--- THE OFFICIAL NEW ENGLAND PATRIOTS THREAD --- OFFSEASON THREAD

[prez t]

overall -- i think it was a typical Belichick/Patriots draft . addressed most of the needs .

two things i would question (kind of go hand in hand):
1. why did we take two WRs? with the signings of Hogan and Washington in FA and retention of Edelman, Amendola, and Keshawn Martin, i dont see the need to dedicate two picks to WRs
2. why didnt we draft a RB? one of the big needs IMO on the team is RB depth, which is non existent right now

 

[DeadsetAce]

1. why did we take two WRs? with the signings of Hogan and Washington in FA and retention of Edelman, Amendola, and Keshawn Martin, i dont see the need to dedicate two picks to WRs
2. why didnt we draft a RB? one of the big needs IMO on the team is RB depth, which is non existent right now

i'll try my best to offer my 100% non-expert based opinion on those


1) i think it was smart to grab someone at WR for a couple reasons. one is that FA sighnings in the past have shown an inability to always come in and get consistent play time. i'd even say a bunch of them don't even make the squad some of the time. now Hogan and Washington should make the team, so maybe not so much that one. another reason is Amendola's future with the team isn't 100% from what I understand ($$$ reasons). then, like Rolaholic said, depth. we've seen WR go down in bunches in the past, so always good to load up if possible. lastly, gotta plan for the future. if one of the two develops, consider it a win. hopefully one of them can be a legit contributor 2-3 years down the road.

2) agree 100% with you here. i would have bet the farm we try for a RB. total lack of depth as it stands. but my guess is Bill has something in mind as far as picking someone up in FA. gotta be.

 

[rolaholic]

Spoiler: Warning: Spoiler!

 

[7th Chamber]

 

[DeadsetAce]

OTAs underway....

- Brady was Brady
- No Jules, Dola, or Gronk
- Jimmy G: nothing mind blowing obviously, but word is Jimmy looked very decisive and was pretty sharp
- Martellus Bennet was uncoverable supposedly
- Malcolm Mitchell made a couple highlight reel catches
- Cyrus Jones made the only INT of the day (Jacoby Brisset)

 

[rolaholic]

Gronk + Marellus = Gronk + Chico 2.0 hopefully

Glad to hear the rooks had good days ,besides Brisset . Really high on Mitchell. He seems to have great character with all the stuff he does off the field as well.

 

[DeadsetAce]

Greg A. Bedard ‏@GregABedard 8m8 minutes ago
Greg A. Bedard Retweeted SI NFL
Collins, Hightower, Butler, Vollmer, Ninkovich, Sheard, Ryan set to become FAs after this season. What will they do?

can anyone say "trade for draft pick(s) prior to start of the season"....who's it going to be? that's the question.

me being selfish and a TB12 homer, i want to keep all of them and go for #5. but you know BB is thinking long term

 

[7th Chamber]

I would really like to keep Hightower, Collins and Butler, but I feel like we're going to lose at least two of those for some reason

 

[DeadsetAce]

realistically, you're only going to get decent return for guys like butler, collins, hightower, and vollmer. would HATE to lose any of those guys. and then would be a shame to lose Ryan after he's started to come into his own. Sheard is probably safe since we lost Jones.

 

[7th Chamber]

Rookies report today

 

[DeadsetAce]

hoping cyrus, mitchell, and thuney are ready to go.

 

[7th Chamber]

I'm interested to see how this WR/TE group shakes out. Adding Hogan to Edelman and Amendola and drafting Mitchell makes for an intriguing unit along side Gronk & Bennett. Not to mention getting Lewis back.

 

[7th Chamber]

Can anyone clarify some of the terms of Brady's suspension? I've read that he can't have any communication with the team or coaching and can't even watch game film. However, other players suspended for other offenses are able to be full participants with their team.

Is this accurate and if so, why is that?

