. Everybody who is directly involved in this situation perceives this man as being white and if you polled the jury and lawyers I'm willing to bet they would to.

Fact is race in America is about perception.  Why do people like Obama and J. Cole consider themselves black, even though they're both technically half white and were raised by white mothers? Because THAT is how the dominate culture perceives them, they've been treated like black men, they've gone through many of the same experiences as black men, harassment, racism, etc.

We know Florida has a history of racism. The reason why race is even a factor in this case is because in the beginning charges weren't filed on Zimmerman and it seemed very suspect that a (perceived) white male killed a black boy and basically went home like it was all cool.  Why did ppl factor in race? Because (true or not) it appeared to be another case of white privilege and a lack of value placed upon a black boys life.  Lets be honest for a minute, if Trayvon and GZ switched races, would this case have gone the same way, would the same people have donated all that money for GZ's defense, would it have taken all those weeks to file charges?.....HELL NO.  Even if GZ looked like George Lopez would this situation be the same?..Probably not.

Race is and will probably always be a factor in this country, and it will ALWAYS be about perception, how does the dominate culture view you.  And for the purposes of this case GZ is viewed by the dominate culture as a white male and associates HIMSELF as such.  

Peace.


Edit: Last point, don't tell me anything about what the damn "census" says because anybody with common sense knows the census is extremely flawed.  Persons from the Middle East and North Africa are still considered "white" by the census and y'all know damn well DJ Khaled isn't perceived as a white man in this country 
laugh.gif
Click to expand...

CHUUCH.
 
mugen81 said:
I tried to stay out of here but the arguments are beyond belief....
So it's not against the law to follow somebody
So you telling me somebody is following you to your home and you have no idea of their intentions, you are just going to turn around and have a rational discussion with them like an adult
FOH with this non sense...
Yes this is an emotional case because people fail to see a black mans life ain't worth ish
This kid did nothing wrong, he wasnt casing homes, this "boy" was going home to chill and some entitled nitwit took it upon himsel to play a character out of the movie kick-***
Why can't people see this for what it is??
Yes TM parents say this is not racial but they are being politically correct because anytime a person of color says that, instantly we are crying wolf, it's all in our heads and we live in a post racial non sense is spewed...
These people want justice for their child so it's better for them to say this in hopes of an conviction ....
Stop playing devils advocate and fake Perry Masons' because none of your points are logically or hold any substantial meaning because guaranteed some of you have been drinking the kool aid and smashing different ethnicities of chicks got you feeling comfortable in life
Facts:
Kid was just minding his business
GZ is clearly a low life racist prick( next people are going to say the phone call was doctored...smh)
All of this could have and should have been avoided, none of this had to happen just like Oscar Grant and other individuals these past few years
I guess the kid in the car in the parking lot that was shot by a white man for not turning down loud music deserved that too
GZ will walk simply because the justice system does not favor black people
Yeah I said it
They build prisons to keep us in
Destroyed our family structure
Perpetuate stereotypes through bogus media propaganda
And monolithically paint brush all black males as over sexualized, thugged out beast( we don't help or cause by selling our souls for that dead, green white man paper)
Don't give a flying**** about being flamed but this thread truly shows me that no matter what I will always be guilty for being born a proud black man and if I chose to fight the system or move into a nice home I better walk around we my deed, hoa fees and title so I won't be killed by a wanna be community watch captain
Though with this....
Click to expand...
goodness gracious...

Great post.
 
Manti* out here preaching this morning, but I'm still not sure if this **** gets put into evidence....

LOL @ O'Mara debating that GZ's application and homework was his .... the judge literally laughed at that *****
 
George Zimmerman is lying if he said that he didnt know about the "Stand Your Ground" Law. Every person who completes a Concealed Weapons permit in the State of Florida is given a pamphlet outlining the law and when you are legally allowed to use you weapon.
 
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