***Official Political Discussion Thread***

[dwalk31]

The prosecutors' assertion has more standing than a serial liar like Trump.

Of course we can agree to disagree on this point.

 

[nawghtyhare]

Going to bat for due process...

i been preaching the same thing for r kelly

 

[Belgium]

I wonder to what extent the Special Counsel is investigating potential witness intimidation and tampering.

Wouldn't want anything to happen to your father-in-law when testifying against me, "rat"[1]


"He should give information maybe on his father-in-law, because that’s the one that people want to look at."
- President Trump in phone interview to Fox News

What about your wife and father-in-law, "rat"?

Nice to know that criminal targets in the investigation still have the guts to refuse cooperating no matter what


Good job Manafort for refusing to break, unlike "rat" Michael Cohen.
Such respect for the now convicted felon, who also pleaded guilty to conspiring to obstruct the Mueller investigation in coordination with Konstantin Kilimnik.


James Comey better hope there are no tapes before he goes testifying under oath to Congress about me



1) Trump tweet on December 16:
Remember, Michael Cohen only became a “Rat” after the FBI did something which was absolutely unthinkable & unheard of until the Witch Hunt was illegally started. They BROKE INTO AN ATTORNEY’S OFFICE! Why didn’t they break into the DNC to get the Server, or Crooked’s office?

 

[dwalk31]

i been preaching the same thing for r kelly

I have too. In his case, he was actually acquitted on the charges. But despite that, people still choose to ignore due process.

 

[Belgium]

By contrast, both Cohen and Davis forcefully denied the McClatchy report alleging Cohen traveled to Prague.
It should be noted that Davis himself has faced some credibility issues, specifically a comment claiming Trump had advance knowledge of the Trump Tower meeting that he later retracted and apologized for because he didn't have the evidence to make that claim. He appears to function in a similar role as Giuliani. Technically a lawyer but more of a PR spokesman.

It appears he has smartened up this time, refraining from commenting one way or the other.
Excerpt:
Todd pressed Davis about corrections to BuzzFeed's story, but Davis did not say anything to knock down or bolster the report.
"I'm going to just say read the story and the journalists have written about their sources and other corroborating evidence," Davis said. "I can't confirm anything, I have no independent evidence."
https://thehill.com/homenews/admini...er-refuses-to-confirm-or-deny-buzzfeed-report
Cohen adviser refuses to confirm or deny BuzzFeed report
An adviser for President Trump's former lawyer, Michael Cohen, on Friday refused to confirm or deny BuzzFeed News's report that Trump instructed Cohen to lie to Congress about plans to build a Trump Tower in Moscow during the 2016 presidential campaign.

"Neither deny nor confirm, we're just not commenting on the story," Davis said during an appearance on NBC's "Meet the Press."

Davis, speaking with host Chuck Todd, notably did not say anything to confirm or discredit the report.

"[Cohen] had nothing to do with the writing of the story. He didn't initiate the story. It was done by independent reporting. So the story stands on its own," he said.

"You have, in the past, denied others or corrected the record when something has been wrong," Todd said, citing a Wall Street Journal report published Thursday. John Gauger, director of RedFinch Solutions LLC and the chief information officer at Liberty University, told the Journal that Cohen hired a small polling firm during the 2016 election to rig two online polls in Trump's favor and paid less than half of what was owed in cash.

Todd pressed Davis about corrections to BuzzFeed's story, but Davis did not say anything to knock down or bolster the report.

"I'm going to just say read the story and the journalists have written about their sources and other corroborating evidence," Davis said. "I can't confirm anything, I have no independent evidence."

Davis's comments came one day after BuzzFeed News published a report late Thursday, citing two federal investigators who claimed that Cohen told special counsel Robert Mueller that Trump personally directed him to lie after his election about the timing of when negotiations involving the project ended in an effort to obscure the president’s involvement.

Trump took aim at Cohen on Friday, accusing his former lawyer and "fixer" of “lying to reduce his jail time.”

White House press secretary Sarah Huckabee Sanders echoed Giuliani, saying Friday the BuzzFeed report was “categorically false.”