 

[DeadsetAce]

Can anyone clarify some of the terms of Brady's suspension? I've read that he can't have any communication with the team or coaching and can't even watch game film. However, other players suspended for other offenses are able to be full participants with their team.

Is this accurate and if so, why is that?

it's more that Josh Gordan is getting a break with the rules. they think it will better benefit him from being with the team:

This is a unique situation, unlike other suspended players such as Tom Brady, who are banned from any football-related activities with their team during suspension. Any player suspended for performance-enhancing drugs or personal conduct policy violations have to stay away from the team, but there has been some leeway given to players on substance abuse suspensions, and commissioner Roger Goodell deemed this one of those cases.

 

[7th Chamber]

I see. Good luck to Josh then. Not sure what he'll make of this opportunity though.

 

[DeadsetAce]

Five positions up for grabs as Patriots enter camp
Jeff Howe Wednesday, July 27, 2016

The Patriots have a handful of prominent roles up for grabs despite boasting one of the most loaded rosters in the NFL. With training camp opening this week, the Pats can begin sorting through those positions.

These are the five best positional battles to monitor over the next five weeks.

Bryan Stork vs. David Andrews

The center competition looked like a dead heat during organized team activities and minicamp. Andrews played well in Stork’s absence last season, but the two-year starter returned to his perch when he was healthy. They’re different types of players, with Stork as more of a Logan Mankins type of mauler and Andrews as a cerebral snapper, a la Dan Koppen. Stork has had injury issues in his previous pair of training camps, so that’s always a concern. If both players remain healthy, this will be a fascinating battle.

Aaron Dobson 
vs. the field

The fourth-year wide receiver will essentially need to dare the coaches to cut him by unleashing the best camp of his career. He’ll also need to catch a break, and that might have just come in the form of Tom Brady’s four-game suspension, which frees up a spot on the 53-man roster. The Pats typically carry five true receivers, and Julian Edelman, Danny Amendola, Chris Hogan, Malcolm Mitchell and Keshawn Martin should be viewed as locks. Now, Amendola’s stay on the PUP list could be a factor, and Martin could be displaced as the fifth wideout through competition. But the most important thing is Dobson’s ability to stay healthy enough to continue his performance from the spring.

Five guards for two spots

Third-round pick Joe Thuney and Chandler Jones-trade acquisition Jonathan Cooper were the starting guards during OTAs and minicamp while Shaq Mason, Tre’ Jackson and Josh Kline were on the mend. Mason and Jackson are starting camp on the PUP list, so they’re still behind in the competition. Mason had a really good rookie season, and Kline was the Pats’ most reliable lineman in 2015 before injuring the shoulder that required surgery. Jackson started nine games while dealing with a knee injury that also needed surgery. Now is really the time to learn about Thuney and Cooper, especially when they begin practicing with pads this weekend. Thuney is a roster lock due to his draft status, so it’s possible one or two of the remaining four gets cut. In that respect, it’s extremely important for Cooper to win a starting job because his $2.39 million cap hit is the highest among every interior lineman on the roster and about $1.5 million more than youngsters Mason, Jackson, Thuney, Stork and Andrews. Speaking of which, the loser of the center battle could enter the fray at guard, too.

Cyrus Jones vs. Justin Coleman vs. Darryl Roberts

Jones, the Pats’ first pick in April’s draft, should win the job at nickel cornerback, and it’d be an upset if he doesn’t. But Coleman played pretty well last season when he wasn’t dealing with a broken hand, holding quarterbacks to 24-of-47 (51.1 percent) for 301 yards and two touchdowns, and he added seven pass breakups. Roberts had a good training camp in 2015 with a team-high 10 pass breakups, and he earned a start in the preseason opener before dislocating his wrist. Jones was clearly the best of the three this spring, and the Pats theoretically wouldn’t draft him in the second round if they didn’t view him as an upgrade. Still, don’t sleep on Coleman and Roberts.

