RIP New York Hip-Hop? (Need Some Feedback)

Trill Nimley said:

I haven't been a part of the demographic for sometime.

But we're claiming Nicki now? She went down south to blow. Aligned herself with 2 of the hottest stars of the time in fact. And if we're gonna pass off French as a star that opens the floodgates for pretty much anyone from the south. A lot of guys in the south bubbled regionally before breaking nationally. Boosie is on the Freshman cover with Saigon, Papoose. We know where he is, where are they? Currensy is on a freshman cover with Mickey Factz, Cory Gunz and Charles Hamilton. There's not even a NY artist on the Freshman10. KRIT is on the 11 cover with Fred Da Godson.

Then you have 2Chainz. Yo Gotti just began to break nationally in the past 5-6 years. Young Thug. Rich Homie. Travis Scott. Kevin Gates. Even Juicy J reinvented himself, no 90s NY artist is doing that (applies to 2Chainz). Gucci broke on the east in 08-09 he had been killing the south and Midwest tho.

The list is way longer. Ross domination began in 09 foreal. Newer guys like Migos.

NY has not had a new platinum artist since Paul Wall, Mike Jones and Chamillionaire was selling units, and those dudes are dinosaurs now.

Rocky sounds more like UGK than BIG L. It would be one thing if Houston had a few artists breaking nationally that sounded like Mobb Deep or something, but that's not the case. Cole and Jay Elect are the LAST group of southers that grew up looking up to NY, and NY is barely producing artists that look up to their hometown heroes.

TDE/Nipsey etc respect their west coast forefathers.

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okay a far as cats who really made a huge impact from that list, we have 2Chainz & Ross, who really have gotten to that A list Rapper Level & that's my point. In the Grand Scheme of things many of those rappers you named aren't really dominating as much as people make them out to be. They are artist who consistently drop music, have had one or two "Hit Records" and cater to their individual fanbases which is great. The thing is throughout the years NYC dudes are doing the same thing.

I mean just six months ago, Thug, Migos, Quan were being touted around here like they were some game changers, future stars..... Future completely goes Savage on his lane and quite honestly i don't hear much of anything about these guys projects since Future started bombing again.

The southern Sound as a whole has been big in Hiphop for years, but when you really sit back and look at it, their have been very few artist who have been able to solidify themselves as a force in the culture that people are really building with. Outside of having a Big radio smash, ain't nothing really separating the Bronsons, Fergs, Bamz etc etc from the Thug's, Migos, Krits of the world.

Because quality wise NYC's up & comers are neck & neck

Trill Nimley said:

So why can't NY inspire artists anymore? The same borough the produced MC Lyte, produced Biggie it also produced Mos Def. The same borough that produced LL produced Kool G Rap. Later produced Tribe and Mobb Deep. So where is today's equivalent?

As you pointed out the artists from LA all speak from a different perspective, while gang culture plays a backdrop to some degree, and with the south the trap plays the backdrop. Chicago gang culture can be heard in Kanye, Lupe all the way to Chief Keef and King Louie. But you still have Vic Mensa, Chance and Mick Jenkins.

Houston has its car/drug culture that plays the backdrop to their music. What is ours? Where is the balance in NY? Skyzoo is by no means will ever be BIG but he has a sound and a following, why can't 4 or 5 other NY artists speaking from different perspectives carve out a lane?

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I dislike Troy Ave music... but he has a backdrop ..... A$ap Rocky has a backdrop of NYC (it just isn't crack in the slums backdrop) , Ferg is in the same group and his projects have a completely different feel, Bronson has more of an old school NYC backdrop, Dave East has a Gritty Back Drop, Joey Bad***** same thing.

Who's to say artist aren't being inspired? Artist from NYC simply aren't the darlings of mass media right now, but being from NYC i listened to all these guys music and at some point and i still hear NYC, just not the same NYC that i grew up on.

There are jut as many artist creating now in NYC as there was before, but the quality simply isn't the same as the 90's. I have no problem admitting that. But the goes for EVERY other region, but we are the only ones still being expected to drop clasic Genre changing albums, while everyone else is allowed to be free and do music as they see fit.

Literally the Only artist i see putting out music that can compete with the golden era of whatever region their from is Kendrick Lamar.

