Ahmadinejad sayin' what most NTers think...

[raycash]

o werd

 

[primetime]

 

[nash]

speak for yourself, not everyone is a self-righteous idiot conspiracy theorist

 

[wsdesigner14]

Denied the Holocaust? Are you that naive? He questioned the figures of the Holocaust (the 6 million # is highly disputed). He also questioned why out of the 60 million people or so who were killed during WW2, how come we only focus on the Jewish casualties when there were millions of people of other faiths who lost their lives as well?

The 6 million figure is disputed because it is hard to accurately report the true amount of Jews killed however most historians agree it was close to the 6 million number. It is not a dispute that argues whether 6 million were killed or a far lesser number. Are you really questioning way "we" focus on the 6 million Jews who perished during the Nazi era, rather than the other casualties? It is not a matter of which faith were the casualties of the war, it's the fact that Jews were persecuted and exterminated from 1933-1945 in a almost mechanical way simply due to their race. Clearly, millions of soldiers were killed in battle, and millions of civilians were killed as a result of being in the midst of a world war, however, the Jews were killed for no other reason than their being Jews. It's beyond me how people can de-legitimatize and belittle the importance of the Holocaust as an event in human history, and it further disturbs me when a proclaimed world leader does it.

Hatred towards gays? How ironic that he spewed hate towards gays during a lecture in a country which has little tolerance for gays and was previously governed for 8 years by a Republican party that doesnt respect gays. Face it, gays are hardly respected in 98% of the world. You are nitpicking by criticizing the man simply because he is opposed to homosexuality.

Regardless of the irony of  the event/comment (which was far more an evasion of the question on your part than anything else), Ahamdinejad actually claimed during the lecture that the gay "phenomenon" does not exist in Iran. Again, in this day and age, and especially as a world leader, if you make such a claim you are doing nothing more than showcasing your ignorance and stubborn, blind faith.

Regarding his comments on 9/11, I am glad that more and more people are bringing this issue to light, however, I would prefer if far more respected and legitimate world leaders (or any politicians) would bring this to light.

 

[carlos tevez]

Originally Posted by wsdesigner14

Denied the Holocaust? Are you that naive? He questioned the figures of the Holocaust (the 6 million # is highly disputed). He also questioned why out of the 60 million people or so who were killed during WW2, how come we only focus on the Jewish casualties when there were millions of people of other faiths who lost their lives as well?

The 6 million figure is disputed because it is hard to accurately report the true amount of Jews killed however most historians agree it was close to the 6 million number. It is not a dispute that argues whether 6 million were killed or a far lesser number. Are you really questioning way "we" focus on the 6 million Jews who perished during the Nazi era, rather than the other casualties? It is not a matter of which faith were the casualties of the war, it's the fact that Jews were persecuted and exterminated from 1933-1945 in a almost mechanical way simply due to their race. Clearly, millions of soldiers were killed in battle, and millions of civilians were killed as a result of being in the midst of a world war, however, the Jews were killed for no other reason than their being Jews. It's beyond me how people can de-legitimatize and belittle the importance of the Holocaust as an event in human history, and it further disturbs me when a proclaimed world leader does it.

Hatred towards gays? How ironic that he spewed hate towards gays during a lecture in a country which has little tolerance for gays and was previously governed for 8 years by a Republican party that doesnt respect gays. Face it, gays are hardly respected in 98% of the world. You are nitpicking by criticizing the man simply because he is opposed to homosexuality.

Regardless of the irony of  the event/comment (which was far more an evasion of the question on your part than anything else), Ahamdinejad actually claimed during the lecture that the gay "phenomenon" does not exist in Iran. Again, in this day and age, and especially as a world leader, if you make such a claim you are doing nothing more than showcasing your ignorance and stubborn, blind faith.

Regarding his comments on 9/11, I am glad that more and more people are bringing this issue to light, however, I would prefer if far more respected and legitimate world leaders (or any politicians) would bring this to light.

Dude, I think you misread the context of my posts.

Someone here criticized Ahmedinajed for denying the holocaust. I pointed out Ahmadinajed's stance on the holocaust. I wasn't stating my opinion on the holocaust.

