Plain clothes Ny cop runs up on black dude, gets shot and dies

If they came out with guns drawn it just would've been another excuse for why they got shot at.

Did you read the account given by the NYPD to the media?

Going by the account they engaged in a dialogue before the shooting occured.

They asked if he had something in his waistband.


To me that as a plainclothes officer, one who suspects that the individual in question may be in possession of a firearm, is giving up the very advantage he has as a plainclothes officer.

That advantage is the element of surprise.

To me that is the single most frustrating, absolutely exasperating aspect of this story.

Why, if you honestly believe a subject is in possession of a firearm, would you choose to engage in dialogue (and giving up the element of surprise) instead of acting first to ensure your safety and the safety of the general public?

To me it was a complete malpractice of protocol. I don't see how that's unreasonable for me to believe. If you think someone has a gun, as a police officer, your first and foremost directive is to nullify any danger that individual may pose to others.


Take control of the situation.
 
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This cop wasn't aggressive enough and got killed.... had he been trigger happy he would probably be alive...but it could have ended bad if he was trigger happy and the suspect was just holding a black cellphone and got shot too..
This is what makes cops so brave though, I get what you're saying. But a cops life is supposed to be in jeoprady. It comes with the position, If being a cop was shoot first ask questions later my 3 year old sister can do that.
 
SneakerHeathen speculation makes sense and given the lack of trust for NYPD I can understand why people are skeptical of the account given by the department.

That doesn't mean people think the shooter is an awesome guy or pillar of the community who shouldn't be in prison. it's just people saying the details sound off based on personal and anecdotal experience with the NYPD.
 
All I'm seeing is "I'm not justifying this BUT...."

I'm not justifying murder (killing is wrong), but the cop should have used his grappling hook to rappel from the side of the building to approach the subject and then tried to karate chop the gun out of his hand.

I'm not justifying murder, but the situation should have been handled better by the cop.
 
Crazy part this went down  3 blocks from where I grew up.. Hollis/Queens Village aint the hood especially where this happen (I past here pretty much everyday to see my kid) .. I mean every area has undesirables but this was shocking to the entire neighborhood. We havent has shootings go down in atleast 3-4 years. I seen the shooter around the neighborhood he is just some simple low life that roams around hollis. I honestly have gotten jumped out on 105th pct detectives a few times growing up and I can’t lie those plain clothes dudes are pretty aggressive but thats how they changed the face of the neighborhood from years ago. 

Only reason this guy got killed was lack of wisdom and training my dad stated being on the force as well as my grandfather being a decorated officer. Besides him having 150 arrests he was probably REALLY new to that squad there is a certain way you run up on dudes in my area he honestly shouldn’t have pulled up on a dude he thought was strapped in the car who does that?  I have seen it countless times directly on hollis ave (were most of the crime happens) you’ll usually have 4 of them in the car with vests and football jerseys on and they hop out the car like linebackers if they think your carrying or have drugs on you. I feel for the cop and his family. This DEFINITELY wasn’t a race thing dude would have bussed on anyone even me I’m the same age. I passed the NYPD test with a 98 if I decided to join the force this could have been me smh. 

R.I.P 
 
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Anybody who has been rolled up on by NYC undercovers knows they hop out of the car immediately and run up on you. You'll probably see them pass by you once too and their impalas or fusions are so obvious. The fact that he didn't even get out before being shot says this guy was planning on shooting to me. They are overly aggressive so definitely not defending them. It sucks every time
 
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ITT people complain about cops automatically treating them like criminals but say these plainclothes cops should have run up on the brother with guns drawn to avoid getting shot. Ridiculous. I would love to see the responses if they had actually done that and gotten shot anyways.
 
Maybe I'm beating around the bush, and for that I apologize.

To put it concisely, I believe there is a history of bad habits being practiced by plainclothes officers in the NYPD.

Bad habits such as baiting, profiling, bullying, instigating etc.

To me when officers get in the habit of employing "unconventional" methods to do their jobs there will be some undesired results.

Officers often forget protocol and their training, the very training that readies them for dangerous situations, and they fall into a pattern of lazy policing.

Can I say for certain that was the case here? No absolutely not. That would be irresponsible to conclude.

I do feel however, given what we know about the situation, the account given by the NYPD, the officer ignored protocol and put his life as well as the life of the general public in danger by not taking full control of the situation and acting decisively.
 
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Maybe I'm beating around the bush, and for that I apologize.

To put it concisely, I believe there is a history of bad habits being practiced by plainclothes officers in the NYPD.

Bad habits such as baiting, profiling, bullying, instigating etc.

To me when officers get in the habit of employing "unconventional" methods to do their jobs there will be some undesired results.

Officers often forget protocol and their training, the very training that readies them for dangerous situations, and they fall into a pattern of lazy policing.

Can I say for certain that was the case here? No absolutely not. That would be irresponsible to conclude.

I do feel however, given what we know about the situation, the account given by the NYPD, the officer ignored protocol and put his life as well as the life of the general public in danger by not taking full control of the situation and acting decisively.
wow.... so you're saying he should have been more aggressive....

and its the cops fault for trying the  unconventional method of trying to decide if the suspect was indeed a threat 

I guess he should have Tamir Rice'd him..
 
