batman/Bruce wayne vs Iron man/ tony stark

Well isn't that a doosey


Hmm gonna take some time with this one.

Solidus Snake said:

No, not won.

Just that neither side will relent so screw it. CA is a bum.

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Sorry didnt mean to turn it into a captain America thread lol
Edit:my man super antigen did work
Where is that clapping gif lol

The Iron Man armor is not merely a suit, it is EVERYTHING that makes Stark a hero.

If we're going to strip him of that, what is the point of this question?

PLVN said:

The Iron Man armor is not merely a suit, it is EVERYTHING that makes Stark a hero.

If we're going to strip him of that, what is the point of this question?

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But why can't batman plan as well
You cant have a one sided arguement, you have to look at the bigger picture as well
The well "ironman" doesn't have to plan arguement is weak and selfish, you have to explore all options in a fight/war... You don't just run into a fight( that's how dudes get knocked out) you size your competition up and look for a weakness before the first blow is thrown( unless u get snuffed or jumped)
Which then people argue well "batman can just be shot"so are we just negating the fact batman has all types of guns and electronics in his UTILITY BELT (that are non lethal) to handle those types of situations and I seriously doubt a trained assassin is just going to sit there in bulletproof armor and just get done in by a laser, proton cannon,flying missile, etc
You can't just say ironman is a definite win just because he can fly and shoot, where they do that at.... In the end people are going to ride with ironman because its the easy choice
Proton cannon,flying,lasers=win
Heart,tenacity,strategy, real "cqc" training=losing...smh

I vote for ironman just cause I think he looks more bad a**

It seems like Super Antigen read one reply to his post and made that reply. He'd perfectly understand why the notion of stripping Stark of his suit is negated and not a weakness anyway if he read the thread. I won't even get in to his description of DC characters being more reality based or grounded when that's a highly regarded sentiment towards Marvel comics

To keep it simple Tony Stark is a superhuman, he's not some regular dude that happens to have a super powered suit. So even if you take the suit from him pre-Extremis he'd still kill Batman with a repulsor chest blast. So simply repeating over and over in your essay that Stark is nothing without the suit is simply a fallacy you believe without closely reviewing the actual facts.

As for PLAN bringing up Captain America, I've held the understanding that he's pretty much a superhuman as well or at least an enhanced human. It's not simply that he's peak human physicality it's that he's always at his peak. I'm pretty sure he can lift 1 ton too but I'd have to go look up his power and skill set.

SuperAntigen said:

My earlier post was argued based of these observances. I compared and contrasted Bruce/Bat's to Tony/I.M based on their on screen realities; based on their most sensible realities, as it relates to our own, and not on the farfetched, fantastical, paradigms we are so often witness to in contemporary comic story-lines, which is your (Sir Charles) primary source evidence. If you are going to harangue us about what Tony Stark/Iron Man is capable of then you have to be open to what Bruce Wayne and Batman are also capable of. It's not a one way street, and your opinion is not the end-all-be-all on the matter.

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Okay then, lets talk about screen realities. I'm going to go off of the current Iron Man series, and The Dark Knight Rises series.

Now a really ridiculous criticism by some of you T.S/I.M supporters is that it's silly to make arguments that take into consideration the separation of Tony Starks from the Iron Man shell. Why is that a silly argument? Why shouldn't that possibility be accounted for in a debate that explores the relative strengths and weaknesses of the two subjects, in their entirety? Y'all Iron Man fanboys are not even being realistic with yourselves. Y'all want to harp on Tony's/Iron Man's strengths but don't even want to consider his biggest weakness? Com'on Son!!!

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Now, if this is the biggest way Batman can defeat Iron Man, why does the question exist? Iron Man, as in Tony Stark in a suit. His greatest power. Yet, you want to strip him of his power to make it so its man vs batman? That's simply defeating the purpose.

Hey lets make tony have a memory-gone serum so Wayne forgets all his training! (Same thing, equal chance of happening)

Tony Stark's biggest advantage in this duel is his Iron Man shell, but it's also his biggest weakness--FACT!!!

