meet Terrence Wise, a 36 year old, 2nd-generation fast-food worker

[RIP sleazyy]

The scale is based on children living in households making below 60% of the median income for the given country. Doesn't seem to be meant as a comparison scale. It wouldn't make sense to compare them that way. Most urban areas and like 3/4 of rural areas in Mexico have running water I think.

Also think the UNICEF study linked in the second link has a better break down but I haven't had a chance to read it yet as I haven't been home. But I'm home now, finna give it a look in a bit.

 

[jape]

 
How do you know he didn't strive for something greater? Where are all these jobs that would allow every person earning low wages to move up in the world? 

 i know for damn sure he couldve found a better paying job in 20 years of looking

you cant be that naive

 

[Mark Antony]

I could explain the bigger picture, and that in the end the point is to sell this to a largely selfish nation that blames the poor for its issues, so it can benefit those including the guy mentioned in op, but not sure you would get itI because your mo seems to just be to argue to no real purpose. Not saying he isn't the face, but shouldn't be the face of a proposal that needs to be successful. Unfortunately you need the support of all types. One battle at a time.

 

[jchambers]

I could explain the bigger picture, and that in the end the point is to sell this to a largely selfish nation that blames the poor for its issues, so it can benefit those including the guy mentioned in op, but not sure you would get itI because your mo seems to just be to argue to no real purpose. Not saying he isn't the face, but shouldn't be the face of a proposal that needs to be successful. Unfortunately you need the support of all types. One battle at a time.

So you don't have any quality input for the thread. Got it.

 

[Mark Antony]

As I said, you clearly don't understand. Bless your heart.

 

[boris]

 
 i know for damn sure he couldve found a better paying job in 20 years of looking

you cant be that naive

How much better though? The data that has been presented suggests that a huge portion of American workers earn low wages.

Also I asked:  

 
Where are all these jobs that would allow every person earning low wages to move up in the world? 

 

[frenchbreadbuilds]

Makes sense. So Terrence Wise is a good representation of the average minimum wage worker in this country.

I would say so. I just think that using Terrance as the face of this cause is difficult because so few understand what keeps poor people poor and why it's so difficult to just "do better" and "make better decisions". I mean you already see it in this thread. So many people think that working you way out of poverty is as simple as pulling yourself up by your bootstraps and that Terrance is poor solely because he decided to have kids and stay at the same job for 20 years. I can understand why it would be hard to wrap your mind around it.

 

[Mark Antony]

Makes sense. So Terrence Wise is a good representation of the average minimum wage worker in this country.

I would say so. I just think that using Terrance as the face of this cause is difficult because so few understand what keeps poor people poor and why it's so difficult to just "do better" and "make better decisions". I mean you already see it in this thread. So many people think that working you way out of poverty is as simple as pulling yourself up by your bootstraps and that Terrance is poor solely because he decided to have kids and stay at the same job for 20 years. I can understand why it would be hard to wrap your mind around it.

Exactly, ultimately you have to appeal to those with those misguided thoughts so they'll help support something that will effect change. Show them someone trying much harder than he has. You have to have a better presentation and play the politics right or sit there and be offended while nothing changes.

 

[RIP sleazyy]

Sad thing is people don't care about the good examples because they don't tend to be these extreme cases like Terrence, where you can point out the perceived flaws in what he is doing. They don't coverage.

The examples that we tend to see getting the most conversation aren't the cases where someone working a "good" job is struggling, it's the fast food worker who people think doesn't deserve more because of the simplicity of his job.

Coupled with most people not understanding generational poverty, or lack of education due to uncontrollable circumstances, blaming the poor for being poor, seeing poor people as undeserving or meant strictly to service those with more, and the boot straps mentality.. we end up where we are.

People just don't know. The lack of education and inflated egos are hurting the cause.

 

[Mark Antony]

True, but the brute force, in your face approach will never work with someone with a lack of education and an inflated ego. Never. Ease it in so the right thing gets done, deal with the opposition's education afterwards. Otherwise we're just screaming in circles, no progress.


