The Minnesota Timberwolves Thread: Timberwolves, Anthony Bennett part ways

How though?

I mean all I keep hearing is words like this, yet no actual examples?

The Pek deal was popular at the time and a no brainer imo

His Drafts have been exceptional, although at the time I bashed the Burke deal he def won that one

Martin was Kahn's era no?

Turned Love into Wiggins

Drafted Lavine and Towns and Bazz literally all the pieces of value we own he brought in
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The things you note above are all general manager moves. If Saunders wants to do just that at this stage in his career more power to him. He does not, however, need to be minority owner, president/GM, and also head coach. I don't really think anyone could argue any differently to be honest, and in fact that is almost laughable - which it was nationally by the media when it happened.

I won't rehash all the "examples" here in order to save time, and I am also not sure how old you are or how long you have been following the Wolves, so that probably factors here. But Flip Saunders is really no different than most NBA lifers. They've been fired, hired, fired, hired, and so on. With a few ESPN television appearances in between. It's a good old boys club, but that's nothing new. He however hoodwinked a senile Glen Taylor into bringing him back to MN and giving him the most power of any person in the NBA - that is not going to fly with me as a close fan of this team since 1989.

Saunders' last teeny straw for me was pretending he ran a coaching search and couldn't find anyone so he just named himself coach.
 
Eh, but Dave Joerger would've been hired if he and Robert Pera hadn't made up. Aside from that you're right.

It's getting to the point where more and more coaches are the GM's, however. Budenholzer was just given those reigns a week ago after Danny Ferry was removed. Jason Kidd is Milwaukee's GM now, as John Hammond is essentially Milt Newton. It's moving that way.
 
Hey all, long time since I saw so much positivity to talk about this team. Love the direction, although 8 million for KG!!?? I love that dude but nah, not when Duncan is making less and better.

Flip as a coach has to go, and has to know he needs to go eventually, let him cook one more season but after that I'm gonna start asking questions.
 
Let's all sort of elaborate on WHY we have disdain for Saunders the head coach (Ry, yours has to be the longest by default :lol: ) Let's all stay completely away from any transactions or draft picks he's made as the GM.


The Pros


In his eight full seasons with the Timberwolves the first time around, and then three years with the Pistons, his teams averaged an eighth-place finish in offensive efficiency, via Basketball-Reference.com.

"If you look at my teams, I've had a point guard-oriented offense pretty much everywhere I've been," Saunders said after joining the Wizards in 2009, via Stein. "Myself and my point guard, we're usually joined at the hip."

Darren Wolfson @DWolfsonKSTP June 5, 2014
The Rubio camp is very excited w/ Flip. Had little interest in Joerger, a defensive-minded coach. Rubio contract talks begin soon. #twolves (the Rubio trade rumors are so dumb to me, there are so many signs that reveal

The last four seasons have been the only four seasons in franchise history that the Timberwolves, as a team, averaged fewer than 20 personal fouls per game - two of those are Saunders-coached teams.


The Cons

From Saunders first season to second season, the Timberwolves three-point attempt per game average as a team fell from 21.4 to 14.9. The Timberwolves only shot 0.9% worse as a team, which is no excuse for their attempts to decrease by 6.5 per game.

By the way, the team's point-per-game average in 2013-14, 106.9, was the highest in franchise history. Maybe Love's departure, Martin's inability to stay healthy, and Budinger muzzling whatever three-point acumen he had by not shooting when healthy, can be part of the explanation. But no, the coach needs to make that a priority no matter whose on the team, especially when the team's percentage only decreased by 0.9% from the year in which Love was in tow and Martin was healthy.

The Timberwolves last four seasons:

2011-12: 6th-most 3pt Att. in NBA
2012-13: 21st
2013-14: 16th
2014-15: 30th (last)

Kevin Martin had the most three-point attempts on the Timberwolves last season by a margin of 21. He played in 39 of the team's 82 games.

The three-point line doesn't disappear when your best three-point shooters are out due to injury. That has to be beaten into the team in the huddle, as there's ample data to back up a team's win percentage and the frequency of 3pt attempts. It's no damn secret that the four teams in the conference finals this year were top-4 in 3pt attempts.
 
Lets take a look at those rosters shall we?

