NikeTalk › NikeTalk Forums › The Lounge › Sports & Training › OFFICIAL 2016 @HEAT PLAYOFF THREAD
New Posts  All Forums:Forum Nav:

OFFICIAL 2016 @HEAT PLAYOFF THREAD - Page 44

post #1291 of 2814
I agree that Spo needs to switch it up and figure out how to use Whitside more down the stretch, but Hassan is acting like a baby.

He hasn't earned the right to be throwing shots on social media at Spo. What has he done in the league? Get a few triple doubles??! The fact he's "mentally checked out" shows just how weak minded he is. Stay the the course and play through it. If he's like this now, how is he gonna act when the Heat or any other team actually pay him?

If he's gonna criticize Spo, he needs to look at himself in the mirror first. It's not just the bad free throws shooting keeping him out the game. Whiteside commits stupid fouls and has become a turnover machine on offense. If it wasn't for Wade he would be useless on offense most of the time. He really needs to look at film on Drummond or even Alonzo Mourning and learn about positioning and leverage.

This fact of the matter is this team struggles with speedy/fast teams. Be apart of the solution and not the problem. You real b****made if you the first to complain and when you aren't even doing YOUR job. eyes.gif
post #1292 of 2814


White Jesus done cut off the hair... I wonder if it'll help his shooting?
post #1293 of 2814

They need to let Whiteside do what he does best...dunk. We can look at these highlights and see that he's most effective on lobs and catching the ball in the restricted area. The post is not his strength so they should stop giving it to him far away from the basket. 

 

 

As for Goran, just give him the ball in space. It's effective in the half court and on fastbreaks. As you look at these highlights, he doesn't need everybody else to be fast. He can drive on his own. Once he's penetrating and the players actually move around, he can hit guys for the open 3 or layups. Making those open shots is another story.

 

On the Hassan situation, I don't see the benefit in spo benching him for an entire 4th quarter. Our offense is not much better with him on the bench. His minutes have decreased and we started losing. We have no bird rights on him, so he can easily just walk away if circumstances don't improve. There's no doubt that he's being immature though.

Heat| Eagles|Hurricanes |Dolphins|Chelsea FC
pimp.gif NT Madden 16 League Season 2 Champion pimp.gif
Reply
Heat| Eagles|Hurricanes |Dolphins|Chelsea FC
pimp.gif NT Madden 16 League Season 2 Champion pimp.gif
Reply
post #1294 of 2814

Nah man, Whiteside's been due some complaining. He's been getting stemmed to the bench for whatever and ignored on offense. Gerald Green is averaging more shots a game than him...man, they don't even have any plays for him. Terrible for the development of a big man, who is suppose to be a big part of your team and supposedly future. He's struggled but I feel like a big part of that is the level of trust Spo has showed to him. Spo's showed a grandeur amount of trust in just about everybody but him... I know some of y'all think otherwise, but I don't like it. I feel like he should have been up in arms and complaining earlier and I was mad that he wasn't complaining while getting stepped all over... this should have happened earlier, I don't really think it was a big deal

"WHO WILL SURVIVE IN AMERICA" ~ Gil Scott

Reply

"WHO WILL SURVIVE IN AMERICA" ~ Gil Scott

Reply
post #1295 of 2814
Quote:
Originally Posted by OlDirtyReseller View Post

Nah man, Whiteside's been due some complaining. He's been getting stemmed to the bench for whatever and ignored on offense. Gerald Green is averaging more shots a game than him...man, they don't even have any plays for him. Terrible for the development of a big man, who is suppose to be a big part of your team and supposedly future. He's struggled but I feel like a big part of that is the level of trust Spo has showed to him. Spo's showed a grandeur amount of trust in just about everybody but him... I know some of y'all think otherwise, but I don't like it. I feel like he should have been up in arms and complaining earlier and I was mad that he wasn't complaining while getting stepped all over... this should have happened earlier, I don't really think it was a big deal

My only question is... What has Whiteside done to earn the trust of his head coach? Trust is a two way street and you don't earn trust by airing your grievances on social media. You don't earn your coaches trust by continually pouting on the bench. How is the coach gonna trust Whiteside in the 4th quarter is he continually makes dumb mistakes in the 1st quarter?

