Is NOT Having Children Considered a Selfish Act?

The Bible and religion are dangerous when it comes to sex and the role of women. Catholics condemn birth control, even in AIDS ravaged countries in Africa. What a crime IMO. Women aren't allowed to become priests, priests aren't allowed to have sex, Sex is only for procreating. It's a circus.

Call me selfish though.
 
LIONBLOOD said:
In my experience people who are adamant about others having children are selfish and obtuse. Having children is a sellfish act.



I suppose that woman who wants to forgo having children because she thinks it may interfere with her career as a surgeon (takes commitment and sacrifice, she wants to help others) and she feels she can't give the child the attention it deserves is somehow less committed than that woman with 5 kids and no job, who relies on government funds and child support?
Click to expand...

When your womb becomes barren and you've lost out on potential life partners because you kept putting off children in lieu of a career you have no one to blame but yourself for being selfish.
 
TheRealRell said:
No. If you can't support said kid that you bring into the world. You're sparing your potential child a life of difficulty and hardship.

Yes. People who are generally adamant about not having children are selfish people themselves. Everything about them from their lifestyle to the way they interact with people reflects that value. Having a child requires sacrifice and commitment which is something they don't want to give up.
Click to expand...
yes
LIONBLOOD said:
 
 Having children is a sellfish act.
Click to expand...
laugh.gif
 just stop man
 
:lol: no man. The original post does not share my views. Too many people have kids who shouldn't. Like me back in the day. :lol: waiting 10 years would have saved me a lot of headache.
 
Last edited:
Not really.

I know married couples with no kids.


Life maybe too busy for them, travel too much for job. Everybody can't have a live in Nanny and children aren't cheap. Depends on the people but it's selfish bringing a child into the world and not being able to maintain or work hard for them.
 
if you work at mcdonalds i think its selfish to have 3 kids or any kids when you have no money to support them.  especially when your mother worked at mcdonalds and she barely had enough money to support you
 
japejapejape said:
if you work at mcdonalds i think its selfish to have 3 kids or any kids when you have no money to support them.  especially when your mother worked at mcdonalds and she barely had enough money to support you
Click to expand...

I'd agree also.

My current physical therapist has 6 children, my occupational therapist has 4.

I assume even with their jobs their husbands have good jobs also.
 
It isn't selfish. On the contrary, it's actually being realistic and accepting that you may not have the ability to raise children.

Unlike irresponsible parents that don't discipline their kids and let them do whatever they want just to avoid responsibility or don't find the energy within them to lay the hammer down.
 
Yes, not having children is considered selfish, but on the flipside, having children is selfish as well, and I will give reasons for both sides.
And warning this will be long, so I already know some of you wont read it, but I hope i can shed some light for those who do read


The problem is we have been raised to associate the word "selfish" with negative connotations and it is only described to us in situations where it is to be avoided, when in reality there are situations where its beneficial. "Selfishness is not living as one wishes to live, it is asking others to live as one wishes to live" - Oscar Wilde.




Firstly having a child is a choice not an obligation, and its a shame many people grow up never realizing that they actually have this option because society tries to portray having children as a necessity, as one of the stepping stones of life following the progression of 1) Got to school. 2)Get a job. 3)Get married. 4)Buy a house. 5)Have children. also known as the LIfe Script. Any deviation from this is met with heavy resistance. When you do something, even if its harmless and in this case it is, that goes against what generally accepted by the majority of society, they will continually shame you for it until you submit and fall back in line. Usually because they never realized they had the same choices you did. People want their opinions validated and You choosing something opposite from them somehow negates their choice, makes them think their choice could somehow be wrong, which in their minds is bad and they will make you confirm to reassure themselves. Crabs in a barrel essentially






Now having children is selfish. No one has ever been able to tell me why they wanted children without using the words "I wanted" and that's if they've actually given it some thought since most people dont:

"I want to know real unconditional love for someone" "I want someone to take care of me when I am old" "I want to fix my marriage" "I want to be a 'real' adult" "I want to have my own family" "I want to pass on my genes" "I want to pass on the family name" "I want more pieces of me in the world" etc.

Others who haven't thought about it just parrot what society tells them:

"Its just what people do" "Accidents happen" "I don't want to be lonely" "Its the only reason to get married" "The bible says so" "I don't want to looked at like less of a woman/man" "You cant make a meaningful difference in a childs life unless your are a parent" "I don't want people to think I'm selfish" etc.