11Jose BareaPG6-0175June 26, 19847Northeastern University

13Corey BrewerSF6-9185March 5, 19866University of Florida

10Chase BudingerSF6-7218May 22, 19884University of Arizona

33Dante CunninghamPF6-8230April 22, 19874Villanova University

5Gorgui DiengC6-11245January 18, 1990RUniversity of Louisville

6Robbie HummelSF6-8215March 8, 1989RPurdue University

Othyus JeffersG6-5200August 5, 19852Robert Morris University (IL)

42Kevin LovePF6-10260September 7, 19885University of California, Los Angeles

23Kevin MartinSG6-7185February 1, 19839Western Carolina University

12Luc Mbah a MoutePF6-8230September 9, 19865University of California, Los Angeles

15Shabazz MuhammadSG6-6225November 

14Nikola PekovicC6-11285January 3, 19863

22A.J. PriceSG6-2181October 7, 19864University of Connecticut

9Ricky RubioPG6-4180October 21, 1990

21Alexey ShvedSG6-6190December 16, 19881

32Ronny TuriafC6-10249January 13, 19838Gonzaga University

7Derrick WilliamsPF6-8241May 25, 19912University of Arizona

Love - out, Rubio-out, Budinger-Out

Who the heck supposed to be shooting 3's? Derrick Williams?

I am not going to judge his coaching until he has a decent roster 

I for one didn't want Thibs coming in and running wiggins into the ground MORE than Saunders has been doing. For the record I want him to go as a coach as well, I just don't hold him responsible for our problems that some of ya'll do. Kahn's moves are just now starting to leave this team, that dude sent us 8 years back SMH.

My issue with Saunders to prove ya'll I'm not Ryan posting in here is that he needs to assemble more 3 point shooters. Kevin Martin is still on this team because he is the only one who can shoot it consistently, and we just lost out on our second best shooter because we overpaid KG. I agree with Flips claims that he needs 3 point shooters to take them, but if he isn't going to draft them he has to sign them. 3 straight off seasons without getting one is unacceptable. 
 
The value of the three pointer is not lost when your players are lost to injuries.

No, I don't care who was on the team in any season. It doesn't matter. Is it better to have a volume of good three-point shooters? Of ******* course. But no matter who you have, over the course of an entire game (furthermore, a season), three-point field goal misses/makes still pay off more than playing inside 15 with those misses/makes. Stop playing those damn Thad-Gorgui-Pek lineups and get with the times, it's 2015 not 1978.
 
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Apples to apples the worst normal shot in basketball is from 18-22 feet in front of the 3-point line.

Flip Saunders' entire offensive philosophy is essentially based on that shot. No one is going to tell him differently, and why would they when he signs the same assistants at every stop.

Basketball Reference keeps track of all shots 16-22 feet so we will use that as a reference here. Here is where Flip's last 11 teams have ranked in that stat.

Percentage of Team's Shots 16-22 feet

2015-16 - 28th out of 30 (WOLVES)
2011-12 - 23rd out of 30 (WIZARDS)
2010-11 - 27th out of 30 (WIZARDS)
2009-10 - 29th out of 30 (WIZARDS)
2007-08 - 28th out of 30 (PISTONS)
2006-07 - 23rd out of 30 (PISTONS)
2005-06 - 19th out of 30 (PISTONS)
2004-05 - 25th out of 30 (WOLVES)
2003-04 - 28th out of 29 (WOLVES)
2002-03 - 29th out of 29 (WOLVES)
2001-02 - 26th out of 29 (WOLVES)

Saunders' roster talent and cities change but his philosophy does not no matter what he says now - it's interesting to see on paper.

That is but one nitpick about how outdated he is as a coach, but word has leaked out in the past about how sick players have gotten of Saunders in every stop he has been at. We've read the quotes. We saw the Wolves tuned him out so bad his first stint here that McHale was forced to fire him. You might say, well that was just Sam Cassel and pouting about his contract. But then he moves to Detroit and the players there quit on him, Dumars said he essentially had no choice but to make a move. He then moves to Washington and he was the joke of the league with their renegade players not listening to him from the day he walked in the door.

So.... I am not going to get excited to hear this guy is coming back to Minnesota to run and coach this team after 3 straight firings. He's simply a below-average coach, and that should not be our bar.

But for this I blame Glen Taylor.

So...you want to be a GM and evaluate talent? Fine. You want to also be coach again, while also having the same country club of assistant coaches back plus your own son? No sorry we've already been there and done that.
 