I can almost guarantee he'll get more PT down the stretch of games if he came in and busted his butt with the PT he does get. He'll play more if he didn't get into early foul trouble and was smart with the ball. This is not a lottery team. This is a team who has big aspirations and Whiteside has to grow up quickly. The Heat can't afford for Whiteside to continually make rookie mistakes. He has to understand there is a pecking order on this team and he's nowhere near as good as he thinks he is.... yet!

It's cliche, but leaders don't make excuses and complain. They do their job and make the best with what they have. Let the chips fall where they may. If coach Spo was a garbage coach, so be it. Come in and dominate, keep your mouth closed and get paid somewhere else.
post #1296 of 2814
Nothing but not playing him in the 4th isn't working
post #1297 of 2814
Quote:
Originally Posted by SpottieOttie305 View Post


My only question is... What has Whiteside done to earn the trust of his head coach? Trust is a two way street and you don't earn trust by airing your grievances on social media. You don't earn your coaches trust by continually pouting on the bench. How is the coach gonna trust Whiteside in the 4th quarter is he continually makes dumb mistakes in the 1st quarter?

I can almost guarantee he'll get more PT down the stretch of games if he came in and busted his butt with the PT he does get. He'll play more if he didn't get into early foul trouble and was smart with the ball. This is not a lottery team. This is a team who has big aspirations and Whiteside has to grow up quickly. The Heat can't afford for Whiteside to continually make rookie mistakes. He has to understand there is a pecking order on this team and he's nowhere near as good as he thinks he is.... yet!

It's cliche, but leaders don't make excuses and complain. They do their job and make the best with what they have. Let the chips fall where they may. If coach Spo was a garbage coach, so be it. Come in and dominate, keep your mouth closed and get paid somewhere else.

Whiteside has pouted about calls and being benched but never to the level where it was disrespectful. We've already acknowledged to him that he's a big part of the team, you don't hand him that responsibility without the trust that goes along with it. If Spo was benching some of the other starters for their mishaps then I would be okay with them but he'll ride with his guys no matter if they are doing terrible or not, Even bench players (i.e. Winslow/Green/McBob) but he'll bench Whiteside for anything, it's visably disproportionate. Whiteside has all the reason in the world to be upset

"WHO WILL SURVIVE IN AMERICA" ~ Gil Scott

Reply

"WHO WILL SURVIVE IN AMERICA" ~ Gil Scott

Reply
post #1298 of 2814
Whiteside needs to see himself in the role Deandre occupies. Basically very few to zero plays ran for him outside of oops. Hassan is not a smart player. Hope he has a reality check and sees that he needs to focus on being more efficient with the opportunities he does have.
post #1299 of 2814
@OlDirtyReseller


You're on fyah tonight!!!

Whiteside leads the league in blocks, top 6 in rebounds, and the most consistent player on the team in terms of minutes used and production.

Stay the course? Spolstra haaaasss noooo plaaaan! Al Golden got fired for the same $#!+ Spolstra is doing with this team. For years when Bron was on the Heat, it was "this heat team needs a big man". Now we finally have one and he's damn good and we treat him like he's replaceable.

Like Oldirtyreseller said, "Spo's not benching (Winslow, DRAGIC, and McBob) for their terrible play and inconsistency, but he has time to bench Whiteside, arguably our second best player. He's treating Whiteside like how he treated Michael Beasley.

Spolstra is in over his head without LeBron. mean.gif
post #1300 of 2814
Quote:
Originally Posted by soychulo View Post

Whiteside needs to see himself in the role Deandre occupies. Basically very few to zero plays ran for him outside of oops. Hassan is not a smart player. Hope he has a reality check and sees that he needs to focus on being more efficient with the opportunities he does have.

Whiteside's raw offensively but I feel like he's a little better than Deandre. Teams are just packing the paint now and causing us some real problems, which is why I think plays should be run to get him more single coverages like last year

 

 

We forget because he came up so quick that he's still basically a rookie. We need to give him time to develop his offensive and defensive game but also trust so he can grow into that role. I don't think that he's so far off that his development would hurt us, at 30 mins a night he is basically a top 10 PER player, which he was before we reduced his minutes even further. I still feel like he's our most important player this year and if we mess up it could effect this season and our future greatly.

