NT I'M TAKING PRAYER REQUESTS VOL. OMNITHEISM

Originally Posted by Wooly Willy

Originally Posted by AntonLaVey

Originally Posted by Mo Matik

You know what fam you right, Noah did fit all those animals in the ark. I'm a look for the simplest answer to all of life's mysteries from now on. Carry on.


If you understand the Abrahamic faiths for what they claim to be, you would know that Muslims believe that all Abrahamic faiths are 1, and Islam is the last and final testament.

If one were to examine the story of Noah in the Qur'an, it would make more sense because there are no scientific impossibilities mentioned. And if one were to examine where the Qur'an says where the ark is, and where they found the ark in '94, I would imagine it would cause one to think.

http://www.fatwa-online.com/aboutislaam/0020101.htm

Consider for a moment that you don't know as much as you think you do. Consider for a moment that not all religious people are making a constant effort to illogically make sense of the world. Hopefully it will give you reason to examine the very institutions you love to criticize a little more closely.
You know what you right.....I'm converting to Islam tomorrow. I just shuffled a bunch of religions  and pulled yours out of a hat. You win.

  
Honestly Anton, you really seem like a nice dude even though you get a lot of hate on here for making threads like this but I noticed that whenever you and lobotomybeats are confronted by a logical argument from a religious person (*GASP*) both of you always break down into fits of sarcasm (and meaningless insults in the case of lobotomybeats
laugh.gif
). Defense mechanism perhaps? I mean it's clear that you want to spark debate through your threads which is a beautiful thing but why always avoid the serious answers?




Even tho I think dude linking me to a picture of the ark is an insult to my intelligence. I've answered the question already with my "Crazy charismatic prophet scenario". Noah could have existed, Noah may have built an ark....it is unlikely he fit two of every species into said ark. I feel stupid as hell talking about this.

BDW I believe Jesus existed......these so-called prophets emerge all the time with cults. We're sensible enough in present time to dismiss them because the "correct" religions have already been established.


Sry about the sarcasm, I'll try to watch that. Bad habit.
 
Originally Posted by SplashySplash

I'm curious bro....I can understand not really believing in organized religion (though I do)...but do you really not believe that their is a higher power?...A God??
Anton's maintained and repeated a # of times that he's an agnostic.
 
Originally Posted by SplashySplash

I'm curious bro....I can understand not really believing in organized religion (though I do)...but do you really not believe that their is a higher power?...A God??
Anton's maintained and repeated a # of times that he's an agnostic.
 
Originally Posted by AntonLaVey

Originally Posted by Wooly Willy

Originally Posted by AntonLaVey

Originally Posted by Mo Matik

You know what fam you right, Noah did fit all those animals in the ark. I'm a look for the simplest answer to all of life's mysteries from now on. Carry on.


If you understand the Abrahamic faiths for what they claim to be, you would know that Muslims believe that all Abrahamic faiths are 1, and Islam is the last and final testament.

If one were to examine the story of Noah in the Qur'an, it would make more sense because there are no scientific impossibilities mentioned. And if one were to examine where the Qur'an says where the ark is, and where they found the ark in '94, I would imagine it would cause one to think.

http://www.fatwa-online.com/aboutislaam/0020101.htm

Consider for a moment that you don't know as much as you think you do. Consider for a moment that not all religious people are making a constant effort to illogically make sense of the world. Hopefully it will give you reason to examine the very institutions you love to criticize a little more closely.
You know what you right.....I'm converting to Islam tomorrow. I just shuffled a bunch of religions  and pulled yours out of a hat. You win.

  
Honestly Anton, you really seem like a nice dude even though you get a lot of hate on here for making threads like this but I noticed that whenever you and lobotomybeats are confronted by a logical argument from a religious person (*GASP*) both of you always break down into fits of sarcasm (and meaningless insults in the case of lobotomybeats
laugh.gif
). Defense mechanism perhaps? I mean it's clear that you want to spark debate through your threads which is a beautiful thing but why always avoid the serious answers?


