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Official 2016 World Series Chicago Cubs Season Thread: (103-58) - Page 10

post #271 of 3749
Quote:
Originally Posted by SLP Product View Post

^
I like Baez at 2nd, I was hoping to keep Bryant at 3rd but more than likely he'll go to the OF and Russell gets 3rd.

Do you guys think anyone else will get called up this year?
Or do they just wait till next year?
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Baez needs to stay at 2B. Just like what Castro said the other day. They understand each other well.
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post #272 of 3749
Thread Starter 
Cubs have made a waiver claim on 23 year old pitcher Jacob Turner. nerd.gif

My God if Theo pulls this off.
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post #273 of 3749
^
wasn't he a top 20 pick a few years ago?
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post #274 of 3749
Thread Starter 
Top 10 pick in 09, at 18.

He's had moments, but lost a lot also in Florida. Give him to Bosio, who knows what he can get to at 24-25.

And he's a cheap, easy pick up. Theo's 3rd low risk grab in the last month. pimp.gif

We don't have dominant arm prospects to match our bats, but he damn sure is building up depth of young arms. And at no cost. pimp.gif
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post #275 of 3749
Theo nthat.gif
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post #276 of 3749
Thread Starter 
Quote:
Cubs prospect Javier Baez got the call Tuesday and announced his presence with authority. He will likely soon be joined by the likes of Jorge Soler (I'll guess September) and Kris Bryant (I'll guess April), and then later Addison Russell and Albert Almora. He was preceded by Arismendy Alcantara. The Cubs' first-round selection this year was Kyle Schwarber, and he has already been promoted twice. The two Cubs All-Stars this season were Anthony Rizzo and Starlin Castro.

All of those guys have something in common: None of them are pitchers.

In fact, only one of the Cubs' top nine prospects at the midseason update by MLB.com was a pitcher (C.J. Edwards, No. 7).

This information has caused many fans and media alike to treat the Cubs' future like that of Venus de Milo:

THEY HAVE NO ARMS! WHO IS GOING TO PITCH?

This line of thinking blatantly and quite conveniently ignores the ability to add via free agency (Jon Lester?) or trade in the future, of course. Think about the wonders the Cubs have worked on Jake Arrieta, Jason Hammel and Scott Feldman after acquiring them on the cheap, on one hand. On the other, they still have Arrieta and Kyle Hendricks looks like a quality starter as well. I don't think two years ago that many would have believed the Cubs would be able to say that Arrieta and Hendricks were a definite part of the future core, so why should we make the leap to say that the Cubs won't have pitching two years from now? The logic doesn't add up.

Maybe pitching guru Chris Bosio makes something out of Felix Doubront and/or Dan Straily. Maybe the Cubs sign Lester or someone else. Maybe they trade from position-player strength for a stud pitcher. Maybe they just continue to find guys on the cheap like they did in Hammel and Feldman, only keeping them through the season if and when they're in contention.

In my mind, it's far more important to take note of what the Cubs appear to be doing. Whether it was accidental or by design initially, I believe it's an obvious plan now to stockpile position players. In light of the Tommy John epidemic, putting a lot of stock in guys like Jose Fernandez, Matt Harvey, Jarrod Parker, Matt Moore, Patrick Corbin, Kris Medlen -- sigh, this is depressing, isn't it? -- et al means the possibility of having a lost season. In light of second surgeries for Parker, Medlen, Brandon Beachy and Cory Luebke, careers can be altered. By focusing on just throwing together a lineup of mashers and picking your spots with pitching, the risk is thereby minimized.

This isn't to say that the Cubs won't miss on a few position players. Of course they will. Prospects bust. But make no mistake, the Cubs are lining things up all over the diamond with veritable insurance policies. Let's take a stroll around the diamond and look at the options:

C: Schwarber? Many think he can't stick behind the plate and will instead end up in the outfield. So they acquired Victor Caratini from the Braves, who was a second-rounder last season and is playing well in Class A. And, really, Welington Castillo is 27 and he's not awful.

1B: Rizzo. There isn't much need for a backup plan here, but there is Dan Vogelbach down the road.

2B: It looks like Baez. Alcantara is also an option, just as Russell could be.

SS: Castro, though Baez, Alcantara and Russell could all take over if needed. Just for fun, I would like to point out how embarrassing it is to see some people, who have been writing about baseball for decades, be so ignorant in mockingly asking things like, "How many shortstops do they need?" after the trade for Russell. Dustin Pedroia, Manny Machado, Billy Hamilton, Alcantara and Baez -- among so many others throughout history (Ryne Sandberg!) -- were shortstops in the minors.

3B: Bryant is playing third in Triple-A. If he's moved to the outfield, as many believe he will be eventually, Russell, Castro or Baez might slide here. Alcantara has already proven to be plenty versatile, too.