 

His growth has hurt us because we didn't plan for it, our spacing issues are magnified because he's in the paint and we're basically trying to use him as Deandre Jordan. I think we may have some line-up issues to manage as well


Edited by OlDirtyReseller - 12/12/15 at 8:00pm

"WHO WILL SURVIVE IN AMERICA" ~ Gil Scott

Reply

"WHO WILL SURVIVE IN AMERICA" ~ Gil Scott

Reply
post #1301 of 2814
Quote:
Originally Posted by roboski View Post

@OlDirtyReseller


You're on fyah tonight!!!

Whiteside leads the league in blocks, top 6 in rebounds, and the most consistent player on the team in terms of minutes used and production.

Stay the course? Spolstra haaaasss noooo plaaaan! Al Golden got fired for the same $#!+ Spolstra is doing with this team. For years when Bron was on the Heat, it was "this heat team needs a big man". Now we finally have one and he's damn good and we treat him like he's replaceable.

Like Oldirtyreseller said, "Spo's not benching (Winslow, DRAGIC, and McBob) for their terrible play and inconsistency, but he has time to bench Whiteside, arguably our second best player. He's treating Whiteside like how he treated Michael Beasley.

Spolstra is in over his head without LeBron. mean.gif

I'm not usually on the other side of the Spo-gate but he's been doing some questionable things

"WHO WILL SURVIVE IN AMERICA" ~ Gil Scott

Reply

"WHO WILL SURVIVE IN AMERICA" ~ Gil Scott

Reply
post #1302 of 2814
That's a great point about benching other players. We all know that Dragic, Winslow and Mcbob have all deserved to be benched at times during the season.

Don't think this would be happening if Whiteside wasn't in a contract year.
Heat| Eagles|Hurricanes |Dolphins|Chelsea FC
pimp.gif NT Madden 16 League Season 2 Champion pimp.gif
Reply
Heat| Eagles|Hurricanes |Dolphins|Chelsea FC
pimp.gif NT Madden 16 League Season 2 Champion pimp.gif
Reply
post #1303 of 2814
Quote:
Originally Posted by OlDirtyReseller View Post

Whiteside has pouted about calls and being benched but never to the level where it was disrespectful. We've already acknowledged to him that he's a big part of the team, you don't hand him that responsibility without the trust that goes along with it. If Spo was benching some of the other starters for their mishaps then I would be okay with them but he'll ride with his guys no matter if they are doing terrible or not, Even bench players (i.e. Winslow/Green/McBob) but he'll bench Whiteside for anything, it's visably disproportionate. Whiteside has all the reason in the world to be upset



Great points! The only thing that's needs to been seen is Whiteside getting more minutes against teams who use smaller lineups agasint the Heat. Spo has opted to keep him out of the lineup in these situations. More specifically against the Pacers, Wizards, and Celtics. Three teams who shoot the ball really well and have really skilled guards and stretch forwards. The Heat have play quicker and faster in order to score enough points to win these games. After the Pacer loss on Friday, Wade said himself the Heat were not a fast team. So what should Spo do in these situations? Should he speed the game up and play Bosh at the 5? Or should he leave Whiteside in?

Now typically, if you had a really skilled big man who could score(i.e. Shaq) you would keep him in the game because he posses big threat on offense. Teams would have to adjust to you. With Hassan, its a bit of a stretch...

Here's some stats that shows how Whiteside's efficiency on offense has slowed from last season.


December 8, 2015


Do you all think Whiteside poses enough of a threat offensively to keep him in against a team's small package? He's getting looks, he's just not getting the job done when he is in the game. His TO % is WAAAY up from last season in post up situations. And lets not forget one of the biggist problems facing this team isn't rebounding or block shots. It's turnovers.

The Pros... Whiteside protects the paint and should be able to get easy rebounds/dunks against smaller lineups.
The Cons... He's Turnover prone. Won't be able to stay in front of smaller/quicker guards and forwards. Slows down the offense. Can't constantly guard the three point line. Can't make free throws if fouled.

