Any managers on NT? Vol. I NEED HELP

[keif sweat]

I'm looking to start managing artists/bands. No experience at all, so I'm looking to find and start with new/emerging artists and grow with them until I have an established client history. I've always been intrigued by the business side of entertainment, so managing artists is something I know I'd enjoy doing. So like the title says, does anyone have experience in the managing business? To artists, what kind of things do you look for in a manager? All input is welcome. I know NT has a diverse population so any advice helps.

 

[captaindreamcast]

I don't manage or anything, But I think an artist ultimately want a manager that's up front with them and transparent on what hes doing to push both of your careers. It would help a lot if you actually cared about your artist brand & music so you don't end up pushing stuff you don't like.

 

[armenexchange]

I'd stay away from it. From what I've seen most managers of up and coming artists put in the grunt work only to get swept away by big name managers when the artist starts to get buzz. Of course there are exceptions to this, but not worth grindin it out with a no-name rapper only to be left in the dust.

 

[keif sweat]

Originally Posted by CaptainDreamcast

I don't manage or anything, But I think an artist ultimately want a manager that's up front with them and transparent on what hes doing to push both of your careers. It would help a lot if you actually cared about your artist brand & music so you don't end up pushing stuff you don't like.

Word. I have a passion for music in general, some genres more than others though, so I plan to work with artists in areas I have a vested interest in. Thanks for the input.

I'd stay away from it. From what I've seen most managers of up and coming artists put in the grunt work only to get swept away by big name managers when the artist starts to get buzz. Of course there are exceptions to this, but not worth grindin it out with a no-name rapper only to be left in the dust.
I've def thought about that and I feel you. I feel like that can only help though even if it does happen a few times. What better way to promote yourself to the next artist than to show them the level you got your previous artist too? Whether they stay or not, its a testament to your ability to push an artist to the next level, just gotta charge their disloyalty to the game.

And its funny you brought up rap. When I tell people what I wanna do, they automatically assume I want to represent rappers since I'm a young black male. And even though I'm a fan of rap, I LOVE indie and alternative music. I like innovative music, new sounds and techniques/writing styles and that seems to be lacking in the hip-hop genre. So as of now I'm looking to start with bands but I could def see myself representing rappers once I get a better understanding and footing in the industry.

 

[keif sweat]

So no artists/industry heads have any insight? I figured there'd be at least a few on here

 

[leclutchjames]

this is NT......they dont care to help. =(

but id be down to work with you. Im an artist. lo

 

[keif sweat]

Originally Posted by LeClutchJames

this is NT......they dont care to help. =(

but id be down to work with you. Im an artist. lo

I've learned that

It's crazy because I feel like I see so many artists popping up on here, so either they aren't saying anything or they don't have or aren't looking to be managed, which says alot. I appreciate it tho man. What kind of music do you make?

 

[illphillip]

I've worked in the music business for 10+ years. And I don't think I would ever want to be a manager.

You're basically a professional baby sitter.

But, in terms of some insight.......

You need to gain some level of experience. It's hard to just pop up and say "I want to be a manager" if you don't already have a connection to an artist with talent, or don't have any knowledge/connections within the industry.

It's going to be hard for you to steer an artists career if you don't have some level of understanding of the business itself.

There are management companies. Violator Management. Roc Nation. ThreeSixZero. Azoff Management.

Maybe you should apply for an internship at one of those companies just to start to get an understanding of what happens day to day at those companies.

Or intern at a record label so you start getting an understanding of how the system you'll be dealing with works if you manage an artist. The marketing, the sales, the promotion etc.

There, you'll also start to build a proper network of contacts that will help you if you start managing an artist.

Hope that helps. Fire back some more specific questions if you have any and I'll assist if I can.

 

[the encore]

I help manage some producers and manage some unsigned artists ... Pretty much just giving them some advice & direction when needed since I have some industry experience ... Keif, peep the link in my sig and hit me up sometimes ... u and i seem to be on the same page

 

[keif sweat]

Originally Posted by illphillip

I feel you on the babysitter thing, from my research I'veseen that as a running theme. Not to say I'd be a fan of it per se, but I'vealways been interested in who made the PR decisions for a band or musician, whodecides what direction an act should be taken and who decides that. I know inmany cases its not the artist and I feel like I could make those decisions.