Rarely does anyone give a reason for the well being or benefit of the potential child :smh: . Its mainly about their own self gratification or selfish reasons which to me is crazy because having children is a whole life changing event that not only affect you but your S.O. and more importantly the child itself, but most forget that. They think about the short term but not the long term
If they have considered the child's well being and future and planned accordingly for it, then they have every right to go and be selfish and have that child. I support it because that's a good form of being selfish. They considered how it would affect not only themselves but everyone else involved in the act.
I especially hate hearing about those who only had kids to please their S.O. or to save their relationship, or to exploit their partner for child support or to game the system for welfare or other selfish situations. That child was an afterthought, just a means to an end since It was only about you. Its even worse when they know they don't have the resources to provide for the child and have them anyway because reasons or society says its the "thing to do"


Honestly the world is overpopulated and it resources are being drained. we no longer need to "be fruitful and multiply. We multiplied so much that there are those that have and those that don't. The human race is also in no danger of dying out anytime soon. We are the ones causing stress on the planet, not the reverse. Every new child born in a first world country will consume more resources and less will be available for children in other less fortunate places. Heres and interesting video and its unsettling because its true, tho I don't agree with his solution :





There are hundreds of thousands of kids in the US alone looking to be adopted, but no one wants them because they're not babies (no one wants a preteen or teenager), because they don't share the same blood/genes as potential families, because a majority of people who want children are not interested in raising other people kids because they could not love them like their own. And its sad that many of these kids will age out of the system never have a family. So where are all the selfless parents who love children? If all children are special and you actually want kids, why not adopt? Why do so many go without homes if the majority of parents or potential parents are selfless people? :rolleyes


Society wants you to have children because more people ensures the status quo will be enforced, especially capitalism because more children means more workers and spenders, which keep business going. its also why the govt incentivizes you to have children and are trying to reverse falling birth rates. To expand on this look at the backlash on programs for alternate Sex Ed in schools and on programs like planned parent hood. A lot of people are taught abstinence only education, yet there are a lot of teen pregnancies . These programs will help people make informed decisions, protect themselves and give people options but those that never had those options dont want the future knowing they have a choice for some reason. Crabs in a barrel again






Now not having children is also selfish. Technically a decision made for someone who does not exist cant be selfish because it does not affect them but apparently society does not think so. The person made that choice because they don't want to change the way they live, it would be an inconvenience for them. They want to be able to do what they want without having to think about, care for and provide for any one else and there's nothing wrong with that. They could have perfectly valid reasons for doing so such as not being able to afford a child, not having the resources or time to support a child, not wanting to bring a child into this world because they don't like where the future is heading, not wanting to raise a child under bad living conditions, not wanting to pass on genetic diseases that would give a child a lower quality of life, etc. Decisions that actually factor in the well being and positive future of the child, but society treats these as nonsense because everyone should have a child, even if they really shouldn't just because its the thing to do, and you are selfish if you don't



People also believe you can't make a positive difference in a child's life without being a parent. We all know bad parents negatively affecting their child's life who prove this statement wrong. But they had a child so are they selfish?
There are many people who don't have children of thier own who are unselfish who help children everyday in many ways. Teachers, Doctors, Caregivers, Volunteers for children's organizations like Big Brothers Big Sisters, Toys for Tots, people who visit children in hospitals, provide food for children at food banks, Foster parents, and many countless other examples. But Society considers these people "selfish" because they don't have kids of their own? makes no sense to me :x and I dare you to call any of those people selfish to their face




Its crazy that we live in a world where more people will tell you that you shouldn't have a dog if you cant provide a good home for them, afford all the food and things they need, don't have adequate time or resources and haven't taken the time to learn to care for them properly, you like dogs but just don't want the constant responsibility for the dog but if you change "dog" to "child" more people will tell you to have the child and chastise you if you don't :smh: . Its crazy that we live in a world where its seen as ok for people to tell you that regardless of your age, you're too young to decide not have a child, but your not to young to have children or think about having them :smh: . You are too young to make a decision by yourself that affects your life, and since they know so much more about your life than you, they know whats best. Its crazy how people say "I am unable to do something I want to do, and since you can do the thing I want to do you should do it for all the people like me who cant, even if you just don't want too, even if it would make you unhappy, even if the thing it would negatively affect you, even if you given it some thought and there are more cons than pros of the situation for you, you should just do it anyway because I cant, and you are selfish if you don't because what you want doesn't matter, what I want does." :smh: |I