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If this is going off the partial quote above, well.

As previously mentioned, in my earlier post, without his Iron Man shell, he's DONE. And as for Extremis--how convenient. That whole arc is evidence of the aforementioned point. It was developed to patch up that very significant loose end which served as a reminder of Tony Stark's greatest vulnerability: that without his Iron Man shell, and the Superhuman powers if affords him, he's about as pathetic as any other "regular" human in the Marvel universe. And the icing on the cake--the fact that Extremis was not even a Tony Stark invention; in other words, let's entertain the possibility that, in a reality where Bruce Wayne's and Tony Stark's worlds coalesce, Maya Hansen, in exchange for a blank check for her cancer research, gives billionaire playboy Bruce Wayne all the info and data as well as live samples of the Extremis virus. What now?

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Alright, so your argument here is Batman takes Maya's extremis virus. Batman becomes Iron Bat. So now they have equal power, but unequal genius. I'll get into that later. What if we flip it? Since we are capable of taking the others abilities now, lets give Stark a chance.

Stark uses his business genius to take over Wayne Enterprises. Shuts the whole thing down. What's wayne going to do now? Where is his money to fund his technology?

Or, Stark visits the bat cave. Steals a bat mobile, or the bat wing.

Or Stark has a talk with Bane, gets himself on that "Molly"

Or, stark grabs batman, flys him into Bane's prison, drops him in and collapses the place.

Or, maybe Stark uses his nuclear arsenal to destroy Gothem.

Far fetched, yet equal possibilities.

Back to screen realities

Tony Stark is weak. Bruce Wayne is not. Tony Stark develops different iterations of his Iron Man shell because no one shell is absolute, either. Each has it's faults and limitations, that's why he's had to create so many different types over the years. Bruce Wayne, on the hand, and relatively, has kept it simple. Why? Because his strength is NOT dependent on his Batman shell. Even if he is deprived of his Bat suit, he remains just as dangerous. Tony Stark loses his Iron Man shell, and he's nothing.

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Is that not planning ahead with his "prep time" like everyone has said.

Either way, since we are talking about movies. Want to know why Batman has kept it simple? Because he fights muggers. Muggers and thieves. Why would he need a metal suit? Hell, his biggest enemies were the Joker and Bane.

Batman's strength against lower level humans remains innate, but when he goes up against bane it's not enough. His technology is his weapon against enemies of equal strength and stronger. Where would he be without the Batmobile, Batwing, and his bat cycle? Walking. Now continuing on, we have batman fighting Bane. He gets that back broken. Then he is thrown in prison. With his simple get up. You think iron man couldn't match that?

In the movies, iron man has upgraded his suit three times. One, he turns scrap metal into an arc reactor, and a functioning Mark I. Then, he improves is with the Mark II prototype to test his limits. And he perfects it with the good trimming on the Mark III. Where he defeats armies. Armies of enemies. And his big two, Stane, and Whiplash.

Batman's plain and simple outfit does him a lot of good until he is faced with an actual challenge.

Here we have two cases where one hero is dependent on his suit/shell and the other is not. The former hero's abilities and effectiveness are directly dictated by the shell he chooses to "wear" that day; the same is not true for the latter hero, whose abilities and effectiveness remain the same even if he's wearing a pajamas. I don't know about you, but if I had to go with one, I'd go with the guy whose strengths are innate, and not extrinsic and coupled to some specific shell which may not even be the right "equipment" for the job given any number of circumstances.... What's that saying, "it's the man that makes the suit and not the other way around"...

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Okay then, if Wayne isn't dependent on his shells, lets take off his cowl and have bane smash that head in again and see if he survives. Or, lets have him shot at, like he always is, without that bullet proof chest plate. He needs his protection just as much as iron man b.

Iron man changing suits every different enemy is a smart things. Example. I have a golf club, and a bat. I'm about to go fight a fat kid named Ed. I grab the golf club. Then I have to fight Jim, the buff dude. I grab the bat. Its smart to grab the tool that works best against the enemy you are fighting.