As far as gaining the experience, this route seems to be the only one thatreally works for me. I've spent close to the last year applying for assistantpositions at both major and smaller management firms in and around NYC. Noluck. Internships weren't really an option as by the time I started setting outon trying to make this happen I was finishing my first year of law school andstarting to realize I didn't really wanna be a lawyer at that time.

I figure by doing it this way (actively going and finding an act I'd like towork with), I can learn and grow with an act that is simultaneously learningthe business as well, sort of a symbiotic growth system. They'll likely not beable to afford major management at this point in their career and I won't havethe experience to manage a major act. Not to mention by the time I would'veprocured employment at a firm and got enough experience to head out I'd alreadybe 3-4 years along doing it on my own. I feel like I'm motivated enough to makeabout as much progress in that time as I would've at your average firm.

Thanks for the input man...I really do appreciate it.

I do have a question, are you aware of any resources that show what shows/actsare playing in a given area based on genre? I've found some local ones but theytend to either exclude a lot of emerging or poppy acts or they're not easilybroken down into genres.

Besides the babysitter thing, what other aspects turn you away from managingartists?

Also, what area of the music business are based in? (I understand if you don'twant to be too specific) That way I know which questions I should be asking you

Originally Posted by The Encore

We really do sound very much alike. The way you worded it almost soundslike you do it here and there...are you looking to be a full-time manager orare you doing it with another direction in mind? Also what genre/s of music areyou involved in? I'll def check out your site as well, thanks for the inputman.

 

[the encore]

Originally Posted by Keif Sweat

Originally Posted by illphillip

I feel you on the babysitter thing, from my research I'veseen that as a running theme. Not to say I'd be a fan of it per se, but I'vealways been interested in who made the PR decisions for a band or musician, whodecides what direction an act should be taken and who decides that. I know inmany cases its not the artist and I feel like I could make those decisions.

As far as gaining the experience, this route seems to be the only one thatreally works for me. I've spent close to the last year applying for assistantpositions at both major and smaller management firms in and around NYC. Noluck. Internships weren't really an option as by the time I started setting outon trying to make this happen I was finishing my first year of law school andstarting to realize I didn't really wanna be a lawyer at that time.

I figure by doing it this way (actively going and finding an act I'd like towork with), I can learn and grow with an act that is simultaneously learningthe business as well, sort of a symbiotic growth system. They'll likely not beable to afford major management at this point in their career and I won't havethe experience to manage a major act. Not to mention by the time I would'veprocured employment at a firm and got enough experience to head out I'd alreadybe 3-4 years along doing it on my own. I feel like I'm motivated enough to makeabout as much progress in that time as I would've at your average firm.

Thanks for the input man...I really do appreciate it.

I do have a question, are you aware of any resources that show what shows/actsare playing in a given area based on genre? I've found some local ones but theytend to either exclude a lot of emerging or poppy acts or they're not easilybroken down into genres.

Besides the babysitter thing, what other aspects turn you away from managingartists?

Also, what area of the music business are based in? (I understand if you don'twant to be too specific) That way I know which questions I should be asking you

Originally Posted by The Encore

We really do sound very much alike. The way you worded it almost soundslike you do it here and there...are you looking to be a full-time manager orare you doing it with another direction in mind? Also what genre/s of music areyou involved in? I'll def check out your site as well, thanks for the inputman.

I do it in my free time due to a full time job ... I'm more of a passion-project type of guy, so i started this team w/ my former college roommate to help artists & producers who need direction ... The 1st group of artists/producers we are working w/ are our talented friends who already have some credibility going in their field. and just need some overall direction on creating a project and gaining awareness.

We are hands on w/ these artists / projects, and the range of music we work w/ isn't really limited to one particular genre ... I think we can all honestly come to agreement that country just isn't our strong point tho

 

[illphillip]

The Encore just hit on something. He has talented friends that he is helping due to his first hand experience in the music business.

Which makes perfect sense. I at times act as a "consultant" for people I know. Sometimes they'll throw me some paper. Or just get me a bottle of Johnnie Blue as a thank you. I don't ask for anything.

It seems like you want to be a manager, but it's going to be tough if you don't have the artist yet. It will also be tough to convince a developing artist to let you manage them when you may have less music business experience than they do. And if you're a complete stranger.

Tough, but not impossible. If you think you have a fairly good understanding of marketing etc. in the NEW music business, you may be able to get it done.

Look at ASAP. That didn't happen by accident. Rocky has a team and on that team they have a dude with a TON of experience in the business.

