***Official Political Discussion Thread***

keko jones said:
Ok Trump, what now?

Screenshot_20200106-173949_Chrome.jpg

www.wbaltv.com

American family attacked in Mexico, child killed

An American family returning to the U.S. after a holiday visit to Mexico came under attack just south of Texas on Saturday night, with armed gunmen killing a 13-year-old and wounding three other people.
www.wbaltv.com www.wbaltv.com
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Not even trying to be insensitive, and granted I’m a huge proponent of Mexico (trying to move there soon), but people have to be smarter. Mexico isn’t a place you can just bop through without a care in the world. Like any country there are areas you shouldn’t frequent as a foreigner, namely the known cartel areas around the border. 95% of the country is safe, but the bad parts are BAD.

It’s unfortunate what happened, but driving with U.S. plates in that area wasn’t a good idea. But I’m sure we’ll hear about the horrors of Mexico all over the news now. :rolleyes
 
dwalk31 said:
Bernie has the best shot
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She’s actually completely right, and both she and the party orthodoxy have used opportunities to more or less say this to each other multiple times since she has been elected.

However, I question the idea that if progressives were a party in and of themselves that they would be more likely to be elected to power.
 
Wargames said:
She’s actually completely right, and both she and the party orthodoxy have used opportunities to more or less say this to each other multiple times since she has been elected.

However, I question the idea that if progressives were a party in and of themselves that they would be more likely to be elected to power.
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She is also a hypocrite off the fact alone that she doesn't get elected without the D next to her name.....
 
Wargames said:
She’s actually completely right, and both she and the party orthodoxy have used opportunities to more or less say this to each other multiple times since she has been elected.

However, I question the idea that if progressives were a party in and of themselves that they would be more likely to be elected to power.
Click to expand...
If we had a parliamentary system and the DSA was in party, they would not be in power, they would not be the main left wing party, I don't even think they would be even be the secondary left wing party.

This is the fool's errand people like AOC are on, they think taking over the Democratic party is "winning". That's somehow all the Dems problems can be traced back to them not being left enough.

I mean I like her, but ole girl kinda be feeling herself too much. There are some things of things other progressives should push back on her about.
 
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Also, if Biden wins Iowa and NH, it is ****ing over. Done :smh:

He is gonna light up the field. Pulling up from the center logo like he MVP level Curry.

Reading this pretty much got me thinking this...

https://newrepublic.com/maz/article/155958/man-full

Even though statewide results are what the TV networks emphasize on primary nights, most Democratic convention delegates will be chosen by congressional districts. Elaine Kamarck, a longtime member of the DNC’s rules committee and a senior fellow at the Brookings Institution, points out that each congressional district is awarded a certain number of convention delegates (usually four or five) based on its prior Democratic vote. Because congressional districts with a heavy concentration of African American voters deliver such lopsided Democratic margins, they often have eight or nine delegates.

As Biden himself might say, this calculus of primary support is getting a little wonky—but the math is important for understanding the contours of the coming nomination fight.
A candidate needs to collect at least 15 percent of the vote in a congressional district to win a delegate. An affluent suburban district might split its five votes: Warren two, Buttigieg two, and Biden one. But in a majority-minority district, Biden might be the only candidate hitting the 15 percent threshold. So, in such a scenario, he could walk off with all nine delegates.
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RustyShackleford said:
If we had a parliamentary system and the DSA was in party, they would not be in power, they would not be the main left wing party, I don't even think they would be even be the secondary left wing party.

This is the fool's errand people like AOC are on, they think taking over the Democratic party is "winning". That's somehow all the Dems problems can be traced back to them not being left enough.

I mean I like her, but ole girl kinda be feeling herself too much. There are some things of things other progressives should push back on her about.
Click to expand...


It is true that the Democratic coalition is huge (it has to be since the Republican Party enjoys a whole suite of counter majoritarian devices) but in that size do come direct material contradictions of interests. We have Hospital administrators and the no benefits contract workers who make food at the same hospital. We have Hollywood producers and their unpaid interns. We have Private Equity barons and the retail workers at the firms whom those barons are raiding.

It is hard to pitch politics as a remedy to your humble and precarious station when the political party, for whom you're supposed to vote, includes your boss and considers their concerns much more important than yours.

Give us a viable multiple party system, where we can oppose the GOP while also being unshackled from the corrupt and plutocratic Democratic Party, and in time, the various left and workers parties could grow their membership and much of that grow would be out of the half of the adult population that doesn't currently vote.

In the first go around, I'd imagine there would be three parties that get anything over 1% of the national vote (I'm assuming we have a unicameral and parliamentarty system). There'd be the GOP, the Dems and the Bern Party. The Bern Party gets 15%, the Dems get 40% and the GOP gets 45%. It'd be time to form a government and the Bern Party would publicly ask the Dem Party for a whole suite of items that would help workers and would be paid for by taxes on big moneyed interests. The Dem Party would low ball if not refuse every substantial policy demand. Horse trading would continue. Many in the Dem Party would want to give the Bern Party everything it asked for but the lawyers and financiers who still ruled the Party would not budge. No Government gets formed. Finally, we'd have a new election.