Davis's appearance on the show and recommendation that people read BuzzFeed's report is likely to bring more attention to the story.

 

[boris]

Why don’t you think he should be a senator, if it isn’t due to the allegations. Do tell. Because the allegations are what have been mentioned in this thread. If it’s due to his politics, then that is a cop out from the conversation. It begs the question why you are commenting to my stance on due process?

Also, I did comment on bigrockford’s posts and stated that they are, at best, ill-informed and/or ignorant.

Ah, so now you want to deflect and ask me what I believe after you falsely stated what I believe several times.

I'm not sure how his politics would be a cop out when I suspect his politics have a lot to do with why people think he shouldn't be a Senator. But, did you ever bother to ask anyone why Roy Moore shouldn't be Senator? What was their response (please provide the quote)?

As I said before, I don't expect you to comment on bigrock.

 

[Belgium]

Roy Moore is pro-slavery. Literally.
Didn't stop Trump from endorsing him in spite of the allegations and his medieval views on slavery, people of color and the LGBT community.

 

[Belgium]

It certainly doesn't look like a government reopening deal is being finalized. National emergency declaration tomorrow?

 

[gry60]

Roy Moore is pro-slavery. Literally.
Didn't stop Trump from endorsing him in spite of the allegations and his medieval views on slavery, people of color and the LGBT community.

Due process though...

I wonder how much due process was afforded to Black folks in the Jim Crow South.

 

[RustyShackleford]

It certainly doesn't look like a government reopening deal is being finalized. National emergency declaration tomorrow?

I have seen some reporters on Twitter saying that their sources in the White House are telling them Trump beleives that reopening the government without the Dems caving will look like a "win" for them. And he doesn't want to hand them a win.

This delusional clown is willing to destroy thousands of people's lives just so he doesn't look bad.

 

[dwalk31]

Roy Moore is pro-slavery. Literally.
Didn't stop Trump from endorsing him in spite of the allegations and his medieval views on slavery, people of color and the LGBT community.

I have never defended his politics. And I will not.

 

[IATT]

 

[gry60]

You think he deserves a fair trial to determine guilt (I'm assuming), and still believe that accusations are enough to preclude him from being worthy of being a US Senator.

You don't need to go to court to determine who should be and shouldn't be trusted with the power elected officials, let alone US senators, get access to.

When a man can say publicly that a certain portion of the population shouldn't have the same rights as others, that alone is enough to disqualify him IF you are someone who lives by the principles of American legal institutions.

When a man has been linked to multiple instances where he used his professional position to take advantage of impressionable people, it is absolutely reasonable to not want to give him the power of making the laws that will regulate our lives.

You keep talking and talking about "due process" but you're not saying anything respectable, and it is remarkable to read someone debase himself day after day and regurgitate despicable opinions for a $0.02 tax cut. Some folks truly are cheap.

 

[plansb]

I have seen some reporters on Twitter saying that their sources in the White House are telling them Trump beleives that reopening the government without the Dems caving will look like a "win" for them. And he doesn't want to hand them a win.

This delusional clown is willing to destroy thousands of people's lives just so he doesn't look bad.

He's ****ing disgusting. Ppl just trying to get by and live their lives.

I overheard 3 coworkers yesterday talking about how they hope the shutdown never ends. I ****ing snapped and told them how my parents are directly suffering from this and what pieces of **** they are for wanting people to continue suffering. They looked shocked when i went off on them, my hope is that maybe now those people realize these are real peoples lives that are being adversely effected by this - but i doubt it. Im still really ****ing pissed about it and i dont know what to do about it. I hold them and their ilk directly responsible for this nonsense.

 

[deleted]

Roy Moore is pro-slavery. Literally.
Didn't stop Trump from endorsing him in spite of the allegations and his medieval views on slavery, people of color and the LGBT community.

Roy Moore said some vile things about transgender people and I do remember that his #1 defender has expressed some questionable views of his own on that issue

Perhaps that's what compels him to staunchly defend Moore as he does

Though this was a long time ago so maybe he has grown out of that

 

[elpablo21]

Specific statements

 

[dwalk31]

You don't need to go to court to determine who should be and shouldn't be trusted with the power elected officials, let alone US senators, get access to.