Even tho I think dude linking me to a picture of the ark is an insult to my intelligence. I've answered the question already with my "Crazy charismatic prophet scenario". Noah could have existed, Noah may have built an ark....it is unlikely he fit two of every species into said ark. I feel stupid as hell talking about this.

BDW I believe Jesus existed......these so-called prophets emerge all the time with cults. We're sensible enough in present time to dismiss them because the "correct" religions have already been established.


Sry about the sarcasm, I'll try to watch that. Bad habit.
The website article is a directly from the Guardian, a secular newspaper established in the UK in 1821. 

http://www.guardian.co.uk...mation/0,,711853,00.html

I'm sorry you found it so offensive.  And like I said, he didn't fit 2 of every species into the ark (Islamically speaking).

I wish this issue wasn't so difficult to discuss.  Both sides are often unwilling to enter open discussion, possibly exposing our weak convictions, and our fears of losing them.  This topic really doesn't have to be so polarized.
 
Originally Posted by AntonLaVey

Originally Posted by Wooly Willy

Originally Posted by AntonLaVey

Originally Posted by Mo Matik

You know what fam you right, Noah did fit all those animals in the ark. I'm a look for the simplest answer to all of life's mysteries from now on. Carry on.


If you understand the Abrahamic faiths for what they claim to be, you would know that Muslims believe that all Abrahamic faiths are 1, and Islam is the last and final testament.

If one were to examine the story of Noah in the Qur'an, it would make more sense because there are no scientific impossibilities mentioned. And if one were to examine where the Qur'an says where the ark is, and where they found the ark in '94, I would imagine it would cause one to think.

http://www.fatwa-online.com/aboutislaam/0020101.htm

Consider for a moment that you don't know as much as you think you do. Consider for a moment that not all religious people are making a constant effort to illogically make sense of the world. Hopefully it will give you reason to examine the very institutions you love to criticize a little more closely.
You know what you right.....I'm converting to Islam tomorrow. I just shuffled a bunch of religions  and pulled yours out of a hat. You win.

  
Honestly Anton, you really seem like a nice dude even though you get a lot of hate on here for making threads like this but I noticed that whenever you and lobotomybeats are confronted by a logical argument from a religious person (*GASP*) both of you always break down into fits of sarcasm (and meaningless insults in the case of lobotomybeats
laugh.gif
). Defense mechanism perhaps? I mean it's clear that you want to spark debate through your threads which is a beautiful thing but why always avoid the serious answers?


Even tho I think dude linking me to a picture of the ark is an insult to my intelligence. I've answered the question already with my "Crazy charismatic prophet scenario". Noah could have existed, Noah may have built an ark....it is unlikely he fit two of every species into said ark. I feel stupid as hell talking about this.

BDW I believe Jesus existed......these so-called prophets emerge all the time with cults. We're sensible enough in present time to dismiss them because the "correct" religions have already been established.


Sry about the sarcasm, I'll try to watch that. Bad habit.
The website article is a directly from the Guardian, a secular newspaper established in the UK in 1821. 

http://www.guardian.co.uk...mation/0,,711853,00.html

I'm sorry you found it so offensive.  And like I said, he didn't fit 2 of every species into the ark (Islamically speaking).

I wish this issue wasn't so difficult to discuss.  Both sides are often unwilling to enter open discussion, possibly exposing our weak convictions, and our fears of losing them.  This topic really doesn't have to be so polarized.
 
^^^^Then educate me what did he say in Islam. And why is the Islamic story more credible than the Judeochristian version?

No insecurities here, it's just hard for me to humor folktales/ myths but I will try for the sake of "debate".


What are your thoughts on what I said about prophets? If I'm gonna look into your Noah's ark story, you should be open to the idea that prophets may be a farce.
 
^^^^Then educate me what did he say in Islam. And why is the Islamic story more credible than the Judeochristian version?

No insecurities here, it's just hard for me to humor folktales/ myths but I will try for the sake of "debate".


