Comet Probe scientist breaks down in tears following accusations of Sexism over his shirt-Vol. "I d

Is it Sexist ?

  • Yes it is

    Votes: 0 0.0%

  • No it is not

    Votes: 0 0.0%
  • Total voters
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oxpenguin said:
Didn't read but **** feminists.
They're so obnoxious.
Click to expand...

This

The shirt is stupid but to tear this man down over it is crazy. Especially in this sexual society that we live in. This isn't the Arab world where this type of **** isn't pushed the way it is over here. Don't ***** about the individual but ***** about the whole system. ***** about the media pushing these sexual images that's ingrained in everyone's mind

Feminist are a bunch of bullies that picks on individuals for headlines. These dumb broads don't want any real change. Selective *** *****
 
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They took a huge L with the cat call video and need a rebound. What a joke. Dudes are landing space ships on asteroids and they're talking about a tshirt.


Outrage over a shirt = one step closer to equality?

Seems legit
 
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I remember rocking shirts like this back in the day

t-shirt-plastik-logo-girl.jpg
 
Methodical Management said:
 
You know what's really obnoxious?  Sexism.  

Being paid less for performing the same work?  That's obnoxious.  

Comprising half the workforce, yet accounting for 60% of minimum wage jobs and less than 8% of the top-earning jobs at Fortune 500 companies?  That's obnoxious.  

Being more likely to be raped by a fellow soldier than killed in action?  That's obnoxious. 

Knowing that between 1 in 4 and 1 in 5 female college students will survive at least one rape or attempted rape during their time on campus?  That's obnoxious.  

Living in a society where 1 in 4 women experience intimate partner violence?  That's obnoxious. 

Feeling guilty over an inappropriate shirt?  Not quite as inconvenient.

If only a portion of the energy misspent demonizing feminists were instead used to fight sexism, we'd all enjoy a more just and equitable society.  
Click to expand...
and as usual dudes just gonna ignore the best post in here. Why am I not surprised...
tired.gif
 
ShotsRangOut said:
and as usual dudes just gonna ignore the best post in here. Why am I not surprised...|I
Click to expand...

What does complaining about a shirt have to do with defeating those problems? I'm not anti females AT ALL but Explain to me how blowing up this topic about a Tshirt will somehow raise pay for females?


What was posted wasn't incorrect but it was directed to another post someone made, not really the topic
 
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You know what's really obnoxious?  Sexism.  
Click to expand...
Sexism is obnoxious. While I don't agree with ox that all feminists are obnoxious, the vocal minority most certainly can be.

Feminism once recognized that judging people for their sexuality was a bad thing and should never be acceptable. Now they want to judge straight men for their sexuality. It's as pathetic and hypocritical as straight people judging homosexuals.

Nobody judges lonely 40 year old women for reading 50 shades of grey. And I don't think we should be judging a man for wearing a shirt with scantily clad animated women either.



Being paid less for performing the same work?  That's obnoxious.
Click to expand...

The wage gap has been refuted countless times by numerous economists. The 23 cent pay gap is only the difference between the average earnings of all men and women who work full time positions. The wage gap statistic doesn’t compare two similarly situated co-workers of different sexes, working in the same industry, performing the same work, for the same number of hours a day. It merely reflects the median earnings of all men and women classified as full-time workers.

The Department of Labor’s Time Use Survey, for example, finds that the average full-time working man spends 8.14 hours a day on the job, compared to 7.75 hours for the full-time working woman. Employees who work more likely earn more. Men working longer than women alone explains about one-quarter of the wage gap.

There are lots of other factors at play.

Men and women tend to gravitate toward different industries. The argument could be made that women are forced into lower-paying sectors of the economy. But that sounds a lot like "His tacky shirt is why I didn't STEM major" and I believe if someone has enough interest in a field, they will pursue it. Even within groups with the same educational attainment, women gravitate towards fields of study, such as sociology, liberal arts or psychology. These are fields that have always paid less in the labor market.

Men tend to take jobs with less desirable characteristics in pursuit of higher pay. They work longer hours. They tar roofs in the sun, drive trucks across the country, toil in sewer systems, stand watch as prison guards, and risk injury on fishing boats, in coal mines, and in production plants. Such jobs pay more than others because otherwise no one would want to do them. Nearly all the most dangerous occupations, such as loggers or iron workers, are majority male and 92% of work-related deaths in 2012 were to men.

The supposed pay gap becomes very apparent when marriage and children enter the picture.There is no question that children play an important role in men and women’s work-life decisions. If a mother chooses to take care of her children herself she effectively takes herself out of the labor market. When they return its no surprise that those women will have less work experience than similarly-aged males.

Many working mothers who choose to continue to work will seek jobs that provide greater flexibility, such as telecommuting or flexible hours. Not all jobs can be flexible, and those which flexible almost always pay less than those which are not. Women who have children or plan to have children tend to be willing to trade higher pay in exchange for more time with their children. In contrast, men with children typically seek to earn more money in order to support their children and spouse, often taking on more hours and less attractive positions to do so.

Academics can debate why men and women make these different choices. The important takeaway, however, is that there are many reasons that men and women on average earn different amounts. It’s a mistake to assume that “wage gap” statistics reflect on-the-job discrimination.



Comprising half the workforce, yet accounting for 60% of minimum wage jobs and less than 8% of the top-earning jobs at Fortune 500 companies?  That's obnoxious.  
Click to expand...
60 to 40 is a rather narrow gap and those numbers do not take into consideration the age or experience of the minimum wage workers. I find it hypocritical that many feminists claim they are for equality and demand equal numbers in fields that offer higher pay, yet never mention equalizing numbers in areas like homelessness or prison incarceration.



Being more likely to be raped by a fellow soldier than killed in action?  That's obnoxious. 
Click to expand...

It is obnoxious, it's despicable and I don't think anyone in their right mind would condone it. Still though, more men than women are raped every year in the military and there is little coverage on the issue. Also take into consideration women are less likely to be involved in active combat roles, therefore having a higher overall survival rate when compared to men in action.

