what if u have a job in jb

then we would say way more COOL grey kickz , preferably patent leather.. like 9's or 11's .. and way more blue kickz :pimp:
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Im Great Letz Face It yOu Cant Compare..
KOUDIE tHE GREAT ...
 
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^^^^^^^ nobody cares

why don't you actually read what the man wrote and give it some thought. :rolleyes
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Why do we always get these cats trying to post like they got MBAs??????? Seriously, You're not impressing anyone.

I do have a Minor in Business.

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Let's be real, you could be a successful BASKETBALL oriented brand for the next 25 years.... or you can be a trendy fad/hype oriented brand for the next 4-5 years.
I think JB is realistic. Just how long can the brand survive while Michael is not playing? Other than the Stealths, suede XVIII's, the XVI's and maybe some other colorway, there hasn't been a classic and timeless AJ since his retirement. Sure, all of the shoes eventually will grow on us a little or we buy them because of name or supposed technology, but I honestly have thought for the last few years that JB won't be around after 2010. I just can't see it. Melo is not a strong enough force in the industry to keep the brand going, and they don't have another prospect anytime soon.

The brand is living off of history. Everything that comes out is about history, and not at all about future. You have the Defining Moments Pack, the Laser IV's, the Nubuck XIV pack and there's another pack that might very well include white/caro mid XIV and white/caro IV's. That's as many shoes released as the entire XXI campaign. That must be a problem.

Well, not so much to JB, because the retro models will sell out. They can fully exhaust any color combination we thought possible, and then even come out with cinder, chartreuse, wheat, and the endless lasering possibilities.

JB is most definitely a bussiness. They won't drop OG colorways now because they're saving them for that last ditch effort should they meet a "rainy day".

Expect to see more, more, and even more retros in the next year, JB is bringin back everything in multiple variations, from lasering, low-tops, or retro+ colorways that are ever so slightly different from the OG. They will all sell out (because...*gasp*...people buy anything if it means they can be "cool") no matter the materials used. They created a great business model where hype is the main driving force of the shoe. I personally hate it because people aren't buying what they like, but rather what is "hot" or hardest to get. UNDFTD IV's? :lol:
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The trend will continue, because the future of the AJ line is uncertain. While he's a really nice guy and the effort is there, D'Wayne Edwards' designs have not traditionally sold well. Nu Retro 2, 1.5's and V.5's are all marginal shoes if you realistically look at what it means to carry the Jordan name. III-XIV are all beautiful in their own right, and the Melo line just doesn't have that same spark.

That's why I said I would continue to oversaturate the market with retros (which they are), because you might as well gain all the revenue you can now before it's too late.


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Other than the Stealths, suede XVIII's, the XVI's and maybe some other colorway, there hasn't been a classic and timeless AJ since his retirement


When did the shoes become classics and timeless? Obviously, they weren't always that way. As you noticed, Jays really didn't sell out like they did until the retro IVs and the XIs released. When I first started buying J's in 98, I would see shoes sit on shelves and on eastbay for months until they went on clearance. Even saw the 13s go on sale for 59.99.



[color=1E90FF]FLOSS DAILY[/color]
My Collection on Myspace
 
I remember the black/white XIII going on sale on Eastbay and the black tip XIV as well.

Other than that, everything sold unless it was a sz. 16+ or smaller size.

s...55​
 
I would stop all this foolishness, and concontrate on solid releases instead of a overhyped shoe that sells out because it's trendy or hip or cool to have. I would go back to the classic days when Jordans ment something, when they were a great shoe to have not just something to have to say you have them. If they do continue down the road that they have been going down, I feel that a lot of the core fans will get turned off by all of the overhyped shoes and the limited crap is getting real old really quick. Just put out quality shoes, in quality colors and the fans will buy them.