Another thing, the managers I know, SPEND money on their artists. They invest in their artists. Developing them. Styling them. With the belief that said artist has the talent that they will make that money back in the long run.

So if you have no experience, and no money to help support your artist, it will be an uphill battle. Not trying to discourage you. But just letting you know some of the things you're up against.

Posting on here was a good start. Maybe you and Encore can connect. And you can learn from there.

If your are in NY, use the back of the Village Voice for shows. Ignore all the hookers and past that section is the breakdown for damn near every venue in the city. Get out, network, and once you build a network you'll find out about shows through word of mouth. Get to shows early because you're scouting the opening artists more than you're there for the headliners.

 

[keif sweat]

Originally Posted by The Encore

Originally Posted by Keif Sweat

Originally Posted by illphillip

I feel you on the babysitter thing, from my research I'veseen that as a running theme. Not to say I'd be a fan of it per se, but I'vealways been interested in who made the PR decisions for a band or musician, whodecides what direction an act should be taken and who decides that. I know inmany cases its not the artist and I feel like I could make those decisions.

As far as gaining the experience, this route seems to be the only one thatreally works for me. I've spent close to the last year applying for assistantpositions at both major and smaller management firms in and around NYC. Noluck. Internships weren't really an option as by the time I started setting outon trying to make this happen I was finishing my first year of law school andstarting to realize I didn't really wanna be a lawyer at that time.

I figure by doing it this way (actively going and finding an act I'd like towork with), I can learn and grow with an act that is simultaneously learningthe business as well, sort of a symbiotic growth system. They'll likely not beable to afford major management at this point in their career and I won't havethe experience to manage a major act. Not to mention by the time I would'veprocured employment at a firm and got enough experience to head out I'd alreadybe 3-4 years along doing it on my own. I feel like I'm motivated enough to makeabout as much progress in that time as I would've at your average firm.

Thanks for the input man...I really do appreciate it.

I do have a question, are you aware of any resources that show what shows/actsare playing in a given area based on genre? I've found some local ones but theytend to either exclude a lot of emerging or poppy acts or they're not easilybroken down into genres.

Besides the babysitter thing, what other aspects turn you away from managingartists?

Also, what area of the music business are based in? (I understand if you don'twant to be too specific) That way I know which questions I should be asking you

Originally Posted by The Encore

We really do sound very much alike. The way you worded it almost soundslike you do it here and there...are you looking to be a full-time manager orare you doing it with another direction in mind? Also what genre/s of music areyou involved in? I'll def check out your site as well, thanks for the inputman.

I do it in my free time due to a full time job ... I'm more of a passion-project type of guy, so i started this team w/ my former college roommate to help artists & producers who need direction ... The 1st group of artists/producers we are working w/ are our talented friends who already have some credibility going in their field. and just need some overall direction on creating a project and gaining awareness.

We are hands on w/ these artists / projects, and the range of music we work w/ isn't really limited to one particular genre ... I think we can all honestly come to agreement that country just isn't our strong point tho

I see. I'm also working to supplement my income but I hope to be fully funded thru managing within the next year or two...as I'm sure you know music acts tend to cost money long before they make it so I'm willing to invest the time in order to make it something lasting. I took a look at your page (followed you on Twitter) and you seem to be dealing in genres similar to what I'm looking to work in so I hope we can do some work together in the future, especially with your corp of producers. And yeah country never really did it for ya boy either

 

[keif sweat]

DP

 

[the encore]

Originally Posted by Keif Sweat

Originally Posted by The Encore

Originally Posted by Keif Sweat


I feel you on the babysitter thing, from my research I'veseen that as a running theme. Not to say I'd be a fan of it per se, but I'vealways been interested in who made the PR decisions for a band or musician, whodecides what direction an act should be taken and who decides that. I know inmany cases its not the artist and I feel like I could make those decisions.

As far as gaining the experience, this route seems to be the only one thatreally works for me. I've spent close to the last year applying for assistantpositions at both major and smaller management firms in and around NYC. Noluck. Internships weren't really an option as by the time I started setting outon trying to make this happen I was finishing my first year of law school andstarting to realize I didn't really wanna be a lawyer at that time.