When the Defense Department released the results of its anonymous sexual abuse survey recently and concluded that 26,000 service members were victims in fiscal 2012, which ended Sept. 30, an automatic assumption was that most were women. But roughly 14,000 of the victims were male and 12,000 female, according to a scientific survey sample produced by the Pentagon.



Knowing that between 1 in 4 and 1 in 5 female college students will survive at least one rape or attempted rape during their time on campus?  That's obnoxious.  
Click to expand...

The one-in-five figure is based on the Campus Sexual Assault Study, commissioned by the National Institute of Justice and conducted from 2005 to 2007. Two prominent criminologists, Northeastern University’s James Alan Fox and Mount Holyoke College’s Richard Moran, have noted its weaknesses:

“The estimated 19% sexual assault rate among college women is based on a survey at two large four-year universities, which might not accurately reflect our nation’s colleges overall. In addition, the survey had a large non-response rate, with the clear possibility that those who had been victimized were more apt to have completed the questionnaire, resulting in an inflated prevalence figure.”

Fox and Moran also point out that the study used an overly broad definition of sexual assault. Respondents were counted as sexual assault victims if they had been subject to “attempted forced kissing” or any in intimate encounters while intoxicated.






Living in a society where 1 in 4 women experience intimate partner violence?  That's obnoxious. 
Click to expand...

Domestic violence is a terrible thing no matter who the victim. It's also terrible that the Justice Department nor any other agencies will fund research on domestic violence perpetuated against men. Because they refuse to do the research, people are able to perpetuate such myths as women are only violent when defending themselves, or that men could more easily leave a violent relationship.

There are very few shelter that cater to men and the majority of shelters available will only take women and children, many even have an age limit on the boys that they will take in, a maximum on 13 years old. Much more money is spent on women’s programs, and more programs are started on in defense of women who are victims of domestic violence despite the fact that men are almost equally or in some cases more likely to be victims of both physical abuse.

In out society there is a huge taboo against men reporting domestic violence and men who do report physical violence are more likely to be ridiculed by not only the public but even law enforcement.



Feeling guilty over an inappropriate shirt?  Not quite as inconvenient.
Click to expand...


This man just played a large role of one of man kinds greatest accomplishments. He knew he was going to get a large audience because of it. Instead of thinking about himself he probably thought "oh, it would make my friend really happy if I wore that shirt she made me". Hell, he might have even thought "this would be a good chance to help my friends business, if people see this shirt, they might wanna buy it!" (which it did, the shirt sold out immediately after)

I don't think there was anything selfish or inappropriate about him wearing a shirt with animated girls. I mean seriously, what is the actual issue?


People are ignoring the important accomplishment in this mans life (and one of the most important in the space travelling) and judging him based on what he's wearing.

Now imagine a firestorm if people tried to judge a woman based on her clothes and not accomplishments.



If only a portion of the energy misspent demonizing feminists were instead used to fight sexism, we'd all enjoy a more just and equitable society.
Click to expand...

I agree but this goes both ways.

If many self proclaimed feminists spent only a portion of the time and energy they dispense demonizing male sexuality and belittling peoples accomplishments to accomplish something great of their own, we would enjoy a more just and equitable society.

 
 
dankenstien88 said:
You know what's really obnoxious?  Sexism.  
Click to expand...
Sexism is obnoxious. While I don't agree with ox that all feminists are obnoxious, the vocal minority most certainly can be.

Feminism once recognized that judging people for their sexuality was a bad thing and should never be acceptable. Now they want to judge straight men for their sexuality. It's as pathetic and hypocritical as straight people judging homosexuals.

Nobody judges lonely 40 year old women for reading 50 shades of grey. And I don't think we should be judging a man for wearing a shirt with scantily clad animated women either.



Being paid less for performing the same work?  That's obnoxious.
Click to expand...

The wage gap has been refuted countless times by numerous economists. The 23 cent pay gap is only the difference between the average earnings of all men and women who work full time positions. The wage gap statistic doesn’t compare two similarly situated co-workers of different sexes, working in the same industry, performing the same work, for the same number of hours a day. It merely reflects the median earnings of all men and women classified as full-time workers.

The Department of Labor’s Time Use Survey, for example, finds that the average full-time working man spends 8.14 hours a day on the job, compared to 7.75 hours for the full-time working woman. Employees who work more likely earn more. Men working longer than women alone explains about one-quarter of the wage gap.

There are lots of other factors at play.

Men and women tend to gravitate toward different industries. The argument could be made that women are forced into lower-paying sectors of the economy. But that sounds a lot like "His tacky shirt is why I didn't STEM major" and I believe if someone has enough interest in a field, they will pursue it. Even within groups with the same educational attainment, women gravitate towards fields of study, such as sociology, liberal arts or psychology. These are fields that have always paid less in the labor market.

Men tend to take jobs with less desirable characteristics in pursuit of higher pay. They work longer hours. They tar roofs in the sun, drive trucks across the country, toil in sewer systems, stand watch as prison guards, and risk injury on fishing boats, in coal mines, and in production plants. Such jobs pay more than others because otherwise no one would want to do them. Nearly all the most dangerous occupations, such as loggers or iron workers, are majority male and 92% of work-related deaths in 2012 were to men.

The supposed pay gap becomes very apparent when marriage and children enter the picture.There is no question that children play an important role in men and women’s work-life decisions. If a mother chooses to take care of her children herself she effectively takes herself out of the labor market. When they return its no surprise that those women will have less work experience than similarly-aged males.

Many working mothers who choose to continue to work will seek jobs that provide greater flexibility, such as telecommuting or flexible hours. Not all jobs can be flexible, and those which flexible almost always pay less than those which are not. Women who have children or plan to have children tend to be willing to trade higher pay in exchange for more time with their children. In contrast, men with children typically seek to earn more money in order to support their children and spouse, often taking on more hours and less attractive positions to do so.

