Another Nas vs Jay thread.

[hueyp in louiev]

My two favorite living MCs hands down.

I have times when I zone out on Nas for weeks and times when I zone out to Jay for weeks. I find myself zoning to Nas more actually.

But 1 thing I noticed is...as well written and real as Nas's lyrics and subject matter are.....his music just can't hold a candle to the impact andfeel of Jay's for me.

Like they are 1a and 1b in my book and Nas has way more heartfelt and personal tracks that sound like a page out of my life.

But I just finished bumping The Lost Tapes and Black is Back, back to back....

Jay's s_ hit way harder. The wordplay on December 4th, What more can I say, Lucifer & Allure....Damn.

I don't know if its the voices, the personas, swag, presentation, lyrical styles...I can't call it but thats the way I feel.

What y'all think?

 

[m16]

Nas hits much harder, it's literally unenjoyable to listen to Jay most of the time for me.

I can understand why people feel Jay comes off as easier to listen too though, it's more accessible music, that's why it's also more commerciallysuccessful.

 

[the gr8]

Jay aint even on the same leve as Nas lyrically. He just has more mainstream appealing $+!#. Nas is the FAR better MC though IMO

 

[hueyp in louiev]

Originally Posted by THE GR8

Jay aint even on the same leve as Nas lyrically. He just has more mainstream appealing $+!#. Nas is the FAR better MC though IMO

Not true.

They have different styles but you can't say that Jay ain't on Nas's level if you analyze both MCs lyrics without bias. They approach theirrespective styles differently but they are both masters of the craft.

But thats not even the topic of the this particular thread...I acknowledged Nas's lyrical brilliance inthe OP...the question is whose music hits harder and has more of an impact for you?

Pun was faaaar more lyrical than Pac but whose music had more impact and was harder hitting to most....really no contest.

This is mainly directed at listeners of both artists.

 

[seven30]

Nas hits me more on serious and emotional topics & Jay gets me with his punchlines and witty wordplay. Both dudes are legends it just pretty much dependson my mood whenever I listen to them.

 

[seymore cake]

While I understand where you're coming from Haze... I have to respectfully disagree, I'm a fan of personalable rap and Nas does that to a T, its notall about being fly and how much chop he has, for the most part he raps about real #++* that most of us deal with. I was just telling Jewels a few weeks backthat it seems as though nobody raps about the struggle of our people anymore. Like our plight is over or some #++* like that.


In terms of Jay's catalog being more appealing I believe its the "personality of his music" its the bragadociousness (sp?) of Jay's vibe thatpulls listeners in...

 

[i am knowledge]

At the end of the day I think a person's judgment on these two brilliant men will all boil down to said person's individual character. Fortunately,I've got some bipolar ways about myself, which gives me a different level of enjoyment at different times. There are times when Jay's music reallydoes it for me, and there are sometimes when Nas' music puts me where I need to be.

It's crazy though, because I really feel as if a person's response to the question on who they prefer out of the two is like a Litmus test to thatperson's character. There have been people that I've never really met, and they'll say that they prefer Jay over Nas, and I've automaticallyassumed certain things about the person that have proven to be true as I got to know them. The same goes for those who prefer Nas as well.

Now these character traits aren't good or bad, but it's just something that I've noticed.

I really feel like these two dudes music complete each other, on some Joker Vs. Batman +$!!.

 

[Jordan8]

Jay's. Charisma goes a long way on the microphone.

 

[hueyp in louiev]

Originally Posted by I AM KNOWLEDGE

At the end of the day I think a person's judgment on these two brilliant men will all boil down to said person's individual character. Fortunately, I've got some bipolar ways about myself, which gives me a different level of enjoyment at different times. There are times when Jay's music really does it for me, and there are sometimes when Nas' music puts me where I need to be.

It's crazy though, because I really feel as if a person's response to the question on who they prefer out of the two is like a Litmus test to that person's character. There have been people that I've never really met, and they'll say that they prefer Jay over Nas, and I've automatically assumed certain things about the person that have proven to be true as I got to know them. The same goes for those who prefer Nas as well.

