Jay-z had a Diss Record Ready For 2Pac during East & West Beef

illphillip · Aug 17, 2015

I don't know that the volume of acting roles really outweighs his music career.

Most of which are supporting roles in movies/shows of varying success vs. a critically acclaimed and successful career in music.

When he was at the Oscars, it was for his music.

3 Gold albums is nothing to sneeze at.

The majority of people I interact with know him as a musician moreso than an actor. Maybe Selma changes that recently but at least until then I'd say he was far more popular as a musician.

It's not like Tom Cruise or Bradley Cooper fans know Common the actor if we're talking about "mainstream success" :lol:

Again, I guess it just depends on how you define "mainstream". Because the majority of his acting roles probably wouldn't apply either.

And if having Can I Borrow A Dollar is supposed to be the qualifier to "speak on Common", well then I can do that too.

Magic33 · Aug 17, 2015

You might want to read the entirety of the discussion. That was all after Like Water For Chocolate.

When he took on Cube, who was Cube?

One of the top five rappers of all time. The person who created No Vaseline. Who also was involved in movies.

Common wasn't close to being on Ice Cube's level. That's not even debatable.

And I can speak on it, because I know what I'm talking about. Not saying you in particular, will say they know about a subject. When it's obvious they don't. Common was one of my top ten favorite rappers at one point.

onetrust · Aug 17, 2015

LOBCITY said:
Nobody was talking about radio spins.

Just because you lived on the Westcoast doesn't mean you didn't listen to East coast.

My family in the Oakland had Redman next to the Too Short and Dru Down cds

My family in LA had Naughty By Nature next to the Comptons Most Wanted , Cypress Hill cds. Like I Said yes there were a lot of hardcore west coast fans. But if you watch music videos the whole end of 80s all the way up until the mid to late 90s no way you aren't an east coast fan with a bunch of east coast tapes / cds its impossible

The real power in music was The Source, MUSIC VIDEOS. As I Said earlier everyone watched videos. You had to at some point rock with LL, Wutang, Mobb Deep, BadBoy , Naughty By nature, Gangstarr,Boot Camp ,Dr la Soul, Tribe, PE. I can go on for days. East coast music DOMINATED

Yes we was heavy on Bone Thugs, but the No Limit wave was 97/98. Dudes was not on Ghetto D or TRU when it first came out. P wasn't gettin spins and how often did they play Bout it Bout it and Ice cream man?

To close out my point, Yes Jay-Z was wasn't popular, Yes u could buy his album at the used section at the wherehouse music store . But he did have 3 videos or so prior to the Pac diss and Pac ain't gonna call out dudes name if he was a nobody.

A nobody doesnt go bar for bar with BIG and end up on his debut album

I never said nobody listened to East Coast artists. I kept saying to you that majority of cats out here weren't playing them heavy...ESPECIALLY JAY Z, who is the topic at hand.

Of COURSE you'll have some artists from the East that were played especially the ones that got played a ton on YO MTV Raps around the late 80's - early 90's. Hell, I had Public enemy's album, Naughty by Nature's album AND Gangstarr. I had a ton of singles from Tribe, LL, etc

That isn't what the topic at hand is though. The topic at hand is was Jay Z known back then? Answer again, is hell no, especially out West. NOBODY out here I knew had Reasonable Doubt. None of our two major radio stations played "AIn't No" in heavy rotation. CMC (OUR local video station) wasn't having him in heavy rotation, if ANY at all.

So I don't get how you gonna tell me Jay was known at that time, especially out West, when he definitely wasn't. He wasn't in heavy rotation during the YO! MTV Raps or Rap City either during that era. Hell, dude didn't even perform in his own city's Summer Jam until the late 90's.

Also, you wrong about Master P and how nobody was rocking with Ghetto D until later. I copped that album right when it dropped. Dudes out here were bumping Ice Cream Man and Bout it, Bout It more than any reasonable doubt track. Out west, he was hitting harder than Jay cause he had more of a west coast type sound.