We don't ask T.Scott To be Scarface
We don't ask Thug, to be 3000
We don't ask Nipsey to be Snoop
Meek to be Beans etc etc.

It's Only in NYC where we ask artist to level up to some of the greatest pieces of music created instad of just appreciating the art itself.

NYC seems more concerned with "winning" than actually doing what it takes to win.
Yall dudes seem far more concerned with the respect you think you deserve than putting in the work to continually receive said respect.
Once the South snatched the crown, NYC immediately lost its self assurance, began pouting & making disparaging remarks from the sideline, desperately grafting styles, ect.
LA on the other hand looked inward after their fall from the top. They went back to the lab & made music for themselves. It took a while, but a genuinely organic groundswell of unique music started bubbling out of LA. They took the humbling steps needed for a cultural rebirth.
NYC is to self important to ever play the humble and go back to the lab like that. You won't make music to impress each other. You need to "win".

Honestly & with no disrespect, I don't care if NYC ever "comes back". The city that made the music I loved growing up is long dead & buried under an artisanal pickle store. With its current mind frame, "Bringing NY back" strokes NY dudes egos, but does nothing for my eardrums.

I mean, if you ask anyone to name their top 10-20 rappers, New York will probably dominate the list.

Which is crazy, but can you really expect a single region to keep producing 1st ballot HOF'rs forever?

iLLscan said:

NYC seems more concerned with "winning" than actually doing what it takes to win.
Yall dudes seem far more concerned with the respect you think you deserve than putting in the work to continually receive said respect.
Once the South snatched the crown, NYC immediately lost its self assurance, began pouting & making disparaging remarks from the sideline, desperately grafting styles, ect.
LA on the other hand looked inward after their fall from the top. They went back to the lab & made music for themselves. It took a while, but a genuinely organic groundswell of unique music started bubbling out of LA. They took the humbling steps needed for a cultural rebirth.
NYC is to self important to ever play the humble and go back to the lab like that. You won't make music to impress each other. You need to "win".

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How many artist from LA are winning?

I don't expect the new dudes to be 2015 versions of BIG/NaS/Jay-Z the same way they weren't Rakim/Kane/G Rap but they became more well rounded versions of the earlier generation to an extent. Then Pun/X expanded once again. 50 took elements and expanded. Cam recreated himself to get the Diplomats movement nationwide, after that point NY stopped evolving. Saigon/Papoose/Joell Ortiz simply were add water and stir for the most part.

Pac expanded on what Cube had done. Snoop added a melodic flow to a style of rap that was ALWAYS aggressive. What happened in LA after the class of Snoop, Pac, Ras Kass, Xzibit was a generation trying to recreate a style that had seemed to be worn out.

The west failed with their class of 04-06 much like NY. Guerrilla Black, G Malone, Clyde Carson, Hot Dollar all the way to Nipsey and Jay Rock signing to majors and falling flat at first. Game was the only survivor, and part of that was his multi regional appeal. Had Game dropped Doctors Advocate first and not Documentary maybe history changes. I don't think DA would've been universally accepted without The Documentary coming first.

The east needs to implement what's popular nationally to bring attention back to NY, then expand on the sound.

On "Deep Cover" Dre and Snoop are still saying "yeah.. And you don't stop".
On "Nothin But A G Thing" their saying "it's like this and like that and like think and a"
They used a CLASSIC call and response approach that was used in NY in the late 70s and become a staple, that's what they used to gain the nation's attention, then they expanded on the sound, introduced G Funk. There's cuts and scratches on those records for God's sake.

Who from NY is gonna do that today? I like Dave Ea$t, it's a lyrical version of east coast trap if you will. It looks and sounds like 2015 NY. He's not compromised lyrically either. I felt Rowdy Rebel was gonna be instrumental in reinventing a sound for NY.

GKMC has "Money Trees" and "Swimming Pools" which are more or less turn up records with a message, Vince Staples has Future on "Seniorita". You gotta use what people are LISTENING to if you want then to listen. Don't go against the grand, just sand it your own way.

