College Degree Value Decreasing

[Air Champa]

Know a dude who did everything "the right way." He worked hard while putting himself through one of the local trade schools.

Last I seen him he was 10 of thousands of dollars in debt and working at the local Sam's Club

 

[mplsdunk]

I don’t get why you would go to a trade school to learn something like electrician or whatever.

that’s one of the benefits of trades, no schooling and paid to learn. Idk maybe it’s different in right to work states or something but nobody does that here. You just get a job and get paid 50% of full scale and get a raise every 500 hours.

 

[deusavertat]

This!

And with some of these jobs, there is a physical component that is very important and often ignored. The potential for career-ending accidents/injuries is higher. ATC and pilots can't fly/direct air traffic past a certain age.

Few of these professions have older workers, and the ones who last have gone through the process of obtaining the aforementioned certs/continuing education and gave themselves the ability to move up the ranks.

The way I see it, there's no way around formal studies to future proof one's ability to earn an income.

Yea, one of my biggest motivations for going far in my education was getting a job where the physical labor was minimal. One of my best friend's pops was a delivery man for most of his life. Dude messed up his back badly moving boxes all those years. I never asked him what his dad ended up doing after his disability. My body is already a mess from playing football, I definitely don't wanna do any heavy lifting for a career.

I rather read 1000 books than lay brick and cement.

 

[mplsdunk]

I used to work on a paving crew that **** is no joke.

now I just walk a lot at my job which is cool l, I don’t mind at all. Sometimes I get in 15k steps in a shift. Not bad for a truck driver.

 

[blastercombo]

This!

And with some of these jobs, there is a physical component that is very important and often ignored. The potential for career-ending accidents/injuries is higher. ATC and pilots can't fly/direct air traffic past a certain age.

Few of these professions have older workers, and the ones who last have gone through the process of obtaining the aforementioned certs/continuing education and gave themselves the ability to move up the ranks.

The way I see it, there's no way around formal studies to future proof one's ability to earn an income.

Those jobs pay well but do so for a reason. You got 7-8 years max until your back is fried. After that you’re SOL. Not a good trade. Have a lot of people here that work the oil fields right out of high school/mid way into undergrad. They’re ballin for a couple years but are physically done after that. Company don’t care because they’ll have new faces who want to ball for a couple years too. No thanks

 

[whitemamba27]

while in college you have to be proactive and get internships/work experience over the summers. Difficult to get a job straight out of graduation without from what i've seen

 

[mplsdunk]

Union trades is like the mn version of the oilfield. Put in your 10 years as a laborer then move to equipment operator and hopefully you were smart and got some cabins to air bnb or something.

 

[fluid hips]

I don't understand why people overpay for a private university when you can get the same education or better at a public university for less money

 

[mplsdunk]

I don't understand why people overpay for a private university when you can get the same education or better at a public university for less money

appearance. My daughter lives in a super good school district but her rich friends are all going to private high schools because their parents did.

I refuse to pay for f’ing high school when the school district is great and a STEM school at that.

 

[deusavertat]

I don't understand why people overpay for a private university when you can get the same education or better at a public university for less money

The high ranked public universities are very hard to get into eg. UCLA, UC Berkley, UMich etc. Every smart kid in Cali that isn't rich wants to go to the high ranked UC schools.

The other reason is, believe it or not there ARE people out there who could afford to spend damn near 100 grand a year on NYU.

 

[deusavertat]

Those jobs pay well but do so for a reason. You got 7-8 years max until your back is fried. After that you’re SOL. Not a good trade. Have a lot of people here that work the oil fields right out of high school/mid way into undergrad. They’re ballin for a couple years but are physically done after that. Company don’t care because they’ll have new faces who want to ball for a couple years too. No thanks

Yea man I wanted a job I could do well into old age.

 

[bowflex]

I don't understand why people overpay for a private university when you can get the same education or better at a public university for less money

This. People also get sucked in with that “we’ll give you a full ride for year 1” but then they are stuck paying 30k+ for the last 3-4 years.

