2013-2014 NBA Thread - IND @ WAS and OKC @ LAC on ESPN

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So with this superstar argument, were y'all saying the same thing about Dirk when he got his MVP before he got his ring? It seems KD is heading in that category, since it's likely he'll have an MVP and one finals appearance. 


Only thing that seperates a Star from a Superstar is talent level and impact on the game, not championships.

Durant is a superstar weather he has a ring or not because he's already a historically great player at 25 and has a global impact on the NBA in its golden era.

A ring is only going to solidify what he is to those not fully aware and the brain dead media types, basically like 55% of this thread.
 
So people never going to understand it takes a team to win a title?

Doesn't matter how elite you are as a player, MIA has 3 HOF level talents. So do the Spurs, Bulls in the 90's, Lakers/Celts in the 80's, Sixers in the 80's, see where this trend is going?

Durant Westbrook Harden Ibaka...yeah he didn't have a team. Heat 4 OKC 1. Y'all act like that Thunder team was A Is Sixers.
 
its just the way it is and the way it always has been. if you want to be at the top of the nba legend's list you have to win multiple championships

when you win championships they define your career, when you dont that defines your career.

theres a reason kobe is trying so hard after 18 years just to tie jordan with 6 rings

theres a reason why mj thinks kobe > lebron because of rings

theres a reason why magic and bird are about equal basketball players but bird says magic was better only because he won more rings

look at all the slander payton manning gets for only having 1 ring

teamsport or not, winning a championship is what makes legends
 
I really don't think its foolish. I really think it comes down to who ultimately gets the job done at the end of the post season.


As great as Charles Barkley is, you know the difference between him and MJ. Between Patrick Ewing and Kareem.


I really think people give these guys who haven't achieved the ultimate goal too much credit in comparison to the guys that have.


Favorites aside. IMO you can't put Wolverine on the same level as Superman until he saves the world, b.


People are trying really hard nowadays to discredit the value of winning titles. Giving players just as much, if not more credit than the guys who play just as many games and ultimately, get the job done. KD is not on Lebrons level at the end of the day for that exact reason. And thats the difference between a star and a superstar.

Thank you. Been arguing the same thing for the past 5 pages but you articulated it better than me.
 
This star/superstar **** is about the dumbest **** I've ever read in this thread, and that is saying something. :lol:

Good God.
 
Off track, but if the slander is coming Paul's way, if Houston don't make it out the first round, Dwight ain't gonna have a nice summer neither.

I think both will recover and get this series, it's only 1 damn game, but if not.....they both gonna hear a ton of crap.

And he's another one that could lean on an excuse :lol: it's gotta be exhausting having someone blow by Harden almost every possession and cleaning up that mess.

I'm not saying the slander wouldn't be 100% unwarranted but the act that he has been the sole reason for playoff failures in LA and the dismissal of his carrying of NO all those years is ridiculous to me. There's always an excuse for Blake being injured like everyone else is this time of year.


As much love as I have for Steph's game, there's no way in hell he's better than CP3. But everyone is "what have you shown me lately" and infatuated with one side of the play in the NBA, so there's no point in even going back and forth about it.
people say melo is the sole reason for playoff failures every year though

same with lebron when he doesnt win

and kobe when he doesnt win

Again, I'm not saying it's completely unwarranted. But, there is a lot of selective memory going on when it comes to him.

You watch the Knicks playoffs the last two years, you'll see that while he was a big part of their wins he is also a gigantic part of there losses with his refusals to pass and inability to defend. If you're going to hold it against CP that he puts his teammates in the best position to succeed and make open shots and they continue to falter, then that's where we'll have to agree to disagree.

There is a HUGE difference between shooting your team out of games and taking your teammates ability to impact games away like Melo and Kobe have been known to do/accused of over the years than having below average and even star teammates continue to shrink in the big moment.
 
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Skip really said that CP isn't elite though? 
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I was ok with the not being a superstar until you have the ring and all, but to say he isn't elite and/or the best pg in the game right now is crazy. 

Can you really say anything about Barkley and Ewing not having rings, when 1 man single-handedly kept them from winning rings? Oh and those 2 years for HOU thrown in there too 
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I could see if it was a different team every year or every other year getting the title and you are still left with nothing, but for one man (the greatest of all time at that) to play in your era and win everything, means Reggie Miller wasn't a superstar/elite, Gary Payton, Karl Malone, Stockton, Ewing, Dominique Wilkins, insert anyone to play during the 90s was not a superstar...Only Jordan, Hakeem, & Pippen
 
Only thing that seperates a Star from a Superstar is talent level and impact on the game, not championships.

Durant is a superstar weather he has a ring or not because he's already a historically great player at 25 and has a global impact on the NBA in its golden era.

A ring is only going to solidify what he is to those not fully aware and the brain dead media types, basically like 55% of this thread.

So only your definition of Superstar is valid and everyone else who has a different opinion of what makes a Superstar is wrong.

Ok got it.
 