Honestly I would rather not have kids and regret I didnt, than have kids and regret I had them, but that's just me. There are parents who feel this way but are not vocal about it because society will shame them if they tell how they really feel. You should be able to talk about the positives and negatives of having a child and people should be able to make educated and informed decision regarding whether having a child is right for them and more importantly, is in the best interest of the child. it unfortunate the child is the one most often forgotten about in these situations


and if you actually read all that Thank You. hopefully I was able to make you think and see that you have options and to make the choice that works best for your situation
 
Last edited:
Joe Cool said:
Yes, not having children is considered selfish, but on the flipside, having children is selfish as well, and I will give reasons for both sides.
And warning this will be long, so I already know some of you wont read it, but I hope i can shed some light for those who do read


The problem is we have been raised to associate the word "selfish" with negative connotations and it is only described to us in situations where it is to be avoided, when in reality there are situations where its beneficial. "Selfishness is not living as one wishes to live, it is asking others to live as one wishes to live" - Oscar Wilde.




Firstly having a child is a choice not an obligation, and its a shame many people grow up never realizing that they actually have this option because society tries to portray having children as a necessity, as one of the stepping stones of life following the progression of 1) Got to school. 2)Get a job. 3)Get married. 4)Buy a house. 5)Have children. also known as the LIfe Script. Any deviation from this is met with heavy resistance. When you do something, even if its harmless and in this case it is, that goes against what generally accepted by the majority of society, they will continually shame you for it until you submit and fall back in line. Usually because they never realized they had the same choices you did. People want their opinions validated and You choosing something opposite from them somehow negates their choice, makes them think their choice could somehow be wrong, which in their minds is bad and they will make you confirm to reassure themselves. Crabs in a barrel essentially






Now having children is selfish. No one has ever been able to tell me why they wanted children without using the words "I wanted" and that's if they've actually given it some thought since most people dont:

"I want to know real unconditional love for someone" "I want someone to take care of me when I am old" "I want to fix my marriage" "I want to be a 'real' adult" "I want to have my own family" "I want to pass on my genes" "I want to pass on the family name" "I want more pieces of me in the world" etc.

Others who haven't thought about it just parrot what society tells them:

"Its just what people do" "Accidents happen" "I don't want to be lonely" "Its the only reason to get married" "The bible says so" "I don't want to looked at like less of a woman/man" "You cant make a meaningful difference in a childs life unless your are a parent" "I don't want people to think I'm selfish" etc.

Rarely does anyone give a reason for the well being or benefit of the potential child :smh: . Its mainly about their own self gratification or selfish reasons which to me is crazy because having children is a whole life changing event that not only affect you but your S.O. and more importantly the child itself, but most forget that. They think about the short term but not the long term
If they have considered the child's well being and future and planned accordingly for it, then they have every right to go and be selfish and have that child. I support it because that's a good form of being selfish. They considered how it would affect not only themselves but everyone else involved in the act.
I especially hate hearing about those who only had kids to please their S.O. or to save their relationship, or to exploit their partner for child support or to game the system for welfare or other selfish situations. That child was an afterthought, just a means to an end since It was only about you. Its even worse when they know they don't have the resources to provide for the child and have them anyway because reasons or society says its the "thing to do"


Honestly the world is overpopulated and it resources are being drained. we no longer need to "be fruitful and multiply. We multiplied so much that there are those that have and those that don't. The human race is also in no danger of dying out anytime soon. We are the ones causing stress on the planet, not the reverse. Every new child born in a first world country will consume more resources and less will be available for children in other less fortunate places. Heres and interesting video and its unsettling because its true, tho I don't agree with his solution :





There are hundreds of thousands of kids in the US alone looking to be adopted, but no one wants them because they're not babies (no one wants a preteen or teenager), because they don't share the same blood/genes as potential families, because a majority of people who want children are not interested in raising other people kids because they could not love them like their own. And its sad that many of these kids will age out of the system never have a family. So where are all the selfless parents who love children? If all children are special and you actually want kids, why not adopt? Why do so many go without homes if the majority of parents or potential parents are selfless people? :rolleyes