Academics can debate why men and women make these different choices. The important takeaway, however, is that there are many reasons that men and women on average earn different amounts. It’s a mistake to assume that “wage gap” statistics reflect on-the-job discrimination.



Comprising half the workforce, yet accounting for 60% of minimum wage jobs and less than 8% of the top-earning jobs at Fortune 500 companies?  That's obnoxious.  
Click to expand...
60 to 40 is a rather narrow gap and those numbers do not take into consideration the age or experience of the minimum wage workers. I find it hypocritical that many feminists claim they are for equality and demand equal numbers in fields that offer higher pay, yet never mention equalizing numbers in areas like homelessness or prison incarceration.



Being more likely to be raped by a fellow soldier than killed in action?  That's obnoxious. 
Click to expand...

It is obnoxious, it's despicable and I don't think anyone in their right mind would condone it. Still though, more men than women are raped every year in the military and there is little coverage on the issue. Also take into consideration women are less likely to be involved in active combat roles, therefore having a higher overall survival rate when compared to men in action.

When the Defense Department released the results of its anonymous sexual abuse survey recently and concluded that 26,000 service members were victims in fiscal 2012, which ended Sept. 30, an automatic assumption was that most were women. But roughly 14,000 of the victims were male and 12,000 female, according to a scientific survey sample produced by the Pentagon.



Knowing that between 1 in 4 and 1 in 5 female college students will survive at least one rape or attempted rape during their time on campus?  That's obnoxious.  
Click to expand...

The one-in-five figure is based on the Campus Sexual Assault Study, commissioned by the National Institute of Justice and conducted from 2005 to 2007. Two prominent criminologists, Northeastern University’s James Alan Fox and Mount Holyoke College’s Richard Moran, have noted its weaknesses:

“The estimated 19% sexual assault rate among college women is based on a survey at two large four-year universities, which might not accurately reflect our nation’s colleges overall. In addition, the survey had a large non-response rate, with the clear possibility that those who had been victimized were more apt to have completed the questionnaire, resulting in an inflated prevalence figure.”

Fox and Moran also point out that the study used an overly broad definition of sexual assault. Respondents were counted as sexual assault victims if they had been subject to “attempted forced kissing” or any in intimate encounters while intoxicated.






Living in a society where 1 in 4 women experience intimate partner violence?  That's obnoxious. 
Click to expand...

Domestic violence is a terrible thing no matter who the victim. It's also terrible that the Justice Department nor any other agencies will fund research on domestic violence perpetuated against men. Because they refuse to do the research, people are able to perpetuate such myths as women are only violent when defending themselves, or that men could more easily leave a violent relationship.

There are very few shelter that cater to men and the majority of shelters available will only take women and children, many even have an age limit on the boys that they will take in, a maximum on 13 years old. Much more money is spent on women’s programs, and more programs are started on in defense of women who are victims of domestic violence despite the fact that men are almost equally or in some cases more likely to be victims of both physical abuse.

In out society there is a huge taboo against men reporting domestic violence and men who do report physical violence are more likely to be ridiculed by not only the public but even law enforcement.



Feeling guilty over an inappropriate shirt?  Not quite as inconvenient.
Click to expand...


This man just played a large role of one of man kinds greatest accomplishments. He knew he was going to get a large audience because of it. Instead of thinking about himself he probably thought "oh, it would make my friend really happy if I wore that shirt she made me". Hell, he might have even thought "this would be a good chance to help my friends business, if people see this shirt, they might wanna buy it!" (which it did, the shirt sold out immediately after)

I don't think there was anything selfish or inappropriate about him wearing a shirt with animated girls. I mean seriously, what is the actual issue?


People are ignoring the important accomplishment in this mans life (and one of the most important in the space travelling) and judging him based on what he's wearing.

Now imagine a firestorm if people tried to judge a woman based on her clothes and not accomplishments.



If only a portion of the energy misspent demonizing feminists were instead used to fight sexism, we'd all enjoy a more just and equitable society.
Click to expand...

I agree but this goes both ways.

If many self proclaimed feminists spent only a portion of the time and energy they dispense demonizing male sexuality and belittling peoples accomplishments to accomplish something great of their own, we would enjoy a more just and equitable society.

 
Click to expand...

View media item 1263275
View media item 1263277
 
GrimlocK said:
dankenstien88 said:
You know what's really obnoxious?  Sexism.  
Click to expand...
Sexism is obnoxious. While I don't agree with ox that all feminists are obnoxious, the vocal minority most certainly can be.

Feminism once recognized that judging people for their sexuality was a bad thing and should never be acceptable. Now they want to judge straight men for their sexuality. It's as pathetic and hypocritical as straight people judging homosexuals.

Nobody judges lonely 40 year old women for reading 50 shades of grey. And I don't think we should be judging a man for wearing a shirt with scantily clad animated women either.



Being paid less for performing the same work?  That's obnoxious.
Click to expand...

The wage gap has been refuted countless times by numerous economists. The 23 cent pay gap is only the difference between the average earnings of all men and women who work full time positions. The wage gap statistic doesn’t compare two similarly situated co-workers of different sexes, working in the same industry, performing the same work, for the same number of hours a day. It merely reflects the median earnings of all men and women classified as full-time workers.

The Department of Labor’s Time Use Survey, for example, finds that the average full-time working man spends 8.14 hours a day on the job, compared to 7.75 hours for the full-time working woman. Employees who work more likely earn more. Men working longer than women alone explains about one-quarter of the wage gap.

There are lots of other factors at play.

Men and women tend to gravitate toward different industries. The argument could be made that women are forced into lower-paying sectors of the economy. But that sounds a lot like "His tacky shirt is why I didn't STEM major" and I believe if someone has enough interest in a field, they will pursue it. Even within groups with the same educational attainment, women gravitate towards fields of study, such as sociology, liberal arts or psychology. These are fields that have always paid less in the labor market.

