Official 2014 State of The Union Address

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oh dear god lol

on that note, I'll see y'all around the boards tomorrow

I've seen enough for tonight.
 
011781 said:
you really think the opposition wanted or would allow a "black" president to succeed?

you can't tell me the tea party isn't making **** in DC a lot more complicated

all we can do is GM from the sideline.. I have my opinions and you have yours
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Thing is these aren't opinions. I am giving facts on why Obama is not succeeding. All the things I said can be qualified and quantified. The way Obama came into office he was destined to fail. But like so many office holders before him he thought he had the public in his hand because he had a decisive victory. He thought that political capital would get him threw anything. An that is not the case. He didn't forsee the fickleness of the American public. Seasoned pols know this fact though. The "what have you done for me lately factor?" He thought he could remain a Washington outsider and truly change it without actually utilitizing those that are already in Washington.

I'm not trying to debate you bro. Just educate you. An skin color doesn't mean ****. There have been numerous blacks that have been successful in Washington on both sides of the aisle. Why? Because they knew how to play the game.
 
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011781 said:
oh dear god lol

on that note, I'll see y'all around the boards tomorrow

I've seen enough for tonight.
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Bandit Country said:
011781 said:
what does it say about all the other economists and universities that forecast the min wage increase as having no real negative impact on unemployment?

all fools?
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Why are you dodging the question? Why not make the minimum wage $100 an hour?

BTW, I think I'll go with Bill Gates' take on the matter over Krugman's. :wink:

http://www.ijreview.com/2014/01/110131-answer-msnbc-host-looking-bill-gates-raising-minimum-wage/
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the possibilities would be endless with $1000 dollar minimum wage. people can spend more!! flood the economy with more money and create more jobs. worked quite well during weimar germany and zimbabwe
 
Bandit Country said:
I miss Rashi. :frown:
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dude got that austrian econ swag

@011781

“Unfortunately, the real minimum wage is always zero, regardless of the laws, and that is the wage that many workers receive in the wake of the creation or escalation of a government-mandated minimum wage, because they lose their jobs or fail to find jobs when they enter the labor force. Making it illegal to pay less than a given amount does not make a worker’s productivity worth that amount—and, if it is not, that worker is unlikely to be employed.”

― Thomas Sowell, Basic Economics: A Citizen's Guide to the Economy
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“Reduced employment opportunities is one effect of minimum wage legislation. The minimum wage law has imposed incalculable harm on the disadvantaged members of our society. The only moral thing to do is to repeal it.” — Walter Williams
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Host Charles Payne asked whether Williams was inferring that unions have been part of a “covert plan” to keep black people from getting the better paying jobs? Williams said yes.

“Well, they always have done that,” Williams said. “If you look at the justification for the David-Bacon Act, which is the federal minimum wage or super minimum-wage if you look at the legislative debate in 1931 unions were major supporters and they want to protect white workers from having to compete with black workers in construction.”

Overall, Williams emphasized his point that government rules and regulations are an enemy of working people.
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@Rico x Hood If Obama's the Black Jimmy Carter, then who's Reagan?
laugh.gif
 
Rico x Hood said:
Thing is these aren't opinions. I am giving facts on why Obama is not succeeding. All the things I said can be qualified and quantified. The way Obama came into office he was destined to fail. But like so many office holders before him he thought he had the public in his hand because he had a decisive victory. He thought that political capital would get him threw anything. An that is not the case. He didn't forsee the fickleness of the American public. Seasoned pols know this fact though. The "what have you done for me lately factor?" He thought he could remain a Washington outsider and truly change it without actually utilitizing those that are already in Washington.

I'm not trying to debate you bro. Just educate you. An skin color doesn't mean ****. There have been numerous blacks that have been successful in Washington on both sides of the aisle. Why? Because they knew how to play the game.
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our definition of "opinion" must be different then... 

"he thought his decisive victory meant the public was in his hand"

"he didn't forsee the fickle American public" 

etc etc... 

all sound like your personal opinions... 

how can you put a fact on another man's thought process unless he told you himself that's what he was thinking? 

now, if Obama is on record saying all these things you're repeating then ok, I'll agree they're facts.... 

and to say color doesn't matter sounds insane to me... in america? as president?  
 
011781 said:
didn't think a silly *** question like that was even serious or required a response .... 
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Lol. So taking your precious minimum wage to its logical conclusion is silly? Thank you for proving my point.

Btw, how much did McDonalds make last year?
 
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andycrazn said:
011781 said:
Bandit Country said:
Shows he's a short sighted fool. Why shouldn't minimum wage be $60 an hour?
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what does it say about all the other economists and universities that forecast the min wage increase as having no real negative impact on unemployment?

all fools?
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they are paid hacks for a political party (left or right dont matter)

kinda like scientific "studies" on the pros and cons for weed except there is nothing scientific about economics.

any self respecting economist would tell you REAL minimum wage is ZERO
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Word. Just like with stocks, a lot of these dudes put noise out there for their own agendas. Raising minimum wage will lead to job cuts. Do the math. Why would McDonald's pay employees $15+ an hour when a machine can do the same thing as them for less? The uproar should be in folks not acquiring a worthwhile education. Schooling is too predicated on regurgitation, precisely of the frivolous. Kids should've been learning code in middle and high school since 1995.
 
