let this thread die (NYK)

[blackmagnus514]

Originally Posted by MrONegative

Originally Posted by Mez 0ne

Nobody wanted to gut the team man, everyone was complaining when we gave up both of our SG's and wanted to at least keep Gallo.

Donnie did more positives than we had for a decade and we had a nice foundation, and did not want to give up too much for Melo...because you know what? If that trade did not go through, he would have gone with an alternative or waited until the off-season

Dolan just sabotaged the franchise yet again, I can't give that scumbag my money.

all of this.

I remember all the non-Knick fans running in on some, "what are you guys #%#*#-ing about?! You got Melo for some scrubs and picks. He was going to NJ, bros."

and Jorts

Dude was becoming my favorite Knick...

This 

 

[mronegative]

Originally Posted by ATGD7154xBBxMZ

If that was really Dolan pushing that then Donnie is a punk $%* {[]}.

I think you mean professional. Donnie was only there for a few gotdamn weeks when Dolan stomped on his toes.

...and forced to make the Melo trade?

If that's the case Donnie was just collecting a check.
Why you think he's gone?? Find anyone in or around the NBA who didn't think he did a great job fixing the Knicks. So %+@$@%@ disrespectful the way Dolan did him.

If that's how it is then we're really waiting until Dolan is dead

 

[seymore cake]

Originally Posted by blackmagnus514

Originally Posted by MrONegative

Originally Posted by Mez 0ne

Nobody wanted to gut the team man, everyone was complaining when we gave up both of our SG's and wanted to at least keep Gallo.

Donnie did more positives than we had for a decade and we had a nice foundation, and did not want to give up too much for Melo...because you know what? If that trade did not go through, he would have gone with an alternative or waited until the off-season

Dolan just sabotaged the franchise yet again, I can't give that scumbag my money.

all of this.

I remember all the non-Knick fans running in on some, "what are you guys #%#*#-ing about?! You got Melo for some scrubs and picks. He was going to NJ, bros."

and Jorts

Dude was becoming my favorite Knick...

This 

I don't believe I ever said that... I distinctly remember saying this made you guys more predictable and easier to beat because you wouldn't play 4 perimeter players (shooters) and only Amare in the paint thus people would be able to help more since they weren't so spread out chasing all the shooters.  In addition to losing a lot of versatility on the defensive end with Wilson. Yep. That was my stance.

But serious question... If you guys had to point to one moment that lead you guys down this path what would it be... like one key decision that started this downward spiral?

 

[pmatic]

 

[mronegative]

like one key decision that started this downward spiral?


[h1][/h1]

[h1][/h1]Monday, August 29, 1994
Business Digest
[h1]Madison Square Garden Sold By Viacom To ITT, Cablevision[/h1]
Seattle Times News Services

NEW YORK - Cablevision Systems Inc. and ITT Corp. have announced they will buy Madison Square Garden, the New York Knicks, the New York Rangers and related assets from Viacom Inc. for $1.075 billion.

The sale had been reported in the works for days.

Viacom chairman Sumner Redstone said the company was unloading the landmark sports arena to cut his company's debt from the acquisition earlier this year of Paramount Communications Inc.

 

[|A-Man|]

Originally Posted by Mez 0ne

Originally Posted by ATGD7154xBBxMZ

I do not believe Pringles was not Donnie's choice for coach. If that was really Dolan pushing that then Donnie is a punk $%* {[]}. You mean to tell me he got forced to hire D'Antoni and forced to make the Melo trade? If that's the case I'm not mad at Dolan I'm mad at Donnie for being a !$%*$. I don't want a GM making moves for our team that lets the owner mess with his plans for the team any time he feels like it. If that's the case Donnie was just collecting a check.

Really? You tell me what GM in the history of ANYTHING over-rides the owner of a team and lasts more than a week.
What kind of business establishment has a hired employee over-ride what his boss/owner WANTS?

You know what happens in that case? Termination.