Ohh and I'll just leave this here...


View media item 353822

Obviously, Bruce Wayne can make fancy suits too.

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But does the suit match the power of the repulsor technology, is it capable of flight, does it hold machine guns and missiles? It just looks like an exoskeleton to enhance human abilities to me. (Running, physical attacks, the works.)




I'll check back tomorrow to see what other exaggerations y'all have come up with...

...[/quote]


And lets face it with the tie breaker, Jarvis >>>> Pennyworth

looks here it is

iron man > batman heads up

bruce wayne > tony stark heads up

with prep time factored:

iron man = batman

bruce wayne > tony stark

/thread.

killa07 said:

PLVN said:

The Iron Man armor is not merely a suit, it is EVERYTHING that makes Stark a hero.

If we're going to strip him of that, what is the point of this question?

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But why can't batman plan as well
You cant have a one sided arguement, you have to look at the bigger picture as well
The well "ironman" doesn't have to plan arguement is weak and selfish, you have to explore all options in a fight/war... You don't just run into a fight( that's how dudes get knocked out) you size your competition up and look for a weakness before the first blow is thrown( unless u get snuffed or jumped)

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Nobody said iron man doesn't have to plan. But if they were both thrown into an arena, iron man wouldn't have to plan. His power, is over Wayne's.

Which then people argue well "batman can just be shot"so are we just negating the fact batman has all types of guns and electronics in his UTILITY BELT (that are non lethal) to handle those types of situations and I seriously doubt a trained assassin is just going to sit there in bulletproof armor and just get done in by a laser, proton cannon,flying missile, etc

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What defense does batman have against a missile that can destroy a tank that the tank doesn't have? He doesn't. If Iron Man turns on that 50 cal the battle is over before it starts. Plain and simple. Lets talk about the utility belt, what does he have in there that you keep clinging to it for?

The laser itself moves faster than batman, and it has a large radius. Batman wouldn't have much defense against that.

You can't just say ironman is a definite win just because he can fly and shoot, where they do that at.... In the end people are going to ride with ironman because its the easy choice
Proton cannon,flying,lasers=win
Heart,tenacity,strategy, real "cqc" training=losing...smh

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Alright, so by this logic if I put a boxer up with a mugger with a gun, the boxer will win simply because he has heart, strategy, and real fighting training? No, bang bang, boxer down.

honestly at this point I think Marvel and Dc should make a movie bout this.

Sir Charles said:

Nobody said iron man doesn't have to plan. But if they were both thrown into an arena, iron man wouldn't have to plan. His power, is over Wayne's.
What defense does batman have against a missile that can destroy a tank that the tank doesn't have? He doesn't. If Iron Man turns on that 50 cal the battle is over before it starts. Plain and simple. Lets talk about the utility belt, what does he have in there that you keep clinging to it for?

The laser itself moves faster than batman, and it has a large radius. Batman wouldn't have much defense against that.
Alright, so by this logic if I put a boxer up with a mugger with a gun, the boxer will win simply because he has heart, strategy, and real fighting training? No, bang bang, boxer down.

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I give up... There is no reasoning... You have brow beat the situation over my head
Ironman is the strongest super hero ever because he has guns/laser/ training from captain America and batman can't win because he strategizes and he is a merely just a man
And nobody has ever disarmed a man with a gun and batman couldn't have a device in his belt to disarm a missile
And this is why I stop reading marvel comics and started reading mangas lol

killa07 said:

I have seen the light.
Ironman is the strongest super hero ever

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Fixed

killa07 said:

I give up... There is no reasoning... You have brow beat the situation over my head
Ironman is the strongest super hero ever because he has guns/laser/ training from captain America and batman can't win because he strategizes and he is a merely just a man
And nobody has ever disarmed a man with a gun and batman couldn't have a device in his belt to disarm a missile
And this is why I stop reading marvel comics and started reading mangas lol

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Don't pout.

