Rap Pinocchios: Is The Era Of Keeping It Real Finally Over?

[rocyaice]

Rocy

you might be right about the "Shawty Said" song, I never made it past the hook... But there's countless quotes from this guy that he contradicts time and time again... He went out and told black women they shouldn't get perms, and they were tryin to be white... Then gets an S Curl?? There's no excuse for "Play"... Look @ him on the Hip Hop Vs America %**+ a few years ago... His heart is clearly in the RIGHT place, but his brain and body are in a different world...

Yea I guess in reality the Shawty Say hook had absolutely nothing to do with the song. I mean I guess it did but the context Wayne used it inLollipop was completely different than what Banner was saying in his song.

But as far as your opinion on Banner i'm not rocking with it. And when did Banner have an S curl lol? I think you od'in on that. And you bring up"Play" which is probably the freakiest song i've ever heard actually get play on the radio. But where's the contradiction though? The factthat he's making an sexually explicit song about women? You can't knock the video because it was done tasteful. I hear your gripes but I don't seethe contradiction in what Banner is doing. And let's speak some real *@+ for a second. Banner didn't become really vocal until he saw the way ourgovernment handled the Katrina situation. He spoke out when no one else would or gave a damn for that matter.

 

[b smooth 202]

you gotta look at the game now...these rappers are under the microscope A LOT more..with videos, blog rumors, twitter and all that.

besides who takes raps literally? especially now when everybody wants to call themselves a rapper

 

[harlem on the rise]

FEDS been watchin hip hop since the early 90s... That doesn't change the fact... If anything there was a more watchful eye on artists and their contentback then... Yall don't remember Calvin Butts smashin the music in the streets?? Ice T being protested until eventually beaing dropped from Warner Bros...

Keeping it real came with a cost, I mean even in the 90s there were people dying t test you and what you say on your record... That's on a street/physicallevel... Not like now, where a dude'll just flash a few pics, make a YouTube video about you...

 

[Jordan8]

[KRS One] REAL GANGSTAS DONT RAP!!!!! [KRS ONE]

 

[deuce king]

Ross's new album though , is undeniably classic

Just for clarification, are you saying that Ross's new album is a classic??

 

[dapper d]

Originally Posted by Harlem On The Rise

Dapper D

YOU do THIS all the time... You make an EXTREME comparison to prove a point by inserting BIG, 2Pac, Nas or Jay... And say this person did it... How can you even compare David Banner and Pac @ anything?? Come on... We around the same age... Which would've made us arounf 9 or 10 when Infamous dropped, nobody knew them Ns was frauds till we was grown men and old enuff to know better... Ns actin like they knew Prodigy was buns, Ns aint know that %**+ till Mobb wasn't even poppin... Same with Onyx... That's 95... We didn't know that %**+ back then... These cats now, will be exposed and Ns will still go out and support the %**+... No one in here was old enuff to know some of these cats was fakin, not to mention there was a good deal of cats keepin way real also...

Cut it out with the comparsions, these guys wernt exposed till the 2000s, no one in here was listenin to Mobb from 94-99 and sayin these Ns lyin... except my N illPhill

... Keep it funky we were all scared of Ice Cube and thought he was G

... I neva even heard that %**+ about him being fake till prolly late 90s early 2000... The N's prime was a decade before...

I guess the point I'm trying to make is theres two positions you can take on this...
a) One is my position...where u understand its entertainment first and don't really care that much if they lied about certain aspects or overexgareated#!!*...
b) Then there is the position you take where u feel if a rapper talks about it then he really has had to live it...a position I can understand and respect butyou have to be consitant...
Just beacuse mobb deep got exposed when they were past their prime..and made way better music than Ross shouldn't excuse them if u want to take positonB...
I just feel that a lot of people have this perfect perceeption of rappers from the 90s because we grew up on it and the music was so much better but themN's was just as bad as rappers now a day...except now we have the Internet
If we had the Internet back then and everyone believed in position b then half of our favorite rappers people wouldn't even ##%% wit...

 

[harlem on the rise]

The position I have always taken when it comes to rappers and their content is... Rappers are a represenatives... The same way a cat in congress wouldrepresent a state, or district these guys represenatives for other people and places and for the most part the things that go on in those enviorments ...They're the voice of the voiceless... Even in the case of Mobb Deep, I mean they came in the game as sharing there perspective and young Ns growing up inthe projects and the type of $@%# you might end up getting involved in... Prodigy didn't talk ANY more robotic $@%# than anyone else in the 90s, he has alot of 100% honest true to life rhymes throughout his ENTIRE career... I don't really see his image he built as being this big bad gangster anyway...They're music was street orientated no doubt, but it wasn't limited to tough guy talk...