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Would you please elaborate on these for us, please, and are they really just gonna keep pumping the retro's out next year???
Life is a beautiful strugglePeople search through the rubble for a suitable hustleSome people usin' the noodle, some people usin' the muscleSome people put it all together, make it fit like a puzzle - Talib Kewli
 
While I won't go into a full length dissertation like Method Man. I will add this. You posed the question- How long can JB live of the past?- by way of re-releasing retros. Keep in mind that MJ legacy continues to grow. Its like his whole career has been turned into one long highlight film. We remember those MJ moments like the Ehlo shot and the Flu playoff game. I don't know if you're familiar with Keith Jenkins and his take on history. Ultimately, MJ's history like all other history begs us to ask not "What is MJs history?", but "Who is MJ's history for?". JB personifies all those MJ moments packaged into the product.
 
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That's why I said I would continue to oversaturate the market with retros (which they are), because you might as well gain all the revenue you can now before it's too late.
Here's where I disagree:

As I've said before and will be forced to reiterate, I believe that people would still buy Muhammad Ali boxing themed gear. People wouldn't buy Muhammad Ali home pregnancy tests.

Michael Jordan is one of the single most recognizable, revered, and beloved athletes in the history of sports. His name has become synonymous with excellence. When someone attempts to express dominance metaphorically, they don't say, "so and so is the Kobe Byrant of _______." That's not poised to change anytime soon.

Their foundation in legend gives them the pedigree and prestige that most other brands lack. They have an advantage over virtually every other athletic apparel brand in the marketplace. Yet they've apparently accepted that the brand only has a few short years of life left and they might as well cash out now. It's myopic.

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While he's a really nice guy and the effort is there, D'Wayne Edwards' designs have not traditionally sold well. Nu Retro 2, 1.5's and V.5's are all marginal shoes if you realistically look at what it means to carry the Jordan name.
I'm glad someone has the courage to admit it.

From what I know, he is a great guy and I don't think it's fair to evaluate his ability as a designer based on nu retros. That, I think, is a good portion of the problem. Shoes like the .5s chain the brand to the past and they prevent a designer from being truly able to express themselves creatively. I'm anxious to see what he's able to accomplish with the XXI, because he'll actually be free to create a unique and ORIGINAL product as opposed to some mandated clone of a 15 year old shoe.

By focusing on retro shoes, they're taking a shortcut and leaning on past marketing campaigns and past designs. The V has already been sold successfully to the public. It's a classic. Selling a 5.5 isn't creating a new classic, it's trying to eke still more value out of an existing classic and it DOESN'T work. Why would I want the 5.5 when I already own or can easily buy the REAL V and the REAL VI?

How do you create a new classic? Well, isn't that what they USED to be doing? Focus on the flagship product. Focus on NEW and innovative products and you'll create new classics. No one cares about the XX because it's 1/15th of the product line. It's an afterthought in the present line, and yet that's supposed to be the brand's future. That's just foolish. They're not investing in the future.

A few retro products here and there are great, but oversaturation is only killing any chance of creating future classics. They can only squirrel away so many classic colorways and dangle "almost" products like the 'fire red' lasers before people begin to lose interest.

Most of us are SO loyal to Jordan brand that we'd LOVE to buy their products whenever possible. If I want a gym shoe, I REALLY want to like the jordan trainer. If I want an outdoor basketball shoe, I REALLY want to like the Jordan Work'M. That's an AMAZING advantage for them. The problem, though, is that I can't see my way clear to buying those shoes. They use outdated technology and they're horribly overpriced given their performance qualities. I'm not paying $110-$150 for a shoe with air sole when I can get a Nike shoe with Shox or Zoom air for far less. They're trying to sell to collectors with scores of shoes. You have to do better than what I already have in my closet. I'm not buying the new Jordan trainer if my original Trunners are just as good and Nike's new Free shoe has more intriguing technology.

The brand as a whole just doesn't appear focused on moving forward, and that's what I think is so damning.

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^^^^^^^ nobody cares
Look around for a second and you'll find proof to the contrary in this very thread. Everyone has the ability to express their opinions about sneakers and sneaker companies on NT. I'm entitled to that whether you like it or not. I've been speaking my mind on NT for five years. Get used to it, get over it, and get on with your life.

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Actually, after reading your entire post I found the points you made to be fairly obviously. Very well written, but still lack of insight.
Apparently, the points I've made aren't obvious to everyone. Jordan brand's embarked head first down a very slippery slope in trying to raise quarterly profits at a pace they can't possibly sustain. If you think that's "good business," I suppose we'll just have to disagree. 10 years from now it'll look good for an employee whose used this slash and burn mentality and the ensuing profits to move on to a better job with another company, but it won't look so good for the brand itself, which will almost certainly be in worse position in 2010 than it was in 2000.