Then again maybe i've been in corporate and maneuvering it's politics for too long.

 

[jchambers]

As I said, you clearly don't understand. Bless your heart.

Yeah, you're right. I guess that the many economists who disagree with you are all wrong too. LOL @ acting like raising the minimum wage is an unequivocal decision that will cure the ails of the working class. Little weak snide remarks aren't progressive, they are just a weak attempt at masking your inability to form a coherent explanation.

 

[jchambers]

Makes sense. So Terrence Wise is a good representation of the average minimum wage worker in this country.

I would say so. I just think that using Terrance as the face of this cause is difficult because so few understand what keeps poor people poor and why it's so difficult to just "do better" and "make better decisions". I mean you already see it in this thread. So many people think that working you way out of poverty is as simple as pulling yourself up by your bootstraps and that Terrance is poor solely because he decided to have kids and stay at the same job for 20 years. I can understand why it would be hard to wrap your mind around it.

What you are basically saying is that Minimum wage isn't the most important issue concerning poverty in this country. I don't disagree with that. When people in this thread talk about Terrence's dilemma, they are speaking from their own experiences, and their experiences with others in similar positions. While I understand the difficulty in transcending economic class in this country, I also know that there are ways to escape poverty. The right doesn't seem to care about these problems, and the left won't admit that a lot of people are stuck in poverty because of their own decisions, drug addictions, inability to stop having children, etc.

 

[frenchbreadbuilds]

What you are basically saying is that Minimum wage isn't the most important issue concerning poverty in this country. I don't disagree with that. When people in this thread talk about Terrence's dilemma, they are speaking from their own experiences, and their experiences with others in similar positions. While I understand the difficulty in transcending economic class in this country, I also know that there are ways to escape poverty. The right doesn't seem to care about these problems, and the left won't admit that a lot of people are stuck in poverty because of their own decisions, drug addictions, inability to stop having children, etc.

I think it's just hard to describe and put into words as far as the left goes. Like I tried to explain earlier in the thread, personal accountability is always a factor to an extent. But when it comes to the context of poverty their choices only affect a persons degree of poverty not necessarily changing their economic status. Coupled with what is considered the norm for people in that situation, what we see as a bad choice they see as something that is normal.

 

[jchambers]

What you are basically saying is that Minimum wage isn't the most important issue concerning poverty in this country. I don't disagree with that. When people in this thread talk about Terrence's dilemma, they are speaking from their own experiences, and their experiences with others in similar positions. While I understand the difficulty in transcending economic class in this country, I also know that there are ways to escape poverty. The right doesn't seem to care about these problems, and the left won't admit that a lot of people are stuck in poverty because of their own decisions, drug addictions, inability to stop having children, etc.

I think it's just hard to describe and put into words as far as the left goes. Like I tried to explain earlier in the thread, personal accountability is always a factor to an extent. But when it comes to the context of poverty their choices only affect a persons degree of poverty not necessarily changing their economic status. Coupled with what is considered the norm for people in that situation, what we see as a bad choice they see as something that is normal.

I agree with you completely. I guess that our issue is that while we both accept the fact that life isn't fair, you think that the government can correct these inequalities, and I don't.

 

[Mark Antony]

As I said, you clearly don't understand. Bless your heart.

Yeah, you're right. I guess that the many economists who disagree with you are all wrong too. LOL @ acting like raising the minimum wage is an unequivocal decision that will cure the ails of the working class. Little weak snide remarks aren't progressive, they are just a weak attempt at masking your inability to form a coherent explanation.

This wasn't even the point and nowhere was that implied. There was nothing snide, I was being pretty clear. You however are masking your lack of comprehension behind snide remarks and dismissals due to your own limitations. The fact that you can't even see your own hypocrisy is telling. You have no intent to read and understand. You have an agenda, nothing snide about recognizing that. I'm still not sure where you saw that minimum wage will solve the working class ills, just reconfirms that either you're not reading, or just don't understand. Bless your heart.