 

[Rj4147]

I think people need to understand this tech hustle while the $ is still there (and it should be for a while..)

admin folks make over 100k MINIMUM with little working experience

folks who manage calendars make 95k MINIMUM straight outta college

“Program managers” with no hard science skills make 175-200k MINIMUM

theres avenues to get there like linkedin (via contract work) and then transitioning full time. Companies love poaching talent from competitors. With the advent of the pandemic, it makes it easier to pursue this kind of work without having to move to the Bay/seattle/ny/austin

do you mind sharing how to get into one of these fields?

 

[calibeebee]

I used to work on a paving crew that **** is no joke.

now I just walk a lot at my job which is cool l, I don’t mind at all. Sometimes I get in 15k steps in a shift. Not bad for a truck driver.

I’m in the exact situation. Dat driver life. It’s not physical labor, just walking a lot. Could be worse. Def glad I’m not working on houses for 12/16 hours a day.

 

[heatpinoyboy]

do you mind sharing how to get into one of these fields?

Just want to be very clear this isn't about being a software engineer. That career path is very cut and dry.

Starting from the college you went to, it helps that you attend a school that's targeted by these tech companies. Traditionally its the UCLA's, Berkeleys, CAL Tech, MIT, Stanford, Ivys, USC, Duke, etc. Nowadays most tech companies broaden their scope as a way to combat bias and try to not look at school as a determining factor, though it doesn't mean outreach in these schools have gone down since there are still tons of alumni that went to these target schools

In tandem with building relationships through this network (LinkedIn, attending physical event, any career fair, etc) you want to build up as vast of a collection of work experience via internship. Obviously internships with target companies you want to work for will string you along father, but it can be done with experience from other places like non-profits, event industry, etc. Because the roles I am referencing don't require any hard skills (e.g. how good is your prioritization, time management, your ability to work across different departments, etc) it helps to be proficient in something like MS suite/Google Suite/basic SQL etc

Another thing to be aware of is what roles are open to new graduates straight out of college. These vary from company to company but common ones are: Admin business partner, recruiting coordinator, HR coordinator, Account strategist, Associate Marketer, Associate Analyst, etc etc. Build a catalog of roles that you know are actually available to you as a new grad. You want to be sure you meeting MINIMUM requirements because 9.9/10 times you'll get passed up.

Don't do a cover letter

Feel like I'm missing a lot but let me know if theres something you need covered

 

[Rj4147]

Just want to be very clear this isn't about being a software engineer. That career path is very cut and dry.

Starting from the college you went to, it helps that you attend a school that's targeted by these tech companies. Traditionally its the UCLA's, Berkeleys, CAL Tech, MIT, Stanford, Ivys, USC, Duke, etc. Nowadays most tech companies broaden their scope as a way to combat bias and try to not look at school as a determining factor, though it doesn't mean outreach in these schools have gone down since there are still tons of alumni that went to these target schools

In tandem with building relationships through this network (LinkedIn, attending physical event, any career fair, etc) you want to build up as vast of a collection of work experience via internship. Obviously internships with target companies you want to work for will string you along father, but it can be done with experience from other places like non-profits, event industry, etc. Because the roles I am referencing don't require any hard skills (e.g. how good is your prioritization, time management, your ability to work across different departments, etc) it helps to be proficient in something like MS suite/Google Suite/basic SQL etc

Another thing to be aware of is what roles are open to new graduates straight out of college. These vary from company to company but common ones are: Admin business partner, recruiting coordinator, HR coordinator, Account strategist, Associate Marketer, Associate Analyst, etc etc. Build a catalog of roles that you know are actually available to you as a new grad. You want to be sure you meeting MINIMUM requirements because 9.9/10 times you'll get passed up.

Don't do a cover letter

Feel like I'm missing a lot but let me know if theres something you need covered

Gotchu thanks for the detailed post.
What do you think about attending a coding bootcamp without any degree? Would it lead to a job or is a bachelors degree necessary?

