***Official Political Discussion Thread***

An Armada said:

So should we ban alcohol again? because there are people who cant get their life together because of it and spend the little they have to get drunk all day. that isnt positive.

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alchol abuse has killed a lot more people than marijuana, but marijuana use hasnt been known to have killed anyone, not one person has been documented to have died from using marijuana. So i guess that one wouldnt be too hard to figure out.

DWalk31 said:

An Armada said:

So should we ban alcohol again? because there are people who cant get their life together because of it and spend the little they have to get drunk all day. that isnt positive.

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Your logic: All dangerous drugs should be legal, because some dangerous drugs are legal.

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Actually that was your logic.

This is the thing. Many of the arguments supporting widespread distribution of marijuana are the same as for any other drug. And marijuana, like any other drug can be abused. We all know someone that can't quite get their lives together who spend the little they have getting high all day. That isn't positive.

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whywesteppin said:

 

An Armada said:

So should we ban alcohol again? because there are people who cant get their life together because of it and spend the little they have to get drunk all day. that isnt positive.

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Alcohol and tobacco are by far the most destructive drugs on society. We have mitigated much of the damage caused by tobacco in the past couple decades but it's still pretty bad. Alcohol is much worse.

That said, I would never ban alcohol because it's not as simple as that. That's the whole point my post above was trying to make. If anything, I think we should consider reducing the drinking age.

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I agree with you I was just pointing out how easy his logic could be flipped to something that is already legal.

DWalk31 said:

 

An Armada said:

So should we ban alcohol again? because there are people who cant get their life together because of it and spend the little they have to get drunk all day. that isnt positive.

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Your logic: All dangerous drugs should be legal, because some dangerous drugs are legal.

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No that is not my logic or my point I never once said all dangerous drugs should be legal you are putting words in my mouth. My point is its not as simple as banning things because some people abuse it like you where alluding too.

But it wasn't

Not one person has died from abusing marijuana, thats crazy to think about. Not one, noone, ever. Wow.

If you use a crutch for so long, whatever you were alleviating becomes weak. But you cant really blame the crutch for the pain.

I think the issues with marijuana are its gateway-drug potential

DWalk31 said:

This is the thing. Many of the arguments supporting widespread distribution of marijuana are the same as for any other drug. And marijuana, like any other drug can be abused. We all know someone that can't quite get their lives together who spend the little they have getting high all day. That isn't positive.

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Marijuana has MAJOR DOCUMENTED MEDICAL BENEFITS. What benefits do tobacco and alcohol have? The benefits marijuana provide far outweigh the abuse by the pot head who never became a manager at Sears.

An Armada said:

 
So should we ban alcohol again? because there are people who cant get their life together because of it and spend the little they have to get drunk all day. that isnt positive.

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migu420 said:

Not one person has died from abusing marijuana, thats crazy to think about. Not one, noone, ever. Wow.

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DWalk31 said:

I don't
Abortion is a different issue. Generally, I am pro life. Of course if a woman is raped/has medical fears that is different. The recreational use of any drug is the only thing up for debate.
This is the thing. Many of the arguments supporting widespread distribution of marijuana are the same as for any other drug. And marijuana, like any other drug can be abused. We all know someone that can't quite get their lives together who spend the little they have getting high all day. That isn't positive.

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An Armada said:

 
So should we ban alcohol again? because there are people who cant get their life together because of it and spend the little they have to get drunk all day. that isnt positive.

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This is the answer that cannot be answered by anyone who is against marijuana for rec use. Alcohol is much more detrimental to the drinker and those around them than marijuana could ever be.

DWalk31 said:

I think the issues with marijuana are its gateway-drug potential

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It doesn't have any. People may smoke it and want a larger high but that's more of the user than it is of the plant.

DWalk31 said:

I think the issues with marijuana are its gateway-drug potential

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 These findings are consistent with the idea of marijuana as a "gateway drug." However, the majority of people who use marijuana do not go on to use other, "harder" substances. Also, cross-sensitization is not unique to marijuana. Alcohol and nicotine also prime the brain for a heightened response to other drugs52  and are, like marijuana, also typically used before a person progresses to other, more harmful substances.
It is important to note that other factors besides biological mechanisms, such as a person’s social environment, are also critical in a person’s risk for drug use. An alternative to the gateway-drug hypothesis is that people who are more vulnerable to drug-taking are simply more likely to start with readily available substances such as marijuana, tobacco, or alcohol, and their subsequent social interactions with others who use drugs increases their chances of trying other drugs. Further research is needed to explore this question.

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https://www.drugabuse.gov/publications/research-reports/marijuana/marijuana-gateway-drug

There a documented benefits of many drugs that are restricted to prescription medical use.

DWalk31 said:

There a documented benefits of many drugs that are restricted to prescription medical use.

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And?

Alcohol is by all means worse than marijuana in every imaginable way. My dad died at 55 years old from blood poisoning resulting from a destroyed liver due to severe alcoholism. Alcohol is a toxin, marijuana is not. Furthermore, alcohol is one of the few drugs that can include fatality as a withdrawal effect. Alpzazolam (Xanax) being another prime example of such. It's rare yes, but it happens.

Using marijuana for recreational purposes is relatively harmless. At the very least it should be legal for all medicinal purposes.

Some of the best doctors in this country are working on finding the diagnosis for my chronic disease and each and every single one of them has supported using marijuana for pain relief. In fact the specialists were the ones who convinced my mom to allow me to use it, because she was skeptical whenever I brought it up. So I discussed it with as many specialists as possible and every single one of them approved of it. I'm prescribed a wide array of various medications including sleeping medication, opiate painkillers, a hormone treatment to boost testosterone and cortisol, ...