What are your thoughts on what I said about prophets? If I'm gonna look into your Noah's ark story, you should be open to the idea that prophets may be a farce.
 
Originally Posted by IM A HELION

Fam, just pray for me. I leave for Army basic tomorrow. Thanks in advance.
I prayed for your safety, for courage and mental/physical discipline. Good luck my dude. I'm thinking about the military after school, we'll see.
    
 
Originally Posted by IM A HELION

Fam, just pray for me. I leave for Army basic tomorrow. Thanks in advance.
I prayed for your safety, for courage and mental/physical discipline. Good luck my dude. I'm thinking about the military after school, we'll see.
    
 
Originally Posted by AntonLaVey

^^^^Then educate me what did he say in Islam. And why is the Islamic story more credible than the Judeochristian version?

No insecurities here, it's just hard for me to humor folktales/ myths but I will try for the sake of "debate".


What are your thoughts on what I said about prophets? If I'm gonna look into your Noah's ark story, you should be open to the idea that prophets may be a farce.
I didn't mean to say you personally, I just feel like it's a safe generalization to make when describing both theists and atheists/agnostics.

As for the Quranic version of the story of Noah, there are important differences to make take note of.  Wikipedia does a surprisingly good job summing it up.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Noah's_Ark#In_Islam
Noah (Nuh) is one of the five principal prophets of Islam. References are scattered through the Qur'an, with the fullest account in surah Hud (11:27–51). As a prophet, Noah preached to his people, but with little success; only "a few"[sup][11:40][/sup]of them converted (traditionally thought to be seventy). Noah prayedfor deliverance, and God told him to build a ship in preparation forthe flood. A son(named either 'Kan'an' or 'Yam' depending on the source) was amongthose drowned, despite Noah pleading with him to leave the disbelieversand join him (Surah Hud, 42-43).

In the Qur'an itself, there is no explicit indication that the floodwas worldwide, only that it destroyed all the unbelievers among Noah'speople.[sup][16][/sup] Some Muslim authorities have nevertheless adopted the Judeo-Christian view that the flood was global.[sup][who?][/sup]


[sup][/sup]

As far as why it's more credible, the main gripes I hear are that:
a- a worldwide flood is impossible
b- 2 of every species on a boat is impossible

Neither of these are mentioned in the Islamic version.

There is this concept you might be familiar with called pan-Babylonialism.  Because archaeologists anthropologists found ancient sources in modern Iraq describing a huge flood, many use that as an argument that the Abrahamic religions are simply continuations of ancient religions.  However, many also argue that a large flood would obviously garner much attention, enough to warrant multiple sources of the same event.  So depending on how one interprets that, it may or may not make the story more credible.

Then, as I mentioned earler, the fact that the location of the ark was given in the Qur'an 1400 years ago:

11:44
[font=Arial, Helvetica, sans-serif]{When the word went forth: "O earth! swallow up thy water and O sky! withhold (thy rain)!" and the water abated and the matter was ended. The Ark rested on Mount Judi and the word went forth: "Away with those who do wrong!"}[/font]

And that the ark was found in that location, confirms the plausibility of the story actually occurring.

How to make a prophet?

-Charismatic man smokes some hallucinagens or possibly suffers from a mental illness that gives him illusions of granduer.

-Man claims he's spoken to God and ventures out to find followers.

-Desperate/ possibly crazy group of people listen to man and consider him a prophet.


It still happens in this day and age, but we know better....see Jim Jones.

Isit at all possible that Noah was a little crazy, and built that ark to"fit two of every animal" and there was no flood. Crazy people do %%#like that all the time.
Undoubtedly it is a possibility, and even then, there are historic sources arguing that.

For example, Pagans who found fault with Muhammad (pbuh) called him one of two things (usually):
-mad
-a poet

But there are also reasons for believing otherwise.  Reasons that, in my opinion, far exceed the other side of the argument. 

