***THE 2011 NFL QUARTERBACK THREAD*** (QBRs through week 9 pg. 16)

[dland24]

Its just tough because I have watched every play of the Niners season (and most plays multiple times as I typically watch our games twice), and I just cant help but think that what Alex is doing could be duplicated by almost every QB in the NFL. He takes no chances, he fits no throws into tight windows, he chooses high percentage passes over any other pass regardless of the situation, etc.

Dont get me wrong, I am THRILLED that it has worked so far. Its just when your defense develops into the top D in the league, and our ST is in the top 3-5, your expectations change. I just cant help but feel we are at a severe disadvantage in the playoffs due to our QB.

 

[CP1708]

Watch this......

Trent Dilfer = Alex Smith
Ray Lewis = Patrick Willis
Jamal Lewis = Frank Gore
Shannon Sharpe = Vernon Davis


You literally, are the 2000 Ravens.  And that is not a knock at all.  You guys are damn near identical.  The only thing that has changed, is the era.  The passing game now is far beyond what it was in 2000.  So being the 2000 Ravens does not guarantee a SB.  But you'll be in the hunt, and that's all you can ask for.  But in all liklihood, you're going to face Drew Brees and the Saints at home your first game.  MAJOR test that is.  Survive it, and you get to go on the road and face Aaron Rodgers and the Packers.  The Ravens didn't face 2 offenses like that I don't believe.  They won some nice games, they earned their bowl, but I don't remember them beating two teams like this.  So it will be tough. 

 

[dland24]

Originally Posted by CP1708

Watch this......

Trent Dilfer = Alex Smith
Ray Lewis = Patrick Willis
Jamal Lewis = Frank Gore
Shannon Sharpe = Vernon Davis


You literally, are the 2000 Ravens.  And that is not a knock at all.  You guys are damn near identical.  The only thing that has changed, is the era.  The passing game now is far beyond what it was in 2000.  So being the 2000 Ravens does not guarantee a SB.  But you'll be in the hunt, and that's all you can ask for.  But in all liklihood, you're going to face Drew Brees and the Saints at home your first game.  MAJOR test that is.  Survive it, and you get to go on the road and face Aaron Rodgers and the Packers.  The Ravens didn't face 2 offenses like that I don't believe.  They won some nice games, they earned their bowl, but I don't remember them beating two teams like this.  So it will be tough. 

I would equate Alex Smith to Brad Johnson more than Trent Dilfer, but I agree with the point of this message.

 

[dmxfury]

I like how SF built their team, unfortunate that doesn't equate to championing like it used to. Honestly out of the NFC I'm probably pulling for SF even though it'd give them six

 

[shaunhillftw49]

Originally Posted by CP1708

Tim Tebow >>>>> Mark Sanchez. 

No joke. 

Huge joke.

Michael Vick – ...What was so impressive to me (last year) was his decision making in and out of the pocket, which went along with his pocket presence, and his consistent pinpoint accuracy... Given it was only one year, I’m hesitant to put Vick in the elite quarterback category (athlete, yes), but I think this year he plays himself into that top tier. ...offensive line struggled in the preseason, but they’ll figure it out...If healthy, Vick will once again have huge all around numbers.

Vick is elite(*%$). O-line never figured it out and Vick didn't stay healthy. The final stretch of games to the season proved what they could do, but it needs to be done over the whole season for Vick to be Top 5.


Turnover mania. Bad contract

 

[CP1708]

No, no joke.  Give Tebow the same weapons.  Give him Plax, Holmes, LT, Greene, Keller, a big o line (though they weren't great this year) and let's see Tebow figure out how to work that club a LOT better than Maria. 

Flip it.  Give Sanchize Royal, Thomas, some other dudes I never heard of, and McGahee and what does Sanchez do?  Throw interceptions to defensive lineman some more. 

No, not joking, Tebow > Sanchez. 

There are 32 starting QB's in the NFL, Pick 6 is #33.  Not sure how that's possible, but he sucks that much. 

 

[aztec06jr]

Originally Posted by CP1708

Watch this......

Trent Dilfer = Alex Smith
Ray Lewis = Patrick Willis
Jamal Lewis = Frank Gore
Shannon Sharpe = Vernon Davis


You literally, are the 2000 Ravens.  And that is not a knock at all.  You guys are damn near identical.  The only thing that has changed, is the era.  The passing game now is far beyond what it was in 2000.  So being the 2000 Ravens does not guarantee a SB.  But you'll be in the hunt, and that's all you can ask for.  But in all liklihood, you're going to face Drew Brees and the Saints at home your first game.  MAJOR test that is.  Survive it, and you get to go on the road and face Aaron Rodgers and the Packers.  The Ravens didn't face 2 offenses like that I don't believe.  They won some nice games, they earned their bowl, but I don't remember them beating two teams like this.  So it will be tough. 