If you were the coach how what would you all do?
post #1304 of 2814
Thread Starter 
The Chalmers Game
HEAT - DOLPHINS - I AM MIAM! - MARLINS - THE U
Reply
HEAT - DOLPHINS - I AM MIAM! - MARLINS - THE U
Reply
post #1305 of 2814
Quote:
Originally Posted by SpottieOttie305 View Post




Great points! The only thing that's needs to been seen is Whiteside getting more minutes against teams who use smaller lineups agasint the Heat. Spo has opted to keep him out of the lineup in these situations. More specifically against the Pacers, Wizards, and Celtics. Three teams who shoot the ball really well and have really skilled guards and stretch forwards. The Heat have play quicker and faster in order to score enough points to win these games. After the Pacer loss on Friday, Wade said himself the Heat were not a fast team. So what should Spo do in these situations? Should he speed the game up and play Bosh at the 5? Or should he leave Whiteside in?

Now typically, if you had a really skilled big man who could score(i.e. Shaq) you would keep him in the game because he posses big threat on offense. Teams would have to adjust to you. With Hassan, its a bit of a stretch...

Here's some stats that shows how Whiteside's efficiency on offense has slowed from last season. Warning: Spoiler! (Click to show)

Hassan Whiteside ranks 35th among 36 qualified players in post-up efficiency (min. 50 plays). He's 0.697 pts/play. Kevin Love 1st at 1.268.

— Tom Haberstroh (@tomhaberstroh)

December 8, 2015


Do you all think Whiteside poses enough of a threat offensively to keep him in against a team's small package? He's getting looks, he's just not getting the job done when he is in the game. His TO % is WAAAY up from last season in post up situations. And lets not forget one of the biggist problems facing this team isn't rebounding or block shots. It's turnovers.

The Pros... Whiteside protects the paint and should be able to get easy rebounds/dunks against smaller lineups.
The Cons... He's Turnover prone. Won't be able to stay in front of smaller/quicker guards and forwards. Slows down the offense. Can't constantly guard the three point line. Can't make free throws if fouled.

If you were the coach how what would you all do?

I think more of Hassan's perceived problems are team problems. His numbers as a whole has gone down because our team is suffering in so many ways. We have been force feeding him at times in the paint, late in the shot clock and hoping for some easy points but our off-ball movement and spacing is so bad that we've been getting the results of living and dying on this kind of Iso ball. As of late, Whiteside post-ups have been amounting in TO's but I don't think he is turnover prone, I just think the lack of offensive flow effects him moreso than the others. Everybody in our starting line-up is having a statistically worse year than last year, not just Hassan. There are instances where I trust my eye test over statistics and this is one of them, statistics also show that we are better without Tj and Wade on the court... and I don't see that, I see more team problems. This year we've already had multiple 20 and over TO games and a ton of very high TO games, I think that has to do more with a lack of off-ball movement and iso ball than it does Hassan. At the pace that we play, we shouldn't have anywhere near that many.

 

In my opinion, Whiteside has a good offensive game and great touch for a big man but is still very raw in certain areas. His free throw shooting is nowhere near bad enough for us to keep him out of forth quarters, we need to show him some more trust in that area as well. If he slows down the offense then I don't really think he does it by much, we're still pretty slow without him(also that full quote by Wade doesn't seem as bad as the one that has been hitting Twitter). Whiteside is the only player on our team that consistently attracts double-triple coverage, if we had an actual offense or offensive mind, I think that is something we could exploit and make a great offense out of. Hassan definitely needs to get better at passing but he doesn't need the craftiness of Marc Gasol to be effective, just needs to adjust his game as we do as well

"WHO WILL SURVIVE IN AMERICA" ~ Gil Scott

Reply

"WHO WILL SURVIVE IN AMERICA" ~ Gil Scott

Reply
post #1306 of 2814
Quote:
Originally Posted by OlDirtyReseller View Post

I think more of Hassan's perceived problems are team problems. His numbers as a whole has gone down because our team is suffering in so many ways. We have been force feeding him at times in the paint, late in the shot clock and hoping for some easy points but our off-ball movement and spacing is so bad that we've been getting the results of living and dying on this kind of Iso ball. As of late, Whiteside post-ups have been amounting in TO's but I don't think he is turnover prone, I just think the lack of offensive flow effects him moreso than the others. Everybody in our starting line-up is having a statistically worse year than last year, not just Hassan. There are instances where I trust my eye test over statistics and this is one of them, statistics also show that we are better without Tj and Wade on the court... and I don't see that, I see more team problems. This year we've already had multiple 20 and over TO games and a ton of very high TO games, I think that has to do more with a lack of off-ball movement and iso ball than it does Hassan. At the pace that we play, we shouldn't have anywhere near that many.

