Handchecking? NBA

[tony3di]

I was reading something a little earlier about handchecking in the NBA, & would like to know what are you guys feelings on it? good or bad for the game?

I personally understand the reason for eliminating handchecking because the game has evolved, players have gotten a whole lot better, and more vertical that it slowed the pace of the game down entirely too much to the point where basketball wasn't nearly as entertaining (late 90's)

So you take away handchecking to open up the game, i think its better for the game, keeps the best players on the floor longer

any thoughts?

 

[vietstar]

Definitely. It's frustrating to watch games with so many pauses because of chippy and soft fouls being called - really messes up the flow of the game for both the players and fans.

 

[shoeking2101]

IMO it sounds good to say "Man the Defense in the League getting soft, they took away handchecking" etc., but it's good that they did.

It's not a real basketball play, and it is definitely a foul. Anybody who has really played ball and tried going to the basket understands what I mean. If someone is riding your hip, and using his hands/forearms to stay in front of you and slow you down, that's illegal, and a foul.

Use your feet, get your chest in front of the ball instead of using your hands, forearms, etc.

My two cents.

 

[brandon3000]

Definitely. It's frustrating to watch games with so many pauses because of chippy and soft fouls being called - really messes up the flow of the game for both the players and fans.

i agree

 

[truthgetsbusy]

IMO it sounds good to say "Man the Defense in the League getting soft, they took away handchecking" etc., but it's good that they did.
It's not a real basketball play, and it is definitely a foul. Anybody who has really played ball and tried going to the basket understands what I mean. If someone is riding your hip, and using his hands/forearms to stay in front of you and slow you down, that's illegal, and a foul.
Use your feet, get your chest in front of the ball instead of using your hands, forearms, etc.
My two cents.

Agreed. Plus scoring sells tickets.

 

[vietstar]

IMO it sounds good to say "Man the Defense in the League getting soft, they took away handchecking" etc., but it's good that they did.
It's not a real basketball play, and it is definitely a foul. Anybody who has really played ball and tried going to the basket understands what I mean. If someone is riding your hip, and using his hands/forearms to stay in front of you and slow you down, that's illegal, and a foul.
Use your feet, get your chest in front of the ball instead of using your hands, forearms, etc.
My two cents.

Understandable. I drive all the time and a push to any body part can throw you off. But it's difficult and annoying to watch games when fouls are being called possessions after possessions, and then having to watch players shoot x amount of free throws. With the rules being "softer," or the better word would be "stricter," now than ever before, it gives the players the idea to "act" and flop to get the fouls called since they know they'll put the refs in a position to have to call the foul. Idk man, this turns away a lot of viewers and it's not for the better for the NBA.

 

[mgrand15]

They have 3 choices - call it tight on the perimeter, call it tight in the paint or do neither.

They tried to let everything go with the new age zones and defenses - it led to teams like Detroit holding teams under 80 ppg CONSISTENTLY. With all the athletes nowadays, psuedo-zone defenses, and really good coaching - if you don't call some fouls, scoring becomes nearly impossible. I love defense and basketball but no one wants to watch a 74-70 grind it out game on a regular basis.

I'd rather they let stuff go in the paint versus hand checks. If you let these monster athletes hand check plus let teams zone up, getting into the paint becomes real tough. At least this way, getting into the paint is possible, scoring after the initial drive just becomes harder. I'm cool with how it is now.

I would like them to make that restricted area bigger though. I'm tired of dudes just sliding in the last second and the refs giving them the call JUST because they're outside the restricted area. If the offensive player is out of control or pushing off, it should be a charge. If he's just trying to score and the defensive player is in position, then the refs need to let them play on regardless of contact.

 

[nycknicks105]

For you people agreeing to keep the hand check away never really saw real defense. As some of you guys have said, players have gotten stronger and faster. You can do so much, but a bigger, stronger player will always blow by their defender. The hand check would kind of "balance" the power the offense or evolution of offense in the NBA.

Watch older NBA video and you'll see how the hand check never really slowed the game down. All it really did was prevent easy baskets in the paint. Really interested to see how players like LeBron, Kobe, and Durant would fair if hand checking was allowed. They'd def get hurt more often though.

Long story short, when the NBA outlawed hand checking they allowed zone defenses. Guess it's a give and take I suppose.

What the NBA needs to do is modify how the charging call is called.

 

[tony3di]

My question now is why do people swear the game was so much better when there was handchecking, I played ball back in high school, so I have my extreme non biased almost "disrespectful" thoughts about a lot of things... these old school guys where supposedly so good then why where there box scores so high? and don't say its because of shooting, I watch espn classic, and i seriously feel players shoot the ball a lot better now than they did then, I like hearing peoples thoughts, I argue with folks just about everyday on why I feel Lebron & even Kobe is/was better than Jordan

 

[tony3di]

For you people agreeing to keep the hand check away never really saw real defense. As some of you guys have said, players have gotten stronger and faster. You can do so much, but a bigger, stronger player will always blow by their defender. The hand check would kind of "balance" the power the offense or evolution of offense in the NBA.
Watch older NBA video and you'll see how the hand check never really slowed the game down. All it really did was prevent easy baskets in the paint. Really interested to see how players like LeBron, Kobe, and Durant would fair if hand checking was allowed. They'd def get hurt more often though.
Long story short, when the NBA outlawed hand checking they allowed zone defenses. Guess it's a give and take I suppose.
What the NBA needs to do is modify how the charging call is called.