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95% of the coaches in this league don't matter anyway. It's a superstar driven league. And as far as I'm concerned, KG is the main influence, leader and coach of this team and I'll take that 9 times out of 10.
 
651akathePaul said:
95% of the coaches in this league don't matter anyway. It's a superstar driven league. And as far as I'm concerned, KG is the main influence, leader and coach of this team and I'll take that 9 times out of 10.
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well said.....

Lebron hated Spo and he's def a good coach....

Dwight got Stan Fired

Derron made Sloan (all time great) Say fuh dis shi
 
Jerry Zgoda @JerryZgoda 11m
Had NBA scout come up to me this week in Vegas after seeing Wolves & said, "they've got a little OKC-Golden State thing going on w/ them"
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Also, four former Timberwolves are playing for Team USA in the 2015 Pan-American Games that begin next week.

Left to right: Anthony Randolph, Ryan Hollins, Damien Wilkins, Bobby Brown


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95% of the coaches in this league don't matter anyway. It's a superstar driven league. And as far as I'm concerned, KG is the main influence, leader and coach of this team and I'll take that 9 times out of 10.
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This I agree with. And that's why we all said in here the key for this entire franchise is strictly whether they can get Wiggins to be a superstar. Everything else will fall in line. They are on the right path to that plus can now throw in KAT. It's as good a time here right now as we've had in over a decade and it's not even close. This winter is going to be entertaining.
 
651akathePaul said:
95% of the coaches in this league don't matter anyway. It's a superstar driven league. And as far as I'm concerned, KG is the main influence, leader and coach of this team and I'll take that 9 times out of 10.
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The 5% who do keep winning all the rings.

Coaches matter, when you get in the playoffs, and everyone has talent and the margins shrink coaches matter a ton.
 
via Grantland's Andrew Sharp: Karl-Anthony Towns: The Underrated No. 1 Draft Pick


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When he was in high school, he played in the shadow of Jahlil Okafor. In college, he was just one part of a Kentucky machine that was trying to go undefeated as coach John Calipari rotated players in hockey shifts. Before the draft, the basketball world was focused on DeMarcus Cousins trade rumors. For the past week at summer league, Kristaps Porzingis has been the cult hero, the mass of Lakers fans has made every D’Angelo Russell game feel like the NBA Finals, and Emmanuel Mudiay has been the star-in-the-making who’s had everyone buzzing.

So, at what point does no. 1 pick Karl-Anthony Towns become underrated?

I was watching the Wizards play the Suns on Saturday, and Alex Len was doing whatever he wanted against Washington’s band of cast-off veterans. Rebounds, putbacks, passes. Everything. Len would finish with 17 and eight, and it felt like he had most of that in the first half. I walked out in the second quarter and headed for Bulls-Wolves in the other gym.

I arrived right as Towns was destroying some helpless D-Leaguer’s layup. Then it was halftime, and I had to stay out of respect for that block alone. By the fourth quarter, I’d seen him make a few of the passes I’d heard people raving about. He opened the final quarter with an easy hook shot, then drained a face-up jumper. Towns didn’t have a good game — he finished 4-of-11 with nine points and nine rebounds — but it didn’t matter. I’d seen everything I needed to see.

Karl-Anthony Towns is going to be a monster in the NBA for the next 15 years. Reporters and fans may pay lip service to this idea, but we’ve been underselling it. Too many people talked about Towns like he was the “smart” pick for Minnesota, not the “holy ****, why would you ever take anyone else?” pick.

Everything clicked for me at that game, because I walked into the gym after watching Alex Len. For all the potential that Len has, he’s more like the centers we’ve been watching for the past 10 years. He’s awkward. He’s clunky. He’s not real strong. But he’s long, and if you’re looking for some scoring and rim protection, he’s plenty effective. Len will be good if he can stay healthy. Still, he’s one of maybe two dozen NBA big men who seem like they inherited 7-foot frames overnight and don’t know quite how to use them. Most of today’s centers have all the grace and poise of a guy wearing a suit that’s three sizes too big.

With Towns, everything fits. He moves like he’s been this size forever. We saw some of it at Kentucky, but in stripped-down summer league games you could really appreciate what we’re dealing with. Instead of straining to fit into a sport that’s now dominated by guys 6 inches shorter than him, Towns looks like a small-ball cheat code.

