2019 NFL Discussion Thread: StaXX talking to himself

[IATT]

But what scenario does the ball crossing not end the possession?

Happens all the time on kickoffs

 

[kdslittlebro]

Happens all the time on kickoffs

Touchback begins a new possession tho

 

[IATT]

Touchback begins a new possession tho

Pass attempts into the end zone then

Hell you can fumble into the end zone and retain position, as long as it isn't recovered by the other team OR goes out of bounds once crossing the goal line

 

[Chester McFloppy]

 

[bishopstrongbow]

And Mitch Missed 2 games

 

[kdslittlebro]

Pass attempts into the end zone then

Hell you can fumble into the end zone and retain position, as long as it isn't recovered by the other team OR goes out of bounds once crossing the goal line

An incomplete pass isn’t an argument since there’s no possession at that point. I mean a live ball. What’s the difference between a kickoff into the endzone and a fumble? Both have the team losing possession into the endzone. Also a punt

 

[kdslittlebro]

I feel like if you get rid of the touchbacks you gotta get rid of safeties by that same token

 

[jumpman91023]

Ha!


Matt Ryan > Cam

Ryan is a better passer but he wouldn't succeed in Charlotte like Cam has with the lack of WR talent/oline he had for most of his career.

 

[junglejim]

I feel like if you get rid of the touchbacks you gotta get rid of safeties by that same token

Im just glad we are finally starting a dialogue. Like I said last night, I don't know of a good solution other than to spot at the goaline, I just think the outcome is dumb as hell. The defense basically gets bailed out and the ball for being ****ty.

If anything, if you fumble at the goaline and no other team recovers it then it should just be placed on the 20 and the offensive team should retain possession

 

[IATT]

An incomplete pass isn’t an argument since there’s no possession at that point. I mean a live ball. What’s the difference between a kickoff into the endzone and a fumble? Both have the team losing possession into the endzone. Also a punt

On a kickoff, punt and/or fumble possession can change without crossing the goal line.. the possibility is also there for teams to retain position on all 3 of those scenarios even if the ball crosses the goal line

And a team has to possess the ball to throw it.. you miss an attempt into the end zone or just throw it out the back of the end zone, you're just going onto the next down

Also gotta factor in the special teams of all of this.. because it doesn't just go from a team scoring to the kickoff (as we saw last night on the 2 point attempt)

 

[lamekilla]

Ryan is a better passer but he wouldn't succeed in Charlotte like Cam has with the lack of WR talent/oline he had for most of his career.

Cam doesn’t get WR talent because he’s a **** passer

 

[kdslittlebro]

Im just glad we are finally starting a dialogue. Like I said last night, I don't know of a good solution other than to spot at the goaline, I just think the outcome is dumb as hell. The defense basically gets bailed out and the ball for being ****ty.

I think the other side is a better argument tbh, even tho I’m fine with the way it is currently.

If there’s a live ball in the defense’s endzone, it can be recovered by the offense for points, otherwise the ball goes to the defense. If there’s a live ball in the offense’s endzone, it can be recovered by the defense for points AND possession, but the offense can recover and advance the ball out of the endzone. Still seems fair to me, especially in this offensive climate, but I can SLIGHTLY see an argument for this imbalance.

 

[jon4rd]

Ryan is a better passer but he wouldn't succeed in Charlotte like Cam has with the lack of WR talent/oline he had for most of his career.

This 1000 times over. This year Cam had the best receiving core and passing weapons of his career and it essentially is made up of 2 rookies (technically because Curtis Samuel didn't play last year) Devin "dicks for hands" Funchess, CMC da gawd, and like 5 games of Olsen. One remaining starter on the O-line by what like week 2 or 3?

Cam doesn’t get WR talent because he’s a **** passer

You can't seriously believe that makes a bit of sense, can you?

 

[junglejim]

I think the other side is a better argument tbh, even tho I’m fine with the way it is currently.

If there’s a live ball in the defense’s endzone, it can be recovered by the offense for points, otherwise the ball goes to the defense. If there’s a live ball in the offense’s endzone, it can be recovered by the defense for points AND possession, but the offense can recover and advance the ball out of the endzone. Still seems fair to me, especially in this offensive climate, but I can SLIGHTLY see an argument for this imbalance.

The difference is the recovery of the football. I have no issue with a team fumbling on the goaline AND the other team actually gains possession. In that case it absolutely should be a touchback. But if I fumble out of bounds at any time during the game I didnt lose possession of the football. Thats my complaint about it.

Spot that **** on the 20 and make the offensive team whatever down and goal on the 20.