 

[frenchbreadbuilds]

I agree with you completely. I guess that our issue is that while we both accept the fact that life isn't fair, you think that the government can correct these inequalities, and I don't.

Like I said, it more than just a minimum wage issue. It's about improving communities, improving education, and providing more opportunities. This mindset and condition that these people are in took many many years to get to the point it is and it'll take many many years to undo. There are definitely things the government can do to facilitate this. Especially in the education department.

 

[teamjordan79]

I agree with you completely. I guess that our issue is that while we both accept the fact that life isn't fair, you think that the government can correct these inequalities, and I don't.

Like I said, it more than just a minimum wage issue. It's about improving communities, improving education, and providing more opportunities. This mindset and condition that these people are in took many many years to get to the point it is and it'll take many many years to undo. There are definitely things the government can do to facilitate this. Especially in the education department.

you need to go into politics

 

[frenchbreadbuilds]

you need to go into politics

Lol just trying to share my perspective. Since poverty is a multifaceted issue its going to take more than just 1 act, policy, or program to fix it. That's the problem though, so many people don't see that it will be a process, so when one individual thing can't fix it they think it's not worth implementing or even worth discussion at all. I also think it's okay for people to form views on whether this will work for the poor or that will work for the poor but if you aren't even aware of how and why generational proverty is a problem in America and why it's so hard to get out, how are you informed enough to even form an opinion on what is good or bad for the poor?

 

[Mark Antony]

You mentioned different factors but all son will ever see is "minimum wage".

 

[frenchbreadbuilds]

You mentioned different factors but all son will ever see is "minimum wage".

If people would try to understand the different factors that go into being poor I think they'd have a better understanding of why people think it's necessary. But it's also important to understand that it's not a stand alone solution, but part of a multi step process.

 

[teamjordan79]

you need to go into politics

Lol just trying to share my perspective. Since poverty is a multifaceted issue its going to take more than just 1 act, policy, or program to fix it. That's the problem though, so many people don't see that it will be a process, so when one individual thing can't fix it they think it's not worth implementing or even worth discussion at all. I also think it's okay for people to form views on whether this will work for the poor or that will work for the poor but if you aren't even aware of how and why generational proverty is a problem in America and why it's so hard to get out, how are you informed enough to even form an opinion on what is good or bad for the poor?

i think this is only part of a bigger and more overarching problem i.e. our monetary system and how wealth is distributed (top-down interest rates). In other words, the poorer you are, the more expensive money is for you. Meanwhile, banks have the privilege of paying 0% (getting to NIRP soon) and access to "cheap money."

Any policies or programs to "fight" poverty within this context is the equivalent of putting a band aid on a corpse.

 

[dathbgboy]

The poor pay more, because the poor don't make the rules, so of course the rules won't benefit them

 

[Xennial]

 

[executive76]

I’ve worked for five decades but still need food stamps to get by

I was never someone who was afraid to work.

I got my first job at 18, running a cash register at a department store in Chicago. Back then, we had to tally all the sales by hand, rechecking each night to see how much we’d sold.

Since then, I’ve worked for the IRS, at a local hospital and at a Post Office. For several years, I drove a school bus in Crestwood, Ill. No matter what I did though, I couldn’t quite manage to make ends meet and save for retirement. Sure, I saved what I could. But most of my income went toward buying a house and keeping food on my table.

So when I retired at 74, though I’d worked for 56 years, I didn’t have the income I needed to buy food. After all, seniors have lots of expenses. Though I moved into a one-bedroom apartment, my only income was $853 a month in Social Security. After paying rent ($527 per month), utilities (roughly $100 per month) and medical bills (at minimum $104.90 for Medicare Part B Premium), I was lucky to be left with about $100 for all other expenses, including food and transportation.



https://www.washingtonpost.com/post...decades-but-still-need-food-stamps-to-get-by/

 

[frenchbreadbuilds]

Worked for 56 years and is still poor? Didn't work hard enough /sarcasm.