Now these character traits aren't good or bad, but it's just something that I've noticed.

I really feel like these two dudes music complete each other, on some Joker Vs. Batman +$!!.

Seymore CAKE wrote:

While I understand where you're coming from Haze... I have to respectfully disagree, I'm a fan of personalable rap and Nas does that to a T, its not all about being fly and how much chop he has, for the most part he raps about real #++* that most of us deal with. I was just telling Jewels a few weeks back that it seems as though nobody raps about the struggle of our people anymore. Like our plight is over or some #++* like that.


In terms of Jay's catalog being more appealing I believe its the "personality of his music" its the bragadociousness (sp?) of Jay's vibe that pulls listeners in...


My dudes...

I wanted to hear other cats opinions on the matter and y'all gave real unbiased answers.

IAK....I agree wholeheartedly on them being compliments to each other musically. I have felt that way for a long time. They both admire and are influenced byeach others works and moves, even if they won't admit it.

Seymore that bolded section is real as hell. Glad i'm not the only one the feels that way.

cartune wrote:

Jay's. Charisma goes a long way on the microphone.


Thats exactly how I feel.

 

[m16]

Originally Posted by I AM KNOWLEDGE

I really feel as if a person's response to the question on who they prefer out of the two is like a Litmus test to that person's character

Agreed.

More-so than character, it's the easiest way I use to judge other dudes hip hop tastes/knowledge. I don't think I've ever met anyone worth talkingto that preferred Jay.

 

[b smooth 202]

I don't think I've ever met anyone worth talking to that preferred Jay.

this dude continues to prove his ignorance

Anyway I definitely like Nas better, because Nas parallels my personality a lot more..I relate to Nas' music a lot more.

 

[Jordan8]

Originally Posted by M16

Originally Posted by I AM KNOWLEDGE

I really feel as if a person's response to the question on who they prefer out of the two is like a Litmus test to that person's character

Agreed.

More-so than character, it's the easiest way I use to judge other dudes hip hop tastes/knowledge. I don't think I've ever met anyone worth talking to that preferred Jay.

This guy

 

[seymore cake]

Originally Posted by HueyP in LouieV

I wanted to hear other cats opinions on the matter and y'all gave real unbiased answers.

Seymore that bolded section is real as hell. Glad i'm not the only one the feels that way.

Thats because I honestly rock with both of their music and I don't understand how any self respecting fan of hiphop/rap doesn't. While75% of the timeI'm going to say Nasir is the greatest to do it, I can honestly say it has been too many times for me to recall where I've listened to Jay and statedverbatim "This _ Is The

Best!!!" same goes forthe other two in heaven.

It is impossible for you to be a fan of a dudes mic skills and not respect/be able to make an arguement for either of these two being "HIM" as far asG.O.A.T goes

I Am Knowledge... That was the perfect way to put it my dude.

 

[the natural mystic]

Nas is a far better MC and his music has more substance. It's rebel music.

 

[Master Zik]

Damn. I thought this was a Music Forum PYP in disguise.

I prefer NaS. If I'm playing Ol Man Jigga it's only RD or songs I really liked after that. In the end the dust head music > camel music.

 

[m16]

Originally Posted by B Smooth 202

I don't think I've ever met anyone worth talking
to that preferred Jay.

this dude continues to prove his ignorance

Anyway I definitely like Nas better, because Nas parallels my personality a lot more..I relate to Nas' music a lot more.


So observations made over the years through my own life experience is ignorance ? Go sit down somewhere moron.

 

[hueyp in louiev]

I think Nas is definitely the more lyrical of the two at this point in their careers because he goes harder more consistently. Jay is more selective with hissuper lyricism and probably has to do so because of his audience and expectations...hopefully both men are able to keep living and keep putting out qualitywork so that we can still have this conversation when we're in our 30s, 40's and beyond.