EDIT: Also, the reason I mentioned radio spins was because that was one of the major outlets at the time for artists to get known from. The music videos was the other. There was no internet or nothing so if they wasn't popping on the radio and they barely got their video played, like Jay, they wasn't getting out there nationally. In NY, he might've been known but he was probably as known to a West Coast cat as Rappin 4 Tay was to the East Coast.

Another EDIT: About Pac not gonna just call out a nobody...ummm...Chino XL anyone? Reason he called out Jay wasn't because he was "known" it's because he as BIG's right hand man at the time.

illphillip · Aug 17, 2015

I really don't want to read the whole discussion. :lol:

Don't disagree that Common was not on the same level as Cube.

Was moreso addressing Common the musician vs. the actor.

gentry187 · Aug 17, 2015

I remember reading an interview with Jay on The Source (or XXL?) back in the early 2000's and they asked him about his beef with Pac. He said that he did in fact have a diss ready for him. And the only time he ever performed it was at the Apollo in Harlem right before Pac passed away. He said for some strange reason there was no cameras rolling that night so the only people that ever got to hear that diss was the people that attended that show that night. Soon after Pac passed away and he decided to not put the diss out out of respect.

send one · Aug 18, 2015

Magic1978 said:
This is pretty much to all of you who mentioned Common
People are saying Jay-Z wasn't on a certain level, but Common wasn't on Jay-Z's Not even close.

Common didn't have a gold album or top 100 single until The Light. That was four albums in. Aren't we talking about popularity? I Used To Love H.E.R., was cool, but it wasn't as popular as Can't Knock The Hustle and Ain't No. Look at the subject matter.

Common was pretty much in a lane like The Roots. Not pop and not underground.

And how isn't he more popular as an actor, when he has never reached mainstream success musically? He's done far more as an actor from appearing on Hell On Wheels to appearing in two dozen movies. As a rapper he had three gold albums. To put that in perspective, Bleek has four albums that have sold gold or platinum.

And I can speak on Common, because I've been listening to him since Can I Borrow A Dollar in 92. I can actually show you my tape from 92, yes cassette tape. And Resurrection is in my top 20.

Who ever said Common was bigger than Cube? Or even close to his level? But when Com went at Cube he was more known than Jay was in Aug of 96 when he would've went at Pac.

But let me fall back from this discussion since I've long lost my CIBAD cassette. :lol:

spiceman80 · Aug 18, 2015

h2k4 said:
Pac was going at anything and anyone that had a connection to Bad Boy (Big). I'm calling ducktales on this "diss".

I just heard the Taxstone podcast with Bleek, and he confirmed that Jay did have a diss song for Pac. They didn't release it out of respect once he died. As far as it being career ending for Pac, Bleek didn't say all that.

Personally, it doesn't matter what Jay said in that record, Pac was too big for Jay to kill his career. He wasnt important enough in hiphop at that time, and Pac would have made 10 songs for his *** that same day.

Magic33 · Aug 18, 2015

I think Common has the best agent in the world

because most rappers who crossed over to movies were all commercially popular and they picked them for movies, hoping their fans would bring people to the theater

SEND ONE said:
Who ever said Common was bigger than Cube? Or even close to his level? But when Com went at Cube he was more known than Jay was in Aug of 96 when he would've went at Pac.

But let me fall back from this discussion since I've long lost my CIBAD cassette.

How was Common more popular than someone who had more commercial success than him :lol:

You could add together the totals of Common's first three albums and they didn't add up to Reasonable Doubt commercial success from what Jay did just that first six months.

It's really obvious you have no clue about Common from 92 to 97

Peep Game · Aug 18, 2015

It also helps that common doesn't look like a stereotypical rapper, so he doesn't get typecast into the usual roles

send one · Aug 18, 2015

What commercial success did RD have in its first six months? We talking about the album that dropped about five singles and struggled to go gold in its first year, and in 96 for that matter, when everything was going gold.