Son if he can't execute his plan without it getting messed with he should've never took the job. That's something he should've made clear when he was hired and if Dolan lied he should've quit immediately like I said before. Dolan pushes through the trade sending away all of our players. That's what everybody saying right? That's what everyone believes to be what went down so instead of standing by the trade and claiming it was your call to make he should've distanced himself from it. Donnie doesn't do that though, he stands by it and then dips. What the %#!% is that?

We're not talking about an owner who doesn't want to spend too much money and tells the GM not to offer the max or too much to a player or an owner stepping in to say they don't want a player on a team. We're talking about an owner who you guys are saying not only picked the coach but then went on after losing seasons to sabotage the team by sending all of their assets in one trade for one star just so he could make back money and raise prices. Dolan has had a reputation for years now, Donnie should've known what he was coming in to and had dude agree to boundaries. Instead we get the same bull shh where it's Dolan driving out a coach or GM when things don't work out. We can't do anything about the owner. If we lose for the next decade he won't leave unless he wants to or dies. So I'm saying why can't someone who wants to work for this organization have the testicular fortitude needed to draw the line and tell the owner NO when he's wrong about something. Why couldn't Donnie just say fall back and let me cook?

If we don't get someone like that who wants the job, we will the get the same guys who mean well and end up getting fired for failing or leaving after failing all the while getting paid millions for it. I mean so what if they get fired for sticking to what they feel will make the team better? If they get fired for trying to do what they feel is right leave the building with your head held high. Donnie got the nerve to say he gonna finish what he started and then straight up vanishes leaving us in a crappy state. What's the difference?

But hey if this just gonna boil back to Dolan, not Pringles or management like I said before might as well stop watching Knicks games til he dead. Cuz what you'll just have to realize is Dolan isn't looking for us to win he just wants to make his money back.

 

[mez 0ne]

Son if he can't execute his plan without it getting messed with he should've never took the job. That's something he should've made clear when he was hired and if Dolan lied he should've quit immediately like I said before

You really think that's how business works bruh?

 

[you go boy]

i would still do the trade again.... the only thing i would change about the trade is not giving up so many players and i can agree with you guys on that... but gallo is a streaky shooter and as good as he is i rather have melo... and lets just say we kept our team the way it is and not trade for melo can you imagine how much damage amare was going to take? it obviously showed in the post season... dude carried the team on his back and it wore on him during the season... it was obvious we needed a center to help him out and we got chandler but it also affected his offensive game but it was also a sign that we needed a second star to help carry the load which turned out to be melo... so if we kept the team last year as is we would just have amare and can you imagine if he got injured for a long period of time the team would be a wrap... i dont know about you but when amare sat out last year for a game or 2 i was worried the knicks would lose... i hated giving up gallo and felton and i love wilson but he was gone anyway if he we would have signed melo instead of trade for him...

 

[mr marcus]

Team before melo was better ...melo just ain't it

 

[ill steelo]

I could be wrong but I thought Melo was going to sign an extension with whichever team he was on after the trade deadline because he didn't want to sign after the lockout since everyone thought the owners were going to hammer the players in negotiations and the contracts would be much less lucrative.

 

[seymore cake]

Originally Posted by MrONegative

like one key decision that started this downward spiral?

[h1][/h1]

[h1][/h1]Monday, August 29, 1994
Business Digest
[h1]Madison Square Garden Sold By Viacom To ITT, Cablevision[/h1]
Seattle Times News Services

NEW YORK - Cablevision Systems Inc. and ITT Corp. have announced they will buy Madison Square Garden, the New York Knicks, the New York Rangers and related assets from Viacom Inc. for $1.075 billion.

The sale had been reported in the works for days.

Viacom chairman Sumner Redstone said the company was unloading the landmark sports arena to cut his company's debt from the acquisition earlier this year of Paramount Communications Inc.





That's Dolan's company?

 

[upptempo8387]

Am I tripping or does Amar'e have gold teeth now? I was watching the post game show and I could have sworn this dude had a gold grill in his mouth

 

[|A-Man|]

Originally Posted by Mez 0ne

Son if he can't execute his plan without it getting messed with he should've never took the job. That's something he should've made clear when he was hired and if Dolan lied he should've quit immediately like I said before

You really think that's how business works bruh?