The same person criticized Ahmedinajed's anti-gay stance. No question was asked and I did not evade any question. I argued that Ahmedinajed is not the only person in the world that dislikes gays. Further, he is not the only Middle-Eastern leader that persecutes gays. However, the hypocrisy amongst the U.S. government and media lies with the fact that they criticize him for his anti-gay stance while they do not criticize leaders of countries that violate human rights if those leaders have good relationships with the U.S. government.

Ahmedinajed does not like Israel. This is the main criticisms made against him. Big deal. Guess what? Neither does most of the Middle-East. Ahmedinajed does not like gays. Guess what? Neither does the overwhelming majority of the world (including Americans). And yet, he is attacked for his stances on such trivial issues while the U.S. government turns a blind eye to other Middle-East leaders as long as the leaders dont openly criticize U.S. foreign policy.

He's also criticized for possibly pursuing nuclear weapons. However, no one questions America's right to possess nukes (ironically the only country in history to use them on another country...twice). No one questions Israel's right, or Pakistan's right, or India's right, or China's right to own nukes. It's only okay to own nukes if you're pro-American.

Ahmedinajed is probably a bit on the looney side but the main reason why he is criticized by the U.S. government/media is because he is vocally opposed to American foreign policy. Period. There are tons of other crazy leaders out there who do not get as much attention as this guy. Why? Because they dont dare to get in America's way.

 

[hazeleyed honey]

Originally Posted by wsdesigner14

The 6 million figure is disputed because it is hard to accurately report the true amount of Jews killed however most historians agree it was close to the 6 million number. It is not a dispute that argues whether 6 million were killed or a far lesser number. Are you really questioning way "we" focus on the 6 million Jews who perished during the Nazi era, rather than the other casualties? It is not a matter of which faith were the casualties of the war, it's the fact that Jews were persecuted and exterminated from 1933-1945 in a almost mechanical way simply due to their race. Clearly, millions of soldiers were killed in battle, and millions of civilians were killed as a result of being in the midst of a world war, however, the Jews were killed for no other reason than their being Jews. It's beyond me how people can de-legitimatize and belittle the importance of the Holocaust as an event in human history, and it further disturbs me when a proclaimed world leader does it.

I agree with you about not having to dispute numbers because sometimes it is as if they want to deflate the suffering or misery Jews endured during the Holocaust. Does it really matter what the actually number is in the end? I just want to add that being Jewish is not a race, but rather an ethnicity. It does not take away the fact a whole ethnicity was being persecuted.I just wanted to add that other groups were targeted because for their ethnicity and race. The Holocaust is usually taught in schools and in literature, as well as in academia, as the mass genocide that perpetrated and killed six million Jews throughout Europe in WWII. But, Hitler killed around 14 million during his reign in which there was non-Jewish victims which were also persecuted, tortured, tattooed and killed. These include around 5 million which were men, women, and children. Often, these victims are made to die in vain and the survivors as well as their families of these 5 million are often overshadowed by the Jewish casualties and mortalities. These people DO need to be recognized. Many of them were persecuted because of their race or their beliefs and they too deserve their place in history.

I'll give an example...What about the Romas (gypsies)?Does anyone even care about their role and their persecution during the Holocaust? About half a million gypsies, almost the entire Eastern European Gypsy population was cleansed of during the Holocaust. Actually, if we want to be more specific, in addition to Jews and Gypsies which I mentioned, the targeted groups included Polish people (of whom 2 million gentile Poles were killed) and some other people of Slavic descent, Soviets (specifically prisoners of wars), some Africians, Asians and others who did not belong to the "Aryan race", the mentally ill, physically disabled and the mentally challenged, homosexuals and transexual people, and political opponents and religious dissidents such as communists, trade unionists and Jehovah Witnesses.

So, you are indicating that only the Jewish people were persecuted due to their ethnicity? It was actually anyone else that did not belong to Hitler's or the Third Reich's Aryan nation or vision. But, they are certainly not as acknowledged or commemorated when it comes to being victims of the Holocaust.