A Part of the Dem Party would splinter into a centrist PMC Party. The remainder of the Democratic Party merges with the Bern Party but they have to kick out the founders and other hard leftists and change the name of the Bern Party to the Progressive Party. Most "refugees" of the old Bern Party either found the DSA Party or they forms the nucleui of a dozen very small Anarchist Marxist, Troskist, Maoists, ML and MLM parties. In time, the PMC Party would itself splinter into what will essentially be black, white, Latino, Gay and Female (militantly anti trans) PMC Parties whose focus will be rent seeking in the formation of future governments in order to secure as many high level bureaucratic and legal appointments for their identitarian groups. But for the second election of America the unicameral, the PMC Party stays intact and would act as kind maker and joins the GOP to form a slim 51% majority.

At that point it would be a question of whether or not we slip into full fascism (modestly affluent small business owners, who are ordinarily right wing, historically form alliances with salaried, urban professionals against the working class when the chips are down). The other outcome is that the left parties could mobilize workers to engage in vast, general strikes, shut the country down and make the capitalist interests who back the GOP and the PMC Party make concessions to the left.

It would be scary but then again, our current timeline has been scary as well.
 
rexanglorum said:
It is true that the Democratic coalition is huge (it has to be since the Republican Party enjoys a whole suite of counter majoritarian devices) but in that size do come direct material contradictions of interests. We have Hospital administrators and the no benefits contract workers who make food at the same hospital. We have Hollywood producers and their unpaid interns. We have Private Equity barons and the retail workers at the firms whom those barons are raiding.

It is hard to pitch politics as a remedy to your humble and precarious station when the political party, for whom you're supposed to vote, includes your boss and considers their concerns much more important than yours.

Give us a viable multiple party system, where we can oppose the GOP while also being unshackled from the corrupt and plutocratic Democratic Party, and in time, the various left and workers parties could grow their membership and much of that grow would be out of the half of the adult population that doesn't currently vote.

In the first go around, I'd imagine there would be three parties that get anything over 1% of the national vote (I'm assuming we have a unicameral and parliamentarty system). There'd be the GOP, the Dems and the Bern Party. The Bern Party gets 15%, the Dems get 40% and the GOP gets 45%. It'd be time to form a government and the Bern Party would publicly ask the Dem Party for a whole suite of items that would help workers and would be paid for by taxes on big moneyed interests. The Dem Party would low ball if not refuse every substantial policy demand. Horse trading would continue. Many in the Dem Party would want to give the Bern Party everything it asked for but the lawyers and financiers who still ruled the Party would not budge. No Government gets formed. Finally, we'd have a new election.

A Part of the Dem Party would splinter into a centrist PMC Party. The remainder of the Democratic Party merges with the Bern Party but they have to kick out the founders and other hard leftists and change the name of the Bern Party to the Progressive Party. Most "refugees" of the old Bern Party either found the DSA Party or they forms the nucleui of a dozen very small Anarchist Marxist, Troskist, Maoists, ML and MLM parties. In time, the PMC Party would itself splinter into what will essentially be black, white, Latino, Gay and Female (militantly anti trans) PMC Parties whose focus will be rent seeking in the formation of future governments in order to secure as many high level bureaucratic and legal appointments for their identitarian groups. But for the second election of America the unicameral, the PMC Party stays intact and would act as kind maker and joins the GOP to form a slim 51% majority.

At that point it would be a question of whether or not we slip into full fascism (modestly affluent small business owners, who are ordinarily right wing, historically form alliances with salaried, urban professionals against the working class when the chips are down). The other outcome is that the left parties could mobilize workers to engage in vast, general strikes, shut the country down and make the capitalist interests who back the GOP and the PMC Party make concessions to the left.

It would be scary but then again, our current timeline has been scary as well.
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lzsH3.gif


Da **** they serving at these DSA meetings famb.
 
The major things that played a role in forming the Democratic Coalition was not the GOP turning hostile to democracy. The parties started to realign before that.

It was civil rights and the fall out from that. Once the parties started polarizing around that, once the GOP chose white supremacy as their electoral strategy, we were set down this road.

Many DSA types seemingly can't face the fact that the thing holding back their workers coalition is not the Democratic Party looking out for the capital interest of rich people. It is because majority of white people don't wanted it. Full stop. Any analysis that ignores this fact or downplays it misses the mark.

So as a result of this they Democratic Party has to build its coalition in a different way. Each faction needs to feel they are getting something special/specific out the deal (something that means more that the stuff the platform they disagree with) instead of unifying around the "worker" message.

There are large swaths of land where the Democratic brand is dead, yet the far left has made zero inroads with these workers. Why? Because they are rural areas that these people are motivated by white identity politics first and foremost.

Secondly, the insinuation that minorities, even white collar workers, would just throw their desire for more robust civil right policy aside to form a coalition with white supremacist is bull**** as well.

But as always, white supremacy is subordinate so let us view every through the economic lense.
 
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