Come back with a well worded response and further the discussion.

I don't contribute much, but I love reading these threads.

MJGREATXII said:

honestly at this point I think Marvel and Dc should make a movie bout this.

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neither company would want to have their boy lose...

Sir Charles said:

Fixed

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Can't win with marvel fanboys or fanboys in general so no well thought out response will work...not pouting nor are my jimmies are rustled
Ironman some hiw became indestructible and now is a xmen wolverine status and a brotherhood member like juggernaut
And guys acting like "prep" time is a bad thing
Smh....when someone has that much passion for one character/situation...no arguement will suffice...I bid this thread a do lol

Bruce Wayne vs Tony Stark straight up
Bruce wins

Batman vs Iron Man but with suit and gadgets
Iron man wins

killa07 said:

Can't win with marvel fanboys or fanboys in general so no well thought out response will work...not pouting nor are my jimmies are rustled
Ironman some hiw became indestructible and now is a xmen wolverine status and a brotherhood member like juggernaut
And guys acting like "prep" time is a bad thing
Smh....when someone has that much passion for one character/situation...no arguement will suffice...I bid this thread a do lol

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So basically you don't like that the character you favor isn't given an advantage?

I thought the idea of these questions was for the two entities to meet on a level field with their base abilities.

How is it fair if one character is given a head start?

PLVN said:

So basically you don't like that the character you favor isn't given an advantage?

I thought the idea of these questions was for the two entities to meet on a level field with their base abilities.

How is it fair if one character is given a head start?

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Like I have said multiple times nobody wants to point out the weaknesses of ironman
I can list multiple batmans weaknesses and I still feel batman could when In a fair one
I see both sides of arguementsand I give batman the small advantage because of his heart and willingness not to lose... Even if he is just a mere mortal(ironman is a walking battery that still is a mere mortal) but the arguements in here are so skewed towards ironman because truthfully and I respect this pov, he could just be shot end of game
But dudes don't see how many suits ironman has had
Dudes acting like Jarvis or his suit can't be hacked
Dudes act like ironman can't be hurt because he is steel
Come on every superhero has a exploit but somehow ironman is stronger then magneto,Phoenix,wolverine,onslaught,juggernaut, by these arguements I have seen
In the end people are going to view there character higher then the other that is just human nature and how debates go....

Iron Man

Sir Charles said:

Okay then, lets talk about screen realities. I'm going to go off of the current Iron Man series, and The Dark Knight Rises series.
Now, if this is the biggest way Batman can defeat Iron Man, why does the question exist? Iron Man, as in Tony Stark in a suit. His greatest power. Yet, you want to strip him of his power to make it so its man vs batman? That's simply defeating the purpose.

Hey lets make tony have a memory-gone serum so Wayne forgets all his training! (Same thing, equal chance of happening)
If this is going off the partial quote above, well.
Alright, so your argument here is Batman takes Maya's extremis virus. Batman becomes Iron Bat. So now they have equal power, but unequal genius. I'll get into that later. What if we flip it? Since we are capable of taking the others abilities now, lets give Stark a chance.

Stark uses his business genius to take over Wayne Enterprises. Shuts the whole thing down. What's wayne going to do now? Where is his money to fund his technology?

Or, Stark visits the bat cave. Steals a bat mobile, or the bat wing.

Or Stark has a talk with Bane, gets himself on that "Molly"

Or, stark grabs batman, flys him into Bane's prison, drops him in and collapses the place.

Or, maybe Stark uses his nuclear arsenal to destroy Gothem.

Far fetched, yet equal possibilities.

Back to screen realities
Is that not planning ahead with his "prep time" like everyone has said.

Either way, since we are talking about movies. Want to know why Batman has kept it simple? Because he fights muggers. Muggers and thieves. Why would he need a metal suit? Hell, his biggest enemies were the Joker and Bane.