Running back free-for-all

Dion Lewis is starting on the PUP list, which shouldn’t be viewed as a surprise. Lewis hasn’t had any summer setbacks with his surgically repaired ACL, but the Pats just aren’t going to push him before he is ready, especially after the November injury. Until that happens, LeGarrette Blount can be viewed as the incumbent starter, though Donald Brown will get his looks. Undrafted rookie D.J. Foster is the most intriguing back in the group due to his speed and agility. Maybe James White and Brandon Bolden have improved, and Joey Iosefa and Tyler Gaffney are back in the mix. The Patriots could carry as many as five from this group, and every role is up for grabs until Lewis is ready.

 

[DeadsetAce]

The Patriots have completed their first practice of training camp. It was held in shells. Here are the Herald’s observations from the workout.

Did not participate: WR Julian Edelman (PUP, foot surgery), RB Dion Lewis (PUP, ACL surgery), S Nate Ebner (rugby exemption), G Tre’ Jackson (PUP, knee surgery), RT Sebastian Vollmer (PUP), WR Danny Amendola (PUP, knee and ankle surgeries), TE Clay Harbor (PUP), LB Jamie Collins, DT Alan Branch (NFI, hip injury).

Red non-contact jerseys: CB Logan Ryan, S Duron Harmon

Additional attendance notes: Lewis, Ebner and Collins were the only players who weren’t present in any capacity. The rest of the absentees observed portions of practice before conditioning in the bubble. … Guard Shaq Mason was removed from the PUP list and participated in a limited capacity. He didn’t participate in any team drills.

Practice observations:
The Patriots’ first team drill occurred 90 minutes into practice, and Tom Brady led off the 7-on-7 period by working with the starting offense against the starting defense. Jimmy Garoppolo relieved him along with the second-string offense and defense, and Jacoby Brissett and the third-stringers closed the opening set of reps. Then during the second set, Brady worked with a mix of first- and second-stringers before Garoppolo took over with similar personnel.

It was Garoppolo’s show from there on out. He worked with the starting offensive line against the starting defense for all three 11-on-11 periods while Brady had the second-string offensive line and practiced against the second-string defense. The two quarterbacks worked with a mixture of skill position players.

Garoppolo was 24 of 29 overall and an impressive 18 of 21 in 11-on-11s. Though he closed practice by completing his final seven passes in the two-minute drill, five went to Donald Brown and two were to Matthew Slater. It’s important for Garoppolo to move the ball with completions, but it’s also important for him to head downfield a bit more than relying on the running backs, at least during practice.

Brady was 21 of 29 overall, including 16 of 21 in 11-on-11s.

Brissett was 5 of 10 overall, including 3 of 6 in 11-on-11s. We weren’t able to track the third-string drills (“opportunity time”) at the conclusion of the workout.

Moses Cabrera, who was promoted to strength and conditioning coach after Harold Nash’s firing, made an alteration to the stretching line at the start of practice. Instead of all 90 players lining up alongside each other and moving from sideline to sideline, the offense lined up on one side of the field and the defense lined up on the other. They then each marched to the middle of the field before turning around.

Matthew Slater wore Ebner’s No. 43 during today’s practice. Slater mentioned yesterday he was trying to get a Team USA rugby jersey with Ebner’s name on it, so this must be the next best thing.

Rob Ninkovich primarily worked with the defensive ends today, though he took a sporadic rep or two off the line as a linebacker. He remained with the defensive linemen during positional drills, which is the strongest indication there isn’t a positional change forthcoming. It appears more and more the Patriots essentially used Ninkovich at linebacker during the spring to lay a foundation in case they need him in an emergency situation during the season.

As you'd expect, with Collins out, Jonathan Freeny worked alongside Dont'a Hightower at linebacker. Rookie Kamu Grugier-Hill got one set of reps alongside Hightower, though.