His shooting had been off until Wednesday night (when he went 7-of-9 for 20 points, 10 boards, and three blocks against the Blazers), and it’ll take time for him to blend face-up jumpers with post moves. And keep in mind that any time anyone says anything positive about the Wolves, you have to knock on wood and pray that Flip Saunders doesn’t ruin it somehow. But if you watch Towns, you see it.

This is what’s funny and a bit unfair about summer league — and basketball, and maybe life. You can watch Len, Marcus Smart, and Shabazz Napier dominate summer league. But then you see Towns make one play, and you realize those guys don’t have the same thing. That’s Towns. It’s unfair, but he’s just special. He’s quick enough to keep up with today’s game, but he’s big enough to remind you of the ’90s, and every few minutes he’ll make a jaw-dropping play look totally routine.

I don’t know exactly why big men stopped owning the NBA. It’s not just a stylistic thing. For whatever reason, the greatest athletes stopped being 7 feet tall and stronger than everybody. I grew up watching David Robinson, Hakeem Olajuwon, and Shaq. All of them were was as graceful as they were powerful, and they could take over games in 10 different ways. Since Tim Duncan and Kevin Garnett, we haven’t seen any real heirs to their throne. Today’s 7-footers look more like Dirk Nowitzki and Chris Bosh, or Kevin Durant, or some alien hybrid of all three (Anthony Davis). Other potential stars have been slowed by injuries (Greg Oden, Yao Ming), or attitude (Boogie), or everything (Darko).

“Where Killer Big Men Went Wrong” is a different piece, though. All I know is that any trip to Las Vegas is an exercise in sensory overload, and so is any trip to summer league. At the end of five days, everything is a blur, and the only thing I clearly remember is watching the rookie everyone’s forgotten to go crazy over.

I watched Karl-Anthony Towns defend, pass, turn in for easy hook shots, step into jumpers, and move like all of this is completely natural. At some point I started wondering, When was the last time we had an ***-kicking center who could just do everything?

Because it sure seems like that’s what’s coming in Minnesota.




via CBS Sports' James Herbert: Q&A: Towns Sr. says his son wants to make Wolves the new Warriors


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LAS VEGAS — Wearing a Minnesota Timberwolves hat as proudly as possible, Karl Towns Sr. sat in Section 113 of the Thomas & Mack Center and watched his son dominate. No. 1 overall draft pick Karl-Anthony Towns put up 20 points, 10 rebounds and three blocks on Wednesday against the Portland Trail Blazers, shooting 7-for-9 from the field and 6-for-6 from the free throw line. His passing was nice, too:

Towns Sr. watched the game with the focus of a scout and the passion of a fan. From a distance, you could hear him cheer each time his son taught Noah Vonleh a lesson. You could also hear him groan every time the Wolves gave up an offensive rebound. This is why he and his wife, Jacqueline, always sit in different parts of the arena.

After the final buzzer, Towns Sr. discussed what life is like for his family these days. The following Q&A is lightly edited for clarity and flow:

What do you want to tell Karl after watching a game like this?

I just want to tell him he played well. He did some stuff, you know, it's a process. I think that every game from the first one to now, he just got better and better, improving in different areas. I was very happy today with everything, especially with the six-foul rule in effect, that he stayed out of foul trouble. He played hard, he blocked shots. I think that every game, he just seems to get better and better, and I think as time goes on and when he gets to Minnesota, KG starts working with him, he'll be ready come October.

So you're excited to see him work with Kevin Garnett?

I am, I am. You got a Hall of Famer who's been in the league over 20 years who's going to take a young kid who's coming to the league and lead him and guide him toward possibly having the same success he had. So I'm very excited that he's able to come in and be with a veteran like KG and learn. ‘Cause right now, it's a learning process for him. He's a young kid. This is going to be great and KG is going to be a real inspiration and I think that KG's going to really steer him and guide him toward what he needs to do.

What's it been like to spend this time in Las Vegas with him at summer league?

It's been great to get a chance to spend time with my son. We did a lot of family stuff, my wife was here. And it's a chance just to be a part of the experience. For 19 years, I've been supporting him and taking him through this course along with Kentucky and, of course, with Minnesota now. So just to have time to relax and watch him play, sit up here like I do and analyze it, just watch him get better is a great moment for me.

What was draft night like?