When a man can say publicly that a certain portion of the population shouldn't have the same rights as others, that alone is enough to disqualify him IF you are someone who lives by the principles of American legal institutions.

I agree, which is why I have never defended his politics and I will not.

My comments are narrowly related to the allegations of pedophilia and due process.

Aside from that, I have zero defense for Roy Moore, his politics, or his statements.

 

[Belgium]

 

[deleted]

I wonder which statements were inaccurate

 

[elpablo21]

 

[gry60]

He's ****ing disgusting. Ppl just trying to get by and live their lives.

I overheard 3 coworkers yesterday talking about how they hope the shutdown never ends. I ****ing snapped and told them how my parents are directly suffering from this and what pieces of **** they are for wanting people to continue suffering. They looked shocked when i went off on them, my hope is that maybe now those people realize these are real peoples lives that are being adversely effected by this - but i doubt it. Im still really ****ing pissed about it and i dont know what to do about it. I hold them and their ilk directly responsible for this nonsense.

Just wait until they get stuck in a mudslide or a flash flood that could have been predicted if federal agencies were able to function properly.

People don't realize that one of the most important things the government produces is DATA.

This data that is used to sell/buy most goods and services we trade nationally and internationally, travel, make previsions, avoid disasters or get prepared to face them, get utility services, etc... In other words, we are all affected by this, no matter how far away from public employees we think we are.

 

[gry60]

https://www.thenation.com/article/kirstjen-nielsen-family-separation-perjury-merkley/

Kirstjen Nielsen Lied to Congress About Trump’s War on Migrant Children
Senator Jeff Merkley is demanding a perjury inquiry. And he's got documents that point to shameful wrongdoing.

https://www.merkley.senate.gov/news...administration-plan-to-create-border-crisis_-

WASHINGTON, D.C. – In a bombshell NBC News report, Oregon’s Senator Jeff Merkley today revealed a previously secret document that shows the Trump Administration deliberately plotting to create a crisis at the southern border. The memo, dated December 2017, details deliberate plans to implement a family separation policy as a deterrent to would-be asylum seekers and lays out strategies to increase detention of migrant children.

The full NBC report can be read here. The memo is available here.

“President Trump has shut down the government over a crisis we now know he deliberately created,” said Merkley. “This document shows Trump Administration staffers plotting to create a humanitarian crisis at the border—criminalizing the search for asylum, tearing children from their parents’ arms, and expanding the lock-up of both parents and children. This memo shows that the administration was treating children as political pawns, not vulnerable human beings. That’s reprehensible. We must end this Trump war on migrant children.”

This document, created by senior Department of Homeland Security and Department of Justice officials, reveals the step-by-step process that the Trump Administration undertook in December 2017 to devise and implement a formal policy of deterring asylum seekers using the threat of family separation. This policy options memo barely mentions violent gangs and drugs, focusing instead on a detailed plan to expand detention by increasing prosecutions of asylum seekers. Despite many statements by the President and senior political appointees to the contrary, this document proves that the administration was in fact intentionally and deliberately planning all along to separate families and create a crisis on the southern U.S. border.

The document comes as the Department of Homeland Security Inspector General also revealed today that the administration separated more children than it had previously admitted, and that the administration did not effectively track which of the children in their custody had been separated and where their parents were.

Tonight’s newly-exposed document explicitly reveals that high-level administration officials lied at key points about how and why the Trump Administration created this crisis.

 

[Belgium]

That Buzzfeed reporter is gonna have a whole lot of explaining to do

As far as I know this is the first time Mueller's spokesman issued a statement against anything. Not even any comment on the NYT report that claimed Trump ordered Mueller fired in June 2017 but backed off because McGahn threatened to resign "upon receiving the order."

The statement does come off as very lawyerly and kind of vague. A more forceful denial would be much less prone to speculation about the wording of the statement.

 

[dwalk31]

Mueller's office disputes BuzzFeed report that Trump directed Michael Cohen to lie to Congress

https://www.google.com/amp/s/amp.cn...olitics/mueller-statement-buzzfeed/index.html

 

[elpablo21]

Buzzkilled