Donnie's trying to get the job. He tells him he has a plan that'll lead the team to success. All he has to add in is if you let me do what I do we'll be in a much better place in X amount of years. Now if Dolan forced a D'Antoni hire then Donnie's plan was +$%#@@ up from then on. He failed in getting LeBron (lets not hope Donnie ever said he would get us LeBron) and so when the trade deadline draws near Dolan forces the Melo trade after feeling Donnie does not have any better backup plan or that he was not assuring that the Melo trade would go down. I'm not saying Dolan is not a problem but if he is the main problem and source we should just assume any GM or coach is another one of his yes men if we're not going to get ppl in the organization who are going to be made able to do their jobs undisturbed.

If it's strictly do what Dolan says no matter what then why should I feel sorry for any of these guys who end up leaving? Why take the job then?

 

[tim teufel]

I liked this team better when stat was the main guy. I thought bringing melo would actually make stat better lulz boy was I wrong

 

[xbiker47]

Am I the only one who hasnt given up all hope yet?

Didnt we start 2-9 last year and people were screaming for Dantoni's head then we went on to win a bunch of games in a row?

 

[mronegative]

his dad's company cake

you go boy wrote:

---

i would still do the trade again.... the only thing i would change about the trade is not giving up so many players

so...you're saying you wouldn't do the trade that happened...

Donnie started talks with just Wilson and a pick (from trading AR) as his offer. Dude was calling their bluff.

Until Dolan kicked him out of the convo and bid against himself before he folded. They wanted at least Gallo, Chandler and picks. We gave them everything we could. They didn't want Fields cuz they had Afflalo, didn't take back Curry's expiring, got to dump Chompsy's contract and even +++@*#$ at the last minute that they'd back out if we didn't throw in Mozgov.

The trade was the worst case scenario where we still got Melo.



I'm holding out hope that Baron will be a better coach on the floor than anyone on our sidelines. 3 days to the Beard?

 

[cyber smoke]

It's the new goggles . Them $#@! is wack b

 

[|A-Man|]

Originally Posted by xbiker47

Am I the only one who hasnt given up all hope yet?

Didnt we start 2-9 last year and people were screaming for Dantoni's head then we went on to win a bunch of games in a row?

I haven't given up hope yet either. We played well in the first half despite Melo and STAT not shooting great. Fields and Shump stepped up today. I'm just fed up how we play on offense when it comes to Melo and STAT.

If we had won in regulation I was gonna say it was no different than the Boston win where we forget what got us the lead and rely on Melo to bail us out even when he's shooting badly. When OT started and it looked like we were gonna win I wanted Melo to foul out so we could start giving the ball to STAT.

Originally Posted by Cyber Smoke

It's the new goggles . Them $#@! is wack b

I was thinking that and those extra "20 pounds of muscle/growing to 6'11''" that is messing up his shot

 

[gregzzy23]

Originally Posted by MrONegative

like one key decision that started this downward spiral?

[h1][/h1]

[h1][/h1]Monday, August 29, 1994
Business Digest
[h1]Madison Square Garden Sold By Viacom To ITT, Cablevision[/h1]
Seattle Times News Services

NEW YORK - Cablevision Systems Inc. and ITT Corp. have announced they will buy Madison Square Garden, the New York Knicks, the New York Rangers and related assets from Viacom Inc. for $1.075 billion.

The sale had been reported in the works for days.

Viacom chairman Sumner Redstone said the company was unloading the landmark sports arena to cut his company's debt from the acquisition earlier this year of Paramount Communications Inc.





I know it was 1994 but thats a hell of a steal. MSG and 2 sports teams for a billie. The Knicks alone been worth moreDude who called Donnie a %@#*@ for letting Dolan pick the coach and for the Melo fiasco is an idiot. Dude who said Donnie was just being a pro is 100% right. We all know Dolan pulled the trigger on the melo deal and Donnie could've easily exposed him but he stuck with the bs story that they were in total agreement. Because hes a professional and was employed UNDER Dolan. Imagine how upset he was Dolan completely undermined him and I've yet to see a quote from him admitting it.

 

[upptempo8387]

Originally Posted by xbiker47

Am I the only one who hasnt given up all hope yet?