 

[kdslittlebro]

On a kickoff, punt and/or fumble possession can change without crossing the goal line.. the possibility is also there for teams to retain position on all 3 of those scenarios even if the ball crosses the goal line

And a team has to possess the ball to throw it.. you miss an attempt into the end zone or just throw it out the back of the end zone, you're just going onto the next down

Also gotta factor in the special teams of all of this.. because it doesn't just go from a team scoring to the kickoff (as we saw last night on the 2 point attempt)

The first paragraph if iffy, since either team can gain or lose possession on any play of the game, except PATs, which basically fall out of the scope of the rest of the game, which addresses your third paragraph also.

As for the second paragraph, that’s intellectually dishonest. A pass attempt isn’t a live ball until/unless it’s completed to either team

 

[IATT]

If there’s a live ball in the defense’s endzone, it can be recovered by the offense for points, otherwise the ball goes to the defense.

Not always.. need to look up the rule or someone can go check.. but the fumbling team can't automatically advance the ball

It goes back to the spot of the fumble

 

[kdslittlebro]

The difference is the recovery of the football. I have no issue with a team fumbling on the goaline AND the other team actually gains possession. In that case it absolutely should be a touchback. But if I fumble out of bounds at any time during the game I didnt lose possession of the football. Thats my complaint about it.

Spot that **** on the 20 and make the offensive team whatever down and goal on the 20.

I get what you’re saying, but my argument is a live ball always changes possession once it crosses the goal line

 

[spacedoodoo]

I was never on the fire Rivera train but after this skid, losing close games late to these bad teams, and his lack of accountability, I’m the mf conductor. After a 6-2 start you would think worst case a team would go 10-6. This has to be a historic collapse. And look at what this clown showed up to his presser wearing this past week (after talking about how we still had a 5% chance to make the playoffs in his presser the day before)

This isn’t something you wear after your team loses 5 straight games. I would have no issue if we started off bad then got off to a winning streak and had a chance to then make the playoffs but come on bruh...


One can only hope. I’m gonna be pissed if tepper gives this man another year and we play well next year per usual on odd years and we extend him or something.

The panthers have always tried to be this franchise that has built themselves on having great defensive teams. And they have had a little bit of success, 2 SB appearances and a couple of division titles.

What I would like to see is the panthers go completely all in on a HC that knows offense. You’ve got the franchise QB that’s nearing/in his prime. You got the 1st round RB and receiver. It’s like the Panthers and Rivera took CMC and Moore and said “here cam, here are the two offensive guys to help you, now figure it out yourself.”

I do believe it’s time for Rivera to go, as the best seasons are behind him. Time for a culture change in Charlotte.

6-8, a non winning season. The franchise is so volitale it’s ridiculous.

 

[kdslittlebro]

Not always.. need to look up the rule or someone can go check.. but the fumbling team can't automatically advance the ball

It goes back to the spot of the fumble

Only on 4th unless the fumbling player recovers, which otherwise results in a possession change

 

[kdslittlebro]

I get what you’re saying, but my argument is a live ball always changes possession once it crosses the goal line

Except for the one scenario where the offense can still recover and advance the ball out of their own endzone, to their benefit

 

[IATT]

The first paragraph if iffy, since either team can gain or lose possession on any play of the game, except PATs, which basically fall out of the scope of the rest of the game, which addresses your third paragraph also.

As for the second paragraph, that’s intellectually dishonest. A pass attempt isn’t a live ball until/unless it’s completed to either team

I mean the whole thing is theoretically because you got a ton hypothetical situations

The only time crossing the goal line is a guarantee end of position thou, since we're not factoring in the point after attempts, is if the offensive or defensive player crosses the opponent's with possession

And even then you gotta factor in the catch rule and all of that with the ball crossing in some scenarios

 

[kdslittlebro]

I mean the whole thing is theoretically because you got a ton hypothetical situations

The only time crossing the goal line is a guarantee end of position thou, since we're not factoring in the point after attempts, is if the offensive or defensive player crosses the opponent's with possession

And even then you gotta factor in the catch rule and all of that with the ball crossing in some scenarios

If a live ball crosses the goal line and isn’t possessed before the play is dead, it ends the possession on both ends. It doesn’t have to be possessed.

I’m not following where the catch rule comes in, since it’s either a possession in the endzone (score or interception; change possession either way) or the same as any other incomplete pass

 

[freddy fig]

freddy fig Mahomeboy got that MVP on lock

14-2 and homefield > 40+TDs woday

 

[IATT]

If a live ball crosses the goal line and isn’t possessed before the play is dead, it ends the possession on both ends. It doesn’t have to be possessed.

I’m not following where the catch rule comes in, since it’s either a possession in the endzone (score or interception/change possession) or the same as any other incomplete pass

The team has possession on a drive.. and then a player must have possession when scoring or even catching the ball

And they can't blow a play dead if there is a live ball without possession.. sure they can, but has to be something (like ruling a pass incomplete or saying the players forward progress was stopped)

 

[kdslittlebro]

And they can't blow a play dead if there is a live ball without possession.. sure they can, but has to be something (like ruling a pass incomplete or saying the players forward progress was stopped)

Or the ball going out of bounds