JohnnyRedStorm said:
Word. Just like with stocks, a lot of these dudes put noise out there for their own agendas. Raising minimum wage will lead to job cuts. Do the math. Why would McDonald's pay employees $15+ an hour when a machine can do the same thing as them for less? The uproar should be in folks not acquiring a worthwhile education. Schooling is too predicated on regurgitation, precisely of the frivolous. Kids should've been learning code in middle and high school since 1995.
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i understand your point, but even with complete automation there would still be plenty of minimum wage type jobs out there (mostly in the service industry that cannot be automated). in that sense wouldnt a minimum wage be necessary for people to just get by (im no economics person so feel free to correct me)
 
frink85 said:
JohnnyRedStorm said:
Word. Just like with stocks, a lot of these dudes put noise out there for their own agendas. Raising minimum wage will lead to job cuts. Do the math. Why would McDonald's pay employees $15+ an hour when a machine can do the same thing as them for less? The uproar should be in folks not acquiring a worthwhile education. Schooling is too predicated on regurgitation, precisely of the frivolous. Kids should've been learning code in middle and high school since 1995.
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i understand your point, but even with complete automation there would still be plenty of minimum wage type jobs out there (mostly in the service industry that cannot be automated). in that sense wouldnt a minimum wage be necessary for people to just get by (im no economics person so feel free to correct me)
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I should've clarified my stance, certain industries are worthy of wage increases, but those folks demanding more money at McDonald's...they should be demanding training programs so they can move onto better places of employment.
 
JohnnyRedStorm said:
I should've clarified my stance, certain industries are worthy of wage increases, but those folks demanding more money at McDonald's...they should be demanding training programs so they can move onto better places of employment.
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ah k i get you. i remember awhile back in socal there was a grocery bagger strike, while i feel for them....cmon.
 
Bandit Country said:
Lol. So taking your precious minimum wage to its logical conclusion is silly? Thank you for proving my point.

Btw, how much did McDonalds make last year?
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a $30 entry level wage is silly.. 

not even sure what you're even talking by that response. 
 
011781 said:
our definition of "opinion" must be different then... 

"he thought his decisive victory meant the public was in his hand"

"he didn't forsee the fickle American public" 

etc etc... 

all sound like your personal opinions... 

how can you put a fact on another man's thought process unless he told you himself that's what he was thinking? 

now, if Obama is on record saying all these things you're repeating then ok, I'll agree they're facts.... 

and to say color doesn't matter sounds insane to me... in america? as president?  
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There are many books written about Obama's first term in which him and his team discuss how the political climate had changed and they need to figure out other ways to push his agenda. The President had lost a lot of political capital in the 09 healthcare debate. He knew the. American public no longer had the stomach for another drawn out debate so the administration pivoted from "changing" Washington to "reforming". Making things more streamlined, appointing czars, etc.

These realization came when he realized that his election wasn't the referendum he had thought it was. "What have you done for me lately?" Although, he had a huge "Victory" with Obamacare the public did not feel the effects and would not until 2013. This is why his numbers dropped during 09. The people like instant gratification, and based on the actions he took in 09 he made an incorrect political calculation by pursuing ACA. One that he has never really recovered from.

A seasoned pol would know that to take on a change so huge that the proper coalition of Washington wheelers and dealers had to be in place before taking on such a huge undertaking. But the President thought that he would be able to get ACA threw off the strength of public support. Enter the Republican spin machine, and there was no.one on.the Dem side that could quickly and factually counter.

This is of course is just one example but there have been many miscalculations Obama has made and he just doesn't seem to learn from. The biggest being his refusal to let Congressional Dems and Republicans into his inner circle. A legislator is less likely to make problems for you if they have a positive personal relationship with you. The relationship between Regan and Tip O'Neil is proof of this.
 
This ain't 1984 anymore. Running on Reagan is hurting the GOP more than it's helping it.
 
011781 said:
".......Summarizing the studies earlier this year, Paul Krugman -- the Nobel Prize-winning economist -- declared: 'The great preponderance of the evidence... points to little if any negative effect of minimum wage increases on employment.'..."

http://nytimes.com/2013/02/18/opinion/krugman-raise-that-wage.html
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But at the same time, with the ACA, companies are slashing workers hours just so they don't have to pay their healthcare now. You don't think raising the minimum wage would have a similar effect. Corporations are ruthless and all about profit, if they see their cost rising, they will cut expenses somehow, and the most disposable in fact is workers, especially if you are talking about minimum wage jobs.

Put down the sauce and pull your head out of your rear.
 
Raising the minimum wage also increases the cost of living. People have more money they buyer nicer things, might move into a bigger apartment, rent goes up. People that lived in expensive apartments decide to take the plunge and buy homes, house prices go up. Home prices go up and the general area becomes more expensive. An all of a sudden that couple extra dollars you were making goes as far as the money you were previously making. An everyone is in the Exact same position they were in.
 
dudes that are for the increase for minimum wage is nearsighted. they only see the short term effects of the increases and the benefit it has on one group of people but fail to see that it does the exact opposite while does further damage to the economy. but hey they got blame to throw at everyone thats "greedy"
 
Demand for raising the minimum wage is higher than you think, even the red states that wouldn't even consider voting for a Democrat.
 
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