Regardless of the irony of  the event/comment (which was far more an evasion of the question on your part than anything else), Ahamdinejad actually claimed during the lecture that the gay "phenomenon" does not exist in Iran. Again, in this day and age, and especially as a world leader, if you make such a claim you are doing nothing more than showcasing your ignorance and stubborn, blind faith.


I agree with you there, but then again, you have to see where he is coming from. A region in the world in which homosexuality is punishable by death. That does not only have to do with him being ignorant, but it is a product of the society/culture he lives in. On the other hand, here in the West, where we espouse about human rights, democracy, and justice, but yet lash out at other leaders for their ignorance, yet even here gay rights have a long way to go to gain equality status and are discriminated against even by the highest and most notable leaders who in the same breath advocate for the free world and justice as well as equal rights.   

 

[crossisom]

lulz at OP's Sayid avy

 

[wsdesigner14]

wsdesigner14 wrote:

---

The 6 million figure is disputed because it is hard to accurately report the true amount of Jews killed however most historians agree it was close to the 6 million number. It is not a dispute that argues whether 6 million were killed or a far lesser number. Are you really questioning way "we" focus on the 6 million Jews who perished during the Nazi era, rather than the other casualties? It is not a matter of which faith were the casualties of the war, it's the fact that Jews were persecuted and exterminated from 1933-1945 in a almost mechanical way simply due to their race. Clearly, millions of soldiers were killed in battle, and millions of civilians were killed as a result of being in the midst of a world war, however, the Jews were killed for no other reason than their being Jews. It's beyond me how people can de-legitimatize and belittle the importance of the Holocaust as an event in human history, and it further disturbs me when a proclaimed world leader does it.


I agree with you about not having to dispute numbers because sometimes it is as if they want to deflate the suffering or misery Jews endured during the Holocaust. Does it really matter what the actually number is in the end? I just want to add that being Jewish is not a race, but rather an ethnicity. It does not take away the fact a whole ethnicity was being persecuted.I just wanted to add that other groups were targeted because for their ethnicity and race. The Holocaust is usually taught in schools and in literature, as well as in academia, as the mass genocide that perpetrated and killed six million Jews throughout Europe in WWII. But, Hitler killed around 14 million during his reign in which there was non-Jewish victims which were also persecuted, tortured, tattooed and killed. These include around 5 million which were men, women, and children. Often, these victims are made to die in vain and the survivors as well as their families of these 5 million are often overshadowed by the Jewish casualties and mortalities. These people DO need to be recognized. Many of them were persecuted because of their race or their beliefs and they too deserve their place in history.

I'll give an example...What about the Romas (gypsies)?Does anyone even care about their role and their persecution during the Holocaust? About half a million gypsies, almost the entire Eastern European Gypsy population was cleansed of during the Holocaust. Actually, if we want to be more specific, in addition to Jews and Gypsies which I mentioned, the targeted groups included Polish people (of whom 2 million gentile Poles were killed) and some other people of Slavic descent, Soviets (specifically prisoners of wars), some Africians, Asians and others who did not belong to the "Aryan race", the mentally ill, physically disabled and the mentally challenged, homosexuals and transexual people, and political opponents and religious dissidents such as communists, trade unionists and Jehovah Witnesses.

So, you are indicating that only the Jewish people were persecuted due to their ethnicity? It was actually anyone else that did not belong to Hitler's or the Third Reich's Aryan nation or vision. But, they are certainly not as acknowledged or commemorated when it comes to being victims of the Holocaust.


The idea that Judaism is a race is highly disputed even to this day; however, during the time leading up to and during the era of the Third Reich, the Jews were considered a race.

The fact that many non-Jewish persons were killed during the reign of the Third Reich is undoubtedly true, however, the ways in which the Jews were persecuted, and exterminated were, and still are unprecedented events in human history.