Men tend to take jobs with less desirable characteristics in pursuit of higher pay. They work longer hours. They tar roofs in the sun, drive trucks across the country, toil in sewer systems, stand watch as prison guards, and risk injury on fishing boats, in coal mines, and in production plants. Such jobs pay more than others because otherwise no one would want to do them. Nearly all the most dangerous occupations, such as loggers or iron workers, are majority male and 92% of work-related deaths in 2012 were to men.

The supposed pay gap becomes very apparent when marriage and children enter the picture.There is no question that children play an important role in men and women’s work-life decisions. If a mother chooses to take care of her children herself she effectively takes herself out of the labor market. When they return its no surprise that those women will have less work experience than similarly-aged males.

Many working mothers who choose to continue to work will seek jobs that provide greater flexibility, such as telecommuting or flexible hours. Not all jobs can be flexible, and those which flexible almost always pay less than those which are not. Women who have children or plan to have children tend to be willing to trade higher pay in exchange for more time with their children. In contrast, men with children typically seek to earn more money in order to support their children and spouse, often taking on more hours and less attractive positions to do so.

Academics can debate why men and women make these different choices. The important takeaway, however, is that there are many reasons that men and women on average earn different amounts. It’s a mistake to assume that “wage gap” statistics reflect on-the-job discrimination.



Comprising half the workforce, yet accounting for 60% of minimum wage jobs and less than 8% of the top-earning jobs at Fortune 500 companies?  That's obnoxious.  
Click to expand...
60 to 40 is a rather narrow gap and those numbers do not take into consideration the age or experience of the minimum wage workers. I find it hypocritical that many feminists claim they are for equality and demand equal numbers in fields that offer higher pay, yet never mention equalizing numbers in areas like homelessness or prison incarceration.



Being more likely to be raped by a fellow soldier than killed in action?  That's obnoxious. 
Click to expand...

It is obnoxious, it's despicable and I don't think anyone in their right mind would condone it. Still though, more men than women are raped every year in the military and there is little coverage on the issue. Also take into consideration women are less likely to be involved in active combat roles, therefore having a higher overall survival rate when compared to men in action.

When the Defense Department released the results of its anonymous sexual abuse survey recently and concluded that 26,000 service members were victims in fiscal 2012, which ended Sept. 30, an automatic assumption was that most were women. But roughly 14,000 of the victims were male and 12,000 female, according to a scientific survey sample produced by the Pentagon.



Knowing that between 1 in 4 and 1 in 5 female college students will survive at least one rape or attempted rape during their time on campus?  That's obnoxious.  
Click to expand...

The one-in-five figure is based on the Campus Sexual Assault Study, commissioned by the National Institute of Justice and conducted from 2005 to 2007. Two prominent criminologists, Northeastern University’s James Alan Fox and Mount Holyoke College’s Richard Moran, have noted its weaknesses:

“The estimated 19% sexual assault rate among college women is based on a survey at two large four-year universities, which might not accurately reflect our nation’s colleges overall. In addition, the survey had a large non-response rate, with the clear possibility that those who had been victimized were more apt to have completed the questionnaire, resulting in an inflated prevalence figure.”

Fox and Moran also point out that the study used an overly broad definition of sexual assault. Respondents were counted as sexual assault victims if they had been subject to “attempted forced kissing” or any in intimate encounters while intoxicated.






Living in a society where 1 in 4 women experience intimate partner violence?  That's obnoxious. 
Click to expand...

Domestic violence is a terrible thing no matter who the victim. It's also terrible that the Justice Department nor any other agencies will fund research on domestic violence perpetuated against men. Because they refuse to do the research, people are able to perpetuate such myths as women are only violent when defending themselves, or that men could more easily leave a violent relationship.

There are very few shelter that cater to men and the majority of shelters available will only take women and children, many even have an age limit on the boys that they will take in, a maximum on 13 years old. Much more money is spent on women’s programs, and more programs are started on in defense of women who are victims of domestic violence despite the fact that men are almost equally or in some cases more likely to be victims of both physical abuse.

In out society there is a huge taboo against men reporting domestic violence and men who do report physical violence are more likely to be ridiculed by not only the public but even law enforcement.



Feeling guilty over an inappropriate shirt?  Not quite as inconvenient.
Click to expand...


This man just played a large role of one of man kinds greatest accomplishments. He knew he was going to get a large audience because of it. Instead of thinking about himself he probably thought "oh, it would make my friend really happy if I wore that shirt she made me". Hell, he might have even thought "this would be a good chance to help my friends business, if people see this shirt, they might wanna buy it!" (which it did, the shirt sold out immediately after)

I don't think there was anything selfish or inappropriate about him wearing a shirt with animated girls. I mean seriously, what is the actual issue?


People are ignoring the important accomplishment in this mans life (and one of the most important in the space travelling) and judging him based on what he's wearing.

Now imagine a firestorm if people tried to judge a woman based on her clothes and not accomplishments.



If only a portion of the energy misspent demonizing feminists were instead used to fight sexism, we'd all enjoy a more just and equitable society.
Click to expand...

I agree but this goes both ways.

If many self proclaimed feminists spent only a portion of the time and energy they dispense demonizing male sexuality and belittling peoples accomplishments to accomplish something great of their own, we would enjoy a more just and equitable society.

 
Click to expand...

View media item 1263275
View media item 1263277
Click to expand...
That golden snake cane is so gangsta :pimp:
 
Cedric Ceballos said:
 
indifferent.gif
 
indifferent.gif
 
indifferent.gif
  to each of the 3 people who voted that the shirt was offensive.
Click to expand...
I was one of those people.

I'm all for free expression and ish like that.

And clearly his administation didn't give an F because dude got results (and quite frankly neither do I).

Obviously dude wasn't trying to be demeaning and I agree that it's really not but at the same time I'm not gonna tell women how they should feel about stuff that pertains directly to them.

It's not my place. I don't do to other what I don't want done to me. I hate when people tell me how I should feel "as a man..." "as a this.." "as a that..." F that noise.