To add on to this, from another forum:
[table][tr][td]I was reading about our #1 defense in terms of points allowed, and I got to thinking about what the chances of an actual Superbowl win this year was with a stingy defense that stops the run, doesn't allow points, and runs a safe offense with a successful game manager at QB. I naturally went to the 2000 Baltimore Ravens. I then started to try and compare the seasons, and found some interesting stuff of the "history repeating itself" level: 

2000 Baltimore Ravens in context: 

-Led league in points allowed 
-#1 run defense (60.6 per game) 
-Had been on the cusp of being a good defense for a couple years 
-Led on defense by a young former first round middle linebacker wearing #52 (Ray Lewis) in his 5th year and already a perennial pro-bowler and all-pro. 
-Lots of turnover on D, including along the defensive line at nose tackle, and still remained the #1 run defense, though weren't #1 in passing or total yardage. 
-Led on offense by a former early first round pick who never really became the franchise player (Trent Dilfer) and had a third round rookie quarterback (Chris Redman) sitting on the bench. 
-Power run focused game featuring 1300+ yard back (Jamal Lewis), and perfectly complimented by a young 5'9" speedy back (Priest Holmes). 
-Former Pro Bowl tight end in Shannon Sharpe 
-Former 2nd round pick with only one 1,000 yard receiving season who never caught on with his former teams in his 8th year (Qadry Ismail) and a team selected first rounder at WR (Travis Taylor) 
-Offensive line led by 5th year former first round left tackle (Jonathan Ogden), and second year left guard (Edwin Mulitalo). 


The Ravens franchise hadn't had a winning season or made the playoffs in 5 years (as the Browns). 

The successful city had been starved for a championship, where their last Superbowl winner (Baltimore Colts) had won their first (and only) Superbowl 30 years earlier. 

The team was down right terrible at first (4-12), but had managed to climb to relative mediocrity, routinely finishing with 6-10 to 8-8 records. 

In 2000, they suddenly started off hot (5-1), and ended up a surprise Playoff team at 12-4, where they won in the wildcard round at home, surprised the 13-3 Tennessee Titans, the previous year's AFC Champions, and the team with the best record in the NFL in the divisional round, on their way to winning the Superbowl, a surprise for a team with a quarterback nobody thought they would be able to win a Superbowl with, considering the previous 7 winners were all franchise quarterbacks, with one noted winner winning 3 in a 4-year span (Aikman), another winning his only Superbowl despite setting nearly every career passing record of note (Favre), one 2x winner (Elway), and a former first round pick with his second team (Young). 


2011 San Francisco 49ers in context: 

-Leads league in points allowed 
-#1 run defense (70.

 
-Had been on the cusp of being a good defense for a couple years 
-Led on defense by a young former first round middle linebacker wearing #52 (Patrick Willis) in his 5th year and already a perennial pro-bowler and all-pro. 
-Lots of turnover on D, including along the defensive line at nose tackle, and still on pace to be #1 run defense, though not #1 in passing or total yardage. 
-Led on offense by a former early first round pick who hasn't really became the franchise QB (Alex Smith/yet), and had a second round rookie quarterback (Colin Kaepernick) sitting on the bench. 
-Power run focused game featuring (on pace for) 1500+ yard back (Frank Gore), and perfectly complimented by a young 5'7" speedy back (Kendall Hunter). 
-Former Pro Bowl tight end in Vernon Davis 
-Former 1st round pick with only one 1,000 yard receiving season who never caught on with his former teams in his 7th year (Braylon Edwards) and a team selected first rounder at WR (Michael Crabtree) 
-Offensive line led by 5th year former first round left tackle (Joe Staley), and second year left guard (Mike Iupati). 


The 49ers franchise hasn't had a winning season or made the playoffs in 8 years. 

The successful city has been starved for a championship, where our last Superbowl winner was in 1994, and first (1981) was 30 years earlier (from 2011). 

This team was down right terrible at first (4-12), but has managed to climb to relative mediocrity, routinely finishing with 6-10 to 8-8 records. 