If I had to put draft night into words, I'd have to say “surreal.” Because, just to see that, all the hard work and everything that we did over the course of 19 years, including Kentucky, it's rewarding to know that your son has fulfilled what he wanted to do, his dream. My dream was for my kid to go to college and get a free education, but to see that he was able to be athletic enough and good enough to make it to the NBA, it's a blessing. And you know what, I sit here as a proud parent because not everybody can go around saying, ‘My kid is in the NBA.' It's the smallest fraternity and it's the hardest fraternity to join, and to know that you were able to succeed and make it to this level is a joyous moment for me and my family.

Have you had conversations lately as a family reflecting on the journey he's been on?

You know, we sit down every night -- God is good -- and just are thankful for the fact that he's made it. We always talk, and we just are happy for him. As parents, not only is he a good athlete, he's a good kid, speaks well, carries himself well, and that means a lot to me. And he's smart, I mean he wants to be a doctor when it's all said and done after his NBA career. Just to know that all our kids, not just him, are on good paths, it's a rewarding time for us.

What's something that you want Timberwolves fans to know about him?

You're getting a kid that's dedicated to his teammates and takes his teammates before winning individual accomplishments. People don't understand, I'll say this: he wants to win and he's going to do whatever it takes to change and make this franchise better. His goal is to win an NBA championship. He came up two games short in the NCAA, so right now people need to know that he wants to help them build and become the next Golden State.

What's it been like to see people in Minnesota welcoming him like they have?

It just shows that people understand and appreciate what he brings to the table, and when they see him and you sit down, you talk to him, you get to know him, you see he's what Minnesota really, really needed. And that's why they drafted him, because not only is he a good athlete, he's a good person. And what people are seeing in Minnesota is he's as good as advertised in terms of his personality and how he carries himself.

What's next?

The next thing I'm looking forward to is going to Jersey and relaxing and getting in the right time zone [laughs]. You know what I'm looking forward to next? Just to see him improve, go back in the gym, work on all his talents and then just see where it goes from there.
 
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JPZx said:
http://insider.espn.go.com/nba/insi...mberwolves-guard-zach-lavine-more-just-dunker

Anybody? :nerd:
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As valuable as statistical analysis can be in the NBA, it's important to remember that numbers aren't randomly generated by a computer.

They're the product of humans playing on the court. To provide that context and understand the thinking behind the stats, ESPN Insider is sitting down with NBA players for Data Dialogues to discuss their games and their numbers.

Today, Minnesota Timberwolves guard Zach LaVine talks about how he improved during his rookie season, spending more time playing off the ball at shooting guard with the return of Ricky Rubio and addition of Tyus Jones, and how he's more than just a dunker.

1. Averaged 22.0 points per game in two games during the NBA Summer League in Las Vegas, ranking him second in scoring.

Kevin Pelton: What are you trying to get out of playing this week in Las Vegas?


Zach LaVine: I'm a basketball player. I love playing basketball. The coaches asked me if I wanted to play summer league, and I said, "Of course." Come out here and have a good time, show people what you've been working on this summer, and get back in the groove of playing full-court 5-on-5 with the refs and everything.

EDITOR'S PICKS

Pelton: Summer-league standouts in Las Vegas
Who's headlining in Sin City? Kevin Pelton breaks down the performances of noteworthy names on Day 5 at the Las Vegas Summer League.

Pelton: Data Dialogue with Dante Exum
Kevin Pelton talks to second-year Jazz point guard Dante Exum about his defense, usage rate, and adjustment to the NBA game.
Pelton: What have you been working on this summer?

LaVine: Pretty much everything. I've been getting stronger. Shot consistency. Working off the ball a little bit more than point guard, but still knowing that you have to play the point guard position as well. Mental game a little bit as well.

2. Played 79 percent of his minutes as a rookie at point guard, via NBA.com/Stats lineup data.

Pelton: What do you think about playing more shooting guard this season?

LaVine: It's cool. It makes me feel a little more comfortable, more leaning on what I can do. But I like having the ball in my hands as well at the point guard position. It's good to have the best of both worlds. I'm doing the best I can with it.

Pelton: What's the difference between the two positions for you?

LaVine: Off the ball, that's Zach LaVine time. That's embedded in me. You just go react -- score, create. It was my first time playing point guard since high school, pretty much. I can handle the ball and everything, but the different reads -- the NBA pick-and-roll is different -- mean you've got to think more. That's the main thing I was working on.

