Official 2013 NBA Offseason Thread

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DT43 said:
You're really gonna bring up regular season games with no pressure? The Cavs weren't playing for anything but the #1 pick last season.


When I said "pressure situations", I was more referring to things like averaging 20-10 in the playoffs leading his team to the second round. Or dropping 30+pts games and lighting teams up from deep late in March/April, while in the midst of a close playoff hunt in the West. Kyrie has not done anything close to that, so how can you even begin to wrap your mind around the idea that he is a better basketball player than Curry?


Or have people completely forgotten what matters in basketball anymore? Does winning not matter now if you have great commercials? I remember dudes on here were saying they would take Irving over Tony Parker. How does one even justify that statement in their mind

I have to give it to NIKE, Pepsi, et al,, the marketing behind Irving is seriously genius.

It's to the point where people are promoting an unproven player over players who have actually proven things on the basketball court, simply because they want to reserve their ticket on the bandwagon/hype train.

For all the marketing that was behind Lebron, even his biggest stans didn't start putting him over Kobe until he actually started going deep in the playoffs. What is happening with Irving right now is unprecedented.
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So curry is better because his team made the playoffs and he had a couple of good games, but you wont bring up his terrible shot selection and the many times his teammates had to step up and bail him out, at the end of the day their stats are identical and kyrie played less mins, curry has more help but only managed to put up 1 more assist than kyrie but hes a better facilitator?
 
DT43 said:
MJsaver said:
^^

It's obvious you like Steph which Is perfectly fine, but the gap between him and kyries body of work is nowhere near as big as it was between Bron and Kobe before Bron went to south beach.

Curry had a great year last year but I still wouldn't call him a proven player just yet.
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Curry has proven that he is a star who can not just lead a team to the playoffs, but elevate his game there as well. That's a huge gap in body of work. There's nothing players are judged on more than their performance in pressure games and the playoffs.


Irving has the All-Star selection and puts up great numbers on a losing team. But he hasn't even been close to making the playoffs yet, or been in a situation where we can evaluate how well he plays under pressure. All of this could change after this season, but right now he's closer to Jrue Holiday than he is to Steph Curry.
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I tried to be respectful because its clear Stephs your boy but damn. You talking like Steph is a perennial all star who consistently makes deep runs into the playoffs with scrubs.

Golden State has a solid roster that Curry is a part of, stop talkin like he's Bron in Cleveland.

The fact that you compared Steph and Kyrie to Kobe and Bron, then called Kyrie closer to J Rue Holiday than Steph is a clear indicator you've got Curry fever.

Another typical NTer who uses extreme examples to try and make a point :smh:
 
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Black Migo said:
DT43 said:
You're really gonna bring up regular season games with no pressure? The Cavs weren't playing for anything but the #1 pick last season.


When I said "pressure situations", I was more referring to things like averaging 20-10 in the playoffs leading his team to the second round. Or dropping 30+pts games and lighting teams up from deep late in March/April, while in the midst of a close playoff hunt in the West. Kyrie has not done anything close to that, so how can you even begin to wrap your mind around the idea that he is a better basketball player than Curry?


Or have people completely forgotten what matters in basketball anymore? Does winning not matter now if you have great commercials? I remember dudes on here were saying they would take Irving over Tony Parker. How does one even justify that statement in their mind

I have to give it to NIKE, Pepsi, et al,, the marketing behind Irving is seriously genius.

It's to the point where people are promoting an unproven player over players who have actually proven things on the basketball court, simply because they want to reserve their ticket on the bandwagon/hype train.

For all the marketing that was behind Lebron, even his biggest stans didn't start putting him over Kobe until he actually started going deep in the playoffs. What is happening with Irving right now is unprecedented.
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So curry is better because his team made the playoffs and he had a couple of good games, but you wont bring up his terrible shot selection and the many times his teammates had to step up and bail him out, at the end of the day their stats are identical and kyrie played less mins, curry has more help but only managed to put up 1 more assist than kyrie but hes a better facilitator?
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"his team made the playoffs and he had a couple good games" stop right there. Kyrie has yet to do any of that so clearly these two players aren't on an equal plane right now.

Their stats may be equal but their on-court impact is not. Irving's team lost 58 games, his stats = empty. Curry's team made the second round of the playoffs, led by his performance.


No offense but you're sounding like you didn't really watch basketball last season bro. Type of dude to just check boxscores on ESPN.com every once in a while and be like "Uhh huhh.. my boy Kyrie balling out there"


MJsaver said:
DT43 said:
MJsaver said:
^^

It's obvious you like Steph which Is perfectly fine, but the gap between him and kyries body of work is nowhere near as big as it was between Bron and Kobe before Bron went to south beach.

