THE 2015 NBA PRE SEASON THREAD: BEST WISHES TO LAMAR ODOM

Who will represent the Western Conference in the NBA Finals?

  • Thunder

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  • Clippers

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  • Spurs

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  • Mavs

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  • Grizzlies

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  • Rockets

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  • Kings

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  • Warriors

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  • Pelicans

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DJ wanting a bigger role on offense is laughable. We had a top 5 offense last year with him in a limited role and he still has no discernible offensive skill besides catching lobs. I knew Doc gassing him up so much would come back to bite him. Whatever though. Good luck with DJ the offensive weapon, Mavs.

I was just going to say this. He was so over the top comparing him to bill russell and calling him the mvp. Doc is really something else :smh:. Good chance you'll at least end up with tyson chandler tho
Only if Tyson wants to play for peanuts. Like $3M per year.
 
what makes dallas such an attractive spot for DJ? the mavs don't even have a PG

is his relationship with CP3 that bad? can't believe he'd turn down more money and beaches for dallas...yeah no state income tax but still
 
what makes dallas such an attractive spot for DJ? the mavs don't even have a PG

is his relationship with CP3 that bad? can't believe he'd turn down more money and beaches for dallas...yeah no state income tax but still

I have been thinking the same thing. You would think he needs a solid PG to succeed on the Offensive end at least. Dallas has not 1 PG for him to work with.....
 
Jerian Grant & DJ pick & rolls are gonna be :smokin

Kris & DJ frontcourt is gonna be :smokin

6 seed next year is gonna be :smokin
 
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I wouldn't be mad at teams like SAS or GSW maxing out Draymond because he just makes sense being there. But, if a team like Detroit throws the max at him and expects him to be the face of the franchise (or contenders) with Drummond, then they are in for a rude awakening . A maxed out Draymond is more valuable to championship level teams than he is to a team barely in playoff contention.

Lance is probably the best example of this. Lance is not as good as Draymond, but he had a ton of value before leaving Indiana because he could do everything. He defended at a high level, could be a primary/secondary ball handler, rebound, etc. But, he messed his value up by signing with Charlotte, which ended up being a terrible fit. I don't think that happens if he goes to a contending team with a better roster structure. I think he will end up showing his same value in LA like he did in IND.

I think just about every team thats looking to get over the hump from being a darkhorse contender to true contender in the West would love to have Draymond, though.

Solid post
 
Jerian Grant & DJ pick & rolls are gonna be :smokin

Kris & DJ frontcourt is gonna be :smokin

6 seed next year is gonna be :smokin

I would much more prefer to see that then Dallas....Even if they get a Mo Williams or someone of that Caliber. NY is the East and I think he would be a good look there.
 
I wouldn't be mad at teams like SAS or GSW maxing out Draymond because he just makes sense being there. But, if a team like Detroit throws the max at him and expects him to be the face of the franchise (or contenders) with Drummond, then they are in for a rude awakening . A maxed out Draymond is more valuable to championship level teams than he is to a team barely in playoff contention.

Lance is probably the best example of this. Lance is not as good as Draymond, but he had a ton of value before leaving Indiana because he could do everything. He defended at a high level, could be a primary/secondary ball handler, rebound, etc. But, he messed his value up by signing with Charlotte, which ended up being a terrible fit. I don't think that happens if he goes to a contending team with a better roster structure. I think he will end up showing his same value in LA like he did in IND.

I think just about every team thats looking to get over the hump from being a darkhorse contender to true contender in the West would love to have Draymond, though.


I think Stan is a pretty smart dude.. Do a sign and trade with Monroe.. Figure out which pg you want to keep (I assume Reggie).. You move forward with those 3 as the key pieces
 
Man that would be idiotic to get rid of Mills

I don't want Manu back unless it's with a super duper team friendly deal
 
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Jerian Grant & DJ pick & rolls are gonna be :smokin

Kris & DJ frontcourt is gonna be :smokin

6 seed next year is gonna be :smokin

I would much more prefer to see that then Dallas....Even if they get a Mo Williams or someone of that Caliber. NY is the East and I think he would be a good look there.

Knicks trying to sell him on being the 2nd option isn't that crazy imo. when Blake was hurt he stepped up big time & played the best basketball of his life.

also in the east who's the best center he'd have to go up against? Horford? Mozgov? Drummond? Noah?

in the west he's going up against Cousins, Duncan, Dwight, Gasol, Davis, Ibaka, etc every night.

idk, i have a feeling Jordan ends up in NY..
 