I understand what you are saying, but the scoring in the league started getting extra tight and low due to the games evolution, which is why they got rid of handchecking in the first place, people didn't want to watch 74-72 grudge matches, the NBA allows zones, but not really its more of match up zones due to the fact the big man can't camp out in the key

 

[6 Rings G.O.A.T.]

Hand check rule was create to allow more points..

 

[vanexellent]

IMO...since the NBA doesnt allow Hand Checking then they need to enforce dribbling violations(carrying, discontinued dribbles), traveling and moving screens. Give back the Hand Check and get rid of zones and the legal double teams.

 

[datznasty]

If you think the NBA doesn't call enough moving screens, then don't watch the olympics.

 

[vanexellent]

If you think the NBA doesn't call enough moving screens, then don't watch the olympics.

I actually like the Olympic style of letting moving screens go along with the contact they allow the defenders get away with. Just as long as its called consistent and isnt like that last USA vs Spain exhibition where the Refs were terrible.

 

[nychiphophippo]

How the **** do u like moving screens

 

[dmbrhs]

My question now is why do people swear the game was so much better when there was handchecking, I played ball back in high school, so I have my extreme non biased almost "disrespectful" thoughts about a lot of things... these old school guys where supposedly so good then why where there box scores so high? and don't say its because of shooting, I watch espn classic, and i seriously feel players shoot the ball a lot better now than they did then, I like hearing peoples thoughts, I argue with folks just about everyday on why I feel Lebron & even Kobe is/was better than Jordan

In regards to those high box scores, remember in the '80s, teams were averaging 15 to 20 more possessions per game than the league average now. It creates the illusion that there were more misses, just because of the sheer volume of shots going up. Think of it like every team in the league playing the 7 Seconds or Less Suns offense. If all teams played at that pace today, you'd see scores in the 110s to 120s regularly. In 1986, the lowest scoring team averaged 98 PPG. In 2011, that's a little below average. Big difference.

As far as the league shooting better today, it depends on what eras are you're comparing. If you're talking about the '80s, then it's just not true. League-wide FG% was consistently in the 48-49% range until the late '80s, when mass expansion diluted the league. Percentages dropped gradually, then like a rock after Toronto and Vancouver came along. The league average in 1998 was 44%, and that wasn't even rock bottom! '99 (lockout) and '04 (the year they finally abolished hand checking) were both under 44%.

I know that's just a basic stat, but it's very telling. People really underestimate the effects of expansion. It made for some pretty ugly basketball, and the league really didn't recover until the last half decade, or so. A lot of factors have played a role in the recovery, but if you look at it overall, the league is at its best point in 20 years. So yeah, you're right, but it's not because of any one factor.

 

[shoeking2101]

So, in essence, the people that are pro handchecking...are you guys saying that it's okay to ride someone and put one's hands and forearms on people's hips to stop them from getting to the basket?

The reasoning as to why the league started calling handchecking fouls is irrelevant to imo, the point of it all which is that it's a foul. Plain and simple. The fact that handchecking was allowed in the 80's and 90's does not change the fact that that isn't a basketball play.

Zone defense in the league is fine to me, it doesn't do much. I mean, with the defensive 3 second rule in play, it negates it to a large degree. (A rule that I HATE btw. Makes no sense to allow zone, then make a defensive 3 second rule ) Besides, if you watch the Bulls, Knicks, and A BUNCH of other teams in the 90's, they were zoning up illegally anyway so it's no real difference imo. (You're not watching if you don't believe teams were zoning back then.)

 

[dipsetgeneral]

I personally don't like it. Should be only able to put your forearm/hand on the player in the post. Not on the perimeter. And people wit' the ball can't use their arm to fend off defenders, that's cheating!

 

[shoeking2101]

You dont believe that statement. We are talking about WORLD CLASS athletes. They should be able to play defense without fouling their opponent so much. The fact of the matter is that there are too many players that are defensive liabilities now a days. The fundamentals of defense are not being preached to young kids anymore. Gary Payton was selected to 8 additional All-Defensive teams after hand checking was taken away.

EXACTLY MY POINT. You are a world class athlete, if you have to reach, and ride, and hold, and push, etc. to keep up with the offensive player, that's the problem, not that they are calling it. Truth be told, people cry about handchecking being called when if you really watch it, they don't call it nearly as much as it actually occurs in a game.

 

[michael415]

eh, i have more of a problem with moving screens, charges/blocking calls and FLOPS. 

i was taught by all my coaches. YOU PLAY DEFENSE WITH YOUR FEET NOT WITH YOUR HANDS. Stop reaching.

 

[pharelfor3]

I wish they would bring it back. some of these dudes look extra soft in the olympics becaus eof it. I love when a dude says stop fouling me in pickup ball because of a handcheck

 

[yeold360s]

How the **** do u like moving screens

Word.  Had me scratching my head like "huh?"

 

[vanexellent]

How the **** do u like moving screens

I should of clarified that I like that moving screens are not as strictly called...the screener allowed to move his feet somewhat or allowed to turn into the defender a bit. Still being set but allowed to clear off defenders like Perkins or KG do and get away with (well except this last post season for KG).

 

[willzway26]

Handchecking to me is like in football when the defender puts his forearms to chuck a receiver after 5 yards.  Its the same kinda situation when you use your hands to overcompensate getting beat with your feet.  They took it out of football, take it out of basketball too.  You are damn near hitting someone when you do that, which makes it all the more a foul.