Pelton: The transition to the NBA is always difficult as a rookie. Did playing point guard add to that challenge?

LaVine: Yeah, but you just get it with experience. Learning on the fly and game experience helps you more than anything. I felt like the more I did it, the better I got at it. Toward the end of the year I felt a lot more comfortable.

3. Averaged 21.1 points, 6.6 assists and 5.8 rebounds per game in eight April games while posting a .567 true shooting percentage, all his best marks in any month.

Pelton: Was that why you were so effective late in the season?

LaVine: Definitely. The more you play, the better you get. Anybody that's in the NBA, you get on a hot streak and you just go from there. I'll look to carry that into the next year. The year is over and now you start from new. You try to repeat the same thing.


LaVine is known for his dunking, but he believes he can be a well-rounded NBA guard. Elsa/Getty Images
4. Ranked sixth among rookies with 39 dunks, per Basketball-Reference.com.

Pelton: Has winning the Slam Dunk Contest overshadowed some of your other skills?

LaVine: It's funny, because I just got known as a dunker from the Dunk Contest. It's not what I got drafted for or anything like that. It's the excitement in the room. That's the most exciting part of basketball sometimes, is the dunk. Getting away from that is a little challenging, but for people who know me or what I'm trying to become, that won't faze me. It's just another attribute to me.

Pelton: When you say what you're trying to become, what does that entail?

LaVine: I feel like I'm a five-tool player. I'm trying to do the best I can to become one of the better defenders. I feel I can score the ball very well. I feel I'm very versatile on offense, can create. Overall, just try to win, do whatever the coach tells me to do ... but I can jump a little bit too.

5. Wingspan measured at 6-foot-8¼ at the NBA draft combine.

Pelton: How much does your size (6-foot-5) and wingspan help you defend both guard spots?

LaVine: Yeah, that's the main thing. Having to deal with Chris Paul and then go on to the wing and guard dudes as tall as Gerald Green -- a 3, almost. It helps me. Being able to sit down and use my length to my advantage, that's why I've got to take pride in the defensive end.

Pelton: How different was defending in the NBA from college?

LaVine: Man, you can't play zone. You can't have that much help. It's so much more wide open, you're on an island almost. As much as they say you've got help, you really don't. You've got to bunker down and show your manhood -- try not to let your man score on you. If they see any type of weakness, the best players in the world, they're going to go right at you.

6. Shot an effective 68.1 percent on 47 catch-and-shoot opportunities marked as guarded by Synergy Sports, fifth-best among players with at least 40 such attempts.

Pelton: Interesting stat I dug up. You shot better on contested shots last year than uncontested ones. Any reason for that?

LaVine: I'm a really good one-on-one player [laughs]. I had no idea about that, but if I see a shot I think I can make I'm going to take it.

Pelton: Is it something where having a hand in your face helps you line up the shot?

LaVine: I don't know about that, but you've got to be good at making those shots. I guess growing up in Seattle, that helps you out. It gets bred into you because you play one-on-one and take tough shots. [Editor's note: Seattle natives Jason Terry, Aaron Brooks and Jamal Crawford also ranked in the top 30 in effective field goal percentage on contested catch-and-shoot opportunities.] But that's not a stat I like. I want to make the open ones. That's what the coaches want to know.

7. Of the 12 players from the Seattle area who played in the NBA last season, 10 are guards.

Pelton: What is it about Seattle that produces so many guards?

LaVine: Oh, man -- we're a hotbed. It's crazy sometimes. I don't know. Maybe because it rains so much we're all in the gym.
 
I feel like when I'm talking to friends about the Wolves, I always end up talking most about how much I like LaVine. Everyone knows about Wiggins and KAT anyway. I think LaVine can really sneak up on the NBA world. He's so smooth!
 
Really want him to use the tools not many have to become an above-average (at least) defender and on offense, attack the basket more. Resorts to a long attempt in 50-50 situations way too often.

How much would the hit be if the Timberwolves outright cut Bennett? I doubt it obviously, I'm just curious what that would be.
 
JPZx said:
Really want him to use the tools not many have to become an above-average (at least) defender and on offense, attack the basket more. Resorts to a long attempt in 50-50 situations way too often.

How much would the hit be if the Timberwolves outright cut Bennett? I doubt it obviously, I'm just curious what that would be.
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Adrian Payne with a 7.3 PER as a 23 year old with a lower TS%, and worse in every statistical category. vs a 21 year old Anthony Bennett with an 11.4 PER.