If people of a certain group feel some kind of way about it I'm going to say ok. This is how you feel. I respect that. I'm not about to go around telling people their feelings are wrong.

They certainly can have a wrong view of the shirt's intent but definitely not a wrong way to feel.

What I would object to is people using their feelings to hurt someone's career.  Life goes on and I'm sure they will find something to fake care about soon enough.

"Fire this man for offending me!" .....f out of here.  You don't have the right to NOT be offended.

/rant.
 
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The question is "Is it sexist" I'd assume a person to read and interpret the question as is it sexist to you not to other ppl. So the question of telling a woman what's sexist and what's not shouldn't even factor in to it.
 
If all it takes is a shirt to offend you to not get into these types of fields than you don't deserve to be apart of this community.

Man-kinds first landing on a comet, overshadowed by gender whining by feminists. :smh:
 
dankenstien88 said:
You know what's really obnoxious?  Sexism.  
Click to expand...
Sexism is obnoxious. While I don't agree with ox that all feminists are obnoxious, the vocal minority most certainly can be.

Feminism once recognized that judging people for their sexuality was a bad thing and should never be acceptable. Now they want to judge straight men for their sexuality. It's as pathetic and hypocritical as straight people judging homosexuals.

Nobody judges lonely 40 year old women for reading 50 shades of grey. And I don't think we should be judging a man for wearing a shirt with scantily clad animated women either.



Being paid less for performing the same work?  That's obnoxious.
Click to expand...

The wage gap has been refuted countless times by numerous economists. The 23 cent pay gap is only the difference between the average earnings of all men and women who work full time positions. The wage gap statistic doesn’t compare two similarly situated co-workers of different sexes, working in the same industry, performing the same work, for the same number of hours a day. It merely reflects the median earnings of all men and women classified as full-time workers.

The Department of Labor’s Time Use Survey, for example, finds that the average full-time working man spends 8.14 hours a day on the job, compared to 7.75 hours for the full-time working woman. Employees who work more likely earn more. Men working longer than women alone explains about one-quarter of the wage gap.

There are lots of other factors at play.

Men and women tend to gravitate toward different industries. The argument could be made that women are forced into lower-paying sectors of the economy. But that sounds a lot like "His tacky shirt is why I didn't STEM major" and I believe if someone has enough interest in a field, they will pursue it. Even within groups with the same educational attainment, women gravitate towards fields of study, such as sociology, liberal arts or psychology. These are fields that have always paid less in the labor market.

Men tend to take jobs with less desirable characteristics in pursuit of higher pay. They work longer hours. They tar roofs in the sun, drive trucks across the country, toil in sewer systems, stand watch as prison guards, and risk injury on fishing boats, in coal mines, and in production plants. Such jobs pay more than others because otherwise no one would want to do them. Nearly all the most dangerous occupations, such as loggers or iron workers, are majority male and 92% of work-related deaths in 2012 were to men.

The supposed pay gap becomes very apparent when marriage and children enter the picture.There is no question that children play an important role in men and women’s work-life decisions. If a mother chooses to take care of her children herself she effectively takes herself out of the labor market. When they return its no surprise that those women will have less work experience than similarly-aged males.

Many working mothers who choose to continue to work will seek jobs that provide greater flexibility, such as telecommuting or flexible hours. Not all jobs can be flexible, and those which flexible almost always pay less than those which are not. Women who have children or plan to have children tend to be willing to trade higher pay in exchange for more time with their children. In contrast, men with children typically seek to earn more money in order to support their children and spouse, often taking on more hours and less attractive positions to do so.

Academics can debate why men and women make these different choices. The important takeaway, however, is that there are many reasons that men and women on average earn different amounts. It’s a mistake to assume that “wage gap” statistics reflect on-the-job discrimination.



Comprising half the workforce, yet accounting for 60% of minimum wage jobs and less than 8% of the top-earning jobs at Fortune 500 companies?  That's obnoxious.  
Click to expand...
60 to 40 is a rather narrow gap and those numbers do not take into consideration the age or experience of the minimum wage workers. I find it hypocritical that many feminists claim they are for equality and demand equal numbers in fields that offer higher pay, yet never mention equalizing numbers in areas like homelessness or prison incarceration.



Being more likely to be raped by a fellow soldier than killed in action?  That's obnoxious. 
Click to expand...

It is obnoxious, it's despicable and I don't think anyone in their right mind would condone it. Still though, more men than women are raped every year in the military and there is little coverage on the issue. Also take into consideration women are less likely to be involved in active combat roles, therefore having a higher overall survival rate when compared to men in action.

When the Defense Department released the results of its anonymous sexual abuse survey recently and concluded that 26,000 service members were victims in fiscal 2012, which ended Sept. 30, an automatic assumption was that most were women. But roughly 14,000 of the victims were male and 12,000 female, according to a scientific survey sample produced by the Pentagon.



Knowing that between 1 in 4 and 1 in 5 female college students will survive at least one rape or attempted rape during their time on campus?  That's obnoxious.  
Click to expand...

The one-in-five figure is based on the Campus Sexual Assault Study, commissioned by the National Institute of Justice and conducted from 2005 to 2007. Two prominent criminologists, Northeastern University’s James Alan Fox and Mount Holyoke College’s Richard Moran, have noted its weaknesses:

“The estimated 19% sexual assault rate among college women is based on a survey at two large four-year universities, which might not accurately reflect our nation’s colleges overall. In addition, the survey had a large non-response rate, with the clear possibility that those who had been victimized were more apt to have completed the questionnaire, resulting in an inflated prevalence figure.”

Fox and Moran also point out that the study used an overly broad definition of sexual assault. Respondents were counted as sexual assault victims if they had been subject to “attempted forced kissing” or any in intimate encounters while intoxicated.






Living in a society where 1 in 4 women experience intimate partner violence?  That's obnoxious. 
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Domestic violence is a terrible thing no matter who the victim. It's also terrible that the Justice Department nor any other agencies will fund research on domestic violence perpetuated against men. Because they refuse to do the research, people are able to perpetuate such myths as women are only violent when defending themselves, or that men could more easily leave a violent relationship.