I have been prescribed the maximum dosage of the opiate painkiller Tramadol for a few years now and the next step up the ladder would be oxycodone so that's out of the question. Since I still experience quite a lot of chronic pain 24/7 despite those painkillers, I consulted with the specialists about marijuana for additional pain relief. It's unique in the sense that it does not interfere with any of my medications and there is no harm in how much I consume according to the specialists. Unlike alcohol, of which I am only allowed very small doses on rare occasions.

I vaporize the marijuana a couple hours before I go to bed on a daily basis. I'm not much of a fan of the feeling of getting high but it does provide some decent additional pain relief and it sure feels good to go to sleep with less pain.

Considering a patient like me with a complicated medical file and loads of presciption medications has been given a full doctor's approval to consume as much marijuana as I deem necessary, I reckon there's not much harm for regular folks. And again, these aren't some average doctors. Most of them are on a special unit that only handpicks a select amount of very tough cases. And the Ghent University Hospital has global recognition in the medical world.

Also take in mind that marijuana is illegal for all purposes here. If it was truly so harmful, all these doctors wouldn't be approving and even working to convince my mom of the medical benefits of a drug that isn't even legal in this country.

Marijuana is also not physically addictive unlike other drugs like alcohol. The potential for mental addiction is always there of course but mental addiction can be applied to pretty much anything.

In short, I believe there is zero scientific basis for a blanket ban on marijuana. I can sort of see where being against recreational use comes from, though I also disagree with that, but there is absolutely zero reason it should not be legalized for medicinal purposes.

And he's trying to drag this thread into another useless conversation, where he spouts archaic talking points and doesn't offer anything of value to the thread. In the end, the only point he'll have gotten across was that he's simply trying to stir the pot, but not actually try to make anything substantive. If we were to have a serious conversation about drug laws and societal impact, he'd offer substantive opinions that aren't shrouded behind hypotheticals or double-talk. To say "drugs are bad, mmk" and then not back up the statement with anything but debunked talking points, does not help the discourse of this thread.

I think the ‘gateway drug’ argument speaks more to the individual’s will.

migu420 said:

If you use a crutch for so long, whatever you were alleviating becomes weak. But you cant really blame the crutch for the pain.

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the problem is there are no facts leading to gateway potential. It is why i used this metaphor, looking at the crutch as opposed to the pain the crutch is needed for.

Noskey said:

And he's trying to drag this thread into another useless conversation, where he spouts archaic talking points and doesn't offer anything of value to the thread. In the end, the only point he'll have gotten across was that he's simply trying to stir the pot, but not actually try to make anything substantive. If we were to have a serious conversation about drug laws and societal impact, he'd offer substantive opinions that aren't shrouded behind hypotheticals or double-talk. To say "drugs are bad, mmk" and then not back up the statement with anything but debunked talking points, does not help the discourse of this thread.

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I didn't say or do any of the things you're suggesting. I stated facts and arguments against the widespread legal distribution of marijuana. I never stated Alcohol or Cigarettes were more safe. I was stating arguments against it.

This guy

You said this acknowledging that it can be abused like any other drug or substance

DWalk31 said:

This is the thing. Many of the arguments supporting widespread distribution of marijuana are the same as for any other drug. And marijuana, like any other drug can be abused. We all know someone that can't quite get their lives together who spend the little they have getting high all day. That isn't positive.

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then said

DWalk31 said:

I think the issues with marijuana are its gateway-drug potential

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So we ask if you have a problem with marijuana's gateway potential as a reason it shouldn't have wide spread legal distribution why do you not apply that same logic to any other drugs and substances that can be abused (like you said in your previous comment) and have gateway potential as well?

HarlemToTheBronx said:

I think the ‘gateway drug’ argument speaks more to the individual’s will.

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It certainly does.

DWalk31 said:

I didn't say or do any of the things you're suggesting. I stated facts and arguments against the widespread legal distribution of marijuana. I never stated Alcohol or Cigarettes were more safe. I was stating arguments against it.

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You stated "facts" and arguments that have been disproven and trumped by more facts, proof, trials and more.

If anything, marijuana does have a gateway drug potential, potential to get people off of opioids, which really destroys people.

It seems the political discussion thread is just agree with everyone about every topic or you are engaging in substance-less mental gymnastics. Reasonable minds can disagree on topics. It's not that novel of a concept. Tons of people use medical marijuana and it helps their lives tremendously. Many smoke multiple times a day and have a "I don't care" attitude which results in them losing their jobs and/or dropping out of school. And some use it as a gateway to other drugs. It is just the reality. "Alcohol is bad too" isn't relevant.

That is the problem with this argument, is that it isnt the drug, but the individual.

An Armada said:

You said this acknowledging that it can be abused like any other drug or substance

then said



So we ask if you have a problem with marijuana's gateway potential as a reason it shouldn't have wide spread legal distribution why do you not apply that same logic to any other drugs and substances that can be abused (like you said in your previous comment) and have gateway potential as well?

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What do you mean why don't I use it? Im not arguing for Alcohol. You are arguing that point with yourself.

DWalk31 said:

It seems the political discussion thread is just agree with everyone about every topic or you are engaging in substance-less mental gymnastics. Reasonable minds can disagree on topics. It's not that novel of a concept. Tons of people use medical marijuana and it helps their lives tremendously. Many smoke multiple times a day and have a "I don't care" attitude which results in them losing their jobs and/or dropping out of school. And some use it as a gateway to other drugs. It is just the reality. "Alcohol is bad too" isn't relevant.

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But it is relevant when you are pretending like marijunana is the only thing that causes those bad things to happen...we are just asking you to be consistent with your logic because if you are gonna use that logic that "some people abuse it so we shouldnt legalize it" you have to apply that to other things people abuse too and you arent doing that

why do y'all do this dance with dudes who are clearly trolling ?