Curry had a great year last year but I still wouldn't call him a proven player just yet.
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Curry has proven that he is a star who can not just lead a team to the playoffs, but elevate his game there as well. That's a huge gap in body of work. There's nothing players are judged on more than their performance in pressure games and the playoffs.


Irving has the All-Star selection and puts up great numbers on a losing team. But he hasn't even been close to making the playoffs yet, or been in a situation where we can evaluate how well he plays under pressure. All of this could change after this season, but right now he's closer to Jrue Holiday than he is to Steph Curry.
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I tried to be respectful because its clear Stephs your boy but damn. You talking like Steph is a perennial all star who consistently makes deep runs into the playoffs with scrubs.

Golden State has a solid roster that Curry is a part of, stop talkin like he's Bron in Cleveland.

The fact that you compared Steph and Kyrie to Kobe and Bron, then called Kyrie closer to J Rue Holiday than Steph is a clear indicator you've got Curry fever.

Another typical NTer who uses extreme examples to try and make a point :smh:
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I value winning.. just my personal preference. I feel like the point of basketball is to win games, not put up pretty stats and make commercials. As a win-producing player, Irving is closer to Jrue Holiday than Curry (which isn't an insult btw).
 
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tyonenine said:
If the cavs make the playoffs and get swept by bron....
mean.gif


Another L for Cleveland
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all of cleveland would be crying and begging him to come back, dan gilbert's head might explode if this happens.
 
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In my honest opinion, I feel that Kyrie is the better player. Curry isn't the athlete Kyrie is, which really shows at times, which forces him into below average shots. Was extremely apparent in the playoffs most notably. Steph does have a nice knack for finishing in the paint despite his size and athleticism, but he still isn't nearly as good at getting to the rim and finishing the way Kyrie does. Kyrie is better off the bounce, and I think Kyrie is every bit of the playmaker that Steph is. Neither of them are stalwarts defensively, so that's a moot point.

However, one could say that virtually everything Irving has done in the league thus far has been empty stats or that he is just a talented player that plays half a season for a team who never wins, the epitome of empty stats. Meanwhile, Curry did what he did last year, and got his team all the way to the second round of the playoffs in the West Coast Conference.

So my stance is that while I think Kyrie is the better player out of the two, he has to start finding a way to validate this. He just can't box with Curry. Playoff round wins/performances >>>>Empty, arguably inflated stats.
 
All this extra hype the game is making I expect no more just walking up in the gym and grabbing a seat of my choice. This Sunday should be bananas especially if KD and George show up.

It must be about that time to make that last part of the year charity tax donation because when he lost last sunday (no money involved) he stormed off the court with an attitude poutin, no hand shakes, nothin :smh: Now that money is involved he is liable to do anything if they take another L :D

http://jerseychaser.com/baron-davis-and-the-game-bet-50000-on-drew-league-game/
 
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The Warriors have a pretty good team so it's kinda hard to judge them off team success so far, unless you just wanna lean towards Steph then it fits the argument I guess.

This angle sounds familiar though, like when dudes were hypin up Melo when the nuggets made the playoffs and Cleveland didnt, knowing full damn well the nuggets had a much better talent level on that team.

Feels like splitting hairs when comparing these two, neither is head and shoulders above the other.
 
DT43 said:
"his team made the playoffs and he had a couple good games" stop right there. Kyrie has yet to do any of that so clearly these two players aren't on an equal plane right now.

Their stats may be equal but their on-court impact is not. Irving's team lost 58 games, his stats = empty. Curry's team made the second round of the playoffs, led by his performance.


No offense but you're sounding like you didn't really watch basketball last season bro. Type of dude to just check boxscores on ESPN.com every once in a while and be like "Uhh huhh.. my boy Kyrie balling out there"
I value winning.. just my personal preference. I feel like the point of basketball is to win games, not put up pretty stats and make commercials. As a win-producing player, Irving is closer to Jrue Holiday than Curry (which isn't an insult btw).
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So because he had a better supporting cast makes him a better player? Wins= team

Kyries game is way more mature than stephs, take away currys jumper and make him attack and you got yourself a avg bball player, cant say the same for kyrie because he can finish at the rim
 
Tax conscious Thunder gave 1st rounder Andre Roberson just 80% of his slotted $. Most teams sign 1st rounders to 120% (via @MarkDeeksNBA)

Thunder's financial/tax concerns influence most decisions these days from James Harden down to end of bench.
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When Heisley did this with Xavier Henry a few years ago, he and the organization got ripped apart. :lol: Henry refused to play in summer league because Memphis tried to get him to sign for the 80% of the slotted $. Memphis did offered him 100% of the slotted $ with incentives to get the full 120%. I'm schleep
 
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He is getting 120%in the consecutive years and he should be happy we drafted him in the first round to begin with. He was projected as late 40s to undrafted, DraftExpress doesn't even have a video of him. :lol: Rumor is, the Spurs made a promise to him and the Thunder being obsessed with trying to be the Spurs, traded up to get him early. I'm not 100% sure if we worked him out first or not. He is interesting though, long and athletic and a tremendous rebounder but he's only 6'7 201 and a power forward who can't shoot but again averaged 11rpg at Colorado last yr. Thabo is last yr of his deal and he projects to be a great replacement, without the 3pt shooting, which is immaterial since Thabo forgets how to shoot in the playoffs anyways.

