Official 2016-2017 NBA Season Thread - NBA rules Chris Bosh has a career ending injury

[Olympus]

Awarding the MVP to the best player on a good team defeats the purpose of the award. The award is one of individual success.  It should have nothing to do with the team the player's on.

The main criteria for judging the contenders for MVP should be: what team would be the worst off if said player were NOT there. That is to say, which player makes the most impact on his team.

I think subtracting Russ from OKC hurts OKC more than subtracting Harden hurts Houston.

 

[antidope]

 
Awarding the MVP to the best player on a good team defeats the purpose of the award. The award is one of individual success.  It should have nothing to do with the team the player's on.

The main criteria for judging the contenders for MVP should be: what team would be the worst off if said player were NOT there. That is to say, which player makes the most impact on his team.

I think subtracting Russ from OKC hurts OKC more than subtracting Harden hurts Houston.

Yeah but we need something tangible, and "This team would suck without him" is not that. 

Giving out an award based on conjecture would devalue it more than anything.

This is just like the year when Wade went down and the Heat were legit the worse team in the league without him. He didnt win it then, and if we were really going by "value" he should have.

 

[MVP]

I think at this point it's a 3 horse race between Harden, Westbrook, and Kawhi. Kawhi will have the best record, Russ have the best stats, Harden will be in the middle of both. 

 

[Jokegeta]

Nobody deserve that MVP as much as Westbrook does. No one.
He better get it too.

 

[antidope]

And Kawhi's impact on the game is largely felt on an end of the floor where its not easy to quantify, meanwhile WB and Harden are two of the worst defenders around. I've accepted that.

 

[MajinZuub]

Nobody deserve that MVP as much as Westbrook does. No one.
He better get it too.

View media item 2351343

 

[MVP]

I also think expectations vs reality will be a factor as well. OKC won 55 games last season, the fact that they may win 50 after losing the 2nd best player in the world and another really good player in Ibaka and Russ basically being by himself for the majority of the season (Dipo) has missed double digit games as well as Kanter is crazy. I know a lot of yall didn't have them making the playoffs. 

 

[JD617]

The main criteria for judging the contenders for MVP should be: what team would be the worst off if said player were NOT there. That is to say, which player makes the most impact on his team.

So it should be an award for whichever great player has the worst teammates? Then damn near the entire history of the award would have to be rewritten. No MVPs for Bird, Magic, Jordan, LeBron, etc.

 

[Vincent Van Goat]

 
Awarding the MVP to the best player on a good team defeats the purpose of the award. The award is one of individual success.  It should have nothing to do with the team the player's on.

The main criteria for judging the contenders for MVP should be: what team would be the worst off if said player were NOT there. That is to say, which player makes the most impact on his team.

I think subtracting Russ from OKC hurts OKC more than subtracting Harden hurts Houston.

I half agree with you. I've always disliked the idea that the best player on the "worst" team is given more weight

I don't think teammates should matter at all, whether they're good, bad or average

Should just be named the "Most Outstanding Player"

LeBron should win every year tbh

 

[antidope]

 
I also think expectations vs reality will be a factor as well. OKC won 55 games last season, the fact that they may win 50 after losing the 2nd best player in the world and another really good player in Ibaka and Russ basically being by himself for the majority of the season (Dipo) has missed double digit games as well as Kanter is crazy. I know a lot of yall didn't have them making the playoffs. 

I sure didn't said it many times on here. 

 

The main criteria for judging the contenders for MVP should be: what team would be the worst off if said player were NOT there. That is to say, which player makes the most impact on his team.

So it should be an award for whichever great player has the worst teammates? Then damn near the entire history of the award would have to be rewritten. No MVPs for Bird, Magic, Jordan, LeBron, etc.

I've thought about this a bunch, I'd still give LeBron a few. He was dragging lottery teams to 60 wins. But yeah its just way too many hypotheticals

 

[BIG LEEMELONE]

OKC gets the 5 seed, he's definitely winning it. Hell if they get the 6th but it's 50 wins, he'll win it. Watch. 