Society wants you to have children because more people ensures the status quo will be enforced, especially capitalism because more children means more workers and spenders, which keep business going. its also why the govt incentivizes you to have children and are trying to reverse falling birth rates. To expand on this look at the backlash on programs for alternate Sex Ed in schools and on programs like planned parent hood. A lot of people are taught abstinence only education, yet there are a lot of teen pregnancies . These programs will help people make informed decisions, protect themselves and give people options but those that never had those options dont want the future knowing they have a choice for some reason. Crabs in a barrel again






Now not having children is also selfish. Technically a decision made for someone who does not exist cant be selfish because it does not affect them but apparently society does not think so. The person made that choice because they don't want to change the way they live, it would be an inconvenience for them. They want to be able to do what they want without having to think about, care for and provide for any one else and there's nothing wrong with that. They could have perfectly valid reasons for doing so such as not being able to afford a child, not having the resources or time to support a child, not wanting to bring a child into this world because they don't like where the future is heading, not wanting to raise a child under bad living conditions, not wanting to pass on genetic diseases that would give a child a lower quality of life, etc. Decisions that actually factor in the well being and positive future of the child, but society treats these as nonsense because everyone should have a child, even if they really shouldn't just because its the thing to do, and you are selfish if you don't



People also believe you can't make a positive difference in a child's life without being a parent. We all know bad parents negatively affecting their child's life who prove this statement wrong. But they had a child so are they selfish?
There are many people who don't have children of thier own who are unselfish who help children everyday in many ways. Teachers, Doctors, Caregivers, Volunteers for children's organizations like Big Brothers Big Sisters, Toys for Tots, people who visit children in hospitals, provide food for children at food banks, Foster parents, and many countless other examples. But Society considers these people "selfish" because they don't have kids of their own? makes no sense to me :x and I dare you to call any of those people selfish to their face




Its crazy that we live in a world where more people will tell you that you shouldn't have a dog if you cant provide a good home for them, afford all the food and things they need, don't have adequate time or resources and haven't taken the time to learn to care for them properly, you like dogs but just don't want the constant responsibility for the dog but if you change "dog" to "child" more people will tell you to have the child and chastise you if you don't :smh: . Its crazy that we live in a world where its seen as ok for people to tell you that regardless of your age, you're too young to decide not have a child, but your not to young to have children or think about having them :smh: . You are too young to make a decision by yourself that affects your life, and since they know so much more about your life than you, they know whats best. Its crazy how people say "I am unable to do something I want to do, and since you can do the thing I want to do you should do it for all the people like me who cant, even if you just don't want too, even if it would make you unhappy, even if the thing it would negatively affect you, even if you given it some thought and there are more cons than pros of the situation for you, you should just do it anyway because I cant, and you are selfish if you don't because what you want doesn't matter, what I want does." :smh: |I



Honestly I would rather not have kids and regret I didnt, than have kids and regret I had them, but that's just me. There are parents who feel this way but are not vocal about it because society will shame them if they tell how they really feel. You should be able to talk about the positives and negatives of having a child and people should be able to make educated and informed decision regarding whether having a child is right for them and more importantly, is in the best interest of the child. it unfortunate the child is the one most often forgotten about in these situations


and if you actually read all that Thank You. hopefully I was able to make you think and see that you have options and to make the choice that works best for your situation
Click to expand...
Rock clapping.gif
 
I remember back when I was dating this one chick and she wanted to have kids. We were together for a couple of years and I thought we could've had a future together and I figured it would happen at some point in the future. Only thing was that she wanted them NOW. As a 21 year old I was like hell no, we are still kids ourselves. I don't know if it was the fact that her mother had her when she was a teenager or if all of her friends were either having kids or getting married, but she was determined to have a kid. She didn't have a plan or anything. Neither of us had any real money or a place to stay; we were just college kids trying to get degrees. Maybe I was selfish, but there was no way I was ready to have a kid without a stable job or a place to live. Plus I still wanted to travel a bit. A year later after we broke up and I moved across country she tells me she's having a kid. In the end we both got what we wanted. I got to travel, grow up and learn about myself and she got a kid.
 