There are very few shelter that cater to men and the majority of shelters available will only take women and children, many even have an age limit on the boys that they will take in, a maximum on 13 years old. Much more money is spent on women’s programs, and more programs are started on in defense of women who are victims of domestic violence despite the fact that men are almost equally or in some cases more likely to be victims of both physical abuse.

In out society there is a huge taboo against men reporting domestic violence and men who do report physical violence are more likely to be ridiculed by not only the public but even law enforcement.



Feeling guilty over an inappropriate shirt?  Not quite as inconvenient.
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This man just played a large role of one of man kinds greatest accomplishments. He knew he was going to get a large audience because of it. Instead of thinking about himself he probably thought "oh, it would make my friend really happy if I wore that shirt she made me". Hell, he might have even thought "this would be a good chance to help my friends business, if people see this shirt, they might wanna buy it!" (which it did, the shirt sold out immediately after)

I don't think there was anything selfish or inappropriate about him wearing a shirt with animated girls. I mean seriously, what is the actual issue?


People are ignoring the important accomplishment in this mans life (and one of the most important in the space travelling) and judging him based on what he's wearing.

Now imagine a firestorm if people tried to judge a woman based on her clothes and not accomplishments.



If only a portion of the energy misspent demonizing feminists were instead used to fight sexism, we'd all enjoy a more just and equitable society.
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I agree but this goes both ways.

If many self proclaimed feminists spent only a portion of the time and energy they dispense demonizing male sexuality and belittling peoples accomplishments to accomplish something great of their own, we would enjoy a more just and equitable society.

 
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Son...

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There's little quite so ironic as saying fiercely sexist things in attempt to dismiss the need for feminism.  

The backlash to the backlash in these cases couldn't be more self-defeating.  Yeah, your virtual No Ma'am rally sure disproves the whole "sexism" myth.  
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dankenstien88 said:
 
You know what's really obnoxious?  Sexism.  
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Sexism is obnoxious. While I don't agree with ox that all feminists are obnoxious, the vocal minority most certainly can be.

Feminism once recognized that judging people for their sexuality was a bad thing and should never be acceptable. Now they want to judge straight men for their sexuality. It's as pathetic and hypocritical as straight people judging homosexuals.

Nobody judges lonely 40 year old women for reading 50 shades of grey. And I don't think we should be judging a man for wearing a shirt with scantily clad animated women either.

 
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Right off the bat, you're coming across like somebody who says "I thought that judging people by the color of their skin is racist... so the REAL racists are Al Sharpton and Jesse Jackson!"  Think about it.  

I don't see anyone "judging straight men for their sexuality" here.  I'm attracted to women.  I don't have to wear a shirt objectifying women while representing myself professionally.  That's not part of my sexuality.  

Whatever happened to professionalism?  People get fired every day for things they post on social media whether they're actively speaking on behalf of their organization or not.  In this case, the individual was clearly in position to represent his organization.  He made a poor choice and was reprimanded.  I fail to see how that's so oppressive.

The criticism is very easy to understand.  As a woman, you're probably not going to feel 100% welcome in an organization where guys are wearing shirts like this.  

A lot of you guys raise a fuss whenever somebody posts pictures of male actors/models in their underpants, and your gender does not have the same history of sexual objectification.  (An obvious exception there would be the fetishism of Black bodies and the "hypersexualized" portrayals that reduce Black men to their genitals.  Someone would not likely feel comfortable in a workplace environment where a bunch of White people were wearing clothing featuring such portrayals.)  

Being paid less for performing the same work?  That's obnoxious.
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The wage gap has been refuted countless times by numerous economists. The 23 cent pay gap is only the difference between the average earnings of all men and women who work full time positions. The wage gap statistic doesn’t compare two similarly situated co-workers of different sexes, working in the same industry, performing the same work, for the same number of hours a day. It merely reflects the median earnings of all men and women classified as full-time workers.

The Department of Labor’s Time Use Survey, for example, finds that the average full-time working man spends 8.14 hours a day on the job, compared to 7.75 hours for the full-time working woman. Employees who work more likely earn more. Men working longer than women alone explains about one-quarter of the wage gap.

There are lots of other factors at play.

Men and women tend to gravitate toward different industries. The argument could be made that women are forced into lower-paying sectors of the economy. But that sounds a lot like "His tacky shirt is why I didn't STEM major" and I believe if someone has enough interest in a field, they will pursue it. Even within groups with the same educational attainment, women gravitate towards fields of study, such as sociology, liberal arts or psychology. These are fields that have always paid less in the labor market.

Men tend to take jobs with less desirable characteristics in pursuit of higher pay. They work longer hours. They tar roofs in the sun, drive trucks across the country, toil in sewer systems, stand watch as prison guards, and risk injury on fishing boats, in coal mines, and in production plants. Such jobs pay more than others because otherwise no one would want to do them. Nearly all the most dangerous occupations, such as loggers or iron workers, are majority male and 92% of work-related deaths in 2012 were to men.

The supposed pay gap becomes very apparent when marriage and children enter the picture.There is no question that children play an important role in men and women’s work-life decisions. If a mother chooses to take care of her children herself she effectively takes herself out of the labor market. When they return its no surprise that those women will have less work experience than similarly-aged males.

Many working mothers who choose to continue to work will seek jobs that provide greater flexibility, such as telecommuting or flexible hours. Not all jobs can be flexible, and those which flexible almost always pay less than those which are not. Women who have children or plan to have children tend to be willing to trade higher pay in exchange for more time with their children. In contrast, men with children typically seek to earn more money in order to support their children and spouse, often taking on more hours and less attractive positions to do so.

Academics can debate why men and women make these different choices. The important takeaway, however, is that there are many reasons that men and women on average earn different amounts. It’s a mistake to assume that “wage gap” statistics reflect on-the-job discrimination.
 