LF: Bryant? Schwarber? Soler? Don't forget about Billy McKinney, a 2013 first-round pick who was acquired along with Russell and Straily in the Jeff Samardzija-Hammel trade. He's hitting .308/.394/.451 with High-A Daytona since the deal.

CF: Alcantara is the plan until (if?) Almora is ready.

RF: Same discussion as left field, though Soler has to be the favorite here, due to arm strength.

This isn't even getting into minor-leaguers who aren't top prospects and could pan out. This isn't including something like a Chris Coghlan (.292/.371/.475 right now)/Justin Ruggiano (.274/.333/.416) platoon for 2015. It's not including useful pieces like Luis Valbuena or the recently traded Emilio Bonifacio. It's not discussing potential outside-the-organization additions in the future. It was just a quick snapshot of the overwhelming depth the Cubs have coming in the near future.

The bottom line is that president Theo Epstein and general manager Jed Hoyer have lined up their chips all over the diamond and appear very ready to pounce with a strong offense here in the next few years. There are multiple, sometimes lucrative insurance policies at every position in case of underperformance.

Obviously, the Cubs will need starting pitching to complement the offense, but they have money to spend in free agency and could eventually deal from position-player strength. Look at the trade deadline to see what big-league position players landed in pitching as an example.

Most of all, though, loading up on position-playing prospects instead of tying their fate to possibly fragile arms seems the safe, smart thing to do, in light of today's climate. It'll be interesting to see how it unfolds moving forward, and if it works, to see how many teams follow suit. While it might not be likely, it's at least possible this is the start of a movement.

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post #277 of 3749
Thread Starter 
While it is true we don’t have a ton of pitching to match the hitting studs we have, Theo has done a tremendous job adding arms, and lots of them.


Right now we have

Jake Arrieta
Travis Wood
Edwin Jackson

Kyle Hendricks (Dempster trade)
Dan Straily (Shark-Hammel trade)
Felix Doubront (Red Sox trade)
Dallas Beeler
Eric Jokisch
Tsuyoshi Wada
Jacob Turner (Marlin waiver claim????)

CJ Edwards, Neil Ramirez and Justin Grimm from the Garza trade

Corey Black (Soriano trade)

Arodys Vizcaino (Maholm trade)

Johnathan Martinez (Barney trade)

Armando Rivera Cuban signing

Drafted
Pierce Johnson 2012
Rob Zastryzny 2013
Jake Stinnett 2014
Carson Sands 2014


With all those arms, they just need to develop 1 or 2 of them for full time starting spots. Not to mention we figure to have a top 3-4 pick next June which could be a college pitcher ready to help within a year or two. We can sign 1-2 FA’s, then use Arrieta and maybe 1-2 other guys and we have a full rotation, plus tons of relievers to use. And we’d still have guys developing in the minors, building a position of depth.

Obviously, we are bat heavy, we have a ton of talent there, and pitching is harder to predict, determine health and what not, but Theo has brought us a TON of options. And Bosio has been amazing building up Shark, Hammel, Arrieta, Ramirez, Maholm, Feldman, etc. If he works his magic on another arm or two, we could get the staff we need to go along with the bats. Still a lot of work to do, but they have pointed to 2015 as the starting point all along, and now, look how close everything is getting. Soler, Bryant, Russell, Almora getting closer by the minute, and Theo has been adding arms everywhere to give us options. This winter, I expect us to be heavy in the pitching market to try and make a run, starting next year, and by 2016, they could be real strong with the extra 2015 experience.

Theo pimp.gif
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post #278 of 3749
Sooooo.....
Is Theo really trying to acquire Cole Hammels???
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post #279 of 3749
Thread Starter 
Quote:
Originally Posted by SLP Product View Post

Sooooo.....
Is Theo really trying to acquire Cole Hammels???

No, not unless they flat out give him to us.

He's merely being practical. Gives him a 2 day window to negotiate, if nothing comes of it, no harm, no foul.

If they like some things, but still not close, can come back in offseason and talk.

Or, Philly can simply pull him back and deal with it later.


Theo is just being smart by making the claim, and seeing if he gets really lucky. (Like Philly just deciding to off load his contract for a minimal return, which, is unlikely, but you still have to try, right?)


In the end, he likely just stays with Philly. Then maybe something happens in the offseason.
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post #280 of 3749
Thread Starter 
Baez and Castro homers back to back. eek.gifpimp.gif
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post #281 of 3749
Maybe I should start to be a little more optimistic! Haha! Couple bombs, man.
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post #282 of 3749
Thread Starter 
Quote:
Originally Posted by Meyer23 View Post

Maybe I should start to be a little more optimistic! Haha! Couple bombs, man.