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I'm glad you own a thesaurus
I'm glad I possess an adequate vocabulary as well, because it enables me to express myself without relying on little smiley faces.

Believe it or not, I don't have to pull out a thesaurus in order to access 8th grade vocabulary words. It's not exactly an uncommon ability. I once copied out a dictionary a few pages at a time each day for a few months. It's about self-improvement and clarity. I shouldn't and don't need a separate book to find the words necessary to express myself.

 
wow, deep stuff...note to self...dont **#$ with admins...

whoever said mike doesnt give a damn, he's retired...so untrue...his name is what makes the money here. of course he cares what is put on the market. he wouldnt endorse shoes that looked like dadas with JB name on it.

ma bad, didnt get to read the whole post...you guys type a lot. :smh:
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i guess that comment was for my post. i meant why would mike care about dropping 3 retros a year when he can drop 20 and all of them sell out and when i mean sell out when you see a size 8 and 2 14s sitting in a store it doesnt matter they already sold, jb SOLD them to footlocker.jb sells out ALL retros.when and if the huge bubble bursts they will only be back where they were a few years ago AND they will continue to sell because we the core will still covet real colorways and thats what they will return to.you cant tell me you will be so turned off of jordans being oversaturated that if in 2007 they drop a picture perfect military iv you wont buy it,i dont believe that.
why would they stop what they are doing now?it makes NO sense.thousands of cats were on high school/college/intra-mural/au floors wearing the 10/16s,pro status and work ems -thousands.
 
i will bring back the nike air, og colors in og boxes. the only new thing will be the jumpman flight club cards. it wil be og everything and new releases around all star weekend. throw them nasty retro pluses in the east river.

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^^^^^^^ nobody cares

incredible how immature people can be. let me ask you this then. why are you in this culture, if you dont care what a more experienced person has to say, regarding our culture? why even visit niketak if your going to give these responses? honestly man find another hobby. the point of getting into something is not only because you love it, it has to also do with learning. back in the day that guys that taught me the ropes are the guys who today are in there early 40's. you think i was like "nobody cares"? if i did say that, that would be the ultamite disrespect. dotn say things like that unless you can argue with meth and prove him wrong. trust me when i tell you. this guy is incredibly smart and i will have to admit. if i ever got into a debate with him, i would lose. why? well because i agree with everything he says :lol:
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OG SNEAKA HEAD SINCE THE 80'S
<-----Miami Vicethose are my boys. the dynamic duo of the 80's!!!!!
"TEAM-OLDSCHOOL" "YOU GOT TO DO TIME" What gangsta rap did to hip hop is what the retro craze has now done to sneaker culture. - meth.
 
I would probably do all the things that everyone has suggested but in particular, I WOULD ABSOULUTELY CONCENTRATE ON THE FLAGSHIP MODEL (XXI and so on....XXII...) That is what the brand is about and it should stay that way. Keep retroing and team shoes but keep focused on upcomming AJs and make them worth the price you charge JB. And stop with the pathetic retro colors.

Honestly the info on the XXI so far sounds very good. I hope it will actually stay that way. The XXIs are the only upcomming shoes I plan to buy and possibly the black/red retro XIV. If the XXIs turn out to be crap then I will get the Stealth XXs as well and nothing else untill I see the XXII.

BTW well said Meth.
 
I would design hot shoes and have you guys give an opinion in the designs. :wink:
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Syracuse Orange in the house!​
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i would ask if i could get some exclusives and ask for samples but for the people i would make sure that Js wont be cheap quality and make the design a whole lot better and get tinker hatfield back or someone as good as him :D
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<---peep MJ getting his game on with mariah carey
 
I'd drop exclusive retro bundles packs of the AJ 1-2-3, 3-4-5, 6-7-8, etc.. in OG colorways using higher quality materials and sell them online.
 
