BoyCott or Not???

[slg]

It's deeper than that richiecottie I do not know how long you have been on this board nor do I care the point is like it or not the majority of people whoare 25 and up are not satisfied with the direction of the brand so many of us have put thousands of dollars into not too mention the hours, the waiting inline, and all of the countless hours anticipating what... ..........Some of us are very, very, very fed up. When a company leverages so much of its self innostalgia and peoples emotions as they grew up you must be held accountable. We deserve better than this but if no one is willing to take a stand than what isit all about. I will say that to no degree is shoe collecting on the same level as social justice but the action or reaction can make the same result.Change. this is about change and actually people who realize that they matter with who they influence. I have been collecting shoes for 9years and about the same time on this board and officially a member for 7 years. I do not know what Jordan's mean to you but for me and others we have aspecial love for shoes that makes us care about issues like this passionately. Much has changed including what all this means. Jordan brand has consistentlyturned its back on its most loyal fans and there has to be some way to quantify the argument on some unified level. This is what Nike Talk is for............ Say your piece no one ask you to agree but look at the context and see what is going on the only way for us to send a message to Jordan Brand is to not accept$310. 00 packs of shoes every month. you might not agree but looks to me that at least the majority of people here are not satisfied. I just put what myfriends and I have been feeling for years now not too mention the fact that certain people who worked for the brand warned us if we did not support certainideas 2-3 years ago we would be at this point. So if you don't care say your piece but to those who of us who do some of us will keep voicing our opinions because we understand what real love is ......... not just a slogan to sell shoes.

 

[ai bundy]

No offense, but you guys need some perspective in your lives if you honestly think a pair of basketball shoes is grounds for a boycott.

 

[slg]

This is what this actually about perspective!!!! This is a shoe enthusiast website where this type of discussion belongs but this was done for discussions saketo let people know the option is out there.

 

[ai bundy]

I can see that this is a shoe enthusiast website. But you seriously think a pair of basketball shoes is important enough to call for a boycott? You're noteven doing it for ethical or environmental reasons, you're doing it strictly because of your bank account. I mean how corny is that. And then you have theaudacity to compare a shoe boycott to MLK? MLK would be rolling over in his grave if he heard his movement compared to an Air Jordan movement. I just thinksome of you guys take yourselves and shoes way too seriously sometimes.

 

[mr delorean]

i think the people that really need perspective are the ones that lineup or timeout eastbay to hoard up shoes to re-sell on the internet, whether it besupplementary or primary income. face it, if you have to resort to doing this kind of thing for ANY type of profit, you cant really afford to be buying theseshoes in the first place. hows that for some real perspective? otherwise, the rest of us are just here for nostalgia and hobby.

 

[big daddy 8523]

I totally agree with You.^ Couldn't have said it better myself

 

[cwk]

Wait, wait.

Are you saying that a corporation that exists by selling products and services at a profit to provide a return on investment to its shareholders is primarilyconcerned with...profits?

I think you skipped business, economics, and english classes.

 

[fc1114]

Originally Posted by CWK



I think you skipped business, economics, and english classes.

^ A huge percentage of people on NT skipped classes..... (Boy Cott???????????????)

I didn't know it was two separate words.

 

[labanger]

I think we all know how much it costs to manufacture a Nike or Jordan sneaker (well I hope at least). That being said, besides the resellers, most of us buyJordans because they are a bit a happiness in our lives. I agree the cost are going up and the quality is going down, (I remember when I was in middle schoolmy Dad bought me a pair of OG Air Jordan 1's for like $60.00 at the Athletes Foot). But what price are you willing to pay for happiness? Anyways Irespect what your saying but there seems to be more important things then a sneaker boycott, (maybe not to you). And besides the fact that they may be sellingoverpriced poorly manufactured goods, why should we boycott them? Are they discriminating against anyone, or mistreating people or harming the environment??? Who knows maybe they are, but I am not aware of it. Bottom line, I guess just get richer not poorer.

 

[mr delorean]

Originally Posted by CWK

Wait, wait.

Are you saying that a corporation that exists by selling products and services at a profit to provide a return on investment to its shareholders is primarily concerned with...profits?

I think you skipped business, economics, and english classes.

i think you missed the entire point that he is making.

 

[cwk]

No, I'm pretty sure I understood his misguided logic. He feels betrayed by a company that he feels passionately about. I would expect younger kids toform an irrational attachment to their favorite products or companies, but not adults. He is complaining that a for-profit company in a capitalist market isoperating under a normal supply and demand business model. Just because we, and I include myself as former NIKE employee and an avid shoe collector, arepassionate about NIKE products, the situation doesn't change. In the interest of self preservation, all businesses must protect the bottom line. Iprefer NIKE to other similar companies, but I don't have any illusions regarding their (or any other company's) priorities. Admittedly, NIKE is one ofthe best at creating emotional bonds to inanimate objects (products). That's why they are the global leader in their industry.