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You haven't followed this through very far - just to the point where you found confirmation of your bias.  The gap has not been "refuted."  Different studies have attempted to pick away at the 77 cents per dollar figure, but no combination of intervening factors has managed to erase the gap as a whole.  

Differences in college majors do not account for the entirety of the wage gap.  Studies have examined disparities WITHIN fields and found significant pay gaps.  You can find pay gaps between men and women holding the same positions in the same industries.  

http://www.businessweek.com/article...men-even-when-they-are-equally-qualified-mbas  We can cite these sorts of studies by the bushel.  

Nickel and dime your way out of it all you like, the pay gap is real.  Is it 77 cents on the dollar?  That's overly simplistic.  Disparities vary by industry and pure apples to apples comparisons are challenging.  

We don't even have a law in this country that demands equal pay for equal work - and I think one could reasonably ask why that is.  

At a certain point, either you acknowledge the reality there or you try to wash it away by simply expressing the stereotype.  (e.g. b-b-b-but maybe the man just makes more because he's better at his job!  Ever think of THAT?!?)
Comprising half the workforce, yet accounting for 60% of minimum wage jobs and less than 8% of the top-earning jobs at Fortune 500 companies?  That's obnoxious.  
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60 to 40 is a rather narrow gap and those numbers do not take into consideration the age or experience of the minimum wage workers. I find it hypocritical that many feminists claim they are for equality and demand equal numbers in fields that offer higher pay, yet never mention equalizing numbers in areas like homelessness or prison incarceration.
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This is specious at best and comes across as just plain bitter.  It's like saying "I don't hear any of you gay rights supporters arguing that there should be more gays in prison or in poverty."  

It's something I remember hearing as an undergraduate, and often from the same people who thought "BET" was racist for excluding Whites.  "How come they want equality, but they're content to let guys buy drinks for them on ladies night, or open the door for them, or to live in the only dorm building with air conditioning!!  IT'S NOT FAIR!!!"  

There's no debating that men benefit from sexism.  That's sort of the point.  It's one of the oldest forms of systematic oppression on the planet.  

Are there costs associated with sexism?  Of course.  Until recently, the expectation that men serve as the "breadwinners" in a nuclear family cut both ways.  Obviously it hurts women more than men, but what happens to the man who can't "provide" in this way?  If our society so prizes masculinity and all the privilege it entails as a core component of one's identity and self-worth, how would it feel to fall short in one's role?  Tally's Corner is a classic example.  

One could certainly argue that heterosexism is related to sexism, in that both involve limited gender roles.  A "masculine" woman is viewed negatively.  (Which is a big problem if "masculine" traits like assertiveness are viewed as essential to succeeding in the workplace.)  An "effeminate" man is viewed negatively.  We all suffer certain consequences associated with sexism and the ways in which it circumscribes our existence. 

There's good reason for men to work towards dismantling sexism.  That said, it's silly to pretend that the whole structure doesn't exist, fist and foremost, to serve men.  
Being more likely to be raped by a fellow soldier  than killed in action?  That's obnoxious. 
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It is obnoxious, it's despicable and I don't think anyone in their right mind would condone it. Still though, more men than women are raped every year in the military and there is little coverage on the issue. Also take into consideration women are less likely to be involved in active combat roles, therefore having a higher overall survival rate when compared to men in action.

When the Defense Department released the results of its anonymous sexual abuse survey recently and concluded that 26,000 service members were victims in fiscal 2012, which ended Sept. 30, an automatic assumption was that most were women. But roughly 14,000 of the victims were male and 12,000 female, according to a scientific survey sample produced by the Pentagon.
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Again, you're consciously choosing to overlook the fact that there are far more men enlisted in the military than women.  Proportionally speaking, women are far, FAR more likely to be raped or sexually assaulted than men.  If you put a single woman in a men's prison, you could say "well, only one woman was raped - and thousands of men were."  

It's kind of offensive to use that tactic, honestly.  

You can't sit there and tell me that women aren't at greater risk than men.  The disparity doesn't need to be 100:0 to matter.  

The truth of it is, as a man, I go through my daily life without having to worry about how to defend myself against sexual assault.  I don't have that thought process.  

Think about "stop and frisk" or "stand your ground" and White privilege.  Most White Americans do not have to instruct their children on how to protect themselves from the police.  It's expected that the police are there to assist and serve them.  
 
Knowing that between 1 in 4 and 1 in 5 female college students will survive at least one rape or attempted rape during their time on campus?  That's obnoxious.  
Click to expand...
The one-in-five figure is based on the Campus Sexual Assault Study, commissioned by the National Institute of Justice and conducted from 2005 to 2007. Two prominent criminologists, Northeastern University’s James Alan Fox and Mount Holyoke College’s Richard Moran, have noted its weaknesses:

“The estimated 19% sexual assault rate among college women is based on a survey at two large four-year universities, which might not accurately reflect our nation’s colleges overall. In addition, the survey had a large non-response rate, with the clear possibility that those who had been victimized were more apt to have completed the questionnaire, resulting in an inflated prevalence figure.”

Fox and Moran also point out that the study used an overly broad definition of sexual assault. Respondents were counted as sexual assault victims if they had been subject to “attempted forced kissing” or any in intimate encounters while intoxicated.
Click to expand...
In general, we know that rape is grossly UNDER-reported.  The same is true of domestic violence.

It always amazes me how badly certain people want to minimize anything that attempts to demonstrate the scope of the problem. 

You're trying to minimize this.  I'd like to know why.  

Again, there are biases in the other direction that PREVENT people from reporting these crimes.  Just look at the way our society shames and stigmatizes rape victims.  If you wanted to put a traumatic incident behind you, would you want to expose yourself to that?  

If the "true" number were closer to 1 in 10, would you be happy with that?  What about 1 in 20?  