A couple minor injury notes: Mason needed to stretch his legs after positional drills, and Jabaal Sheard had some type of left foot or ankle issue early in practice. Both returned, and Sheard didn’t miss any team drills.

During a kickoff coverage period, Brady broke off to another field with Rob Gronkowski and Martellus Bennett, while Brissett threw passes to Nate Washington, Aaron Dobson and Malcolm Mitchell and Garoppolo led a walkthrough-type of period with some play-action calls with the offensive and defensive lines.

Brady led off the first 3-on-3 period by hitting Gronk for a touchdown. The crowd, as you could imagine, was happy.

Keshawn Martin, Slater and Cyrus Jones worked as kick returners.

The starting offensive line, from left to right, was Nate Solder, Joe Thuney, Bryan Stork, Jonathan Cooper and Marcus Cannon. The backups were LaAdrian Waddle, Josh Kline, David Andrews, Ted Karras and Cameron Fleming. Mason rode the stationary bike during team drills.

Dobson made an eye-popping one-handed touchdown catch on a Garoppolo throw to the back of the end zone in 11-on-11s. He also beat Devin McCourty for a leaping touchdown on a Brady throw in 7-on-7s.

The following caught passes from Brady: Brandon Bolden (three), Aaron Dobson (three), Chris Hogan (three), Martellus Bennett (two), AJ Derby (two), Keshawn Martin (two), Devin Lucien (two), Chris Harper (one), Rob Gronkowski (one), James White (one) and DeAndre Carter (one).

The following caught passes from Garoppolo: Donald Brown (five), Bennett (four), LeGarrette Blount (three), Nate Washington (two), Hogan (two), Gronkowski (two), Slater (two), Derby (one), Martin (one), James Develin (one) and Dobson (one).

The following caught passes from Brissett: Lucien (two), Tyler Gaffney (two) and Harper (one).

Gronkowski, Malcolm Mitchell and White each had one drop.

Justin Coleman, Jordan Richards and E.J. Biggers each had one pass breakup. Richards’ came on a Brady throw for Gronk.

Blount looks like he trimmed down this season.

It was a hot practice with temperatures reaching 90 degrees. Potentially with that in mind, as well as it being the first day of camp, it was a slower-paced workout.

Next up: The Patriots return to practice tomorrow at 9:15 a.m. It is open to the public.

 

[7th Chamber]

Good notes

 

[DeadsetAce]

Dobson making a push for the final WR spot....

FOXBORO — Aaron Dobson’s full-throttle campaign to steal a roster spot can’t be dismissed.

Sure, the 2013 second-round draft pick hasn’t yet matched the hype and absolutely must maintain this performance level for another five weeks to remain a Patriot. But at this point, through a strong offseason workout program and five training-camp practices, Dobson is daring the coaching staff to keep him employed.

Dobson has rivaled Chris Hogan for the most consistent wide receiver in the opening week of camp, and he has produced in team drills with both Tom Brady and Jimmy Garoppolo. It’s fair to be hesitant of Dobson’s staying power because of past performances, but it would be irresponsible to ignore this summer’s surge.

“I don’t think you can look too far ahead,” Dobson said. “I don’t think you should look in the past, as well. You’ve got to take it one day at a time, one step at a time, one catch at a time, everything and just go with it.”

It’s possible Dobson’s ascension can be traced to an offseason alteration. He trained alongside star Houston Texans receiver DeAndre Hopkins at Bommarito Performance in Florida, a diversion from his past workouts in Arizona.

Dobson has taken advantage of his increased opportunities while Julian Edelman and Danny Amendola have been on the physically unable to perform list. He caught 10 passes from Garoppolo and nine from Brady in team drills through last night’s fifth practice, and the younger quarterback connected with him three times in a span of four throws Sunday during the two-minute drill. Garoppolo also wrapped up Saturday’s workout by hitting Dobson for a touchdown, so they’re hooking up at important times of practice.