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I'm anxious to see what he's able to accomplish with the XXI, because he'll actually be free to create a unique and ORIGINAL product as opposed to some mandated clone of a 15 year old shoe.
EXACTLY. I respect D'Wayne as a man. He's a hard working guy who's a good father. On the design side of things, I've definitely been critical in the past. The Nu' Retro 2 is in my humble opinion the worst product visually to have been released under the brand, maybe outside of the Regional XX. While they performed above average, I still don't think that shoe was worthy of carrying the Jordan name. The design screamed cleanliness and entrapment, as he was forced to make a more current and basic shoe of an older classic model. That's a recipe for failure.

I've felt the same way about the .5 series. You just can't compare the 1.5 to the 1 and 2. YOU CAN'T. Same goes with the V and VI. How can you possibly create a shoe better than the V and VI. Again, it's like you're setting yourself up to fail and dissapoint the buying consumer.

In all of these .5 series shoes, JB is limiting themselves to air technology, when we all know damn well that zoom air should be used. Zoom Air SHOULD have been in the 1.5. For $120, I expect heel and forefoot units. I just couldn't imagine why anyone wouldn't spend an extra $5 for a more current and far superior shoe in the Lebron II.

The XXI is the first time I can honestly judge D'Wayne's capability. He is handed a clean slate, with no constraints or technological limitations like the .5 series. He also is able to innovate with this shoe and create a shoe that will forecast the future of footwear. I believe he has already done that with the introduction of interchangeable cushioning to allow a player to determine what form of heel cushioning best suits them.

Hopefully I'm wrong and D'Wayne's designs can carry the brand. But can Melo carry the line as well? We'll have to wait and see.

Meth - I entirely agree about their team and training shoes. I wear my OG Trunners, Zoom Swift, Prestos, and Trunner Condos as my running/casual shoe rotation. The newer JB line is again limited to lesser cushioning than the Nike side, and for $110-$120 they must do a better job of improving that aspect of the line.

On the team shoe side, the Team Flow were incredible quality shoes for $100 and the Work'M will be equally efficient in my opinion. Is blow-molded air worth $110 though? I can go and purchase the 6-column heel/zoom air forefoot VCIV for $110 as well. :\
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Hopefully they straighten things up, cause otherwise I really don't see the brand going past 2010.

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you cant tell me you will be so turned off of jordans being oversaturated that if in 2007 they drop a picture perfect military iv you wont buy it,i dont believe that
2006*
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you cant tell me you will be so turned off of jordans being oversaturated that if in 2007 they drop a picture perfect military iv you wont buy it,i dont believe that
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2006*

WHOA WHOA.... dirk, please please let this be true... Military's are one of my grails, and if JB releases these kicks without any changes, 5 pairs will be copped definitely....

Any more info u can share on this topic will be greatly greatly appreciated :wow:
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Just too SWEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEET

Looking for:Jordan Par23...Jordan IX Molded Cleat...10.5-11.5
For Sale DS Jordan X Retro (STEELS) Size 11 $160 shipped
HWBurnz@yahoo.com
 
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Method Man, I greatly respect and appreciate your analysis. I have been proposing this concern on this board for quite sometime now, yet no one has given me any intelligent feedback on this matter until now.
Thanks for the kind words. As you said, youve been voicing your concerns for months and so have many, many others. Some people fail to realize that this isnt a personal vendetta or crusade. So many Jordan brand fans feel the same or similarly, and that includes countless sneaker fans who dont even post on NikeTalk. I have discussions with guys who dont even know Jordans by number, but who recognize the very same problems that we enumerate here. Its not unique in any sense. If the number of people who feel similarly is increasing, its not because you or I or anyone else is convincing them its because these problems are apparent and intensifying.

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In all of these .5 series shoes, JB is limiting themselves to air technology, when we all know damn well that zoom air should be used. Zoom Air SHOULD have been in the 1.5. For $120, I expect heel and forefoot units. I just couldn't imagine why anyone wouldn't spend an extra $5 for a more current and far superior shoe in the Lebron II.
We as fans have been saying this for a long time and it holds true for the ENTIRE line now, with the exception of the flagship model.