I figure by doing it this way (actively going and finding an act I'd like towork with), I can learn and grow with an act that is simultaneously learningthe business as well, sort of a symbiotic growth system. They'll likely not beable to afford major management at this point in their career and I won't havethe experience to manage a major act. Not to mention by the time I would'veprocured employment at a firm and got enough experience to head out I'd alreadybe 3-4 years along doing it on my own. I feel like I'm motivated enough to makeabout as much progress in that time as I would've at your average firm.

Thanks for the input man...I really do appreciate it.

I do have a question, are you aware of any resources that show what shows/actsare playing in a given area based on genre? I've found some local ones but theytend to either exclude a lot of emerging or poppy acts or they're not easilybroken down into genres.

Besides the babysitter thing, what other aspects turn you away from managingartists?

Also, what area of the music business are based in? (I understand if you don'twant to be too specific) That way I know which questions I should be asking you

We really do sound very much alike. The way you worded it almost soundslike you do it here and there...are you looking to be a full-time manager orare you doing it with another direction in mind? Also what genre/s of music areyou involved in? I'll def check out your site as well, thanks for the inputman.

I do it in my free time due to a full time job ... I'm more of a passion-project type of guy, so i started this team w/ my former college roommate to help artists & producers who need direction ... The 1st group of artists/producers we are working w/ are our talented friends who already have some credibility going in their field. and just need some overall direction on creating a project and gaining awareness.

We are hands on w/ these artists / projects, and the range of music we work w/ isn't really limited to one particular genre ... I think we can all honestly come to agreement that country just isn't our strong point tho

I see. I'm also working to supplement my income but I hope to be fully funded thru managing within the next year or two...as I'm sure you know music acts tend to cost money long before they make it so I'm willing to invest the time in order to make it something lasting. I took a look at your page (followed you on Twitter) and you seem to be dealing in genres similar to what I'm looking to work in so I hope we can do some work together in the future, especially with your corp of producers. And yeah country never really did it for ya boy either

Followed u on my actual acct @max_apollo

A lot of the stuff we do in-house to keep costs low, but for now we are working w/ all the tools we already have in our possession to make a solid product

 

[kickstart]

Sounds like these would be two good books for you to pick up and memorize:
http://www.amazon.com/Ste...ng-Artists/dp/0595328512
Amazon product ASIN 1439153019

 

[keif sweat]

Originally Posted by illphillip

Great advice man...I appreciate it. I'm willing to invest both the time and the money as this is something I really feel could serve as a viable career and something I'd be passionate about doing. I was actually just talking to someone a few days ago about the A$AP movement and how they were very systematic in their approach, especially considering lots of people just saw them as a glorified street team.

One thing this experience is teaching me is that you have to be proactive not only about making connections but also about getting information. Its not like every other academic venture I've been involved in where theres a standard route one takes so learning to get information from nontraditional resources is a new but eye-opening experience. I'll def have more questions along the way I'm sure but I really do appreciate the help so far. I feel like I can make this work.

Originally Posted by kickstart

I ordered All You Need To Know... literally 3 days ago, should be here any day now. Great minds man

I'll have to check out the first one as well. Thanks for the input!

 

[kickstart]

Originally Posted by Keif Sweat

Originally Posted by illphillip

Great advice man...I appreciate it. I'm willing to invest both the time and the money as this is something I really feel could serve as a viable career and something I'd be passionate about doing. I was actually just talking to someone a few days ago about the A$AP movement and how they were very systematic in their approach, especially considering lots of people just saw them as a glorified street team.

One thing this experience is teaching me is that you have to be proactive not only about making connections but also about getting information. Its not like every other academic venture I've been involved in where theres a standard route one takes so learning to get information from nontraditional resources is a new but eye-opening experience. I'll def have more questions along the way I'm sure but I really do appreciate the help so far. I feel like I can make this work.

Originally Posted by kickstart

I ordered All You Need To Know... literally 3 days ago, should be here any day now. Great minds man

I'll have to check out the first one as well. Thanks for the input!

Currently taking a few classes on Music and Entertainment Business and most of the speakers promote that wahoo out of the second book. The first book is from one of the recruiters of Sesac (PRO). I think he's working on his JD now or something to that affect, and back in the day managed The Fugees and a few other artists. Best of luck!

 

[the encore]

All You Need To Know About The Music Business is a good book ... But the best information you're going to get about the business, is by being in it ... If you're still in school, i'd recommend trying to obtain an internship @ a music label (indie or major depending on were you live). I was blessed w/ the chance to intern @ a label during college and it led to an actual postion here ... I was able to listen and gain knowledge from execs like Jay-Z, Jermaine Dupri, LA Reid, Shakir Stewart (R.I.P.), and various managers who came in-and-out of the office ...