Drill/Trap is what people are listening to throughout the country, if you want to revive the culture you have to give the people what they want. "Straight Outta Compton" sonically could have been a Public Enemy record. If their eating burgers don't serve them broccoli. Just put your own seasoning on that burger. You gotta go with the winning formula. If Ready To Die was 15 "Unbelievable's" or "Gimme The Loots" then BIG wouldn't have been a star, as talented as he was. Listen to his last 6 bars of "Goin Back To Cali"

Life After Death is the east coast hip-hop survivors manuel. Straight up.

tyisny said:

Cali right Now, Kendrick, Q, Tyler, Earl, Ty $, Vince Staples, Nippsey, Dom - All completely different sunject matters and sounds......... COMPLETELY different from what was running the West 20 yrs ago.

The south.. Future, Migos, Thug, Travi$, 2 Chainz, Krit, all completely different sounds & nothing like the music that was being made in the south 20 yrs ago.

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I was with you til you said this.

I just had a convo with my boy about this. It's a few different reasons.

Me, personally, I just feel like that NY sound is just stale. That's not a slight to the producers or artists coming from that area, but with Metro Booming type beats and the repetitive but catchy lyrics we hear now, I don't think anybody is into the type of sound NYC created. Basically, nobody wants to hear it anymore. If you look at other regions and their version of Hip Hop it's more enjoyable. To me, anyway.

The west coast's sound is more "funkier," the south's is more soulful, and, IMO, the Midwest artists combine both of thoes things to make better music. The west coast has been able to reinvent themselves with this newer DJ Mustard era, while not sacrificing the sound that Dr. Dre created that made them so successful in the first place. The south has been dominant for 15 years now. While the Midwest has steady pumped out good artists on a consistent basis.

When you look at the major acts that have come from NYC in recent years (ASAP, Nicki, French) they all sound like southern artists, with French and ASAP infusing that NY sound into their music from time to time. Troy Ave is probably the only mainstream artist in NY that still tries to carry on that culture and people seem to rock with it, but I don't see that lasting.

Kids aren't interested in skill anymore.

Ballerific703 said:

I don't think a region will dominate because of the internet. Everyone dresses alike and sounds alike. Back in the day, each region had their own look and sound. Now it's all pretty much the same. Rap music is at an all time low. I can't believe the **** I hear on the radio or the **** that's allowed in today's game :x

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QFT!! Matter of fact, this might be the quote of the year!!

Ain't trying to sound like an old dude but seriously, back then, it was dope to have different sounds from different regions. The east coast had the grimey/gritty/boom bap sound. West coast had G Funk. Down south had their thing. Everything was sooo different, but dope. Even the different fashion styles from the different regions was cool. You would be able to tell if a cat is from the West Coast or East Coast just but the way they dressed back then.

It's funny cuz 10 years ago some NY dudes would say the south ain't real hip hop and you fast forward now the rappers that are popping now from NY or Jersey are southern sounding artists (ASAP Mob and Fetty Wap).

These new rappers in the south whether you like 'em or not, these _'s work. They put out a ton of music for their fans and they eat it up. Future, Young Thug, Migos, Young Dolph, Yo Gotti, Big Krit even Gucci is still flooding the game with music while he's locked up. Then the producers... Metro, Mike Will, Zay, TM88, Southside just to name a few. From the rappers to the producers all these dudes live in the studio. Are NY artist really grinding like that? I'm not saying they're not, I'm just saying. The West got a whole new generation of artists. Kendrick, School Boy, Ab Soul, Jay Rock, Nipsey, YG, Dom Kennedy, Ty Dolla. And they make west coast music.

To me Fab is probably the only NY rapper that has made great projects while staying true to that NY sound. The Soul Tape series is classic to me and I wasn't even that big fan of Fab fan before he started making those. The lyrics, the production it has a classic NY feel. And people can say what they want about French, no he ain't lyrical but him and Harry Fraud make some dope ****. Harry Fraud beats should be all over the radio in NY. He has a soulful yet gritty sound. NY should support him.

Is it something NYC artists could do better? Like, what would need to happen for NYC as a whole to reclaim the top spot in Hip Hop?

Maximus Meridius said:

It's funny cuz 10 years ago some NY dudes would say the south ain't real hip hop and you fast forward now the rappers that are popping now from NY or Jersey are southern sounding artists (ASAP Mob and Fetty Wap).