I don't think you have to have done EVERYthing you say, I prolly wouldn't listen to half the cats I listen to if they did 100% of what they said... Imean the cats that's out there robbing, killing, dealing and stealing in most cases have no real talent outside of committing crime...

But hip hop is a form of self expression... How are you expressing yourself if your not even BEING yourself?? With some of these cats its like someone gettingready to tell you a story and before they start they let you know 100% of this story is false... Would you still have intrest in the rest of the $@%# they haveto say?? I wouldn't...

 

[Jordan8]

 

[m16]

Originally Posted by Harlem On The Rise

The position I have always taken when it comes to rappers and their content is... Rappers are a represenatives... The same way a cat in congress would represent a state, or district these guys represenatives for other people and places and for the most part the things that go on in those enviorments ... They're the voice of the voiceless... Even in the case of Mobb Deep, I mean they came in the game as sharing there perspective and young Ns growing up in the projects and the type of $@%# you might end up getting involved in... Prodigy didn't talk ANY more robotic $@%# than anyone else in the 90s, he has a lot of 100% honest true to life rhymes throughout his ENTIRE career... I don't really see his image he built as being this big bad gangster anyway... They're music was street orientated no doubt, but it wasn't limited to tough guy talk...

I don't think you have to have done EVERYthing you say, I prolly wouldn't listen to half the cats I listen to if they did 100% of what they said... I mean the cats that's out there robbing, killing, dealing and stealing in most cases have no real talent outside of committing crime...

But hip hop is a form of self expression... How are you expressing yourself if your not even BEING yourself?? With some of these cats its like someone getting ready to tell you a story and before they start they let you know 100% of this story is false... Would you still have intrest in the rest of the $@%# they have to say?? I wouldn't...

Nailed it. Not everyone is/was "fake" either... Tragedy Khadafi is one QB example.

 

[guillermo gutierez]

it got REALLY corny and stupid to me when i seen that video of Scarface and some other guy goin back and forth and both of them had court documents about howthe other one was snitchin or something.

i was like "is this what hip hop has become?" everybody publicizing your private personal documents? thats wild corny and unessecsary

u dont see willie nelson doin this typa stuff to garth brooks

 

[mamaco]

Originally Posted by Deuce King

Ross's new album though , is undeniably classic

Just for clarification, are you saying that Ross's new album is a classic??

 

[dapper d]

Originally Posted by Harlem On The Rise

The position I have always taken when it comes to rappers and their content is... Rappers are a represenatives... The same way a cat in congress would represent a state, or district these guys represenatives for other people and places and for the most part the things that go on in those enviorments ... They're the voice of the voiceless... Even in the case of Mobb Deep, I mean they came in the game as sharing there perspective and young Ns growing up in the projects and the type of $@%# you might end up getting involved in... Prodigy didn't talk ANY more robotic $@%# than anyone else in the 90s, he has a lot of 100% honest true to life rhymes throughout his ENTIRE career... I don't really see his image he built as being this big bad gangster anyway... They're music was street orientated no doubt, but it wasn't limited to tough guy talk...

I don't think you have to have done EVERYthing you say, I prolly wouldn't listen to half the cats I listen to if they did 100% of what they said... I mean the cats that's out there robbing, killing, dealing and stealing in most cases have no real talent outside of committing crime...

But hip hop is a form of self expression... How are you expressing yourself if your not even BEING yourself?? With some of these cats its like someone getting ready to tell you a story and before they start they let you know 100% of this story is false... Would you still have intrest in the rest of the $@%# they have to say?? I wouldn't...

Alright pretend if we never found out Ross was a C.O....
Wouldn't u consider Ross a representatives of street N's in Miami...

 

[harlem on the rise]

When I heard the N say... "Pablo... Noreaga"... & name himself Rick Ross I knew he wasn't authentic... Never would I have thought he was thepolice tho... If he sold as many drugs as he claimded he would have his OWN name on the street... That's part of hustlin/grindin as a youngn, you EARN yaname... This N just woke up one morning, after a long shift in the jail and said "Ilm gnna grow a beard and call myself Rick Ross"... Keep it funky alot of yall didn't even know who the REAL Ross was 10 years ago... I personally learned about him via Mos Def's "Mathematics" circa 99, therewasn't no FEDS or DON Diva talkin bout that **@* @ the time...