And the Thunder get ripped plenty, and rightfully so, for being cheap bastards and continuing to play that whole, "small market, no money" card even though everyone knows that isn't really the case given their attendance, merchandising, and public funding. Hell, the other 29 owners just paid Bennett and his boys back money for KD's contract and we still ain't signing nobody because we're calling dudes offering them 894k to avoid the tax. Missed out on Miller because we didn't want to give him the 2nd yr since the NBA only gives the veteran minimum reimbursement for 1 yr on his contract. IIRC, it's like 300k, the difference between 894 and whatever Miller's minimum is based on years of experience which is like ~1.3 mil.
 
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I don't get this Steph vs. Kyrie debate, at least why you have to put down one to praise another.

Kyrie has a ton of potential and will eventually be an elite PG for a long time.

Steph has proven more on a better team and will probably keep on getting better.

Both are a lot of fun to watch.
 
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Don't act like J Wall wasnt hyped up like hell coming outta Kentucky. He hasn't showed much improvement yet and that's why you don't hear his name like Kyrie who's been ballin (team performance aside)
 
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Black Migo said:
DT43 said:
"his team made the playoffs and he had a couple good games" stop right there. Kyrie has yet to do any of that so clearly these two players aren't on an equal plane right now.

Their stats may be equal but their on-court impact is not. Irving's team lost 58 games, his stats = empty. Curry's team made the second round of the playoffs, led by his performance.


No offense but you're sounding like you didn't really watch basketball last season bro. Type of dude to just check boxscores on ESPN.com every once in a while and be like "Uhh huhh.. my boy Kyrie balling out there"
I value winning.. just my personal preference. I feel like the point of basketball is to win games, not put up pretty stats and make commercials. As a win-producing player, Irving is closer to Jrue Holiday than Curry (which isn't an insult btw).
Click to expand...

So because he had a better supporting cast makes him a better player? Wins= team

Kyries game is way more mature than stephs, take away currys jumper and make him attack and you got yourself a avg bball player, cant say the same for kyrie because he can finish at the rim
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You're talking about taking away Curry's jumper like that isn't one of the hardest things to do in the NBA. Curry has a super quick release and a million different ways he can get a shot off, that's why he's so effective. Dude isn't some Novak standing in the corner shooting threes. He can shoot off the bounce, shoot it off screens, he is incredible at playing off the ball and is one of those sneaky players who always frees themselves up for open shots (does the 'mature' Irving have an off-ball game at all???)


I watched the playoffs and I saw Curry play at a level I have yet to see from Irving. I saw Curry CARRY his team to wins with my own eyes, that's why I think he is the better player. That's my opinion from actually watching both players play and not just reading boxscores.

For the record, I think Irving will end up being a better player in the long run. But right now Curry is better. Everyone will have their own opinion, that's just how I see it.

Big J 33 said:
I don't get this Steph vs. Kyrie debate, at least why you have to put down one to praise another.

Kyrie has a ton of potential and will eventually be an elite PG for a long time.

Steph has proven more on a better team and will probably keep on getting better.

Both are a lot of fun to watch.
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I personally like both players. I actually think Kyrie will be better in the long run. I don't have a problem with Kyrie, I just have a problem with supposed basketball fans saying an unproven player is better than a proven (relatively) one. What's the point of even watching ball, if you aren't going to give credit where it's due to players who have elevated their game?

Curry has outperformed Irving, he deserves that respect right now. When Irving starts performing at a higher level he will get his respect as well.
 
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Big J 33 said:
I don't get this Steph vs. Kyrie debate, at least why you have to put down one to praise another.

Kyrie has a ton of potential and will eventually be an elite PG for a long time.

Steph has proven more on a better team and will probably keep on getting better.

Both are a lot of fun to watch.
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Too sensible for around here, bro. Where do you think you are?
 
rck2sactown said:
Bennett=the new Maloof
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He's more 90's/00's Sterling to me. Because we draft/develop talent great, but then just send them elsewhere in lieu of paying them. Even dudes we drafted then traded panned out well like Pondexter and Bledsoe. I wish we could trade owners with another team
 
According to a report in Argentina, Luis Scola traded to the Indiana Pacers.  Danny Granger on his way to Phoenix.  Money doesn't match.  "Will be announced tomorrow"
 
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