Plus at this point in their careers, I think both men are pigeonholed into making certian types of albums. If Jay drops an "Untitled" _s will s_ onhim and Nas drops a "Blueprint" his fans will riot...that should be factored into the discussion as well.

They both get their messages out in their own ways.

Jay has a lot of shallow tracks and half +@@!+ it sometimes but I still get a lot of social statements out of his work.

Like Reasonable Doubt was actually far more analytic, introspective and political than Illmatic IMO.

Jay said "What more can I say" back in '03 and he was right. He had recycled the Hip-Hop cliched topcis so many times and did it better tanhanyone ever...it really was time for him to step back for a minute...but dude is maturing and his music along with it. AG wasn't a "gangster"album that joint was a statement and i'm excited to see where he goes in the future.

Nas is a real ecclectic dude and you can see that from things like his upcoming album with Damion Marley. I just wish that he would go in on some"Stillmatic", "Nas is Like" "My Way" vibe more often. To me when he puts his style of lyricism behind real East Coast Hip-Hopsounds, while delivering his message through the lyrics.....no one is f_n with him. But its not fair to box in brothas with so much potential so I have learnedto appreciate what he does musically.

 

[physicx]

Originally Posted by M16

Originally Posted by I AM KNOWLEDGE

I really feel as if a person's response to the question on who they prefer out of the two is like a Litmus test to that person's character

Agreed.

More-so than character, it's the easiest way I use to judge other dudes hip hop tastes/knowledge. I don't think I've ever met anyone worth talking to that preferred Jay.

i agree with the former statement though, definitely.

i like nas better btw, much better

 

[i am knowledge]

A lot of real talk in here. I honestly think that Nas is 10 years ahead of Jay when it comes to the type of music he makes. (You fools read the rest of thepost before you hit ad reply!)

Once you reach a certain level of greatness you should be free to do whatever you choose to do. I feel that Nas reached this point a while ago, and Jayhasn't yet, but he will eventually.

I think that's why I rock with Nas a little more. He no longer gives a *+$* about what critics have to say about him. I'm really convinced that Jaycould drop an Untitled, but for whatever reason, he's afraid to. Maybe it's because he's climbed the ladder of success by staying in his lane. Heknows that he's great at what he does. Behind the machismo, bravado, and braggadocios, I think a lot of these dudes are really insecure.

Think about it, Jay dropped Kingdom Come, and it was a pretty ill album, and it got %#!! on. You don't think that plays a part in how Jay has chosen toredirect his music?

Yeah, he said, what more can I say? But as long as you're a living artist, there is social commentary to give.

Like I said, I hope he'll get there, but I also know that it's hard to rebel against an establishment that you are now a part of.

He said his D.O.A may piss off some of his connects, and he probably doesn't care about that, but is he willing to piss of his Jewish, and Masonic friends?Guess time will tell.

 

[hueyp in louiev]

From The Hundreds blog...

The first time Nas walked into THLA, Morgan was playing a pirated track off of the new Jay-Z record.

"Yo, is this the new Jay?" Nas inquired.

Turns out Nas was hearing Jay-Z's out-of-retirement album, "Kingdom Come," for the first time. He told Morgan to start it over and turn it up, then Nas stopped in the middle of the floor, dropped his bags, and listened to the first single in its entirety, while customers milled around him, gawking shamelessly at one of the greatest rappers of all time. Considering his and Jay-Z's storied past, it was crazy to watch Nas zone out and bob his head to the track, he was completely oblivious to anyone else in the room, deconstructing and analyzing the words that were being spit from our speakers as if he was squaring up Hova right then and there. The song finished, the spell was broken, he looked up and gave a smug nod.

"So what'd you think?" I asked him.

He cocked his head to the side and declared, "Not bad."

 

[seymore cake]

Originally Posted by I AM KNOWLEDGE

A lot of real talk in here...

I'm really convinced that Jay could drop an Untitled, but for whatever reason, he's afraid to. Maybe it's because he's climbed the ladder of success by staying in his lane. He knows that he's great at what he does. Behind the machismo, bravado, and braggadocios, I think a lot of these dudes are really insecure.