And to LABanger, no - I don't think most people know how much it costs to manufacture a NIKE shoe. Because most people fail to factor inCOGS (cost of goods sold) such as research and development, marketing, advertising, endorsement contracts, and so on. I worked for NIKE for several years andI can only give you a ballpark estimate.

 

[labanger]

Not to be facetious CWK. But can you please enlighten us or me with the cost of the shoe while considering COGS (cost of goods sold) such as research anddevelopment, marketing, advertising, endorsement contracts, and so on. Just a ruff estimate will do. I did not take into consideration all the thingsinvolved in the price of a sneaker.
[h1]
[/h1]

 

[slg]

To those of you who have some form of critical analysis towards if you agree with boy cotting a company that is getting over on you than I appreciate yourresponses. But to those who are on the attack against my argument is for you. I realize most of you have not been here in some form for almost ten years andyou may not have the attachment with your shoes that some of us do. The shoes used to be the best like the man who they are supposed to represent. If I oranyone wants to craft an argument on how we can get change which is better quality shoes than we have the right. If you don't care as much say it and moveon but there are some especially on this board who are as angry as I am with the direction of Jordan Brand. Although my post count is in the 160's I've been browsing this sight for nearly ten years and I have seen what the older collectors mean when something changes and most leave commenting. AllI'm doing is starting a discussion to let people know we are always stronger together than we are apart. Also if you would dare judge me in any wayintellectually based upon the merits of may argument that's fine but don't let the spelling or grammatical errors fool you because I'm passionateabout this and my logic is not misguided. I know MLK would not be going for $310.00 packs or even probabaly $100.00 or S80.00 snaeakers but this is not aboutthe literal its about the perspective of the oppressed people (shoe buyers). If you have been buying the current crop of retroes versus the older ones you arebeing shafted and if you want to just take it shut up and like it but some of us are not. Maybe when you get over 100 pairs of shoes and you see the qualitychange but your LOVE doesn't than you come holler at me. I love Jordan's just as much as anyone but I absolutely hate what Gentry has done and I'mnot going to let anyone tell me it's pointless because it is not.

 

[cwk]

LABanger -
Each model is different, but usually hundreds of thousands of dollars are invested in the creation and promotion of a shoe. For every shoe made after theoriginal production run, the costs decrease because the lasts, molds and designs already exist (like the Cotez for example).

SLG - Please stop writing "boy cotting" IT'S ONE WORD - BOYCOTTING. Your spelling and grammar are taking away from your message.

Shoe buyers aren't "opressed". Shoe buyers are free to purchase (or not purchase) whatever they choose. That's the beauty of capitalism. You vote with your dollar - and boycotts can be an effective tool in the right circumstances. Jesse Jackson helped P.U.S.H boycott NIKE and was veryeffective (although he was wearing Cole-Haan shoes when he met with Phil Knight).

To my knowledge, retro releases aren't worse, they're just different - slightly different colorways, materials, etc... I honestly haven't heardabout quality issues as far as construction or durability. Most of what I read on NT are complaints about appearances.

I'm in my late 30's now, and I've collected NIKE footwear for twenty years. I was a NIKE employee for several years. I collected over 150 pairsof player exclusives. I love shoes as much as anyone here. Of course I would like NIKE to use the exact materials, dyes, and components from the 80's and90's. Most of the time that's logistically impossible.

 

[hustlinflip]

it wouldn't matter if NT were to boycott their products.
Check&Mate.


Nike would be making money either way.

 

[sneakermessiah]

did he mention mlk and a jordan pack in the same sentence?

If you dont like the shoes dont buy them simple as that.

 

[kingk777]

Mass boycotting of the Jordan Brand is highly unlikely.
It would be like organzing a Polo Ralph Lauren freeze-out.
Not going to happen my friends.

 

[nonsense08]

COSIGN^^^ its not gana happen dude...

 

[solefulone]

I think you are asking for lowers prices. On one hand you are saying that the prices are headed for a $1000+, but you use the Countdown packs as reference. Let's take the 13/10 pack for example. The original retail for the 10's I believe was $130. The retail for the 13's was $150. The pack retailedfor $310. Both shoes were release 10+ years ago. From a business standpoint there are several things to consider. If your argument is the tech is old butthe price went up, you have cost related to manufacturing. I can't imagine that the factories overseas keep the equipment from footwear made 10 years agojust in case Nike wants to retro. That means that if they retro an older style they have to build new equipment. I don't know this for sure but its aguess at best. Then you look at packaging and logistics, you have a larger box to hold 2 pairs instead of 1. To ship these you need larger cases. Largercases cost more to ship. Thats the cost of doing business.

