2017 NBA Playoffs Thread - CLE @ BOS Game 5 on TNT

[antidope]

Those things are not the same. Taking LeBron James off of any basketball team makes them unquestionably worse. Making the argument that removing a top 5 player from a team somehow makes them better is something else entirely and it's nonsense.

 

[rbk93]

It's not entirely the same, but it's a comparable argument.  Both teams are better with LeBron/Kawhi, but their actual value to the team is subjective.

People really think Kyrie can't pass when that's not his role on the team, the same as people thinking Aldridge is trash when he just put up 32/14 in a series clinching win with Kawhi out.

 

[nick.]

It's that kinda day, huh?

 

[NickFolarin]

 
If GS don't win this year they will probably go after Blake or Paul George this summer. Can't have enough all stars.

Kinda funny, cuz that's what Bron did midseason this year.... after they won the title. Can't have enough playmakers.

 

[Based Jesus]

 

How do you manage to draft 3 MVP caliber players in consecutive years as well as a shot blocking big who would later expand his range and still eff it up?

Entire front office should be fired. Smh.

Harden didn't want to play behind Westbrook as far as I see it.

Harden had no issue with his role but felt he deserved to be payed more, which he did. FO wasn't trying to hear that for a bench player, so he went to Houston and that was the beginning of the end for the dynasty that never was.

 

[KMante]

 

You gotta pull up after that

is what It is man.. I expected shots like that. Don't bother me. You share something with nt got to know it's going to get brought up in an argument by someone who don't know how to act right over the net. Learned that a long time ago. I only share what I wouldn't mind being thrown back at me.
I've shared bout my illness in other threads. No big Thing..

Oh that was a real shot? I thought it was tongue in cheek, like if someone were to be like "If that's what you think, cool, but be sure to tighten your helmet when you go out today."

But that's a real shot? Nah, he's out the thread. We don't need that.

Seriously. 

 

 

[NickFolarin]

 

 

How do you manage to draft 3 MVP caliber players in consecutive years as well as a shot blocking big who would later expand his range and still eff it up?

Entire front office should be fired. Smh.

Harden didn't want to play behind Westbrook as far as I see it.

Harden had no issue with his role but felt he deserved to be payed more, which he did. FO wasn't trying to hear that for a bench player, so he went to Houston and that was the beginning of the end for the dynasty that never was.

Crazy thing was they were treating him like he WASN'T a productive 3rd overall pick 

 

[rbk93]

 
Harden had no issue with his role but felt he deserved to be payed more, which he did. FO was trying to hear that for a bench player, so he went to Houston and that was the beginning of the end for the dynasty that never was.

Think about it though, if Harden really wanted to stay there, that 4 million dollar difference is pretty measly.  He forced a trade out of OKC.

His earning power as a 6th man isn't the same as it is now in Houston.

 

[Proposition Joe]

Oh that was a real shot? I thought it was tongue in cheek, like if someone were to be like "If that's what you think, cool, but be sure to tighten your helmet when you go out today."

But that's a real shot? Nah, he's out the thread. We don't need that.

Calling people bottom ******* is okay though? He took it to far but dudes been taking personal shots and him and me for a while now.

 

[NickFolarin]

Just curious. With the salary cap how it is now. Will we ever see a 6th man get a max contract?

 

[rbk93]

We already have unless you're talking about a 5 year max.

 

[NickFolarin]

 
We already have unless you're talking about a 5 year max.

I never considered Harden a 6th man. I felt we all knew he was a starter on the bench. I mean someone like a Lou Will, JR Smith, or Jamal Crawford role

 

[rbk93]

Probably, in a few years.  Just not sure who it would be.

 

[Proposition Joe]

Considering the sample size is also small to why people think Kyrie/Love wouldn't be a playoff team without LeBron, this is a fair argument.  


Narratives though.

4-21 without lebron, didn't they lose for like weeks straight when he sat out and all other players played. Sample size is a little bigger.

 

[rbk93]

4-21 without lebron, didn't they lose for like weeks straight when he sat out and all other players played. Sample size is a little bigger.

Meh.

 

[dman14]

 

 

How do you manage to draft 3 MVP caliber players in consecutive years as well as a shot blocking big who would later expand his range and still eff it up?


Entire front office should be fired. Smh.

Harden didn't want to play behind Westbrook as far as I see it.

Harden had no issue with his role but felt he deserved to be payed more, which he did. FO wasn't trying to hear that for a bench player, so he went to Houston and that was the beginning of the end for the dynasty that never was.

Crazy thing was they were treating him like he WASN'T a productive 3rd overall pick 

it's all about the money
i think he would've more than willing to take okc's max offer. it's not like he wasn't getting minutes. he was basically finishing gm similar to manu's role
mgmt low-balled him over a few millions which for a young kid with an ego, not a great decision

 

[MVP]

Think about it though, if Harden really wanted to stay there, that 4 million dollar difference is pretty measly.  He forced a trade out of OKC.