Just read the last page man. I put in everything that's been said already in here but in actual writer form.

Theo is quietly building up the staff on the lower levels, and when the time comes, he will spend the money to nab a couple high end pitchers, and let the prospects round into form.

He isn't rushing the process, he's letting it play out. pimp.gif
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post #283 of 3749
People are very upset that Baez is getting that lazy Soriano comparison laugh.gif
post #284 of 3749
Thread Starter 
People have been tryin to claim that Jorge Soler is a lackadaisical player and doesn’t care/hustle enough, etc.

I think the hype has gotten too big, so now it’s time to tear down the prospects. laugh.gif

As long as they don’t listen to it, and fight like hell to improve, we should be fine.

Sori had a nice career, if Baez can be anything close to that, he should be fine. (tho, I think Baez will be a better defensive player than Sori was)
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post #285 of 3749
Eh, they just don't watch him then. He just needs to be healthy more often.

His problem is that his bar is gonna be really high because he is probably stuck in a corner.

I think he'll be up in September.
post #286 of 3749
I feel you, man. I don't think we'd would of had our little 'discussion' if I was more clear rather than just spouting off at the mouth saying the Cubs suck. Maybe came off the wrong way (as I said, it was simply sarcasm) and while I stand by that, I really am looking forward to the future but patience is not a strong suit of mine.

No matter I'll still have my doubts about the farm, but I guess if half of them actually do amount to something,they should start being competitive fairly quickly.
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post #287 of 3749
Thread Starter 
JAVIER BAEZ CAN HEAR MEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEE
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post #288 of 3749
Thread Starter 
Soler is def a September call up simply because he's already got a contract, no worries on the whole clock starting and what not.
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post #289 of 3749
Thread Starter 
Pro, you see Neyer just now? He said Baez/Sheffield was a fair compare. That's not terrible.
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post #290 of 3749
Javy Sheffield? ??? Ill take it lol
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post #291 of 3749
Baez nthat.gif
Castro nthat.gif

Hendricks nthat.gif
8 good innings

Im against the Hammel deal. I think we're good for now, no need to add an ace if we're trying to get a top 5 pick.
Theo just kicking the tires.

I'm actually pretty optimistic about some the arms we already have
Arrieta
Wood
Hendricks
CJ
Neil Ramirez
All have potential and low cost. Once we start settling all those bats and we see where everyone is at, I'm sure Theo and Co won't hesitate to write a few checks to bring in some studs.
Hell I think Theo can get us Lackey in the offseason for the low nthat.gif
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post #292 of 3749
Quote:
Originally Posted by CP1708 View Post

Pro, you see Neyer just now? He said Baez/Sheffield was a fair compare. That's not terrible.

Don't take it as an insult to the kid but Neyer needs his ******* eyes checked laugh.gif or he must have forgot.

Power wise maybe. But Sheff had eyes at the plate that were outstanding. Comparing him to a guy that struck out more than he walked FIVE time in twenty one seasons (three in his last four seasons in the majors) and had BB per K rate over 1.3 like eight straight years just seems so unfair to the kid laugh.gif

Soler has the Sheffield hands, he is lightning quick through the zone.
post #293 of 3749
Thread Starter 
Osh agreed with it in terms of hands. I don't think he meant full comparison, but wrist/hands wise I could see it.
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post #294 of 3749
Osh is def right, he has quick hands as well.
post #295 of 3749
Now that Theo has claimed Hamels, do the Cubs loyal have interest in trading valuable assets to Philadelphia for him?
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post #296 of 3749
If I was a fan I wouldn't...but then again...Amaro is an idiot so he might just take something not worth Cole's value laugh.gif I think they're players for Scherzer. Pitching is the easy part.
post #297 of 3749
Thread Starter 
If Philly is givin Cole away, sure, but if they want Almora, no way.

Stick to FA, draft, and reclamation projects. And develop in house like Arrieta, Hendricks, maybe CJ or Ramirez, etc.
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post #298 of 3749
^
Agreed. I rather we keep our prospects and grab some arms thru free agency. Theo has stated numerous times they won't hesitate to write some checks to grab some arms as long as they feel they're in the right spot.

Theo and Jeds days in the bean might help persuade Lackey to come aboard for the low, and I can only hope we land someone like mad Max.
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post #299 of 3749
I think Lackey has already verbally committed to pitching in St. Louis next year. I think laugh.gif I believe they're going to try and work out a multi-year deal since his deal for next year is only $500,000.
post #300 of 3749
^
I read that somewhere but I just took it as Lackey being pissed he was dealt and would take the minimum in St. Louis next year as opposed to going back to the bean roll.gif
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