I brought this up maybe 9 months ago with the 1.5 launch to someone at Jordan brand and the response was something to the effect that, We want to establish zoom as a premium cushioning product. Well, theres just one problem: Nike already did that TEN YEARS AGO.

Nike set the bar for zoom technology and these days you can find zoom air in $80 Nike basketball shoes. Theyre not fooling anyone into thinking that zoom air can only be found on top of the line shoes.

Similarly, although its subjective, MANY fans prefer zoom air to conventional air sole technology and why not? Nike spent millions to sell us on the technology and many of us have tried it for ourselves in shoes ranging from the Flightposite to the Jordan XIV. Weve had 10 years to try zoom, tuned air, shox, and IPS. Now, in 2005, they expect us to pay $120 for a shoe with the same cushioning technology as Nikes LEAST expensive products? It really is an outrage.

Well probably never see Shox in a Jordan product, so what were left with is a choice between ten-year-old cushioning technology and TWENTY year old cushioning technology. Im not buying 20 year old cushioning technology in ANY shoe other than a retro, period.

$110 for bottom of the line cushioning is a slap in the face. It gives credence to the argument of the most jaded and cynical of observers, chiding that we as Jordan fans will buy anything with a Jumpman. I try to make informed decisions when I purchase shoes. Im not overpaying for mediocre product no matter HOW nice it looks. The Jordan WorkM is a nice looking outdoor ball shoe and I wont buy it under any circumstance. It could hit $30. Why not jump at $30? I have a pair of VC 1s in black/red that I ordered from an outlet for $30, complete with FULL length shox array and monkey paw ankle support. Every year top of the line Nike basketball shoes hit outlets. Jordan offers no competition in that area, and the tie would go to Jordan brand in ALL cases with me. If you hold that type of advantage and you STILL lose, something is terribly wrong.

Where is MJ's fiery competitiveness? Nike should be their Larry Jordan: the older, bigger brother. You have access to the same technology. Shouldn't you strive to be better at EVERY area of your game, from value products to the very top of the line?

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Hopefully they straighten things up, cause otherwise I really don't see the brand going past 2010.
And I think we can agree, thats NOT good business. As I said, its nice if youre an employee with a PERSONAL agenda that extends beyond Jordan brand, but its horrible for long time fans of the brand or anyone with a vested interest in the brands continued success, like MJ himself.

Again, it looks like theyre flying high in 2005 but unless theyre SERIOUS about easing up on the retros and getting back to basics, were looking at another tragic tale of hubris.

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when and if the huge bubble bursts they will only be back where they were a few years ago AND they will continue to sell because we the core will still covet real colorways and thats what they will return to.you cant tell me you will be so turned off of jordans being oversaturated that if in 2007 they drop a picture perfect military iv you wont buy it,i dont believe that.
What happened when the bubble burst for other apparel companies? Did their core fans come crawling back once the posers cleared out? If it happens in 2007, you can salvage a decent percentage. If it happens in 2010, itll be like nuclear winter: only the hardiest of roaches will survive. What theyre doing NOW is alienating many of their CORE consumers, fans whove been loyal since MJs pre-title days. If wearing Jordan brand still makes you look like a basketball fan in 2007, you wont lose the core audience. If wearing Jordan brand makes you look like a little hype beast in 2007, youll begin to lose the core audience because itll have lost everything that made us wear it to begin with. Itll have lost its connection with basketball and the Jordan legacy, and its only value will be its appeal to immature status seekers who want a x of y limited edition product so they can feel better than the next kid and, guess what, theyll get bored and move on to the next fad soon enough.

Air Jordans used to be the BEST basketball shoes money could buy, worn by the best player on the planet. Can we still say that?

If Jordan brand still means something, if it still stands for something, it can inspire the loyalty of NEW fans while maintaining the support of its CORE fans. If they want to appeal to the lowest common denominator, they can factor me OUT.

 
i wouldnt retro anything....
'Its an obsession, a hunger and an unrelenting quest. Its the reason you learned Roman numerals, for Christ's sake' -A.Parker
 
First thing I would do is create a new html site with a store with all the recent Jordan Brand releases and have international shipping available. I still can't believe a company as big as Nike/JB don't ship to the UK!
 
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