Only if Tyson wants to play for peanuts. Like $3M per year.

He's played long enough I think he's consider it, especially since LA is his home town. Sign a one year deal to play for a playoff team at home. Knows and has played with CP already. Would be a great situation for him even at $3 million.
 
Only if Tyson wants to play for peanuts. Like $3M per year.

Not sure of the exact parameters but I did read that out of respect for tyson the mavs would be willing to work a sign and trade to the clippers. For whatever that's worth
 
He's played long enough I think he's consider it, especially since LA is his home town. Sign a one year deal to play for a playoff team at home. Knows and has played with CP already. Would be a great situation for him even at $3 million.

I can see that Happening. Unless the Bucks shoot up the $$$ to have him anchor their Middle and play for his former PG as coach. Which they are considering.
 
If DJ leaves to Dallas it'll probably be a S&T involving Tyson, and i'm okay with that. Solid / adequate replacement.

I just don't see it though. One of those thing where I would have to literally see it to believe it. You just had the best year of your life. LA, Hooping with your best friend in the L for a title contender, you just made an all D first team and an All NBA team for the first time in your career, I mean I just don't see it. 

I don't even know if Dallas would make the playoffs with DJ next year. Just doesn't make sense to me.
 
Frank Isola @FisolaNYDN 3m
DeAndre Jordan wants a big market; LA, Dallas or NYC. Doc has asked Jamie Foxx to help recruit DeAndre. Phil may counter with Martin Landau.


Like he has sources.
 
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Where's rck Nelson to make sense of these kings decisions?
People still haven't realized that Woj's "source" is just throwing crap at the wall to try to tear the Kings organization apart when big days are coming up? First right before the draft, and now on the day Free Agency begins.....
 
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Cp3 was really on dj's head at times. Like it was really disrespectful and embarassing and noticeably affected dj's confidence. Just another reason I don't see him as a good leader
 
The Spurs can sign LaMarcus Aldridge, but it will be complicated


By Mike Prada @MikePradaSBN on Jun 30, 2015, 11:59a

The Spurs don't have enough cap space to sign LaMarcus Aldridge ... yet. Here's everything they must pull off to make sure they do.

Since 1990, the San Antonio Spurs have won at least 47 games in every season but one. Their prize for the year they didn't was Tim Duncan. The torch has been passed seamlessly from David Robinson, to Duncan, to the Tony Parker/Manu Ginobili duo and now to Kawhi Leonard.

It should come as no surprise, then, that the Spurs are one of the favorites to land Portland All-Star LaMarcus Aldridge, the best free agent on the market that could actually leave his current team. Aldridge and Leonard would then triumphantly lead San Antonio into a new era that should be filled with many more 50-win seasons and titles.

Yet, actually creating the room to sign Aldridge will not be as easy for the Spurs as it seems. Contrary to popular belief, the Spurs aren't guaranteed to have maximum cap space this summer. There are a number of scenarios in which San Antonio could create the space necessary to sign Aldridge, but they almost certainly require sacrificing key players from their 2013-14 title team. By the time the Spurs move those pieces, Aldridge could already be off to join the Lakers.

The Spurs' challenge is a perfect illustration of the salary-cap gymnastics NBA teams must perform every year in the hours after free agency begins.
The Spurs' situation in a nutshell

The Spurs currently have only five players under contract: Tony Parker, Tiago Splitter, Boris Diaw, Patty Mills and Kyle Anderson. Combined, they make $35.3 million, which is well under the $67.1 million salary cap.

But that doesn't mean the Spurs are actually under the salary cap. Each free agent is assessed what's known as a cap hold, which is always a certain percentage more than the player's salary the previous season. Think of a cap hold like a security deposit. It prevents teams from signing someone's free agent with cap space, then benefiting from the exceptions that allow teams to go over the cap to re-sign their own players.

The actual cap hold for each player depends on the kind of free agent they are and the number of years they've been in the league. Here is the Spurs' situation once you include cap holds.

The first-year maximum salary for Aldridge is a little less than 30 percent of what's expected to be a $67.1 million cap, which comes out to about $18.8 million. The Spurs are $22 million OVER the cap with all their holds. Time to start hacking away.
The easy part

The Spurs will surely release the cap holds of players 10-15 on that list without losing much sleep. They aren't part of San Antonio's future plans.

Those players are now removed, but the last three spots are reserved for what's known as incomplete roster charges. Whenever teams have fewer than 12 players on their roster, they are assessed one cap hold equal to the rookie minimum salary for each spot under that minimum. Since the Spurs would have nine players either under contract or with a cap hold, they have three incomplete roster charges.

