GOAT Talk

Hopping from super team to super team? Those bum-*** Cavs who had a 4-23 record in the 27 games LeBron missed between 2014 and 2018 and 1-5 record in the 6 games he missed in the 2015-16 championship season were a "Super Team"?...

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If "hopping from super team to super team" is the easy path, answer me where are the following rings:

Kevin Durant's Nets ring
Kevin Durant's Suns ring
Kevin Durant's Rockets ring
Kawhi's Clippers ring
Harden's Rockets ring
Harden's Nets ring
Harden's Sixers ring
Harden's Clippers ring
Kyrie's Celtics ring
Kyrie's Nets ring
Kyrie's Mavs ring
...and many more.

Where all these easily won rings at? The ONLY time it worked was when Kevin Durant stacked himself on top of a team with a 73-9 record, effectively creating the most stacked team ever.
Meanwhile LeBron joining a Cavs team in 2014 whose 2nd and 3rd best players Kyrie Irving and Kevin Love had never played in the playoffs, and joining the Brandon Ingram-Lonzo Ball Lakers in 2018 was the easy path? And he still won on every team he's been on, the only player in history to be a perfect 3-3, although he will probably ruin this now by going to some other team.

A way more secure path to a championship is actually having a competent management that trades and drafts the right players and builds a solid foundation, like the Bulls did when they got Pippen, albeit they were helped by the moron Sonics management who effectively traded Pippen for Olden Polynice. Meanwhile, the very best that bum-*** Cavs management did for LeBron in a span of 7 seasons is to get him Mo Williams, a bum who became a journeyman bench warmer for the remainder of his sorry-*** career as soon as LeBron left his bum-***.

The problem with the 2000s Cavs young LeBron is that he was way too good for his own good, unlike young Jordan who was incapable of that. LeBron always took those crappy roster Cavs on deep playoff runs including the finals in 2007, even though it was obvious they weren't good enough to win a chip. In retrospect the best thing that could've happened to LeBron in those early Cavs years was to get injured and miss a season so that the Cavs would have a high draft pick, like the pick Spurs recently got when Wemby missed half of a season.
 
Hopping from super team to super team? Those bum-*** Cavs who had a 4-23 record in the 27 games LeBron missed between 2014 and 2018 and 1-5 record in the 6 games he missed in the 2015-16 championship season were a "Super Team"?...

giphy.gif


If "hopping from super team to super team" is the easy path, answer me where are the following rings:

Kevin Durant's Nets ring
Kevin Durant's Suns ring
Kevin Durant's Rockets ring
Kawhi's Clippers ring
Harden's Rockets ring
Harden's Nets ring
Harden's Sixers ring
Harden's Clippers ring
Kyrie's Celtics ring
Kyrie's Nets ring
Kyrie's Mavs ring
...and many more.

Where all these easily won rings at? The ONLY time it worked was when Kevin Durant stacked himself on top of a team with a 73-9 record, effectively creating the most stacked team ever.
Meanwhile LeBron joining a Cavs team in 2014 whose 2nd and 3rd best players Kyrie Irving and Kevin Love had never played in the playoffs, and joining the Brandon Ingram-Lonzo Ball Lakers in 2018 was the easy path? And he still won on every team he's been on, the only player in history to be a perfect 3-3, although he will probably ruin this now by going to some other team.

A way more secure path to a championship is actually having a competent management that trades and drafts the right players and builds a solid foundation, like the Bulls did when they got Pippen, albeit they were helped by the moron Sonics management who effectively traded Pippen for Olden Polynice. Meanwhile, the very best that bum-*** Cavs management did for LeBron in a span of 7 seasons is to get him Mo Williams, a bum who became a journeyman bench warmer for the remainder of his sorry-*** career as soon as LeBron left his bum-***.

The problem with the 2000s Cavs young LeBron is that he was way too good for his own good, unlike young Jordan who was incapable of that. LeBron always took those crappy roster Cavs on deep playoff runs including the finals in 2007, even though it was obvious they weren't good enough to win a chip. In retrospect the best thing that could've happened to LeBron in those early Cavs years was to get injured and miss a season so that the Cavs would have a high draft pick, like the pick Spurs recently got when Wemby missed half of a season.
What year were you born or did you watch MJ in real time in ALL HIS PLAYING YEARS from 1984-1998?

Tell the truth.
 
LeBron making it to the finals 8 straight years and even carrying the cavs team for a good portion of that and winning one is impressive.

Too bad they don’t give any awards for that
:lol:
 


The Heat wouldn't have even made those finals had LeBron not bailed Wade's pathetic performance in the 2011 eastern conference finals, where Wade averaged 18.8 ppg on .405 shooting, 6.4 rpg and 2.2 apg. Meanwhile LeBron averaged 17.8 ppg on .478 shooting, 7.2 rpg and 6.8 apg in the 2011 finals, numbers that are way better than that. Some other amazing performances from Wade:

- 15.2 ppg on .438 shooting, 3.8 rpg and 2.6 apg in the 2014 finals - LeBron's 2011 finals was a masterpiece compared to this atrocity against humanity performance
- 15.9 ppg on .457 shooting, 4.6 rpg & 4.8 apg throughout the entire 2013 playoffs - Only Hakeem Olajuwon and Tim Duncan had lower ppg 2nd leading scorer in a championship playoff run in the modern era. Another example of a LeBron "Super Team", next to those 4-23 record having without him 2014-2018 Cavs. :lol:

By the way, speaking of 2011 Finals, I love how some people here mention those finals to criticize LeBron and spew out manure like "Kobe was better than LeBron" or "How can LeBron be better than Mike when he's not even better than Kobe?" when that same Mavericks team that beat the Heat in 2011 SWEPT Kobe's Lakers earler in those playoffs with Kobe averaging numbers that were overall worse than LeBron's 2011 finals stats.

sweep.png
 
The Heat wouldn't have even made those finals had LeBron not bailed Wade's pathetic performance in the 2011 eastern conference finals, where Wade averaged 18.8 ppg on .405 shooting, 6.4 rpg and 2.2 apg. Meanwhile LeBron averaged 17.8 ppg on .478 shooting, 7.2 rpg and 6.8 apg in the 2011 finals, numbers that are way better than that. Some other amazing performances from Wade:
But he did and then proceeded to choke in the finals.

What ifs are not strong arguments
 
Which explains the constant gushing over Kyrie.


Players did the same for AI last generation.
 
LeBron's eastern conference was so bad that the Heat went from 4 straight finals to missing the playoffs as soon as he left in 2014, and the Cavs went from 4 straight finals to missing the playoffs as soon as he left in 2018. If the eastern conference was so bad, then what does it say about his bum teammates on those teams, who couldn't even make the playoffs, let alone finals in the east without LeBron?

And LeBron still beat the WESTERN conference champions 3 times - all 3 teams who are better than any team Jordan beat in a playoff series.
 
leavemeglazzies leavemeglazzies

Lebron Averaged 17ppg in his prime, in a finals he was favored in, after being up 2-1. Including a game with 8 points.

That is never happening to Michael Jordan.

Take your emotion out of it. For a player of Brons caliber, that is a huge stain. And when it comes to differentiating players at the literal top of the game, stuff like that matters.

The revisionist history and going back and calling people bums is what y’all are doing. Is not the same as what actually happened.

This is why the convo is so frustrating to have with Lebron fans. It’s like, they aren’t even basketball fans :lol. DCAllAfrican DCAllAfrican

Do you see what I’m talking about MIKE LOWERY MIKE LOWERY ?
 
While I don't agree, he brings up a salient point for these mythical being MJ people.

Which leads to my biggest issue with these discussions:


Whenever people discuss MJ (and now Kobe) historically, it's always about what they have done.

When it's Bron, it becomes what he hasn't done.

It's disingenuous.


Yes, 2011 is obviously a mark on Bron's career. Likely the biggest one. But it's not like he hasn't won 4 since then and average 30 in em.


Bron gives Dwayne Casey credit for the zone during the 2011 finals, but I think it was something else going on, in particular Bron and Wade bumping heads.
 
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leavemeglazzies leavemeglazzies

Lebron Averaged 17ppg in his prime, in a finals he was favored in, after being up 2-1. Including a game with 8 points.

That is never happening to Michael Jordan.

Take your emotion out of it. For a player of Brons caliber, that is a huge stain. And when it comes to differentiating players at the literal top of the game, stuff like that matters.

The revisionist history and going back and calling people bums is what y’all are doing. Is not the same as what actually happened.

This is why the convo is so frustrating to have with Lebron fans. It’s like, they aren’t even basketball fans :lol. DCAllAfrican DCAllAfrican

Do you see what I’m talking about MIKE LOWERY MIKE LOWERY ?
Half these dudes never even saw young prime ‘85-‘93 Jordan play in real time or they were 5 yrs old when MJ won his second three-peat and all they can do is watch YouTube highlights and base their opinion on highlight reels.

Can’t blame them when LeBron is all they know
 
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While I don't agree, he brings up a salient point for these mythical being MJ people.

Which leads to my biggest issue with these discussions:


Whenever people discuss MJ (and now Kobe) historically, it's always about what they have done.

When it's Bron, it becomes what he hasn't done.

It's disingenuous.
Nah man, we know what Bron HAS DONE.

It was already dissected 6 yrs ago with this video that calls out the truth and nothing but, and it still applies today even with Bron’s 4 championships and accumulated stats due to his longevity.



Every time I’ve posted this video on NT, NOBODY has refuted any of the facts in the video because those who know, know. Those who don’t know continue to be in denial.
 
Nah man, we know what Bron HAS DONE.

It was already dissected 6 yrs ago with this video that calls out the truth and nothing but, and it still applies today even with Bron’s 4 championships and accumulated stats due to his longevity.



Every time I’ve posted this video on NT, NOBODY has refuted any of the facts in the video because those who know, know. Those who don’t know continue to be in denial.

Because nobody is sitting through a 30+ min video with a no objectivity… You keep using the stats don’t matter argument and it’s not helping you.
 
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leavemeglazzies leavemeglazzies

Lebron Averaged 17ppg in his prime, in a finals he was favored in, after being up 2-1. Including a game with 8 points.

That is never happening to Michael Jordan.

Take your emotion out of it. For a player of Brons caliber, that is a huge stain. And when it comes to differentiating players at the literal top of the game, stuff like that matters.

The revisionist history and going back and calling people bums is what y’all are doing. Is not the same as what actually happened.

This is why the convo is so frustrating to have with Lebron fans. It’s like, they aren’t even basketball fans :lol. DCAllAfrican DCAllAfrican

Do you see what I’m talking about MIKE LOWERY MIKE LOWERY ?dd
 
“The characteristics of a GOAT” goes far beyond individual statistics racked up over 23 years of playing.



 
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