In 2011, we suddenly started off hot (7-1), and could easily end up a surprise Playoff team at 12-4, where we could likely play in the wildcard round at home, end up surprising a potential 13-3 Green Bay Packers, the previous year's NFC Champions in the divisional round, and the team who will most likely have the best record in the NFL, on our way to winning the Superbowl, a surprise for a team with a quarterback nobody thought we would be able to win a Superbowl with, considering the previous 8 winners were all franchise quarterbacks, with one noted winner winning 3 in a 4-year span (Brady), another winning his only Superbowl despite being on pace to have a possibility at breaking every passing record of note (Manning), one 2x winner (Roethlisberger), and a former second round pick with his second team (Brees).[/td][/tr][/table]

 

[IATT]

Originally Posted by ShaunHillFTW49

Turnover mania. Bad contract

you say this because of.......?


are/were you aware that the eagles are only on the hook for next year?

so it really was a 2 year 35.5 million dollar deal (of that amount, $32.5 million is fully guaranteed, and $3 million is guaranteed for injury only)... or a 5 year 80 million dollar deal if he were to reach the end of it (the 6th year that was worth 20 million HAS already been voided, since he played 35% or more of the snaps this year)  

so he received 20 mill this year.. and will receive 12.5 this upcoming year.. then there is $3 mill the eagles would be on the hook for if he was injured and they wanted to get rid of him

 

[fraij da 5 11]

Trent Dilfer went IN on Sanchez yesterday on the Herd... Talking about his work ethic being trash and how his release has gotten worse.

Dude pulled no punches, and hes mostly right.

 

[jet life tony]

Aaron GODgers >>>>>> *

That is all.

 

[crazy dav0]

Originally Posted by cRazy dav0

tom brady (no explanation needed)
peyton manning (hope it's not the last of my dude)
aaron rodgers (going to be an all timer)
drew brees (spreads the ball well, beast)
michael vick (vick 2.0 is a monster)
philip rivers (needs to get to a superbowl, kid has all the tools)

eli manning (solid, his superbowl ring places him this high though, known for bad turnovers but not to the level of a romo)
ben roth (winner/clutch, but he holds the ball way too long trying to make a play and also has a propensity to turnover the ball)
matt schaub (has the tools, defense needs to help him get into the playoffs, any climbing in this list may be temporary though)
joe flacco (needs to improve in a few areas, but overall solid and continues to improve ... i'll admit not entirely sold on him being TOP 10 ... but I'LL take him over others who still have more to prove


my top 10 ...

overrated matt ryan

underrated ryan fitzpatrick

breakout 2011 star ... matthew stafford

/kanye shrug

eli is now top 5 ... i've had him top 7 for a few years ... 
vick

@ me getting fooled off the one year 

rivers regrouped at the end of the year but he and eli have flip flopped 

never will understand what you guys see in matt ryan 

and how could you not see stafford breaking out like he did

 

 

[651akathepaul]

Eli is an interesting guy. In the regular season he fringes on the outside of top 5-10 because he's inconsistent, but like we saw a few years ago and from what we're seeing this season in the playoffs, he can be very dangerous and dangerously clutch. Quite an intriguing guy.

Regular season - top 10

Postseason - top 3 or 4

Overall? - TBD

 

[CP1708]

If Eli sticks with Nicks, Cruz and Manningham for a few years, his numbers are going to jump quite a bit. 

If they can add a TE that stretches the seams better than Ballard (and there are many coming into the league the next 2 years) he's going to really get crackin. 

And this is in a bad weather city, if that offense was in a dome half a season......

After the Super Bowl I'll list out that chart I had early in this thread with all the big timers playoff work. 

Brees 2 games this year. 

 


Alex Smith played the best game of his life to beat Brees.  I was REALLY impressed with his game.  I dunno if he can repeat it vs the Giants though, but same could be said for Eli vs the 9er D.  Either way, fun game to watch this week.  Much better than Brady v Flacco. 

Edit
On a scale Chester, if Brady need only go thru Tebow, Flacco and Alex Smith to get his 4th ring, talk to me about that. 

  I mean, what, no Mark Sanchez to stand in his way? 

  Would that be the absolute easiest QB matchup to get a ring ever?  Now, defensively, Denver, Balt, San Fran is no joke, Brady would have earned that @#$% but the matching QB's would be just putrid.  We NEED Eli to get there just to even it up a bit.  Although, of course I understand you bein a 9er you don't care about any of that horse @#$% you just want to get there and roll the dice.  Good luck to you guys. 

 

[curious24]

Originally Posted by blazinjkid

Rodgers/Brady
Brees/Rivers
Vick/Ryan/Big Ben/Romo
Freeman/Bradford/Stafford
Flacco/Cutler/Cassel
everybody else

what about eli manning lol?