His earning power as a 6th man isn't the same as it is now in Houston.

This is false. It's the principle of the matter. He couldn't force a trade considering he was still under contract and was still going to enter RFA the following summer. OKC still could have maxed him out.

 

[darthska]

 
We already have unless you're talking about a 5 year max.

I never considered Harden a 6th man. I felt we all knew he was a starter on the bench. I mean someone like a Lou Will, JR Smith, or Jamal Crawford role

If he would have stuck around, I think he would have been a starter. Durant/Thabo at the 2/3 spots would have been Beard at the 2 and KD at the 3 real quick.

Methinks.

I definitely didn't think of him as a definite starter at that time, though, especially after that '12 Finals. If Lamar Odom and Manu Ginobili can come off the bench, so can Har_en. There are DEFINITELY games in LO's and Manu's career where the argument could be made that they definitely should be starters, but the fact remains they flourish coming off the bench.

 

[tomdiginson]

If he would have stuck around, I think he would have been a starter. Durant/Thabo at the 2/3 spots would have been Beard at the 2 and KD at the 3 real quick.

Methinks.


I definitely didn't think of him as a definite starter at that time, though, especially after that '12 Finals. If Lamar Odom and Manu Ginobili can come off the bench, so can Har_en. There are DEFINITELY games in LO's and Manu's career where the argument could be made that they definitely should be starters, but the fact remains they flourish coming off the bench.

This, but it just seems like a waste to see players with that kind of potential come of the bench. The funny thing is, you only see glimmers of that potential because of them being relegated to that bench role. If you put them on another team as a starter, you actually see that talent in it's full force just like how we see it with Harden. Long term, I doubt that Harden would have stayed with the Thunder. Could they have retained him longer than they did ? Yes, but as far as keeping him long term, I doubt that was gonna happen.

 

[MVP]

If he would have stuck around, I think he would have been a starter. Durant/Thabo at the 2/3 spots would have been Beard at the 2 and KD at the 3 real quick.

Methinks.


I definitely didn't think of him as a definite starter at that time, though, especially after that '12 Finals. If Lamar Odom and Manu Ginobili can come off the bench, so can Har_en. There are DEFINITELY games in LO's and Manu's career where the argument could be made that they definitely should be starters, but the fact remains they flourish coming off the bench.

This. And his subsequent choking since leaving the Thunder in big moments leads that to being a valid train of thought as well.

 

[rbk93]

This is false. It's the principle of the matter. He couldn't force a trade considering he was still under contract and was still going to enter RFA the following summer. OKC still could have maxed him out.

Again, if he really wanted to stay there, he would have signed whatever "low-ball" offer Presti sent his way.  None of us really know except the people directly involved in the situation.

 

[whiplashtw03]

OKC was up 3-1 to those 73-9 Warriors, and he was a reason they lost 4-3. Not sure what's so hard to understand about that

that he's a huge reason why the team had a 3-1 lead in the first place? that he was playing alongside a player who was equally responsible for the team blowing the lead? why is everybody keep ignoring that part? how terrible Russ was playing for those games. Russ's game is not conductive for winning at the biggest stage.

Then my last sentence doesn't apply to you. It was meant for anyone who felt that way. In my experiences, a lot of people will attack Durant but defend Bron, which always confuses me.

it shouldn't confuse you, teaming up with superstars wasnt peoples issue with durant, players have always teamed up with other superstars. I think most people had a problem with him going to the team that beat him in the western conference finals, a series where his team had the lead.


spurs about to finish them boys anyway  

first of all, the spurs suck & the gsw will go 16-0. second, i guess this is the point where we should agree to disagree.

Bruh GSW won't go undefeated. Get that nonsense out of here.

 

[MVP]

Again, if he really wanted to stay there, he would have signed whatever "low-ball" offer Presti sent his way.  None of us really know except the people directly involved in the situation.

Why would you sign an offer that's a low ball one when you're 23 years old and believe you're a max player. Everybody involved in the situation has gone on record and said he would have stayed had they just offered him the max deal like they did Serge. OKC panicked, were cheap, and undervalued what Harden brought to the table. Only reason he got not minutes in the first place was cause Maynor went down. That's one of Brooks main criticisms.

 

[NickFolarin]

PG - Westbrook

SG - Harden

SF - Durant

PF - J. Green

C - Ibaka

6th - Sefolosha

What could have been...... 

 

[NickFolarin]

 

Again, if he really wanted to stay there, he would have signed whatever "low-ball" offer Presti sent his way.  None of us really know except the people directly involved in the situation.

Why would you sign an offer that's a low ball one when you're 23 years old and believe you're a max player. Everybody involved in the situation has gone on record and said he would have stayed had they just offered him the max deal like they did Serge. OKC panicked, were cheap, and undervalued what Harden brought to the table. Only reason he got not minutes in the first place was cause Maynor went down. That's one of Brooks main criticisms.

What ever happened to Eric Maynor?