I don't know how the police could be a representation of ANY group of black people... ANY where in the world...

Rick Ross is a representation of Miami's stree Ns??

How old are you... Don't nobody respect this N... Atleast nbody real

 

[dapper d]

Originally Posted by Harlem On The Rise

When I heard the N say... "Pablo... Noreaga"... & name himself Rick Ross I knew he wasn't authentic... Never would I have thought he was the police tho... If he sold as many drugs as he claimded he would have his OWN name on the street... That's part of hustlin/grindin as a youngn, you EARN ya name... This N just woke up one morning, after a long shift in the jail and said "Ilm gnna grow a beard and call myself Rick Ross"... Keep it funky a lot of yall didn't even know who the REAL Ross was 10 years ago... I personally learned about him via Mos Def's "Mathematics" circa 99, there wasn't no FEDS or DON Diva talkin bout that **@* @ the time...

I don't know how the police could be a representation of ANY group of black people... ANY where in the world...

Rick Ross is a representation of Miami's stree Ns??

How old are you... Don't nobody respect this N... Atleast nbody real

I'm not saying he is...
But if no one would have ever found out he was a C.O. U would still be thinking he was a street N' who just oerexgaerates in his rhymes(pablo...Noreaga...N' PLease)
Why? Cause he looked the part...and he gets love in his city....
and remember....hes not the 1st dude to steal a name...

 

[harlem on the rise]

I never thought he was a street N... I KNOW street Ns... It basically takes one to know one, on some secret soceity type %+**... I can spot a REAL N, someonewho hasn't walked the path I've walked prolly wouldn't be able to tell the difference between a real and fake one....

What other former CO stole a kingpins name?? Enlighten me... Further more, how many rappers have stolen there names from a GANGSTA?? In the history of hip hop,you could prolly riddle me off 10-20 names... that's less than 2% of ALL rappers EVER... I don't understand how his case gets associated with anyoneelses, seems like an isolated incedient... Unless its some other Police Ns out there... Overexagerate?? The word you're looking for is FLAT OUT LYING...and that's not just on record, he's taken on this persona in his real life... I remember reading a quote of his in the Negro Please (XXL Magazine)section a few years ago, about how he can't live comfortable with under $10 Million grossed in the year

... I didn't need ANOTHER N to tell mehe was a fraud... He over did it with the FIRST 16 I heard the N spit...

 

[infyrno23]

the problem is... Hip Hop is finally getting older.
remember this is a fairly new genre of music in comparison to other genre's
this is our 1st go round with the seperation of the old vs young listeners.

in the beginning, this was a culture that was built on its authenticity. you got your rep from being who you said you were, and you where shut down at thegate for not being what you said you were. it was ok to not be a gangsta, but dont portray one. it was ok to be a guy from the hood that didnt take part inthe foolish behavior, but dont go act like one.
i mean it seriously makes me confused how people like Wayne and Jim Jones, are alive. back in the day, i know dudes who got murdered for false flag reppin....and these dudes is taking it to far, its uncomfortable to watch.

now we in the era, of mirages.... and its accepted. its accepted because most of these fans now, dont live the lifestyle and they want to live vicariouslythrough rappers. just as how a lil child wants to be "spiderman"... its become profitable to look the part of being a rapper...and thats why you havethese tissue soft rap figures and their equally soft fan base,



honestly... i use to bump Ross's music, the 1st album went dumb hard... he got so many bangers on their. the 2nd disc i kinda wasnt feelin it, he had afew joints but other then the singles and Maybach Music, i didnt really mess wit it... after this whole CO thing came out... i found myself distancingmyself.... then i said "well, most rappers are lying so why do i bump these dudes but im partial to Ross" so i go back and listen to the 1st cd....which i really fcks with....and i smirk and shake my head.... i cant do it.
"Im in the White House"

it would be different if he came out and said he did it, but got his connect that way, then got to the coke.... but this dude lied so hard, and then actuallyadmitted it, when it was blatantly obvious... that alone puts a asterik on the person im listening to, and its hard to hear "I know pablo, Noriega theREAL Noriega he owe me a 100 favors" without making a Cop remark.