I’m finishing up a degree in IT from WGU and from what I’ve read job prospects are in help desk positions which I’m trying to avoid. I have 2 years of experience with that. I’m looking to become a software engineer.

 

[mplsdunk]

I’m in the exact situation. Dat driver life. It’s not physical labor, just walking a lot. Could be worse. Def glad I’m not working on houses for 12/16 hours a day.

Holy hell dude that’s hella walking.

yeah I drive a low bed so I can’t fit a lot of places so I might have to walk back a mile to grab a dozer or something and drive it out.

all my co workers are in good shape, we aren’t built like dump truck drivers.

 

[heatpinoyboy]

Gotchu thanks for the detailed post.
What do you think about attending a coding bootcamp without any degree? Would it lead to a job or is a bachelors degree necessary?

I’m finishing up a degree in IT from WGU and from what I’ve read job prospects are in help desk positions which I’m trying to avoid. I have 2 years of experience with that. I’m looking to become a software engineer.

Depends if you can stomach some of what each bootcamp will take from you. Some have you pay large up front some will take a % of your money once you land a job.

But IMO for SWE jobs you do not need a degree whatsoever to land one. It's just that folks who take CS classes for four years are generally more prepared than those who don't. If you leetcode everyday in combo with your bootcamp you should be good. Some companies even offer SWE apprenticeships (LinkedIn comes to mind).

If you're confident you can have mastery over domain expertise or general algorithm questions (in addition to being able to explicate WHY you solved a problem a certain way) through bootcamp then do that. Again, understand what that means when going up against folks who have done CS for four straight years (network, experience, internships...) that is your competition.

 

[finessence]

IG and YouTube are college now for teens

 

[jape]

 

[Rj4147]

Depends if you can stomach some of what each bootcamp will take from you. Some have you pay large up front some will take a % of your money once you land a job.

But IMO for SWE jobs you do not need a degree whatsoever to land one. It's just that folks who take CS classes for four years are generally more prepared than those who don't. If you leetcode everyday in combo with your bootcamp you should be good. Some companies even offer SWE apprenticeships (LinkedIn comes to mind).

If you're confident you can have mastery over domain expertise or general algorithm questions (in addition to being able to explicate WHY you solved a problem a certain way) through bootcamp then do that. Again, understand what that means when going up against folks who have done CS for four straight years (network, experience, internships...) that is your competition.

Got it. I’m a little worried about not even getting interviews without a degree but I guess as long my projects are good/ resume worthy then I should be getting them (post-bootcamp). Any other advice for IT positions that don’t require degrees from top schools? Thanks again.

 

[streetlights]

How many kids went to school to be a music producer? Out there charging kids hundreds of thousands of dollars

at some point people need to be held accountable...at 18 you should be able to think like an adult more than thinking like a child...in any other country on earth 18 is usually a grown man/woman w responsibilities...

if you want to be a musician/nba player/influencer and youre an adult, i really doubt anyone is gonna feel sorry for you later in life and more than likely you will be broke...music degrees are for kids that come from wealth and kids that will be okay financially regardless of education

there is no safer route than college/education for a young adult...but still, that doesnt buy common sense...you have to be accountable for your decisions and work hard

 

[pdino]

College still shouldn’t be as expensive as it is... my dad went to school and worked part time. Paid his tuition working part time.. nowadays couldn’t pay for half your tuition without some financial aide/scholarship working a part time job

 

[mplsdunk]

no one ever talks about this but do you think part of it has to do with your work ethic between these rates and not your intellect?

like my boy has two masters and is paid but he just works really hard, dude isn’t a genius or anything. Just a hard *** worker.

 

[deusavertat]

I’m in the exact situation. Dat driver life. It’s not physical labor, just walking a lot. Could be worse. Def glad I’m not working on houses for 12/16 hours a day.

My job is super sedentary. I have to do at least an hour of cardio a day so I don't die of heart disease.