Batman's strength against lower level humans remains innate, but when he goes up against bane it's not enough. His technology is his weapon against enemies of equal strength and stronger. Where would he be without the Batmobile, Batwing, and his bat cycle? Walking. Now continuing on, we have batman fighting Bane. He gets that back broken. Then he is thrown in prison. With his simple get up. You think iron man couldn't match that?

In the movies, iron man has upgraded his suit three times. One, he turns scrap metal into an arc reactor, and a functioning Mark I. Then, he improves is with the Mark II prototype to test his limits. And he perfects it with the good trimming on the Mark III. Where he defeats armies. Armies of enemies. And his big two, Stane, and Whiplash.

Batman's plain and simple outfit does him a lot of good until he is faced with an actual challenge.
Okay then, if Wayne isn't dependent on his shells, lets take off his cowl and have bane smash that head in again and see if he survives. Or, lets have him shot at, like he always is, without that bullet proof chest plate. He needs his protection just as much as iron man b.

Iron man changing suits every different enemy is a smart things. Example. I have a golf club, and a bat. I'm about to go fight a fat kid named Ed. I grab the golf club. Then I have to fight Jim, the buff dude. I grab the bat. Its smart to grab the tool that works best against the enemy you are fighting.
But does the suit match the power of the repulsor technology, is it capable of flight, does it hold machine guns and missiles? It just looks like an exoskeleton to enhance human abilities to me. (Running, physical attacks, the works.)




I'll check back tomorrow to see what other exaggerations y'all have come up with...

...

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I think you're overlooking (whether by choice or by ignorance, I'm not sure and I won't guess) the real merit of what SuperAntigen has to say here. Look, if we're talking movies here, I think Ironman>>>Batman anyday, prep time or no prep time. The problem is that throughout the thread you've been comparing Comic Ironman with Movie Batman, which is completely irrational and unfair.

You keep throwing stats out there about Ironman and his cannons, strength in his suit, etc. etc. etc. Batman has taken out Superman. Batman has taken out Wonder Woman. Batman has taken out The Flash. You don't get much stronger than those. Plus, SuperAntigen's point about the armors is VERY strong. Stark uses different armors because not one armor is infallible--they all have their different weaknesses and strengths in different situations. Batman's strategical genius allows him to craft tens, perhaps hundreds, perhaps thousands of different situations to exploit his enemies' weaknesses. When you can narrow down the weaknesses to the different nuances of a few suits, then I think you can see where things would go bad for Stark.

Which is why I come back to prep time. You haven't been able to counter my conclusion and if you can't I think that ends it, right? This is what it boils down to: With prep time, Batman>>>>>Ironman. With no prep time--if they're thrown into a coliseum like I believe you mentioned--then Ironman>>>>Batman. It's that simple. Give Tony Stark the same amount of prep time as Batman and he will still get worked. That's it.

Its intresting both smart an rich butneither reall have any real powers ill go with tje dark knight

Seriously though...why is "prep time" even a factor?

If it's absolutely necessary, why aren't both parties given that luxury?

PLVN said:

Seriously though...why is "prep time" even a factor?

If it's absolutely necessary, why aren't both parties given that luxury?

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Both parties ARE given that luxury. Batman can devise 50 ways to beat Tony Stark and then another 100 ways that Tony Stark will exploit his own weaknesses then another 150 ways to counter the 100 ways Tony Stark will try to fight him. That's Batman's true ability.

Prep time is a factor because there are many times when heroes DO prepare strategies before an oncoming battle. Not every fight is absolutely spontaneous.

^ ok, and we'll just assume tony wouldn't or can't.... Perfect

jordan23dotcom said:

^ ok, and we'll just assume tony wouldn't or can't.... Perfect

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I mean, don't we all assume Captain America can't shoot laser beams out of his eyes like Superman? It's not his power. Yes, Stark is a genius, but his genius is more of an inventing ilk, not strategy. If you want strategy in the Marvel Universe, you go to Captain America, Cyclops, or Deadpool. I'd say Deadpool is closest to Batman but that's not the debate. Point being, we assume Tony wouldn't or can't because....he can't. That's what differentiates the two of them.