What I've learned is that people will rationalize any aspect of their lives just to make it appear like the 'sensible' thing to do. Not only that, but people generally perceive themselves to be better than the next person. People with kids call it selfish just to take some moral high ground and say that the sacrifices they've made are valid, meanwhile people without feel like they've made the 'smart choice' since they can move with less responsibility. Truthfully it doesn't matter what you do as long as it makes you happy, and if that's the case, aren't we all selfish?
 
some of the nicest most selfless people i know choose not to have kids.

i have honestly never met anyone who thinks not having kids is selfish, sounds like the type of person to spew other nonsense trying to tell others how to live their lives 
 
Joe Cool said:
Yes, not having children is considered selfish, but on the flipside, having children is selfish as well, and I will give reasons for both sides.
And warning this will be long, so I already know some of you wont read it, but I hope i can shed some light for those who do read


The problem is we have been raised to associate the word "selfish" with negative connotations and it is only described to us in situations where it is to be avoided, when in reality there are situations where its beneficial. "Selfishness is not living as one wishes to live, it is asking others to live as one wishes to live" - Oscar Wilde.




Firstly having a child is a choice not an obligation, and its a shame many people grow up never realizing that they actually have this option because society tries to portray having children as a necessity, as one of the stepping stones of life following the progression of 1) Got to school. 2)Get a job. 3)Get married. 4)Buy a house. 5)Have children. also known as the LIfe Script. Any deviation from this is met with heavy resistance. When you do something, even if its harmless and in this case it is, that goes against what generally accepted by the majority of society, they will continually shame you for it until you submit and fall back in line. Usually because they never realized they had the same choices you did. People want their opinions validated and You choosing something opposite from them somehow negates their choice, makes them think their choice could somehow be wrong, which in their minds is bad and they will make you confirm to reassure themselves. Crabs in a barrel essentially






Now having children is selfish. No one has ever been able to tell me why they wanted children without using the words "I wanted" and that's if they've actually given it some thought since most people dont:

"I want to know real unconditional love for someone" "I want someone to take care of me when I am old" "I want to fix my marriage" "I want to be a 'real' adult" "I want to have my own family" "I want to pass on my genes" "I want to pass on the family name" "I want more pieces of me in the world" etc.

Others who haven't thought about it just parrot what society tells them:

"Its just what people do" "Accidents happen" "I don't want to be lonely" "Its the only reason to get married" "The bible says so" "I don't want to looked at like less of a woman/man" "You cant make a meaningful difference in a childs life unless your are a parent" "I don't want people to think I'm selfish" etc.

Rarely does anyone give a reason for the well being or benefit of the potential child
mean.gif
. Its mainly about their own self gratification or selfish reasons which to me is crazy because having children is a whole life changing event that not only affect you but your S.O. and more importantly the child itself, but most forget that. They think about the short term but not the long term
If they have considered the child's well being and future and planned accordingly for it, then they have every right to go and be selfish and have that child. I support it because that's a good form of being selfish. They considered how it would affect not only themselves but everyone else involved in the act.
I especially hate hearing about those who only had kids to please their S.O. or to save their relationship, or to exploit their partner for child support or to game the system for welfare or other selfish situations. That child was an afterthought, just a means to an end since It was only about you. Its even worse when they know they don't have the resources to provide for the child and have them anyway because reasons or society says its the "thing to do"


Honestly the world is overpopulated and it resources are being drained. we no longer need to "be fruitful and multiply. We multiplied so much that there are those that have and those that don't. The human race is also in no danger of dying out anytime soon. We are the ones causing stress on the planet, not the reverse. Every new child born in a first world country will consume more resources and less will be available for children in other less fortunate places. Heres and interesting video and its unsettling because its true, tho I don't agree with his solution :




There are hundreds of thousands of kids in the US alone looking to be adopted, but no one wants them because they're not babies (no one wants a preteen or teenager), because they don't share the same blood/genes as potential families, because a majority of people who want children are not interested in raising other people kids because they could not love them like their own. And its sad that many of these kids will age out of the system never have a family. So where are all the selfless parents who love children? If all children are special and you actually want kids, why not adopt? Why do so many go without homes if the majority of parents or potential parents are selfless people?
eyes.gif