In my opinion, Whiteside has a good offensive game and great touch for a big man but is still very raw in certain areas. His free throw shooting is nowhere near bad enough for us to keep him out of forth quarters, we need to show him some more trust in that area as well. If he slows down the offense then I don't really think he does it by much, we're still pretty slow without him(also that full quote by Wade doesn't seem as bad as the one that has been hitting Twitter). Whiteside is the only player on our team that consistently attracts double-triple coverage, if we had an actual offense or offensive mind, I think that is something we could exploit and make a great offense out of. Hassan definitely needs to get better at passing but he doesn't need the craftiness of Marc Gasol to be effective, just needs to adjust his game as we do as well

We'll just have to agree to disagree on Whiteside's offense. I don't think Whiteside has a good offensive game at this point. He has potential to be better as you stated, but right now he's better suited to be a lob and dunk player. In double team situations I agree he has a strong upside. They should actually try to get him to re-post after initially passing out of the double team. His passing is terrible tho. Which is another problem.

You may be onto something in terms of offensive flow affecting Whiteside more than other player. When the ball moves he should be able to get easier buckets. He struggles if you continually go to him for points in the post especially in low clock situations.

As for free throws, Whiteside at 50.6% is shooting a lower % than Dwight Howard. One of the worst free throw shooters in the league. If he's gonna play down the stretch in the 4th he has to bring that up.

I actually liked the Heat's ball movement against Charlotte and Boston. They had 25/23 assist, but sill lost those games. They are at the bottom overall in terms of assist per game only averaging 19 a game. This is where Spo has to figure things out. They are actually down from last season... mean.gif

Out of the 9 teams the Heat have lost to, 4 of them are top 15 in 3 point shooting%. Cleveland, Indiana, Hornets, and Wizards. 7 of those teams have stretch 4's who could shoot. So whatever Spo does, he has to get Whiteside in positions to defend on the perimeter, and get the team the share the ball more. The ball can not stick. The Heat have looked their best when there is balance scoring the ball.


P.S.
After looking at the stats, the Heat are actually not doing that bad with turnovers. They are the 2nd best teams in terms of total turnovers thus far this season with 14 per game... better than the Warriors. I guess they just have been sloppy as of late averaging 17 TO's per game. Whiteside had 6 against Charlotte and Dragic had 5 against Indiana. sick.gif
Edited by SpottieOttie305 - 12/13/15 at 2:07pm
post #1307 of 2814
HEAT FAMILY CHECK IN TIME!!
----BLEED ORANGE AND BLUE----
GATORNATION ALUM
Reply
----BLEED ORANGE AND BLUE----
GATORNATION ALUM
Reply
post #1308 of 2814
Quote:
Originally Posted by SpottieOttie305 View Post


We'll just have to agree to disagree on Whiteside's offense. I don't think Whiteside has a good offensive game at this point. He has potential to be better as you stated, but right now he's better suited to be a lob and dunk player. In double team situations I agree he has a strong upside. They should actually try to get him to re-post after initially passing out of the double team. His passing is terrible tho. Which is another problem.

You may be onto something in terms of offensive flow affecting Whiteside more than other player. When the ball moves he should be able to get easier buckets. He struggles if you continually go to him for points in the post especially in low clock situations.

As for free throws, Whiteside at 50.6% is shooting a lower % than Dwight Howard. One of the worst free throw shooters in the league. If he's gonna play down the stretch in the 4th he has to bring that up.

I actually liked the Heat's ball movement against Charlotte and Boston. They had 25/23 assist, but sill lost those games. They are at the bottom overall in terms of assist per game only averaging 19 a game. This is where Spo has to figure things out. They are actually down from last season... mean.gif

Out of the 9 teams the Heat have lost to, 4 of them are top 15 in 3 point shooting%. Cleveland, Indiana, Hornets, and Wizards. 7 of those teams have stretch 4's who could shoot. So whatever Spo does, he has to get Whiteside in positions to defend on the perimeter, and get the team the share the ball more. The ball can not stick. The Heat have looked their best when there is balance scoring the ball.