Even the biggest Jay stans acknowledge he was slow out the gate. That man has had probably the greatest career of any rapper but let's not confuse his entire career with his first official year in the game.

No clue about Com? Maybe. It's not like Hot97 was playing his first singles, or wkcr was playing his bsides and remixes, or Yo!, Rap City or Uncle Ralph were playing his vids......,,wait a min, all that did happen! But keep thinking you know more than all the so called "kids" on NT. :lol:

It's obvious you have no clue about Jay Z 96-97.

SoleByThePound · Aug 18, 2015

Magic1978 said:
How was Common more popular than someone who had more commercial success than him

You could add together the totals of Common's first three albums and they didn't add up to Reasonable Doubt commercial success from what Jay did just that first six months.

It's really obvious you have no clue about Common from 92 to 97

Magic33 · Aug 18, 2015

SEND ONE said:
What commercial success did RD have in its first six months? We talking about the album that dropped about five singles and struggled to go gold in its first year, and in 96 for that matter, when everything was going gold.

Even the biggest Jay stans acknowledge he was slow out the gate. That man has had probably the greatest career of any rapper but let's not confuse his entire career with his first official year in the game.

No clue about Com? Maybe. It's not like Hot97 was playing his first singles, or wkcr was playing his bsides and remixes, or Yo!, Rap City or Uncle Ralph were playing his vids......,,wait a min, all that did happen! But keep thinking you know more than all the so called "kids" on NT.

It's obvious you have no clue about Jay Z 96-97.

The top 50 song on the album :rofl:

It peaked at #50 on billboard

The album itself peaked at #23

Reasonable Doubt spent 18 weeks on the charts

Reasonable Doubt "sold" 420,000 copies by the end of 1996, and was certified gold

Did Common accomplish any of that with his first three albums?

Give me some facts :lol:

because you're saying a lot of nothing.

Magic33 · Aug 18, 2015

These weren't Hot 97 charts, this was Billboard, nationwide

Now show me how in the world Common was a bigger artist when it took him three albums to break 200,000 and hit the billboard 100

Like I said Common didn't even have a real hit until "The Light"

And saying because an artist got played on Rap City or Yo he was popular :lol:

But that would be proven wrong, by Jay-Z getting play with Big Daddy Kane and Jaz. The Big L freestyle, which just happened to be on Stretch & Bobbito....Columbia, WKCR, muchless appearing on Big L, Original Flavor and Mic Geronimo's albums :lol:

And if everything was going gold, why the hell didn't Common go gold with One Day :lol:

That must have skipped over Common for three albums.

rico x hood · Aug 18, 2015

Hov definitely would have ethered pac and destroyed his career. And pac probably would have not died.

So in a way Hov releasing the diss could have saved 2pac's life.

Dang, Jay is a powerful dude.

Master Zik · Aug 18, 2015

Son is all about proving his fandom :smh:

You got the tapes :lol:

He really think he talking to a bunch of ppl born in the 2000s.

Rico x Hood said:
Hov definitely would have ethered pac and destroyed his career. And pac probably would have not died.

So in a way Hov releasing the diss could have saved 2pac's life.

Dang, Jay is a powerful dude.

dakid23 · Aug 18, 2015

OneTrust said:
LMAO at Jay had the public's ears. Yeah, you deifnitely weren't old enough or you lived in NY because Jay DEFINITELY wasn't poppin out here in the West Coast. Nobody out West even heard of a Jay Z until Pac said, "Jay Z die too." Only the hardcore hiphop heads out West heard of him due to the Nutty Professor soundtrack and even then everyone thought he was just Foxy's hype man. Stop trying to rewrite history.

Meek by this time already has a few hits under his belt. Jay, at that time, was a unknown to the majority of people outside of NY.

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