I'm glad that you brought up the other victims of the Third Reich as I should have mentioned in my original post. As an aspiring future historian of this era, in no way am I attempted to diminish the struggle and deaths of others besides Jews during this time period, however, a distinction can and must be made. The Roma indeed were exterminated en masse, and persecuted during Hitler's reign. However, their presence throughout Europe, and specifically in Germany was not as substantially both in number and in role within society. What makes the extermination of the Jews more peculiar and disturbing was the fact that Jews were embedded within German society and not looked upon as outsiders such as the gypsies prior to the rise of National Socialism. Regarding other groups of people, the Poles which you mentioned (specifically gentile Poles) were not exterminated on the basis of their "unfit" role in Hitler's new Germany. They were as much casualties of war and occupation as the Soviet POW's you mentioned. I agree that others such as Asians, Africans, and other ethnically "unfit" (according to the Reich's ideology) were persecuted and murdered. However, their persecution was not as central to the Third Reich as that of the Jews. The mentally ill were largely sterilized by the Nazis and were not murdered on the large scale that the Jews were due to public unrest after the secrecy of their eugenic policies was removed.

The Jewish persecution and extermination was unique during that time period. No other group besides the Jews was so violently, and unjustifiably persecuted under laws which were introduced and "passed" in a nation which was considered advanced both politically and socially. Furthermore, no group besides the Jews was exterminated in such inhumane, systematic, and dogmatic ways as they were. It was not the case that the Roma, homosexuals, Poles, or Soviets were murdered merely for the sake of their complete eradication as were the Jews.

I say all of this simply because the extermination of the Jews, while concurrent to the murders of many other groups of people which all are tremendously unjust and worthy of remembrance was unique in the era of the Third Reich, and unprecedented in human history.

 

[kmun44]

its true it was a conspiracy, i saw it on youtube.

 

[black jesus]

Originally Posted by Carlos Tevez

i agree w/ all your posts bro 

 wish more people saw it like that 

 

[brownin187]

Carlos kept it real as hell in this thread..Bravo.

 

[smoke ya later]

11 million total, 6 million were Jews

 

[kiddiaho]

Originally Posted by Black Jesus

Originally Posted by Carlos Tevez

i agree w/ all your posts bro 

 wish more people saw it like that 

I feel the same way

 

[mr delorean]

look around at the topics here. legitimate discussion on current affairs does not occur at niketalk.

911 truthers = obama birthers. all of these people possess questionable mental capacity.

 

[mangudai954]

The Holocaust is usually taught in schools and in literature, as wellas in academia, as the mass genocide that perpetrated and killed sixmillion Jews throughout Europe in WWII. But, Hitler killed around 14million during his reign in which there was non-Jewish victims whichwere also persecuted, tortured, tattooed and killed. These includearound 5 million which were men, women, and children. Often, thesevictims are made to die in vain and the survivors as well as theirfamilies of these 5 million are often overshadowed by the Jewishcasualties and mortalities.



My high school books did in fact teach this.

 

[duba169]

i love how you +%$@++% idiots praise the man who just recently killed young men and women openly in the streets for protesting the iranian government. most of those killed or jailed were the same age as the majority of the pople in this thread. around 17-25. it's an extreemly young country being oppressed. we all know iran is truning into a military state

some simple people in this thread. living in their black and white world.

 

[Animal Thug]

Originally Posted by DubA169

i love how you +%$@++% idiots praise the man who just recently killed young men and women openly in the streets for protesting the iranian government. most of those killed or jailed were the same age as the majority of the pople in this thread. around 17-25. it's an extreemly young country being oppressed. we all know iran is truning into a military state

some simple people in this thread. living in their black and white world.

Shall I expose your government...?

  

 

[kix4kix]

Originally Posted by Mangudai954

The Holocaust is usually taught in schools and in literature, as wellas in academia, as the mass genocide that perpetrated and killed sixmillion Jews throughout Europe in WWII. But, Hitler killed around 14million during his reign in which there was non-Jewish victims whichwere also persecuted, tortured, tattooed and killed. These includearound 5 million which were men, women, and children. Often, thesevictims are made to die in vain and the survivors as well as theirfamilies of these 5 million are often overshadowed by the Jewishcasualties and mortalities.

My high school books did in fact teach this.

They offed the blacks WAYYY before the jews 

 

[carlos tevez]

Originally Posted by DubA169

i love how you +%$@++% idiots praise the man who just recently killed young men and women openly in the streets for protesting the iranian government. most of those killed or jailed were the same age as the majority of the pople in this thread. around 17-25. it's an extreemly young country being oppressed. we all know iran is truning into a military state

some simple people in this thread. living in their black and white world.