Society wants you to have children because more people ensures the status quo will be enforced, especially capitalism because more children means more workers and spenders, which keep business going. its also why the govt incentivizes you to have children and are trying to reverse falling birth rates. To expand on this look at the backlash on programs for alternate Sex Ed in schools and on programs like planned parent hood. A lot of people are taught abstinence only education, yet there are a lot of teen pregnancies . These programs will help people make informed decisions, protect themselves and give people options but those that never had those options dont want the future knowing they have a choice for some reason. Crabs in a barrel again






Now not having children is also selfish. Technically a decision made for someone who does not exist cant be selfish because it does not affect them but apparently society does not think so. The person made that choice because they don't want to change the way they live, it would be an inconvenience for them. They want to be able to do what they want without having to think about, care for and provide for any one else and there's nothing wrong with that. They could have perfectly valid reasons for doing so such as not being able to afford a child, not having the resources or time to support a child, not wanting to bring a child into this world because they don't like where the future is heading, not wanting to raise a child under bad living conditions, not wanting to pass on genetic diseases that would give a child a lower quality of life, etc. Decisions that actually factor in the well being and positive future of the child, but society treats these as nonsense because everyone should have a child, even if they really shouldn't just because its the thing to do, and you are selfish if you don't



People also believe you can't make a positive difference in a child's life without being a parent. We all know bad parents negatively affecting their child's life who prove this statement wrong. But they had a child so are they selfish?
There are many people who don't have children of thier own who are unselfish who help children everyday in many ways. Teachers, Doctors, Caregivers, Volunteers for children's organizations like Big Brothers Big Sisters, Toys for Tots, people who visit children in hospitals, provide food for children at food banks, Foster parents, and many countless other examples. But Society considers these people "selfish" because they don't have kids of their own? makes no sense to me
sick.gif
and I dare you to call any of those people selfish to their face




Its crazy that we live in a world where more people will tell you that you shouldn't have a dog if you cant provide a good home for them, afford all the food and things they need, don't have adequate time or resources and haven't taken the time to learn to care for them properly, you like dogs but just don't want the constant responsibility for the dog but if you change "dog" to "child" more people will tell you to have the child and chastise you if you don't
mean.gif
. Its crazy that we live in a world where its seen as ok for people to tell you that regardless of your age, you're too young to decide not have a child, but your not to young to have children or think about having them
mean.gif
. You are too young to make a decision by yourself that affects your life, and since they know so much more about your life than you, they know whats best. Its crazy how people say "I am unable to do something I want to do, and since you can do the thing I want to do you should do it for all the people like me who cant, even if you just don't want too, even if it would make you unhappy, even if the thing it would negatively affect you, even if you given it some thought and there are more cons than pros of the situation for you, you should just do it anyway because I cant, and you are selfish if you don't because what you want doesn't matter, what I want does."
mean.gif
tired.gif




Honestly I would rather not have kids and regret I didnt, than have kids and regret I had them, but that's just me. There are parents who feel this way but are not vocal about it because society will shame them if they tell how they really feel. You should be able to talk about the positives and negatives of having a child and people should be able to make educated and informed decision regarding whether having a child is right for them and more importantly, is in the best interest of the child. it unfortunate the child is the one most often forgotten about in these situations


and if you actually read all that Thank You. hopefully I was able to make you think and see that you have options and to make the choice that works best for your situation
Click to expand...
Excellent post. 
 
The world is overpopulated as it is... Having children is more selfish to me than not having them
 
You're a grown man, b. You don't have to do what you don't want to do.

Kids are a choice. Someone has to have them, nobody said that someone had to be you.

Not having children isn't selfish. Having kids isn't selfish.

Kids are a blessing, but also a responsibility. Some people shouldn't have them, because of their selfish ways. I've seen people complain about their children, infants, toddlers, etc as if the child forced themselves onto the parent. Not saying you would do that, DC, but I'm just painting a picture.

Children require the kind of attention a lot of people don't know how to give or refuse to give to them. its a full time job with no off days.

Having children and not owning up to your responsibility is selfish. Everything else is fair game.
 
You must log in or register to reply here.

The ultimate sneaker enthusiast community.

NikeTalk was created as a way of giving back to both the sneaker enthusiast community and to the greater global community of which we are all a part.

NikeTalk is NOT affiliated with Nike Inc. in any way, shape, or form. All opinions expressed herein do not necessarily reflect those of Nike, Inc.

© 1999-2024 NikeTalk.com

Share this page

Back
Top Bottom