There's still a lot of work to do.
Keeping Duncan and Manu

All indications are that the two Spurs legends want to return for at least one more season. Duncan made $10.3 million last year, while Ginobili made $7 million. They have taken less than their market value multiple times over the course of their careers. In order to have a chance at signing Aldridge, the Spurs will almost certainly make them take less again.

As mentioned earlier, there are two ways to remove a cap hold. One is to renounce the player, which almost always means saying goodbye to them. The other is to quickly agree to a new contract with them. At that point, the player's first-year salary replaces the hold. This is beneficial to the Spurs because the first-year salary for both Duncan and Ginobili will be significantly lower than their cap holds.

The question is how much sacrificing they'll do. It appears the Spurs will try to convince Duncan to play for around the average salary. Per the San Antonio Express-News:

There are several NBA player personnel executives who believe the Spurs will offer Duncan a two-year contract that begins between $6 million and $7 million, with a partial guarantee and a player option in the second season.

NBA rules prevent the Spurs from structuring that contract in a way that gives Duncan $1 million this year to preserve space and $12 million the next. Maximum raises must be within 7.5 percent of each other when re-signing players with general Larry Bird rights, per NBA rules. For simplicity's sake, let's say Duncan can make $6 million next year and $7 million in 2016-17.

Ginobili will likely take even less than that. The Spurs could ask him to take the minimum, which would be just under $1.5 million for a player with his much experience. But is that enough to convince Ginobili to put off retirement? If San Antonio wants to compromise, they may have to offer a little more than the minimum.

There is one option that could benefit both parties. The Spurs could renounce Ginobili and remove his cap hold, then sign him to the Room Mid-Level Exception starting at $2.814 million. That's the mid-level exception the Spurs will get by virtue of being an under-the-cap team. This allows (and actually forces) them to sign him after inking Aldridge. Ginobili essentially gets treated like a free agent on another team in this scenario.

There are two complications. For one, it's asking a lot for Ginobili to accept an arrangement that pays him 60 percent less than last season. For another, the Spurs may need the Room Exception to fill out the roster once Aldridge signs. Using it on Ginobil means the Spurs are limited to minimum salaries otherwise.

Nevertheless, it's a tempting scenario for both sides. It gives Ginobili time to make his decision and it gives the Spurs additional cap room to get to Aldridge's maximum. Let's assume that Duncan agrees to an early deal and Ginobili signs for the Room Exception.
The Kawhi Leonard situation

We haven't mentioned Kawhi Leonard, who is a restricted free agent that the Spurs shouldn't let get away under any circumstances. Any new deal with Leonard will, in theory, eat into the Spurs' precious cap space.

Yet there's an easy solution here assuming Leonard goes along with the plan. He is eligible to earn 25 percent of the cap on the first year of his maximum salary, which will be around $16.5 million. But that dollar figure doesn't go onto San Antonio's cap sheet until the deal is officially signed. Until then, Leonard's cap hold, which comes out to about $7.2 million, sits there. Seven million is a lot less than 16.5 million.

As long as Leonard helps out, the Spurs can wait to actually finalize his new deal until after they clear enough space for Aldridge. Leonard could sign an offer sheet elsewhere and torpedo the strategy -- and Spurs rivals with cap space absolutely should make offers to test Leonard's resolve -- but as long as he's confident the Spurs will take care of him, San Antonio will be OK.
There's still more work to be done

Say all that happens, though. The Spurs still have a lot of money to make up.

LaMarcus Aldridge is not signing with the Spurs for a first-year salary of $10 million, no matter how much he wants to leave Portland. Significantly more work must be done to get the Spurs in the range of the $18.8 million Aldridge is eligible to sign for in Year 1. Trading Patty Mills and Kyle Anderson while taking no salary back won't cut it.

(The Spurs could coax Ginobili into retirement, but that's cold even for them. Maybe Ginobili retires anyway and that becomes a silver lining. Let's assume for now that he won't).

Thus, the Spurs likely must make at least one of several difficult choices:

1. TRADE BORIS DIAW WHILE TAKING NO SALARY BACK: Diaw is one of the team's most important players, but started to slow down during the regular season. He signed a four-year, $28 million deal in the summer of 2014. The deal declines each season, is partially-guaranteed in Year 3 and fully unguaranteed in Year 4.