This is my biggest Pet Peeve when it comes to Shawn. He limits himself, he box's himself into certain lanes. Maybe its the "if it aint broke"type mentality or he's just too concerned with how people will view him, but he doesn't take chances with his material. With his skill level, histopics should be limitless.

I mean seriously we all know he can do the

that makes you think "Meet the Parents" "Lucky Me" "Soldiers Ballad" as well as the introspective

"Where I'm From" "WhereHave You Been" "Regrets" the controvesial but needed to be said

"Minority Report" and"

and Sisters" etc. But hedoes it soooooooooooooooooo far and in between that we actually forget he can go like that. That to me is his invisible fence. Had he decided to "Give A

Less" after Vol 2. itwould've worked because while he would've received quite a few () he still would've been accepted because by then everybody was eating whatever*!++ he shoveled, it would've been a much easier transition for him. I'll never understand why he pigeon holes himself

 

[m16]

Originally Posted by Seymore CAKE

I'll never understand why he pigeon holes himself

are you serious ?

$

 

[seymore cake]

Originally Posted by M16

Originally Posted by Seymore CAKE

I'll never understand why he pigeon holes himself

are you serious ?

$

This is the thing... For someone who takes their craft as serious as he does and has prospered much as he does why struggle internally for financial gain whenyou've already become wealthier than you would ever imagine?

"truthfully I wanna rhyme like Common Sense but I did 5million I aint been rappin like Common since"

Now you make more money outside of music than you could ever possibly realistically see from a album. Why not just say forget boundaries I'm not dumbingthis one down. I'm going to show everyone just how ill I am???

Thats just my rationale tho

 

[m16]

He has no spine whatsoever. He's too shook to go against what his teeny bopper fans have come to like him for. If he stepped out and dropped a Untitledrather than the poppy flower bragging garbage they are used too he would have a lot of angry teenagers on his hands. Overall he just puts his own fame/$/iconicstatus over making deeper, more quality music.

 

[hueyp in louiev]

Cake, I think its the personal difference in these dudes makeup and character that reflect in their careers and music.

Nas was that brilliant mind that always wondered about the working of the world and the plight of his people. His pops was a musician and his moms was a strongblack woman, he just happened to be born into America's ghettos like too many of us. He was never really a criminal, he was a ghetto survivor, a naturalborn artist and thinker. He said himself that he only sold crack for a couple of days before realizing that it wasn't for him. Thats why people panned"It Was Written" so much when it firsted dropped, looking back it was a lyrical masterpiece but at the time people smelled the fronting all over it.It wasn't what they expected from Nas. He had no choice but to go back to " I wanna talk to the Mayor, to the Governor, to the Muthaf_nPresident...". He's been on his own unique road since then.

Jay really was a crack dealer. A higher level street crack dealer at that, with an absent father and a mother who were both substance abusers. Jay seemsmotivated by power and control but he is also a brilliant mind, he just analyzes things through his own scope. The way that he authentically talks about streets_ without glamorizing it...Nas could never do that because he never lived that life. Jay-Z has has had the ear of the most needy listeners for a long time buthe is never willing to go all out in his message partially because he wants to maintain his status, partly because he doesn't have the wealth of knowledeof Nas does and partly because he has to talk in the language of the masses to continue to drop his little gems here and there. A lot of these shorties have noidea about what Nas is kicking, eventhough it directly relates to their life and situation but when Jay says "Like I told you sell drugs...no. Hov didthat so hopefully you wouldn't have to go through that". Brothas can clearly overstand that, look at his success and come to a moment of clairty.


Like IAK said. Dudes are like Yin and Yang. Their lives will forever be entwined like Biggie and Pac. Its Like Professor X and Magneto. X raised the shortiesand taught those with higher levels of understanding but Magneto was a coldass villian. So real that his presence may have even overshadowed the founder of thewhole movement.