These new rappers in the south whether you like 'em or not, these _'s work. They put out a ton of music for their fans and they eat it up. Future, Young Thug, Migos, Young Dolph, Yo Gotti, Big Krit even Gucci is still flooding the game with music while he's locked up. Then the producers... Metro, Mike Will, Zay, TM88, Southside just to name a few. From the rappers to the producers all these dudes live in the studio. Are NY artist really grinding like that? I'm not saying they're not, I'm just saying. The West got a whole new generation of artists. Kendrick, School Boy, Ab Soul, Jay Rock, Nipsey, YG, Dom Kennedy, Ty Dolla. And they make west coast music.

To me Fab is probably the only NY rapper that has made great projects while staying true to that NY sound. The Soul Tape series is classic to me and I wasn't even that big fan of Fab fan before he started making those. The lyrics, the production it has a classic NY feel. And people can say what they want about French, no he ain't lyrical but him and Harry Fraud make some dope ****. Harry Fraud beats should be all over the radio in NY. He has a soulful yet gritty sound. NY should support him.

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I don't feel YG and Ty $ definitely doesn't make west coast music.

and neither does Ab Soul

and is Dom anymore relevant than Bronson?
and are Ab Soul or Q anymore relevant than Joey?

So naw bro, the west ain't winning like that either.

Because the biggest artist are still Dre, Game and Kendrick. And everyone else has their niche fanbase. Kendrick's fanbase didn't spread to the rest of Top Dawg.

SkurrtSkurrt29 said:

Is it something NYC artists could do better? Like, what would need to happen for NYC as a whole to reclaim the top spot in Hip Hop?

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Take back radio first of all. It's no longer even New York radio.

When you go to that area of the country, it should sound like you're in that area. I think if that changed in New York things will flow down despite what Ebro says and thinks.

But that ain't changing so it is what it is.

That's why artist from the tri state area are putting out down south sounding music. It's how you will get noticed.

that's another thing that kills me about this discussion, ANYBODY who is winning at radio is doing it with whatever sound is hot at the moment. Hence DJ Mustard/Mikewill/ Metro controlling what seems to be atleast 60-70 percent of smash songs these days (If not them a beatmaker who's sound falls in line with theirs)

Every rapper in the south ain't from ATL but any of them who are making radio/ club records have a sound that's exactly the same. ATL, Florida, Memphis, Houston etc etc.. are all different towns with different slang, different lifestyles, etc etc. but nobody ever points at those artist and discredits them for using the influence of sound that isn't from their town, to keep it 100 ATL sound has been the most dominate of the sounds over the past 10, but we tend to group all these southern regions together.

And btw The A$AP sounds like the south thing needs to stop, i'm starting to be convinced that dudes ain't here nothing from this dude since the first mixtape. but that's another story.

All NY hasn't had in a minute is a singular distinctive sound to control the radio, why is this even important when we are in an age where hiphop is solely going back to consumers buying into the music they like rather than being fed what to like by the radio & major corporations? In order for NYC to be back "on top" we would be forced to make music that is disposable, catchy, and is intended to keep 15-25 year old kids entertained.... is that really the Crown that NY wants??

in terms of pure talent, actual output, and diversity in the sound of the music NYC is in the same place as any other region.

Magic1978 said:

I don't feel YG and Ty $ definitely doesn't make west coast music.

and neither does Ab Soul

and is Dom anymore relevant than Bronson?
and are Ab Soul or Q anymore relevant than Joey?

So naw bro, the west ain't winning like that either.

Because the biggest artist are still Dre, Game and Kendrick. And everyone else has their niche fanbase. Kendrick's fanbase didn't spread to the rest of Top Dawg.

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Have you listened to YG's music?

All his mixtapes and My Krazy Life are 100% west coast.


The point is these other regions have a bunch of new artists that have followings. From the big names to the smaller ones. Look at what Wayne, TIP, Ross and Jeezy have done over the last 10 years. From their success to the success of other people. Look at how Gucci has groomed rappers and producers that are all over the radio. 50 and Cam was the last dudes from NY to do any of that. I think Jim coulda had something with Stack Bundles and Max B but that fell apart once Stack died. That MOB tape is one of the best mixtapes ever.

as a NY'er i can honestly say that our egos are the cause of the downfall. they are too stubborn and don't want to evolve. East Coast rap hasn't evolved as much as we think it has. only guys that might have tried to do that were people like ASAP Rocky & French Montana which i barely even listen to at times.