The U.S. government supports far worse leaders than this. In fact, they back leaders who have actually killed U.S. citizens.

Why just villify Ahmadinejad? What he does in Iran is no different than what other dictators do in their countries. The only difference is those leaders bow down to America's will and so Washington turns a blind-eye.

 

[drsfinest72]

terrorism is a made up word to convince a large amount of people to support their agenda.

 

[mo matik]

Originally Posted by mr delorean

look around at the topics here. legitimate discussion on current affairs does not occur at niketalk.

911 truthers = obama birthers. all of these people possess questionable mental capacity.

You're right...to an extent. 

The people who go about trying to preach "the truth" and who are convinced by youtube videos are absolutely comparable to birthers.

However, the people who question the official report on what happened that day are not.  I'm sure you've heard of Robert Fisk?  Hands down the best journalist on Middle East Affairs. Writes for the independent?  He wrote a good article on the subject, and a really surprising one imo. 

http://www.independent.co...th-about-911-462904.html

 

[callhimar]

Originally Posted by heartofthacity

You do have some good points
but he reflects his religion in his political beliefs (in reference to the homosexuality).
Do you get 100+ lashes, fines, and the possibility of execution for being gay in the US?..

This may not happen at the present time, but in Americas very recent history punishment for being homosexual was extremely common, and extremely cruel. They would be harassed by police, entrapped into revealing their homosexuality and thrown in jail. Also, in some states, the penalty for two consenting adults who had homosexual sex was for the to be put in a mental institution. They could also be castrated and lobotomized.

Hazel and Carlos Tevez are saying everything I'd like to.

i love how you +%$@++% idiots praise the man who just recently killedyoung men and women openly in the streets for protesting the iraniangovernment. most of those killed or jailed were the same age as themajority of the pople in this thread. around 17-25. it's an extreemlyyoung country being oppressed. we all know iran is truning into amilitary state

some simple people in this thread. living in their black and white world.
I don't think anyone is praising him at all. Defending him because he is often misquoted and misunderstood? Yes, because it's important for Americans to understand that he isn't as bad as he is portrayed, but he certainly isn't an angel. America supports far worse leaders than him and our government has fired on its own civilians in the past for protesting. It goes both ways.

 

[duba169]

Originally Posted by Animal Thug1539

Originally Posted by DubA169

i love how you +%$@++% idiots praise the man who just recently killed young men and women openly in the streets for protesting the iranian government. most of those killed or jailed were the same age as the majority of the pople in this thread. around 17-25. it's an extreemly young country being oppressed. we all know iran is truning into a military state

some simple people in this thread. living in their black and white world.

Shall I expose your government...?

  

i'm well aware of the atrocities committed by the US. you won't get any argument from me about that. that's not excuse for people treating this guy like his crap don't stink

but i don't remember bush killing his own people in the streets for protesting

 

[shaunhillftw49]

Originally Posted by Mangudai954

The Holocaust is usually taught in schools and in literature, as wellas in academia, as the mass genocide that perpetrated and killed sixmillion Jews throughout Europe in WWII. But, Hitler killed around 14million during his reign in which there was non-Jewish victims whichwere also persecuted, tortured, tattooed and killed. These includearound 5 million which were men, women, and children. Often, thesevictims are made to die in vain and the survivors as well as theirfamilies of these 5 million are often overshadowed by the Jewishcasualties and mortalities.

My high school books did in fact teach this.

Same. We actually had to do group projects on each separate type of group that was attacked. And the teacher was Jewish.

 

[Animal Thug]

drsfinest72 wrote:

---

terrorism is a made up word to convince a large amount of people to support their agenda.


As ignorant and oblivious as this sounds, I have to agree to a CERTAIN extent.

On some occasions, the media exploits the term 'terrorism' usually associating it with 'Islam' or 'Muslims'. Very unfair and harsh. For example, Virgina Tech shooting. I believe, had he of been of Arabic descent -  the media would've easily labeled him a terrorist. That's just my opinion though.