Didnt we start 2-9 last year and people were screaming for Dantoni's head then we went on to win a bunch of games in a row?

They were 3-8 and were on a 7 game losing streak before their first W..And a lot of those losses were to bad teams..Here are the teams they lost to: Timberwolves, Rockets, Wizards, 76ers (before they made that 2nd half of the season surge) Bucks, Warriors, and Nuggets. Only team out of those that was good early last year was the Nuggets. Then they went on to win 13 of their next 14.



I'm not tripping though..I hate to compare 2 teams that aren't even in the same sport, but look at the NY Giants..They ended the season with a pretty bad 2nd half of the season record..But they ended the season on a good note beating a division rival twice within 3 weeks. Then once the playoffs started, they had a dominant 1st round game that gave them the momentum which led to them beating a team many people considered the best in the league. Obviously that is easier in the NFL since you just have to win 1 game as opposed to 4 in the NBA Playoffs, but why can't the Knicks do the same? Let them come together once the entire team is on the court and we'll be able to judge better.



It's funny how people said "Felton?

He's supposed to be our savior at PG?" But now that dude is gone, everyone wants him back..And now people are saying the same about Baron.."So our entire offensive success is resting on Davis? 

" Yeah, it is..And there's absolutely nothing wrong with that..Stop letting the haters affect your judgment.

 

[|A-Man|]

Originally Posted by gregzzy23

Originally Posted by MrONegative

like one key decision that started this downward spiral?

[h1][/h1]

[h1][/h1]Monday, August 29, 1994
Business Digest
[h1]Madison Square Garden Sold By Viacom To ITT, Cablevision[/h1]
Seattle Times News Services

NEW YORK - Cablevision Systems Inc. and ITT Corp. have announced they will buy Madison Square Garden, the New York Knicks, the New York Rangers and related assets from Viacom Inc. for $1.075 billion.

The sale had been reported in the works for days.

Viacom chairman Sumner Redstone said the company was unloading the landmark sports arena to cut his company's debt from the acquisition earlier this year of Paramount Communications Inc.

I know it was 1994 but thats a hell of a steal. MSG and 2 sports teams for a billie. The Knicks alone been worth moreDude who called Donnie a %@#*@ for letting Dolan pick the coach and for the Melo fiasco is an idiot. Dude who said Donnie was just being a pro is 100% right. We all know Dolan pulled the trigger on the melo deal and Donnie could've easily exposed him but he stuck with the bs story that they were in total agreement. Because hes a professional and was employed UNDER Dolan. Imagine how upset he was Dolan completely undermined him and I've yet to see a quote from him admitting it.
I can't feel sorry for a person that takes that route. Call it being professional but I'd rather he kept his word. I'm not going to imagine how upset he was. He should've spoke up and let us know.

That's the main thing yall are missing the more heat put on Dolan would be a good thing if Donnie spoke up but if dudes just want to fade out of the situation and become a footnote you're just enabling Dolan to keep doing the same bs he's been doing.

 

[you go boy]

im saying i would still do the trade but holdout trading gallo and felton... i was never a fan of trading either one... but at 1 point i did feel that if we failed to land the trade it would be a bad look so i was like whatever it takes get the deal done get it done... but after seeing how things turned out i dont regret getting melo at all but instead regret giving up so many players... its not like melo is garbage and not worth it but the trade in general effected our depth on the team

 

[big j 33]

Bad playcalling + star player who is not a natural playmaker + little confidence in the role players = the Knicks struggles

 

[upptempo8387]

^ To be fair, if he passed that shot off and Landry missed, people (not you) would say he should have taken the shot bc that's what he gets paid big money for. I've seen LeBron pass up horrible shots in the clutch to get the ball to a teammate with a better shot, and when they miss it becomes "LeBron scared to take the important shots" and he gets crucified by the media. And that's a guy that statistically doesn't shoot well with the game on the line so imagine what the media would do to Melo if he was passing up game winners to role players that ended up missing. I agree that role players should be trusted to hit important shots if they're wide open, but there's a large number of people that don't agree

 

[tommykairaa]

wait what happen to jorts huh