P.S.
After looking at the stats, the Heat are actually not doing that bad with turnovers. They are the 2nd best teams in terms of total turnovers thus far this season with 14 per game... better than the Warriors. I guess they just have been sloppy as of late averaging 17 TO's per game. Whiteside had 6 against Charlotte and Dragic had 5 against Indiana. sick.gif

Agreed, our TO's aren't terrible for most teams but a team that plays at our pace can't afford it. We are 3rg in FG% in the league and last in field goal attempts... we're not moving the ball enough and we're not getting enough shots up


Edited by OlDirtyReseller - 12/13/15 at 4:13pm

"WHO WILL SURVIVE IN AMERICA" ~ Gil Scott

Reply

"WHO WILL SURVIVE IN AMERICA" ~ Gil Scott

Reply
post #1309 of 2814

We're even more trash in this game, I wonder how the lockerroom is holding up;

"WHO WILL SURVIVE IN AMERICA" ~ Gil Scott

Reply

"WHO WILL SURVIVE IN AMERICA" ~ Gil Scott

Reply
post #1310 of 2814
Thread Starter 
WE WIN @MiamiHEAT !!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
HEAT - DOLPHINS - I AM MIAM! - MARLINS - THE U
Reply
HEAT - DOLPHINS - I AM MIAM! - MARLINS - THE U
Reply
post #1311 of 2814

Great game, some serious problems to fix tho

"WHO WILL SURVIVE IN AMERICA" ~ Gil Scott

Reply

"WHO WILL SURVIVE IN AMERICA" ~ Gil Scott

Reply
post #1312 of 2814
More of the same, but glad we won.

jP08Don.gif

laugh.gif clearly unhappy
Heat| Eagles|Hurricanes |Dolphins|Chelsea FC
pimp.gif NT Madden 16 League Season 2 Champion pimp.gif
Reply
Heat| Eagles|Hurricanes |Dolphins|Chelsea FC
pimp.gif NT Madden 16 League Season 2 Champion pimp.gif
Reply
post #1313 of 2814
Somebody need to put Whiteside over their knee.
post #1314 of 2814
The human ego's a dangerous thing. I don't understand this guy's mentality, when he was just in an YMCA, now we owe him the world?
post #1315 of 2814

Whiteside didn't do anything tho? all he did was not smile... well I'm not sure.

 

 

It was nice to see less ISO ball and Hassan defending more than going for blocks but we have some serious issues to deal with

"WHO WILL SURVIVE IN AMERICA" ~ Gil Scott

Reply

"WHO WILL SURVIVE IN AMERICA" ~ Gil Scott

Reply
post #1316 of 2814
Quote:
Originally Posted by OlDirtyReseller View Post

Whiteside didn't do anything tho? all he did was not smile... well I'm not sure.


It was nice to see less ISO ball and Hassan defending more than going for blocks but we have some serious issues to deal with

I'm referring to his IG caged lion post
post #1317 of 2814
Quote:
Originally Posted by toast1985 View Post


I'm referring to his IG caged lion post

That was bad, but I still think he was warranted in being angry... I think he should be less passive if he feels so strongly

"WHO WILL SURVIVE IN AMERICA" ~ Gil Scott

Reply

"WHO WILL SURVIVE IN AMERICA" ~ Gil Scott

Reply
post #1318 of 2814
It's simple. Go off on the court in the minutes you do get. Will force Spo to keep him in. If you are a pouter I'm benching you no matter what.
post #1319 of 2814

And here's the bench view of that

 

https://twitter.com/santiarch8/status/676212874084286467

"WHO WILL SURVIVE IN AMERICA" ~ Gil Scott

Reply

"WHO WILL SURVIVE IN AMERICA" ~ Gil Scott

Reply
post #1320 of 2814
Hassan on the Caged lion photo,

New Posts  All Forums:Forum Nav:
  Return Home
  Back to Forum: Sports & Training
NikeTalk › NikeTalk Forums › The Lounge › Sports & Training › OFFICIAL 2016 @HEAT PLAYOFF THREAD