The most important thing to consider is supply and demand. Lets say you have several employers that want to hire you. There aren't many other candidatesthat match your qualifications. Therefore prosepective employers will pay more to have you work for them. For the most part these employers provide anequally great work environments performing the same or similar job. Would you take the the job that offers you most money or the least amount of money?

Nike has a responsibility to its shareholders to stay profitable. In order for any business to stay profitable they have to balance supply and demand. Thedifference in price between buying the 13's and 10's when they first came out and with the pack 10+ years later is $30. A slight increase but worth itto many collectors who may have missed them originally. I won't even go into inflation.

The bottom line is this. If they are too expensive or you don't think the price is fair then you have a choice not to buy them. I didn't buy thepack. I just got a pair of XX2's on sale from Finishline because I didn't think $175 was a fair price when they would probably go down after a year. When the 13's originally came out in 98' I bought every color in the Mids and Lows. (Even the Chutney's) I was like 19 then. I can't do thatnow, my life is different. I struggle to get 1 new model every year because it is not a priority. Retro's forget about it. But i don't blameNike/Jordan Brand for not making them affordable. Its my fault for not making enough money to be able to afford them.

You can't boycott something that is a luxury item. Martin Luther King Jr and others boycotted human rights, things that we were owed as human beings. Freedom is not a luxury it is a right. Please do not use that as an example to make your point.

Air Jordans are a luxury item. If you cannot afford them change your financial situation. I can't afford them anymore because I would rather keep mybills paid on time. So I moved on.

On a side note: I have been visiting NT since 99 but I don't post that often or had a login since then. But when you made a reference to MLK boycotts andboycotting Jordan I had to respond!

 

[rathaunique]

I completely agree with boycotting products to send a message to Nike. That is why I've boycotted all Retro +s and combo packs these past few years. Asmuch as I love the black toe 1's and the carmine VI's, I'm boycotting these products because Nike's just using them as a gimmick to maximizetheir profits. They all know collectors will camp out and fork over extra money for gems like the Camine VI's, but they also know we could care less aboutthe XVIIs or the blk/yellow I's. By combining both shoes together, it's like they're blackmailing us into buying wack Retro +s just to get classicslike the Carmine VI's. Think about it. Would you buy the black suede XVIIs or the blk/yellow AJ Is by themselves? Most true collectors wouldn't becausethey're not originals.

 

[slg]

Thank you for the responses but I believe my analogy is one of the best. (CWK, and Soulfulone I enjoyed your posts but do not agree. )I've said manytimes before I am not trying to use the MLK reference literally just figuratively. I have also said that I don't expect you all right now to mobilize andboycott but I realize that the only way you can get a company's attention is through economic means. I also understand that benign neglect is also ineffect so some of you are willing to just accept the future. I just want people to have the thought process of what if they did pass on something what wouldbe the response. ... I know that we can make a difference but it starts with the individual pure and simple. Some might say I'm old and grumpy(27) but Iremember high quality retro's with Nike Air on the back at the same cost the shoes were sold at when originally produced. Also I do know how to spell andwrite correctly but when I'm passionate about a topic I type the same way and every one still is able to understand what I mean. If you have been readingme throughout I brought this up for discussion and I'm pleased because too much non critical analysis is given to Nike/JB and we should know the only waythey hear us is through the dollars.

 

[kingk777]

Let's just keep it the same,
Kudos to the Republican party

 

[mr delorean]

Originally Posted by solefulone

Nike has a responsibility to its shareholders to stay profitable.

thats 100% correct. money talks. it just rubs me the wrong way when they lie to the long-time loyal buyers by saying the brand is doing what theyre doingas a favor to us.

 

[khadafi252]

no need to boycott. just stop buying. you can create a revolution if you do it the right way. but spewing nike hate on a board full of nike heads isn'tgoing to help your cause. i do feel you though, so no diss on your post here. i work for them and how i give the company the finger at times, is just notbuying the product... and my discount is excellent, but i still dont buy the stuff. sometimes for the same reasons as above, or dropping 5 prs of sneakers onone day. i don't know how people collect AND pay retail these days.

 

[jfktv]

I understand where you're comin' from SLG, but tryin' to boycott would be a waste of time and energy. There's still people across thenation...better yet, there's still people across the world who are goin' to buy the products JB will come out with, and they'll make their moneyeither way. If you feel as if the quality went down for some shoes, and you're dissatisfied, then why would you still buy the shoes? Sometimes, it feelslike it's a necessity, I know, but if you really don't care for the shoes that much anymore, then just stop buyin' them. It should be that simple,nobody is forcin' you to buy their shoes, except yourself.

In this Capitalist country we live in, they'll win all the time. Sad to say, but true at the same time.