You gonna cut Payne as well?

AB is in the last year of his deal, in what world would cutting him make sense...it's a lottery tikcket. one that costed you nothing unlike the Payne lottery ticket.
 
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Several of the PER upticks associated with him were cutting out things from his first year that he had no reason doing in the first place. 'Maybe not using one-fifth of my attempts on 3s when I shoot 24% is something I could fiddle with. Yeah. That could work.' Diverted those to twos and yeah over time his FG% would go up so his FGs made and missed are positively affected, but as good as it is PER doesn't evaluate defense it evaluates blocks and steals.

Asking what the cap hit is on Bennett:

1. Doesn't mean I want them to outright cut him, it's asking what the cap hit is on Bennett. Sometimes a pen is just a pen.

2. And most times it shouldn't prompt a name of somebody else entirely that deserves to get cut more. I think I've made Payne out to be my least favorite player on the team several times, but I ask what the cap hit is because Like you said Flip DID NOT pay anything for Bennett he was a throw-in in that deal, while he listened to his pal Thomas on Adriean + gave up a Rd. 1 pick to go get him, so I don't bring Payne up period as somebody more deserving if he were to do that, because there's literally no damn chance in Flipnosis' universe. And while neither would be likely to happen, I think for those reasons + if Flip ever were to make a random move to address the glut in the FC = that's what I think he, personally, would carry out and execute if he specifically were to do a surprise move of that type. the timing of the T.O. is crucial here. And let's really bring it back to reality on the 'lottery' concept here with this freebee year for AB, it's one thing to say the potential return of having him on a low-risk year is worth checking out for his age and tools hidden beneath that nonchalant and disinterested exterior, whole other thing to have a jumping off point where you say we would realistically 'regret' doing anything prematurely like that because of some supposed fear of Bennett making us regret it for eternity. No I don't think Flip should do it, yes I think he's capable of doing it, no I don't think it would ever come back to hurt him.
 
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Payne is a 24 year old ball player who has been playing organized basketball for roughly 5 years. Can we please stop pretending we gave up so much for him, when in actuality we gave up a pick that will be 16-30 pick in the next 4 years or no pick at all. Essentially meaning we got him for free, ask Ainge how all his protected pics are working out...... I know he sucks right now, but Draymond Green's game grew exponentially when he turned 25. Not everyones potential is tapped by 22. I like the trade and feel it was a good move. 

I feel that Pek and Martin are the ones should be getting all the flak, martin has ADMITTED to not giving his all in games, and is useless on defense. Pek is taking up roster space, and getting paid far too much to ride the pine. Please Flip find a home for these 2 ASAP.
 
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BlackIntellect said:
Payne is a 24 year old ball player who has been playing organized basketball for roughly 5 years. Can we please stop pretending we gave up so much for him, when in actuality we gave up a pick that will be 16-30 pick in the next 4 years or no pick at all. Essentially meaning we got him for free, ask Ainge how all his protected pics are working out...... I know he sucks right now, but Draymond Green's game grew exponentially when he turned 25. Not everyones potential is tapped by 22. I like the trade and feel it was a good move. 

I feel that Pek and Martin are the ones should be getting all the flak, martin has ADMITTED to not giving his all in games, and is useless on defense. Pek is taking up roster space, and getting paid far too much to ride the pine. Please Flip find a home for these 2 ASAP.
Click to expand...

1. A 1st round lottery protected pick is not free, unless flip isn't planning on making the playoffs for the next half decade.

2. Draymond is the exception not the rule.

3. 23 year olds who sucked in their first year, and sucked in the d-league shouldn't cost 1st round picks.


Maybe Adrien Payne figures it out, still shouldn't have cost a pick.
 
Uhhhh

Are we going to see a lot of Payne at the top of the three point arc this season? If so...... *sigh*
 
Payne is my dude.

I hate all his wasted kinetic energy when he's shooting the ball, but he has value. He can carve out that value on this team with the talent around him, but he needs to understand that role and focus on the 1 or 2 things outside of his hustle that can make him a piece of the puzzle that's not easily replaced (by virtue of his length and intensity that creates opportunity on both ends).
 
Not too high on Payne.

I'd probably take a late first rounder over him..Flip dun guf'd with that one.
 
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