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If they came out with guns drawn it just would've been another excuse for why they got shot at.
the guy was minding his own business when plainclothes cops run up with guns drawn.... He was scared for his life and just defending himself....

tired.gif
 
wow.... so you're saying he should have been more aggressive....

and its the cops fault for trying the  unconventional method of trying to decide if the suspect was indeed a threat 

I guess he should have Tamir Rice'd him..

Apparently you're incapable of grasping the fact that there is a middle ground between being too passive and being overly aggressive.

It's called measured, calculated aggressiveness. It's called decisiveness with an emphasis on protocol, recalling your training.

You keep ignoring this factor and continue to fall back into hyperbole and nonsensical parallels to make your convoluted point.

Whatever the hell that is.
 
Crazy part this went down  3 blocks from where I grew up.. Hollis/Queens Village aint the hood especially where this happen (I past here pretty much everyday to see my kid) .. I mean every area has undesirables but this was shocking to the entire neighborhood. We havent has shootings go down in atleast 3-4 years. I seen the shooter around the neighborhood he is just some simple low life that roams around hollis. I honestly have gotten jumped out on 105th pct detectives a few times growing up and I can’t lie those plain clothes dudes are pretty aggressive but thats how they changed the face of the neighborhood from years ago. 

Only reason this guy got killed was lack of wisdom and training my dad stated being on the force as well as my grandfather being a decorated officer. Besides him having 150 arrests he was probably REALLY new to that squad there is a certain way you run up on dudes in my area he honestly shouldn’t have pulled up on a dude he thought was strapped in the car who does that?  I have seen it countless times directly on hollis ave (were most of the crime happens) you’ll usually have 4 of them in the car with vests and football jerseys on and they hop out the car like linebackers if they think your carrying or have drugs on you. I feel for the cop and his family. This DEFINITELY wasn’t a race thing dude would have bussed on anyone even me I’m the same age. I passed the NYPD test with a 98 if I decided to join the force this could have been me smh. 

R.I.P 
excellent post famb
 
excellent post famb
^feels they should have approached him in the nicest way possible in order not to provoke a convicted felon. And fully disagrees with how plain-clothed officers perform their duties.

Now agrees with that post. Lol.

But, yea. That was a great post.
Thanks but you gotta understand the dynamics of the neighborhood there are dudes that literally walk around asking for trouble in a cleaned up middle class area. I actually think what this officer did WAS nice and that's what got him killed. Instead of jumping out commando style he asked dude a question and got popped. Not saying its the RIGHT thing to be aggressive but I have seen the effects of the NYPD being that way to create a safer environment in the area. I used to walk home from school and see crackheads roaming the area walking dead style at 8yrs old in the late 90’s. When 105th started to go HAM on the drug dealers etc. by the time I was in middle school you seen the neighborhood clean up immediately. Its like what would you rather these dudes walking around the place your kid is growing up with illegal guns and selling drugs or be able to take your kid to the local park without them having to see degenerates. From first hand experience I can’t get mad at what the good cops on the NYPD did to the city the aggression worked you just know what to do and what not to do in NYC. 
 
Do your thing, I'm sure somebody will spend their Saturday arguing with you :lol:
Nah, they just want a circlejerk where they can throw smileys like you and not try to actually break down the topic and discuss it.

:lol:

The dude consistently has nothing to add to the topic, but input emojis.

Almost feel bad for the guy. I would hate to be a cheerleader from the sidelines, for a sport I know I can't play.


Aw man you got me.

What's to add? Cop got shot, guy shouldn't have shot cop :lol: I hate cops circle jerk vs the other guys aka every other cop related thread on NT.

Let's talk about the guys mental health :nerd: maybe that's why he did it.
 
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You really have added nothing to this thread, my g.

He never does.

Biggest pseudo intellectual on NT.

Always ranting and raving, stirring the pot with overly simplistic arguments that even an 8th grade debate teamer could shoot down.

That's not even a slight it's the truth.

Maybe it's that he comes from a sheltered background and he really is this naive.

Maybe he's been lucky enough to get this far in life to not have his view of how the world works dispelled.

Because it's not all black and white like you think it is WhatCanISay, there's a big ugly unforgiving grey area.

You're like Carlton in the episode he & Will got locked up for simply driving Uncle Phil's colleague's car to where they were vacationing.

Nobody is making light of this situation. Nobody. It sucks. But the truth is officers oft scoff at protocol and professionalism and as a result people on both sides of the blue line get hurt.

If that's a reality you and others can't accept then I don't know what you want to hear.
 
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Our trust?

Who's we?
Sure there are outliers, but if you're constantly getting stopped by cops, it's not just because you "look a certain way".

Try to be realistic for a moment.
Wow. People are still in denial about profiling.

Incredible.
 
Such an intellectually-filled post :smokin

I should have based my thesis on this, sadly I study higher-level science, math and physics. So it was actually based on developing a mathematical model to be used in transportation engineering. in order to determine a modal split between different modes of transportation. Gathering and analyzing data, adjusting and readjusting said model hundreds of times in order to properly present and defend it.

I apologize for this.

And yet none of that adds any credence to your world view.
 
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