Durant Westbrook Harden Ibaka...yeah he didn't have a team. Heat 4 OKC 1. Y'all act like that Thunder team was A Is Sixers.


That Thunder team was great but they went up against 3 HOF'ers who were better with a better coach and homecourt advantage. :lol:

You expect KD to waltz in at 23 and win his first title? Especially when that 3rd link, Harden disappeared? :lol: @ mentioning Ibaka in 2012.

Stop the revisionist history man.
 
it's gotta be exhausting having someone blow by Harden almost every possession and cleaning up that mess.

How much would you pay to see a guy blow past Harden, and Dwight simply turn and raise his arm out to let the man pass like a doorman? I'd be down for a 50, just to see Dwight turn and look at James like: "I can do that too.....*Superman smile* " .
 
So people never going to understand it takes a team to win a title?

Doesn't matter how elite you are as a player, MIA has 3 HOF level talents. So do the Spurs, Bulls in the 90's, Lakers/Celts in the 80's, Sixers in the 80's, see where this trend is going?

KD doesn't have a team?

Really?
 
So only your definition of Superstar is valid and everyone else who has a different opinion of what makes a Superstar is wrong.

Ok got it.

Yea I'd think so, because mine actually makes sense from the capabilities of an individual player and that's all individual status should be based on.

After seeing your Thunder post, I couldn't care less what you think. :lol:
 
 
Durant Westbrook Harden Ibaka...yeah he didn't have a team. Heat 4 OKC 1. Y'all act like that Thunder team was A Is Sixers.

That Thunder team was great but they went up against 3 HOF'ers who were better with a better coach and homecourt advantage.
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You expect KD to waltz in at 23 and win his first title? Especially when that 3rd link, Harden disappeared?
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@ mentioning Ibaka in 2012.

Stop the revisionist history man.
To add to your point, they were a young team and it was their first time. If you had that mix now, the outcome would be dramatically different. To contrast what you alluded to, Magic did it at 19....
 
That Thunder team was great but they went up against 3 HOF'ers who were better with a better coach and homecourt advantage. :lol:

You expect KD to waltz in at 23 and win his first title? Especially when that 3rd link, Harden disappeared? :lol: @ mentioning Ibaka in 2012.

Stop the revisionist history man.

Thunder lost that series because they basically just shot jumpers. They didn't and still don't have a low post guy that can back his man down and get an easy 2 pts. Ibaka still takes jumpers and perkins is just there for defense and blocking shots.
 
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That wasn't the argument though. KD is a superstar. Famous and 2nd best player in the NBA. Kobe is also a superstar but to skips point Durant hasn't earned what Kobe has nor Lebron. 4 MVPs 2 championships Durant 0 MVPs 0 championships. Skips point was on court accolades. Basically win something and be great and your a superstar to him. Just being great doesn't cut it.

Point taken, but lumping him in the "Melo, Cp3, Howard" category, like somebody else said, is foolish.

And even still we know how lebron got his rings, by teaming up with two other all-stars in a very weak conference. So are we really gonna put THAT much weight into "rings".

(Not saying LeBron is in any way "wrong" for what he did. Just making a point)
 
Was wondering why this thread jumped so many pages today.

Dudes First Take-ified this thread with this "who is a Superstar" nonsense.
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Skip won.
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:rolleyes the whole post up / jumpers thing again :rolleyes The Heat were better and better coached, hell they won with jumpers, 3s to be exact. Nobody on either team was doing work in the post.
 
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That Thunder team was great but they went up against 3 HOF'ers who were better with a better coach and homecourt advantage. :lol:

You expect KD to waltz in at 23 and win his first title? Especially when that 3rd link, Harden disappeared? :lol: @ mentioning Ibaka in 2012.

Stop the revisionist history man.

Question. If KD never plays on a team you feel can compete and all his parts aren't playing up to par (Harden excuse) and never wins a ring, your giving him a career pass and he will be in Kobe LeBron and MJs class because he puts up numbers?
 
 
Durant Westbrook Harden Ibaka...yeah he didn't have a team. Heat 4 OKC 1. Y'all act like that Thunder team was A Is Sixers.



That Thunder team was great but they went up against 3 HOF'ers who were better with a better coach and homecourt advantage. :lol:


You expect KD to waltz in at 23 and win his first title? Especially when that 3rd link, Harden disappeared? :lol: @ mentioning Ibaka in 2012.


Stop the revisionist history man.
To add to your point, they were a young team and it was their first time. If you had that mix now, the outcome would be dramatically different. To contrast what you alluded to, Magic did it at 19....

"Magic had Kareem doe. The game was different back then doe" :lol:

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Ultimately, I'm not taking anything away form KD's accolades and his skill at the game. But I just really don't think he's at that table yet. And I feel a lot of dudes get that label and don't deserve it either. Especially if I think KD doesn't deserve it.

But whatever. What do I know. I just have an opinion. I forgot that when you don't agree with dudes when speaking on opinions, you're an idiot and they are the know all be all.

I do find it funny when people say they hate first take but still watch it every morning :lol:

Man I love that ****. Entertainment.
 
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