Magic1978 said:

I don't feel YG and Ty $ definitely doesn't make west coast music.

 

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Try listening to My Krazy Life. I'll narrow it down more, listen to Twist My Fangaz. If that aint West Coast  music, you don't know what it is.

French Montana's mixtapes are what I want to hear that feels like an updated NY sound. His album was a total mess though.

Maximus Meridius said:

Have you listened to YG's music?

All his mixtapes and My Krazy Life are 100% west coast.


The point is these other regions have a bunch of new artists that have followings. From the big names to the smaller ones. Look at what Wayne, TIP, Ross and Jeezy have done over the last 10 years. From their success to the success of other people. Look at how Gucci has groomed rappers and producers that are all over the radio. 50 and Cam was the last dudes from NY to do any of that. I think Jim coulda had something with Stack Bundles and Max B but that fell apart once Stack died.

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i think the point that he's trying to make is that people are making an argument that nobody listens to artist from NYC or that they somehow don't have followings and that's completely wrong. NYC artist also have their own movements and continue to put out music.

and to the point that someone made about the work ethic...... it's a million times easier to release a thousand songs when you are literally walking into the booth and saying the first things that pop into your head, many of the young cats from Joey, Rocky, Ferg, Troy, Bodega etc etc seem to put more thought into the songs and are more calculated about it. now does that always make better music? NO? the same way dropping 5-6 mixtapes a year and having 10 good tracks in total doesn't mean your "putting in work"

another thing that people fail to mention Jeezy, Ross, Tip, Wayne, Chainz.... ALL were heavily influenced by NYC rappers and mixed it with the southern influence to create their ideas.

Word to Ross & Jeezy damn near partnering with Hov, 2chainz literally saying Cam his favorite rapper, Wayne not becoming Wayne until after Dipset/ Jay etc etc...

tyisny said:

another thing that people fail to mention Jeezy, Ross, Tip, Wayne, Chainz.... ALL were heavily influenced by NYC rappers and mixed it with the southern influence to create their ideas.

Word to Ross & Jeezy damn near partnering with Hov, 2chainz literally saying Cam his favorite rapper, Wayne not becoming Wayne until after Dipset/ Jay etc etc...

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So you saying Jeezy, TIP, Ross were heavily influenced by NY rappers but ASAP Mob doesn't sound like the south?

There is nothing NY about Jeezy or TIP or 2Chainz music. TIP has always reminded me of Jay-Z if Jay was from ATL but he never tried to sound like Jay. On the other hand ASAP Mob uses the same flows, production style and slang as UGK and 3-6 Mafia.

Maximus Meridius said:

Have you listened to YG's music?

All his mixtapes and My Krazy Life are 100% west coast.


The point is these other regions have a bunch of new artists that have followings. From the big names to the smaller ones. Look at what Wayne, TIP, Ross and Jeezy have done over the last 10 years. From their success to the success of other people. Look at how Gucci has groomed rappers and producers that are all over the radio. 50 and Cam was the last dudes from NY to do any of that. I think Jim coulda had something with Stack Bundles and Max B but that fell apart once Stack died. That MOB tape is one of the best mixtapes ever.

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tay1 said:

Try listening to My Krazy Life. I'll narrow it down more, listen to Twist My Fangaz. If that aint West Coast  music, you don't know what it is.

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DJ Mustard makes west coast sounding music?

YG? The dude who made My Nuh? That was west coast sounding to you

I'm not talking about how YG looks or even the subject matter. I'm talking about his music. From the lyrics, hook/chorus to the production. Mustard's production is 808 driven, which is why so many south artist use him. Like Tyga's Rack City, that's not a west coast song, even though they're both from the west coast.

DJ Mustard makes variations of Bay Area hyphy music. So, yes, he makes West Coast music.

Everything about YG is west coast dude and yes, including the music. My Krazy Life is basically an update of the old west coast sound