I can post the most usual ones here:
-The coming of the Prophet Muhammad (pbuh) was foretold by Jesus (pbuh) and is available in the Bible
-Anyone who knows Arabic will argue that the level of Qur'anic Arabic is unrivaled by anything ever written
-The number of scientific evidences that are in the Qur'an
-The nature of Prophet Muhammad (pbuh).  The way he conducted himself.

[sup]http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Noah's_Ark#cite_note-16[/sup]
 
Originally Posted by AntonLaVey

^^^^Then educate me what did he say in Islam. And why is the Islamic story more credible than the Judeochristian version?

No insecurities here, it's just hard for me to humor folktales/ myths but I will try for the sake of "debate".


What are your thoughts on what I said about prophets? If I'm gonna look into your Noah's ark story, you should be open to the idea that prophets may be a farce.
I didn't mean to say you personally, I just feel like it's a safe generalization to make when describing both theists and atheists/agnostics.

As for the Quranic version of the story of Noah, there are important differences to make take note of.  Wikipedia does a surprisingly good job summing it up.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Noah's_Ark#In_Islam
Noah (Nuh) is one of the five principal prophets of Islam. References are scattered through the Qur'an, with the fullest account in surah Hud (11:27–51). As a prophet, Noah preached to his people, but with little success; only "a few"[sup][11:40][/sup]of them converted (traditionally thought to be seventy). Noah prayedfor deliverance, and God told him to build a ship in preparation forthe flood. A son(named either 'Kan'an' or 'Yam' depending on the source) was amongthose drowned, despite Noah pleading with him to leave the disbelieversand join him (Surah Hud, 42-43).

In the Qur'an itself, there is no explicit indication that the floodwas worldwide, only that it destroyed all the unbelievers among Noah'speople.[sup][16][/sup] Some Muslim authorities have nevertheless adopted the Judeo-Christian view that the flood was global.[sup][who?][/sup]


[sup][/sup]

As far as why it's more credible, the main gripes I hear are that:
a- a worldwide flood is impossible
b- 2 of every species on a boat is impossible

Neither of these are mentioned in the Islamic version.

There is this concept you might be familiar with called pan-Babylonialism.  Because archaeologists anthropologists found ancient sources in modern Iraq describing a huge flood, many use that as an argument that the Abrahamic religions are simply continuations of ancient religions.  However, many also argue that a large flood would obviously garner much attention, enough to warrant multiple sources of the same event.  So depending on how one interprets that, it may or may not make the story more credible.

Then, as I mentioned earler, the fact that the location of the ark was given in the Qur'an 1400 years ago:

11:44
[font=Arial, Helvetica, sans-serif]{When the word went forth: "O earth! swallow up thy water and O sky! withhold (thy rain)!" and the water abated and the matter was ended. The Ark rested on Mount Judi and the word went forth: "Away with those who do wrong!"}[/font]

And that the ark was found in that location, confirms the plausibility of the story actually occurring.

How to make a prophet?

-Charismatic man smokes some hallucinagens or possibly suffers from a mental illness that gives him illusions of granduer.

-Man claims he's spoken to God and ventures out to find followers.

-Desperate/ possibly crazy group of people listen to man and consider him a prophet.


It still happens in this day and age, but we know better....see Jim Jones.

Isit at all possible that Noah was a little crazy, and built that ark to"fit two of every animal" and there was no flood. Crazy people do %%#like that all the time.
Undoubtedly it is a possibility, and even then, there are historic sources arguing that.

For example, Pagans who found fault with Muhammad (pbuh) called him one of two things (usually):
-mad
-a poet

But there are also reasons for believing otherwise.  Reasons that, in my opinion, far exceed the other side of the argument. 

I can post the most usual ones here:
-The coming of the Prophet Muhammad (pbuh) was foretold by Jesus (pbuh) and is available in the Bible
-Anyone who knows Arabic will argue that the level of Qur'anic Arabic is unrivaled by anything ever written
-The number of scientific evidences that are in the Qur'an
-The nature of Prophet Muhammad (pbuh).  The way he conducted himself.

[sup]http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Noah's_Ark#cite_note-16[/sup]
 
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