At what point are you cool with this?  Or can we accept the point as valid, that the menace of sexual assault for women is probably a little bigger of a deal than being "forced" to wear professional attire when representing your organization in a public interview.  
Living in a society where 1 in 4 women experience intimate partner violence?  That's obnoxious. 
Click to expand...
Domestic violence is a terrible thing no matter who the victim. It's also terrible that the Justice Department nor any other agencies will fund research on domestic violence perpetuated against men. Because they refuse to do the research, people are able to perpetuate such myths as women are only violent when defending themselves, or that men could more easily leave a violent relationship.

There are very few shelter that cater to men and the majority of shelters available will only take women and children, many even have an age limit on the boys that they will take in, a maximum on 13 years old. Much more money is spent on women’s programs, and more programs are started on in defense of women who are victims of domestic violence despite the fact that men are almost equally or in some cases more likely to be victims of both physical abuse.

In out society there is a huge taboo against men reporting domestic violence and men who do report physical violence are more likely to be ridiculed by not only the public but even law enforcement.
Click to expand...
There's a "huge taboo" against women reporting domestic violence.  In a society where men earn more than women, there's also a significant pressure on mothers to remain with their abuser for the sake of their children.  

For some reason, you really seem to think we're living in a country where men get a raw deal.  

And, again, I can't help but be reminded of all those "Tea Party" voters who think that working-class White men are the "true victims" in our society, and that everyone else gets a free ride at their expense.  

Anyone who would tell a man who's been abused to "man up" is, ironically, engaging in sexist behavior - because it invokes that same concept of masculinity that privileges men in general to demean or belittle the male victims of intimate partner violence.  

A society without such toxic gender stereotypes would not apply the same pressures to men who've been abused.  

If the word "weak" is seen as antithetical to masculinity - if it invalidates your self-worth as a man - then what does that say about the way our society views women?  

We're arguing the same point here, in that sense.  
Feeling guilty over an inappropriate shirt?  Not quite  as inconvenient.
Click to expand...
This man just played a large role of one of man kinds greatest accomplishments. He knew he was going to get a large audience because of it. Instead of thinking about himself he probably thought "oh, it would make my friend really happy if I wore that shirt she made me". Hell, he might have even thought "this would be a good chance to help my friends business, if people see this shirt, they might wanna buy it!" (which it did, the shirt sold out immediately after)

I don't think there was anything selfish or inappropriate about him wearing a shirt with animated girls. I mean seriously, what is the actual issue?


People are ignoring the important accomplishment in this mans life (and one of the most important in the space travelling) and judging him based on what he's wearing.

Now imagine a firestorm if people tried to judge a woman based on her clothes and not accomplishments.
Click to expand...
Thomas Jefferson was a slave owner and a rapist.  

Am I not allowed to criticize him because of his accomplishments?  

This guy was representing more than just himself in this interview.  He made a poor choice.  If the shirt had minstrel characters on it, I know I'd feel some type of way about that.  (And then, of course, we'd learn that his Black friend, Pierre de la Croix, made the shirt...)

Is it the biggest problem in the world?  Of course not, but it was problematic all the same.  
If only a portion  of the energy misspent demonizing feminists were instead used to fight sexism, we'd all enjoy a more just and equitable society.
Click to expand...
I agree but this goes both ways.

If many self proclaimed feminists spent only a portion of the time and energy they dispense demonizing male sexuality and belittling peoples accomplishments to accomplish something great of their own, we would enjoy a more just and equitable society.
Click to expand...
Cultural criticism has value.  It's incredibly important to expose the biases concealed in plain sight.  

Look at James Baldwin's "The Devil Finds Work."  Tell me that's just "demonizing and belittling people's cinematic accomplishments."  

This is necessary work. 
BLASTERCOMBO said:
 
ShotsRangOut said:
and as usual dudes just gonna ignore the best post in here. Why am I not surprised...
tired.gif
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What does complaining about a shirt have to do with defeating those problems? I'm not anti females AT ALL but Explain to me how blowing up this topic about a Tshirt will somehow raise pay for females?


What was posted wasn't incorrect but it was directed to another post someone made, not really the topic
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Why is it only acceptable to complain about sexism when it's a matter of life and death?  

You guys post comments on social media sites over anything and everything.  Nobody complains that your posts about Nike resellers aren't advancing our society.  

Many people are following the comet lander for its own sake.  If you were watching this interview for the first time for that reason and noticed the shirt, would it really be so wrong of you to comment on it?  

Are there other instances of sexism out there that are more deserving of our collective attention than this?  Sure, but there were men on death row facing execution over prosecutorial prejudice back when Henry Louis Gates was arrested for trying to enter his own home.  Should we have just forgotten about the latter?  

I don't think so.  

Certainly, there are some phony activists out there who ONLY seem to care when it's a big, public spectacle, but anyone sincerely concerned about these issues shouldn't be expected to bite their tongues unless the example meets YOUR standard for significance. 
LIONBLOOD said:
 
I used to consider myself a feminist, but these days I want nothing to do with it. It's become a such a spectacle.
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So, you're more concerned with what people will think of you than with equality? 

People are demonizing feminism, so the only logical thing to do is to pack it up and just be an imaginary ally?  

Help me understand this.  

Cedric Ceballos said:
 
indifferent.gif
 
indifferent.gif
 
indifferent.gif
  to each of the 3 people who voted that the shirt was offensive.
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You can count me among those three.  Deal with it. 
BLASTERCOMBO said:
He's getting banned
laugh.gif



nerd.gif
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He's not getting banned for what he posted.  I find some of the arguments inherently disrespectful, but part of the point of a forum like this is to leverage diversity to enhance understanding.  We can't achieve that if we limit our community to only those who all think the same way about everything.  

Overt sexism isn't gonna fly, but we welcome reasoned discussions of the issues. 
 
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If the shirt had minstrel characters on it, I know I'd feel some type of way about that. (And then, of course, we'd learn that his Black friend, Pierre de la Croix, made the shirt...)
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:rofl: I'm dying

Couldn't even keep reading after that. Had to compose myself.
 
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