***Official Political Discussion Thread***

[aepps20]

Primetime shows his high stepping selfish colors every time. Dude cares about himself and is a scumbag. Joey is equally a scumbag. How is Lizzie a corporate democracy? She's out here doing a better job than Primetime and he can't handle it. @deuce king hit them with that Ether Famb.

 

[youngogjosh]

No.

But why don't you enlighten us on what demographics Hillary and Warren both share that make them essentially the same.

I am really interested in hearing this. Srs

As I mentioned when I was making comparisons about demos, I talked about how Biden was very DINO like in his recently proposed plans, Bernie was a very Obama/populist like in his rhetoric concerning his policies and Warren reminds ME most of Hillary which I don't think is a bad thing. Warren while not as popular with black voters, she has at least has policy aimed at helping them. She's also the best orator out of the top 3 similar to Hillary in 16', which will allow her to dominate in debates, but those aren't a great indicator for success at the polls....like we saw in 16'.

 

[RustyShackleford]

This is probably the source of the new found Warren shade from Bernie.

It is the same story with everytime Bernie gets threaten by someone that could eat into his coalition. Only this time no one is buying the argument that Elizabeth Warren is somehow the chosen one of the establishment, centrist, and the 1%.

 

[Belgium]

In light of Hope Hicks stonewalling Congress in her testimony today, here's an excerpt from the Mueller report where Hicks appears to have lied to Mueller, though the obvious problem is a he said/she said issue.
Mark Corallo was the former spokesman of Trump's legal team, who ended up leaving due to obstruction concerns regarding the Trump Tower meeting.
That being said, Corallo's testimony (see excerpt below) is corroborated by contemporaneous notes. Hope Hicks gave a contradictory account to the Special Counsel.

The relevant part from the Mueller report (Page 316/ Volume 2 page 104):

https://www.washingtonpost.com/poli...-alleged-effort-cover-up-trump-tower-meeting/

The conduct described above is part of one of the episodes Mueller examined for potential obstruction of justice by the president.
"G. The President's Efforts to Prevent Disclosure of Emails About the June 9, 2016 Meeting Between Russians and Senior Campaign Officials"
I should note that the report establishes that this particular episode did not meet all 3 criteria for obstruction of justice. In fact it doesn't meet any of them.

 

[RustyShackleford]

As I mentioned when I was making comparisons about demos, I talked about how Biden was very DINO like in his recently proposed plans, Bernie was a very Obama/populist like in his rhetoric concerning his policies and Warren reminds ME most of Hillary which I don't think is a bad thing. Warren while not as popular with black voters, she has at least has policy aimed at helping them. She's also the best orator out of the top 3 similar to Hillary in 16', which will allow her to dominate in debates, but those aren't a great indicator for success at the polls....like we saw in 16'.

Hillary Clinton destroyed Bernie in primary.

And was polling above the polling error going into the election. The Comey letter is what dropped her back and arguably (among other things) cost her the win.

If Warren is as strong as Clinton is the polls. Then barring an October surprise that makes her a clearly best choice. And to her credit while being clearly left of Clinton she is trying to rebuild a Obama/Clinton esque voting base. Bernie rejected his strategy.

But I tend to agree with Erza Klein's point that Warren and Clinton might both be wonks with tons of good ideas, Warren has a much better overarching message which Clinton lacked. Besides a bad ground game, that was probably Clinton's biggest tactical shortcoming in 2016.

Imo Warren seems like she is running Obama's 2012 campaign on steroids. Preaching about how the rich need to pay a fair share and how it is the duty of an activist government to better the lives of all Americans.

I mean Bernie Sanders just delivered a speech about "Democratic socialism" and the only thing I really took away from it is that he really doesn't understand socialism all that well. Bernie needs to learn how deliver his message, and his plans, in a way people can more readily relate too. People that are not his usual base.

This is what is making Warren appear more appealing than him. Not the establishment conspiring in her favor. Bernie acting otherwise is some sucka ****.

 

[deleted]

Can't even trust that Bernie won't steal his neighbor's morning paper so we DEFINITELY can't trust him to run a country

 

[IATT]

 

[youngogjosh]

Hillary Clinton destroyed Bernie in primary.

And was polling above the polling error going into the election. The Comey letter is what dropped her back and arguably (among other things) cost her the win.

If Warren is as strong as Clinton is the polls. Then barring an October surprise that makes her a clearly best choice. And to her credit while being clearly left of Clinton she is trying to rebuild a Obama/Clinton esque voting base. Bernie rejected his strategy.

But I tend to agree with Erza Klein's point that Warren and Clinton might both be wonks with tons of good ideas, Warren has a much better overarching message which Clinton lacked. Besides a bad ground game, that was probably Clinton's best tactical shortcoming in 2016.

Imo Warren seems like Warren is running Obama's 2012 campaign on steroids. Preaching about how the rich need to pay a fair share and how it is the duty of an activist government to better the lives of all Americans.

I mean Bernie Sanders just delivered a speech about "Democratic socialism" and the only thing I really took away from it is that he really doesn't understand socialism all that well. Bernie needs to learn how deliver his message, and his plans, in a way people can more readily relate too. People that are not his usual base.

This is what is making Warren appear more appealing than him. Not the establishment conspiring in her favor. Bernie acting otherwise is some sucka ****.