No books can = that experience

 

[illphillip]

^^^

What he said. You should to get inside somewhere at whatever level you can and work it from within.

I went to one of the best colleges in the country, and much to my mother's chagrin, took a job in the mailroom at Virgin Records as my first job.

But I knew what I wanted to do. I never let my ego get the best of me.

And it all worked out according to plan. After 1.5 years, moved up. 2 years later, moved up. 2 more years, moved up.

People rely too much on books for knowledge. They can certainly be a useful tool. But they are ultimately just someone else's thoughts, ideas, observations etc.

Experience is the ultimate teacher.

 

[imstillmike]

you might pull a p.diddy on peoples career

 

[keif sweat]

Originally Posted by illphillip

^^^

What he said. You should to get inside somewhere at whatever level you can and work it from within.

I went to one of the best colleges in the country, and much to my mother's chagrin, took a job in the mailroom at Virgin Records as my first job.

But I knew what I wanted to do. I never let my ego get the best of me.

And it all worked out according to plan. After 1.5 years, moved up. 2 years later, moved up. 2 more years, moved up.

People rely too much on books for knowledge. They can certainly be a useful tool. But they are ultimately just someone else's thoughts, ideas, observations etc.

Experience is the ultimate teacher.

You guys might have missed it earlier, but I'm not in school so internships are out. I've figured out that many people who end up landing even entry level gigs (such as in your case illphillip) started with internships or things of the like. I don't have that as an option. As I also said earlier I've tried applying for assistant/mailroom/entry level at all types of labels, firms, agencies, etc and I had no luck; whether it was my background or who knows what, it just wasn't happening. Eventually I had to ask myself whether it was worth it for me time-wise to keep waiting and waiting for a position, or go make one on my own. I may run into a lot of obstacles that I could've avoided going the traditional route, but when that route isn't even an option whats the alternative?

I have been doing a lot of reading on the business but ultimately I'd like to do most of my learning thru first hand experience, I know a book could never teach me all the necessary skills and I def don't plan to make that my primary source of knowledge. For the time being though it has helped me gain at least a novice understanding of what moves I should be making regarding building a network and responsibly managing an act.

You guys are pretty lucky to have gotten your experience the way you did and please believe I'll be looking to glean some of that knowledge from you as well. It just looks like that traditional route won't work for ME, and I'm okay learning it an alternative way.

Thanks kickstart, best of luck to you as well. We should trade info at some point, same to you illphillip.

you might pull a p.diddy on peoples career

Would that be a good or a bad thing?

 

[keif sweat]

illphillip, in one of your earlier posts you talked about marketing in the "NEW music era". I think I have a good idea of what you mean (digital mediums, social networks, mixtape/blog sites, etc?) but I'm interested to know what you think is the biggest difference in marketing between this era and the last.

 

[armenexchange]

agreed with what 2 dudes said up there.

if ur a student or can afford to survive as an intern, do it at a label to learn its structure. spent a whole year after graduatin college interning unpaid at 3/4 major labels and didnt lead to a paid position in (a&r) which is what i wanted to do, but def made the connections for my current job and interview i got later today at a mgmt company which im psyched about.

a lot of artists dont mess or know much about the importance of twitter, fb, etc, so if u got that and some industry experience, connections, and the way the labels work, it shouldnt be too hard to convince someone you wanna manage them (assumin u get at them early enough)..

keep an eye out for ascap and bmi mixers and events, found tons of artists n producers lookin for management help at those types of events.

whattup max-props to u guys over at def jam on john west's success, went out to his la show couple weeks ago and was packedddd. his manager ben is super legit-saw him nonstop everywhere greeting and networkin with people all night.

 

[armenexchange]

if u want to get a foot in via internship, u def can.

i interned at radio staitons, etc in college but went to UCSD and theres no music anything going on down there.

i coulda graduated an went into finance offa my degree, but did a 180, moved back home, signed up at a bs community college just to take an internship class and qualify for an internship, and interned away.

i feel u on applying to major company websites and hoping u land an entry level-honestly, unless u got someone working there vouching for u or putting ur app at the top of the list to hr, u got a 2% chance of landing the interview at all. first hand experience lol