“The word is consistency and being dependable for my team,” Dobson said. “I just have to do it every day, and that’s when it counts. I just have to come out here, and do it every day, and be consistent and show my teammates that I’m dependable.”

However, as Dobson alluded, the more distant past has not been kind to him because of an array of injuries. He looked like a slam dunk as a rookie before succumbing to a stress fracture in his foot, and that yielded an offseason surgery that sabotaged his 2014 season, which ultimately ended with a trip to injured reserve because of a popped hamstring.

Dobson got off to a similarly strong start to last year’s training camp before he was shut down for nearly three weeks with another hamstring injury. He struggled to dig out of that hole and only caught 13 balls for 141 yards before a high ankle sprain led to another injured reserve placement.

"You know, Aaron’s had a good spring and a good few days here at training camp. I think we’ve seen that from him before," said Patriots coach Bill Belichick. "I’d say Aaron’s just, for whatever reason, hasn’t been able to consistently be on the field and do it. You know, when he’s been out there he’s looked good a lot, but he hasn’t always been out there for one reason or another. So, hopefully — I know he’s training hard, looks like he’s in good condition this year — hopefully he’ll be able to stay on the field and continue to improve."

Now, Dobson is facing a more difficult challenge. Edelman, Amendola and Hogan are obvious roster locks, and fourth-rounder Malcolm Mitchell will make the team due to his draft status. Keshawn Martin landed a $600,000 signing bonus with his contract extension in January, so the Patriots paid him to make the team, too.

Because Belichick typically carries five receivers (not including special teamer Matthew Slater), something has to give for Dobson to stick around. It’s not absurd to think Dobson can leapfrog Martin, but otherwise, he’d have to play well enough to convince Belichick and offensive coordinator Josh McDaniels to keep six wideouts, all health being equal. In a strange way, Dobson probably caught a break with Brady’s suspension because the Patriots will have an extra roster spot for four weeks.

“It’s like this every year,” Dobson said. “I think that’s the most fun part of it. We’re all out here competing trying to make each other better.”

Those matters will be sorted out this month, and it truly won’t matter for Dobson if he doesn’t keep up this pace. It also will be telling how Dobson practices when Edelman and Amendola are back in the fold, because there won’t be as many passes thrown his way. Dobson will need to continue putting out good tape to impress the coaches.

Look, the coaches like Dobson or they would have cut bait a while ago, notably last year when his hamstring was barking again. Other injury-riddled high picks have been discarded far more quickly, such as cornerbacks Darius Butler and Terrence Wheatley and defensive tackle Dominique Easley.

This is the time for Dobson to reward the Patriots for their patience, and he is off to the right start.

“I’m just trying to compete and keep it consistent,” Dobson said. “I just take it day by day, one day at a time and I’m just going to keep improving.”

 

[DeadsetAce]

it's a good thing we found C David Andrews because Stork got ANOTHER concussion in practice a few days ago. could be nearing the end as concussions have been a problem for the dude

 

[DeadsetAce]

well Stork is back at practice so that's good, i suppose. we'll see how long he lasts now.


bigger and better news...Edelman back and participating in full team drills. still waiting on Lewis and Amendola to get back, though. although there's no need to rush them.

Brady outdueled Jimmy in both blue v white scrimmages. Jimmy with the better supporting cast both times but still wasn't able to win. that said, our defense isn't exactly too shabby, so that could be part of it. people were whispering that Jimmy had looked sharper than Brady in drills up until those scrimmages. TB12 basically squashed any talk of that

 

[7th Chamber]

Good news on Stork and Edelman

I read that Brady was 25/25 during Saturday's scrimmage I think. I know it's training camp, but it's good to see Brady out there sharp and throwing darts.

 

[7th Chamber]

Edelman

 

[rolaholic]

Nink and Minitron

 

[DeadsetAce]

man. injury bug ALREADY biting hard.


Edelman reportedly slammed his helmet down in disgust which isn't a good sign. not good at all. if he fractured his foot again