Any team with cap space that's looking for a playmaking power forward might give him a look, but the Spurs may have to attach additional draft picks and/or the rights to players the Spurs have stashed overseas to entice teams. They might still do that if it means keeping Splitter. Diaw turns 33 and could see his production nosedive on a different team.

2. TRADE TIAGO SPLITTER WHILE TAKING NO SALARY BACK: Splitter has value as one of the league's top defensive centers, but struggled with a calf injury last year. He has two years and just under $17 million left on his deal, which is excellent value if he stays healthy, but that's a big if. He's also turning 31 next season and would become somewhat redundant if the Spurs sign Aldridge.

The issue is that San Antonio must complete this trade quickly to get Aldridge. They do not have the luxury of letting free agent centers sign and then seeking out the teams that miss on them as trade partners.

3. RENOUNCE DANNY GREEN'S RIGHTS: This would sting, but it's the Spurs' only recourse if they can't find a trade partner for Diaw or Splitter. Green is an elite defensive player and an excellent three-point shooter, which is why Tom Ziller has him ranked 14th in this class. His market value is well over eight figures, and many teams will be willing to pay that. Renouncing him essentially means saying goodbye and the Spurs will not be able to replace him so easily.

But if the choice is between Aldridge and Green, Aldridge is the obvious winner. The Spurs will have to find a starting shooting guard elsewhere.
Don't say sign-and-trade

This may seem like a workaround to the Spurs' cap issues, but in practice, it's not. That's because the 2011 CBA made sign-and-trade arrangements much more difficult than in previous years.

The most important rule: a sign-and-trade cannot put the new team more than $4 million above the luxury tax under any circumstances. This number is known as the "apron." No matter what happens, the Spurs must stay under that number for the duration of the season. They effectively are forced to operate with a hard cap.

The luxury tax is expected to be around $81.6 million, so the "apron" is $85.6 million. Say the Spurs and Blazers agree to a sign-and-trade that gives Aldridge his maximum and sends him to San Antonio for some combination of draft picks and the rights to foreign prospects.

This is what happens:

All good, right?

Not exactly. Remember: Leonard's situation still must be addressed and the Spurs now cannot go over $85.4 million under any circumstances. A five-year maximum contract for Leonard, a new deal for Green and filling out the roster will blow through that figure.

A sign-and-trade therefore hurts more than it helps. The Spurs will still almost certainly need to lose at least one of Splitter, Diaw and Green to even have a chance of signing Aldridge and staying under that hard cap number. Realistically, they'd still be in jeopardy of hitting the hard cap even if they trade Splitter and let Green go.
A possible loophole

There's one possible scenario where the Spurs could sign Aldridge and keep Splitter and Green, but it's a long shot. CBA expert Larry **** explained it to me over the phone.

Suppose Duncan wants to play for at least two more seasons. He's certainly shown little signs of slowing down, so there's no reason he can't. He and the Spurs could agree to the following arrangement:

Duncan signs a one-year contract for the veteran's minimum for next season. He would be paid just under $1.5 million, but due to NBA rules, only $950,000 would count against the Spurs cap.
In exchange for his sacrifice, the Spurs make him whole by signing him to a three-year contract in the summer of 2016. San Antonio has his full Larry Bird rights, so theoretically he could sign a maximum deal for 35 percent of an exploding cap. Realistically, the two sides would have to pick a number that fits. For simplicity's sake, let's say three years for an average of $10 million per season.
Duncan plays one more year and then retires.
The Spurs and Duncan then agree to pay the remaining $20 million or so left on his contract in any arrangement they choose. The team is not required to defer money when a player retires in the middle of his contract, but it would be beneficial in Duncan's case. The Lakers did this when Magic Johnson and James Worthy retired, according to ****, and they are just one example.

This could raise the league's suspicions because it's clearly taking advantage of a cap loophole, but it could also be explained if Duncan does play a full second year.

If that happens, here is the Spurs' cap sheet for next season.

Now, the Spurs are at least in the ballpark. They can create enough cap room outright by trading Mills away while taking no salary back, and while Mills is a good player on a very good contract, he's not as important as Green or Splitter. San Antonio could also convince Aldridge to take less money by noting that there's no state income tax in Texas, as opposed to Oregon or California.

This scenario is unlikely, but it's out there.

★★★

The Spurs absolutely can create the room necessary to sign Aldridge. They have plenty of ways to save, whether it's signing Duncan and Ginobili to below-market deals, trading Splitter or Diaw and/or letting Green walk. The Duncan loophole also exists as a remote possibility.