Warren is very good at pleading her case to be president, my only gripe with her is that she's not left enough and if given the choice between true MFA or expanding Medicaid, she'd just expand Medicaid and not fight for the former. I do believe she'll be more aggressive with taxes given her history with CFPB but again, I feel like she won't go far enough in the right direction.

As for B Nard, I mean, I could why you'd think Bernard doesn't know what socialism is if you listened to his speech. He was talking about democratic socialism, not pure socialism.

 

[Belgium]

The FBI has contacted the lawyer for the Deutsche Bank employee who flagged suspicious 2016 Kushner Companies-Russian transactions and was subsequently fired.

 

[RustyShackleford]

Warren is very good at pleading her case to be president, my only gripe with her is that she's not left enough and if given the choice between true MFA or expanding Medicaid, she'd just expand Medicaid and not fight for the former. I do believe she'll be more aggressive with taxes given her history with CFPB but again, I feel like she won't go far enough in the right direction.

As for B Nard, I mean, I could why you'd think Bernard doesn't know what socialism is if you listened to his speech. He was talking about democratic socialism, not pure socialism.

Warren is for a federal public option, not a Medicaid expansion. There is a big difference between the two.

Second, Bernie was talking about social democracy not democratic socialism.

 

[youngogjosh]

Warren is for a federal public option, not a Medicaid expansion. There is a big difference between the two.

Second, Bernie was talking about social democracy not democratic socialism.

Don't social democracies still have capitalist economies? If so how does that describe Bernie's positions at all?

 

[RustyShackleford]

Don't social democracies still have capitalist economies? If so how does that describe Bernie's positions at all?

Yes social democracies do, and yes they describe Bernie's positions generally.

Bernie is not calling for public ownership of all of our infrastructure, and he is not calling for workers to seize the means of production (but he is calling for him to have a ownership stake and stronger collective bargaining power)

His most popular policy is Medicare for All. Where we socialize the health insurance industry. However that falls short of true socialize medicine where you socialize the entire healthcare industry (doctors, hospitals, clinics, etc)

Bernie's plans still involve some capitalist markets and private ownership.

He points to Europe and the New Deal America as proof his policies are better.

If we were to consider Bernie is a socialist, he is a relatively right wing socialist.

So social democrat seems like the more appropriate characterization.

 

[KHUFU]

I watched a bit of this, then became queasy when Jesus showed up in the middle of it all.

 

[RustyShackleford]

Can't even trust that Bernie won't steal his neighbor's morning paper so we DEFINITELY can't trust him to run a country

When it comes to his neighbors he is all about socializing the electricity usage, but keeping the bill privatized.

 

[aepps20]

When it comes to his neighbors he is all about socializing the electricity usage, but keeping the bill privatize.

Primetime when you catch him trying to syphon gas from your whip.

 

[RustyShackleford]

Art Laffer is getting the Presidential Medal of Freedom today.

Brahs, don't ever let people tell you that the world never rewards mediocrity.

Art is a laugh stock of the economics field, his theories are continuously proven wrong, yet he was successful as John Maynard Keynes on selling America on an economic framework.

As long as the you are white, affluent, male, conservative, and willing to debase yourself to further the cause of capitalistic plunder and white supremacy....

 

[RustyShackleford]

Primetime when you catch him trying to syphon gas from your whip.

Primenard is the only person that owes Zel money, and not the other way around.

 

[aepps20]

Primenard is the only person that owes Zel money, and not the other way around.

Only dude that talks about marching with MLK more than Big Mama and DLK.

 

[KHUFU]

They made light of Obama when he wore a beige suit, yet that same peanut gallery is quiet on the orange sphincter's hue, and wind swept do'.

 

[boris]

No one thought Clinton had a realistic shot at losing the general in 2016. Bernie used the unprecedented (for him) opportunity of the election to spread the message of social democracy, which to that point hadn't been articulated on that level for a half-century. Part of this rightfully involved taking the Democratic establishment to task for its decades of rightward drift. It was understandable at the time. Things look very different in hindsight.

And we're eight months away from the first primary this time around. Let's pump the brakes just a little bit

Constantly blaming everyone else and refusing to take responsibility for your actions is stooping to Trump's level. This behavior doesn't demonstrate to me that he cares about saving America from another four years of GOP hell. He has a pattern of derailing when things don't go his way.

 

[RustyShackleford]

Only dude that talks about marching with MLK more than Big Mama and DLK.

Lester would have been out there too, but his bone spurs were acting up that day.

 

[gry60]

Bernie is showing that same victim mentality as Trump.

The frustrating thing about this tweet, especially about Warren being somehow in bed with Big Money and Big Banks is that she is the one who was behind the consumer protection bureau; she put the teeth in that agency when Democrats had the ability to do so, and they successfully sued and won millions of dollars on behalf of the Consumer until the Trump administration limited their ability to pursue corporate wrongdoers.

Let's not do this; let's not engage in misrepresentation of facts to win. That's not being better than the Right; that's being right-lite.

 

[gry60]

For anyone who tries to invoke Godwin's law when those "summer camps" are recognized for what they really are

The indifference of Americans is quite scary, isn't it?

Always trying to tone down the debate, tone down the truth, tone down reality, especially when it's ugly.

Evil thrives in indifference, and Americans love not caring.

 

[gry60]

 

[RustyShackleford]

Picture of Mitch from the Civil War days...

#Dapper