 

[illphillip]

^^^

That's it though. If you know street dudes, you know what it is. I can't believe y'all were really buying what Mobb Deep was selling back then."Official QB murderers"? OK shorty.

If you'd been in the loop with the music and the streets, you knew these dudes weren't built like that. If you started listening to rap the year TheInfamous came out, well then you wouldn't know any better. Ain't nothing wrong with that. But they had been around for years. When the UMC's triedto flip the script, no one was having it. It's really no different.

These cats prey on the ignorance and imagination of their audience. They aren't trying to sell records to street dudes. Those dudes don't buy records.These guys are selling to the kid in the suburbs who likes to drive THROUGH the hood, not who lives in it. The kid who don't know the streets, but isENAMORED with them. That kid don't know if P is real or not, so he eats it up. Same with Ross and all these other cats. The kids that don't know whothe REAL Rick Ross is.

There's a place for everything in Hip Hop/Rap. There's a place for escapism, and a place for reality. I don't view it all as entertainment. It wasmuch more at one time. But if it's escapism, then call it what it is. Don't try to sell it as some real @%$@.

 

[illphillip]

^^^

That was in response to what Harlem wrote, but you threw down some good +$#@ Infyrno. Agree with everything below,,,,,,

in the beginning, this was a culture that was built on its authenticity. you got your rep from being who you said you were, and you where shut down atthe gate for not being what you said you were. it was ok to not be a gangsta, but dont portray one. it was ok to be a guy from the hood that didnt take part inthe foolish behavior, but dont go act like one.
i mean it seriously makes me confused how people like Wayne and Jim Jones, are alive. back in the day, i know dudes who got murdered for false flag reppin....and these dudes is taking it to far, its uncomfortable to watch.

 

[north dade represent]

Originally Posted by illphillip

^^^

That's it though. If you know street dudes, you know what it is. I can't believe y'all were really buying what Mobb Deep was selling back then. "Official QB murderers"? OK shorty.

If you'd been in the loop with the music and the streets, you knew these dudes weren't built like that. If you started listening to rap the year The Infamous came out, well then you wouldn't know any better. Ain't nothing wrong with that. But they had been around for years. When the UMC's tried to flip the script, no one was having it. It's really no different.

These cats prey on the ignorance and imagination of their audience. They aren't trying to sell records to street dudes. Those dudes don't buy records. These guys are selling to the kid in the suburbs who likes to drive THROUGH the hood, not who lives in it. The kid who don't know the streets, but is ENAMORED with them. That kid don't know if P is real or not, so he eats it up. Same with Ross and all these other cats. The kids that don't know who the REAL Rick Ross is.

There's a place for everything in Hip Hop/Rap. There's a place for escapism, and a place for reality. I don't view it all as entertainment. It was much more at one time. But if it's escapism, then call it what it is. Don't try to sell it as some real @%$@.

I think you're taking it too deep. Most of these rappers are from the hood, regardless of what they actually did. Mobb Deep is from QB/Lefrak, so eventhoughthey may not have gotten involved in the stuff they was talking about, that's what most dudes from PJ's rap about. I don't think they makethe music to intentionally trick kids into thinking they some kind of gangsta. It's just that's the dominant facet of the culture they happen to be in.

As far as Ross, I always thought he was halfway legit because I'm from Carol City and I didn't know too many dudes that didn't hustle some way oranother, especially a dude that dropped out of college after one semester. Ross not selling drugs would be an aberration to what was normal for a young blackman with no college education in that area. I never thought he was a don, but I always saw him as another run of the mill dope boy. Maybe he lied, maybe he waspushing, who knows. But I don't think he was on some "I'm going to fool everyone into thinking I'm a kingpin".

 

[illphillip]

^^^

Prodigy took Ballet. What dude in the hood take Ballet?

How did they go from being a group called POETICAL PROPHETS to Mobb Deep?

You don't think they flipped a script? At a time when it became cool to be a G (post NWA)? You don't think they went into that lane because that'swhat was "hot" at the time?

How you Poetical Prophets when Public Enemy is hot and then you're Mobb Deep when NWA is hot?

I know they're from the hood. Not everyone from the hood is a "murderer" etc. Not everyone is a thug/goon. The hood is more complicated thanthat. I don't think their music reflects that. And that's my issue. They are pushing one aspect of the hood. For a reason.....

Guess we'll just agree to disagree. No disrespect but I was in NY for all this.