But they must make a lot of difficult decisions in a very short amount of time, all while Aldridge is taking meetings with teams that already have the necessary cap space. Ideally, they must make these decisions with full cooperation from Duncan, Aldridge, Green, Leonard and Ginobil, which is by no means guaranteed.

This is the ideal sequence:

If Duncan decides immediately he wants to play again, he signs for below his market value.
If a team decides it will help the Spurs out, they take on Splitter and/or Diaw without sending salary back.
If Aldridge is willing to wait on San Antonio to execute Steps 1-2, he signs for the max.
If Green, who is losing leverage on his impending pay day with every second that goes by, doesn't agree to a deal with another team during Steps 1-3, he re-signs using Bird rights.
If Leonard hasn't grown antsy and accepted an offer sheet with another team during Steps 1-4, he re-signs using Bird rights.
If Ginobili still wants to play, he signs for the Room exception.

That's a lot of ifs. It's certainly doable, but it's also a tough task even for a front office as brilliant as San Antonio's.

Keep in mind: they must pull this off in a matter of days and even hours, not weeks. Now you see why the NBA offseason gets so crazy?
 
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I wouldn't be mad at teams like SAS or GSW maxing out Draymond because he just makes sense being there. But, if a team like Detroit throws the max at him and expects him to be the face of the franchise (or contenders) with Drummond, then they are in for a rude awakening . A maxed out Draymond is more valuable to championship level teams than he is to a team barely in playoff contention.

Lance is probably the best example of this. Lance is not as good as Draymond, but he had a ton of value before leaving Indiana because he could do everything. He defended at a high level, could be a primary/secondary ball handler, rebound, etc. But, he messed his value up by signing with Charlotte, which ended up being a terrible fit. I don't think that happens if he goes to a contending team with a better roster structure. I think he will end up showing his same value in LA like he did in IND.

I think just about every team thats looking to get over the hump from being a darkhorse contender to true contender in the West would love to have Draymond, though.
Solid post
Totally agree here. Draymond doesn't save a franchise, he enhances one very nicely.
 
Mark Deeks @MarkDeeksNBA 2m
Jimmy Butler now has 4 options. 1) Accept max QO: 5 years, max salary, no options. 2) Accept 1 year QO: 1 year, $4.5 million, UFA next year. 3) Sign offer sheet with someone; at least 3 years, not including opt years. Will get matched. 4) Sign other deal with CHI: can be anything.


Ethan J. Skolnick @EthanJSkolnick 1m
As I mentioned on @TheTicketMiami ... can confirm that Micky Arison & Dwyane Wade have met to discuss a way forward once he's a FA.
 
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Cp3 was really on dj's head at times. Like it was really disrespectful and embarassing and noticeably affected dj's confidence. Just another reason I don't see him as a good leader
While this is partly true, the times where he's encouraging and supporting DJ far outweigh the "disrespectful and embarrassing moments." During CP's tenure here, that friction between those two has been supremely overblown.
 
 
If DJ leaves to Dallas it'll probably be a S&T involving Tyson, and i'm okay with that. Solid / adequate replacement.

I just don't see it though. One of those thing where I would have to literally see it to believe it. You just had the best year of your life. LA, Hooping with your best friend in the L for a title contender, you just made an all D first team and an All NBA team for the first time in your career, I mean I just don't see it. 

I don't even know if Dallas would make the playoffs with DJ next year. Just doesn't make sense to me.
But Tyson is a FA also so how does that work?
 
Butler going to have to make the Greg Monroe decision.


At least he knows with Thibs gone he won't have to play 52 minutes a game, I hope he takes the gamble.
 
If the spurs strike out on both LMA and Marc where do they go from there? Their core is only getting older, and they probably won't retain Danny Green and a few other parts.

If they do happen to get LMA at the expense of the rest of their team, how do they fill out the rest of their roster?

Hopefully they just die off and fade into the Knicks

DJ wanting a bigger role on offense is laughable. We had a top 5 offense last year with him in a limited role and he still has no discernible offensive skill besides catching lobs. I knew Doc gassing him up so much would come back to bite him. Whatever though. Good luck with DJ the offensive weapon, Mavs.

It took Dwight 10 years to focus solely on dunks, putbacks and defense... DJ needs to stop with this "bigger role" thing :lol:
 
Butler going to have to make the Greg Monroe decision.


At least he knows with Thibs gone he won't have to play 52 minutes a game, I hope he takes the gamble.

What's the issue between him and D Rose, though? Is that just all talk or there is really a beef going on?
 
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