Care to wager?

Lets be real, if we're talking the true definition of the word Value? Its Westbrook. But thats not what MVP means.

The MVP also has a nice little history of ignoring narratives, like when Jason Kidd turned the Nets from worst to first (still agree with Duncan winning), and how Dwight Howard took a team of horrible defenders and put them on his back (The Derrick Rose MVP is an absolute joke).

You talk about narratives yet dismiss Rose's MVP. That MVP was all about the narrative.

 

[JD617]

You're right, I meant the Miami ones.

 

[antidope]

I really dont understand why the Lakers dont do this more often. The guy is so much bigger than people and he's very effective on the post up. 

 

[jbone2308]

People still doubting the mamba blood in Bestbrook veins.....

 

[tyevvyotcu]

So it should be an award for whichever great player has the worst teammates? Then damn near the entire history of the award would have to be rewritten. No MVPs for Bird, Magic, Jordan, LeBron, etc.

bron and jordan would still have some
bron actually might have more than he does now

 

[JD617]

Should just be named the "Most Outstanding Player"

I agree that this is probably the way it should be thought of. I think it should basically be "Who was the best player in the league this year"? I think sometimes the voters/fans overthink it. When they start getting into "Well if we remove the player from his team, how badly would the team suck" type of logic, that's what leads to some goofy stuff like the guy who voted for Melo over Bron in 2013.

 

[the collector]

Last 24 games...

Golden State 19-5
Washington 19-5

Washington 1-0 vs Golden State in the above stretch.

 

[tyevvyotcu]

yes without russ okc would be horrible but even with him they aren't that good so that argument isn't a good one in russ' case

 

[tribals]

Hoping that KD injury is not serious. Dude scores at will and spaces the floor. All of sudden the Rockets and Spurs are gonna be tough games

 

[Olympus]

 
Yeah but we need something tangible, and "This team would suck without him" is not that. 

Giving out an award based on conjecture would devalue it more than anything.

This is just like the year when Wade went down and the Heat were legit the worse team in the league without him. He didnt win it then, and if we were really going by "value" he should have.

So it should be an award for whichever great player has the worst teammates? Then damn near the entire history of the award would have to be rewritten. No MVPs for Bird, Magic, Jordan, LeBron, etc.

I mean it's always a multitude of things. I just don't think we should rule out Westbrook automatically because he wasn't able to carry his team to a top seed if indeed that is the case.

I also understand that you have to take into account the team dynamics and how the player fits on that team. Like, for example, the Warriors without Curry last year would still be a really good team, but Curry makes them a championship team. So I get it. You don't need to have the worst teammates.

The phrase "most valuable player" can be interpreted so many different ways.

 
I half agree with you. I've always disliked the idea that the best player on the "worst" team is given more weight

I don't think teammates should matter at all, whether they're good, bad or average

Should just be named the "Most Outstanding Player"

LeBron should win every year tbh

Most Outstanding Player would be a much better title.

 

[JD617]

So it should be an award for whichever great player has the worst teammates? Then damn near the entire history of the award would have to be rewritten. No MVPs for Bird, Magic, Jordan, LeBron, etc.

bron and jordan would still have some
bron actually might have more than he does now

I meant that you'd have to take some of theirs away, whether or not you'd add some back before they were in good situations. You could do a lot worse than Scottie Pippen and Phil Jackson, there were other stars who'd kill for that, so there go MJ's post-1990 MVPs, and you'd have to take away LeBron's Miami MVPs.

 

[Sonny Corinthos]

Hoping that KD injury is not serious.

He had a good career

 

[Vincent Van Goat]

He had a good career

HOF? We'll see

 

[mister friendly]

RW0 has been insane this season from what I've seen so far.

Basically he won't win the MVP because he's playing with a lot inexperienced NBA players and won't be a top seed?

 

[$tacy]

BI opening up a lil. Tariq black>bg