 

[yungmatt]

Originally Posted by illphillip

How did they go from being a group called POETICAL PROPHETS to Mobb Deep?

How you Poetical Prophets when Public Enemy is hot and then you're Mobb Deep when NWA is hot?

Crazy thing is that my cousin didnt !!%* with the Infamous too tuff and these were the exact reasons why... Hes 32 now.

Me being about 12 years old at the time I really aint care cause the album was crack.

 

[north dade represent]

^^ I agree with some of what you're saying, but I think you're implying that dudes are flipping the script for monetary reasons. I'm saying that iswhat everybody is rapping about that environment. Dudes ain't walking around like yeah "I'm a sensitive brother". Nobody is spitting thatLupe type flow in the trap, it's not accepted.

And I know that the hood is a lot more complex than murder and drugs. Most of my family grew up in the jects and that's the last thing they talk about.However, most of these cats are just following everybody else when it comes to the subject matter in their rhymes. It's not always authentic, but Idon't think it's a conspiracy to fool people.

 

[rocyaice]

Originally Posted by Harlem On The Rise

I never thought he was a street N... I KNOW street Ns... It basically takes one to know one, on some secret soceity type %+**... I can spot a REAL N, someone who hasn't walked the path I've walked prolly wouldn't be able to tell the difference between a real and fake one....

What other former CO stole a kingpins name?? Enlighten me... Further more, how many rappers have stolen there names from a GANGSTA?? In the history of hip hop, you could prolly riddle me off 10-20 names... that's less than 2% of ALL rappers EVER... I don't understand how his case gets associated with anyone elses, seems like an isolated incedient... Unless its some other Police Ns out there... Overexagerate?? The word you're looking for is FLAT OUT LYING... and that's not just on record, he's taken on this persona in his real life... I remember reading a quote of his in the Negro Please (XXL Magazine) section a few years ago, about how he can't live comfortable with under $10 Million grossed in the year

... I didn't need ANOTHER N to tell me he was a fraud... He over did it with the FIRST 16 I heard the N spit...

Ross shouts on Boobie Boys and says Boobie Williams was his mentor and I haven't heard one person deny those allegations. So while its pretty muchconfirmed he was a CO I wouldn't be so quick to rule dude off as fake. That's what i've been waiting for. Waiting for a dude to discredit hisconnection with Boobie Williams and nobody has.

 

[rocyaice]

it would be different if he came out and said he did it, but got his connect that way, then got to the coke.... but this dude lied so hard, and then actually admitted it, when it was blatantly obvious... that alone puts a asterik on the person im listening to, and its hard to hear "I know pablo, Noriega the REAL Noriega he owe me a 100 favors" without making a Cop remark.

I don't think its that easy though especially if what Ross did was true. You were basically a undercover CO for an infamous gang in Miami of all places? Idon't think you just come out and say I lied about %+$ like that. Not saying Ross really did it because I don't buy it. I honestly think dude waslookin' to make bread legally and went the CO route for a minute.

 

[dapper d]

Originally Posted by Harlem On The Rise

I never thought he was a street N... I KNOW street Ns... It basically takes one to know one, on some secret soceity type %+**... I can spot a REAL N, someone who hasn't walked the path I've walked prolly wouldn't be able to tell the difference between a real and fake one....

What other former CO stole a kingpins name?? Enlighten me... Further more, how many rappers have stolen there names from a GANGSTA?? In the history of hip hop, you could prolly riddle me off 10-20 names... that's less than 2% of ALL rappers EVER... I don't understand how his case gets associated with anyone elses, seems like an isolated incedient... Unless its some other Police Ns out there... Overexagerate?? The word you're looking for is FLAT OUT LYING... and that's not just on record, he's taken on this persona in his real life... I remember reading a quote of his in the Negro Please (XXL Magazine) section a few years ago, about how he can't live comfortable with under $10 Million grossed in the year

... I didn't need ANOTHER N to tell me he was a fraud... He over did it with the FIRST 16 I heard the N spit...

I'm not buying that...
If this was true for u and most real N's there wouldn't be any snitches...
U would be able to judge a dudes character before anyone got jammed up
A month ago I could have made a thread saying Alfamega a real N'...and I bet everyone including u would co sign it...
and look at that dude now...

and how is Rick Ross taking his name make him any differnt from what 50 did? (and for the record I think no one should be taking a a name from no one...u earnyour name)...