"He makes his teammates better"

[stylishstef89]

I've been somewhat annoyed by this term for a while now. It sounds like they are giving the franchise player/all-star all the praise and recognition forhis teammates contribution or improvement in play. I mean, the only way someone is going to become better is if they want to improve and puts in the worknecessary to reach that next level.

 

[mjsaver]

not entirely true....

in basketball, some guys can set their teamates up in ways other people couldnt...

look at the effect CP3 had on Tyson Chandler, i doubt Chandler was practicing catchin lobs off the pic-n roll...

 

[Ja's 2¢]

two words: jason kidd.

/end thread.

 

[stylishstef89]

I understand what your trying to say, but I see that differently...

I see that Chris Paul finally got a teammate who he knew had the ability to make those plays and be able to finish them consistently. He can't throw themlobs without having an athletic teammate that can get up there and make the play. So I see it as two teammates taking advatange of each other'spre-existing skills/talent/athletic ability and not one all-star bringing out some unknown skill from his teammate.

 

[doctorshoes]

I agree to a certain extent. I think it's more of the player making it easier for his teammates. Players like Chris Paul and Jason Kidd make it easy forguys like Tyson Chandler to score points, they don't make them better though.

 

[el producto79]

Originally Posted by StylishStef89

I understand what your trying to say, but I see that differently...

I see that Chris Paul finally got a teammate who he knew had the ability to make those plays and be able to finish them consistently. He can't throw them lobs without having an athletic teammate that can get up there and make the play. So I see it as two teammates taking advatange of each other's pre-existing skills/talent/athletic ability and not one all-star bringing out some unknown skill from his teammate.

True, but everybody has known that Tyson was athletic since he was 15. Now, how many PGs did he play w/ before CP that weren't able toeffectively weave that pick n roll lob into the teams' offense to the tune of an easy 8-10 points a game?

 

[e3lal]

Completely agree. The star player can only make his teammates so much better. It is up to the player himself to improve his game. IMO, I see a good exampleas Ariza compared to Kwame and Smuch. Ariza put in time to develop his game while the other two collected their pay.

 

[ben roethlisberger]

That was the main point those highly intillegent espn "analysts" would bring up when arguing between Kobe and Nash getting the MVP.

 

[nnarum]

 

[stylishstef89]

Originally Posted by el producto79

Originally Posted by StylishStef89

I understand what your trying to say, but I see that differently...

I see that Chris Paul finally got a teammate who he knew had the ability to make those plays and be able to finish them consistently. He can't throw them lobs without having an athletic teammate that can get up there and make the play. So I see it as two teammates taking advatange of each other's pre-existing skills/talent/athletic ability and not one all-star bringing out some unknown skill from his teammate.

True, but everybody has known that Tyson was athletic since he was 15. Now, how many PGs did he play w/ before CP that weren't able to effectively weave that pick n roll lob into the teams' offense to the tune of an easy 8-10 points a game?

I understand what you mean. I think that reflects more on Tyson's former PGs more than anything though, right?

And that video above doesn't negate what I'm saying. He got those 21 assists feeding an offensive powerhouse in Amare, another good finisher in afast-paced offense in Marion, and reliable spot-up shooters. Is he making them better? No. Is he making things easier for them? Yes. He complimenting histeammates already existing skills, and vice versa.

 

[dland24]

My favorite is when people say Steve Nash makes his teammates better. Well as much as he may help them on offense, thats as much as he hurts them on defense.Its like playing 4 on 5.

 

[nnarum]

Originally Posted by StylishStef89

Originally Posted by el producto79

Originally Posted by StylishStef89

I understand what your trying to say, but I see that differently...

I see that Chris Paul finally got a teammate who he knew had the ability to make those plays and be able to finish them consistently. He can't throw them lobs without having an athletic teammate that can get up there and make the play. So I see it as two teammates taking advatange of each other's pre-existing skills/talent/athletic ability and not one all-star bringing out some unknown skill from his teammate.

True, but everybody has known that Tyson was athletic since he was 15. Now, how many PGs did he play w/ before CP that weren't able to effectively weave that pick n roll lob into the teams' offense to the tune of an easy 8-10 points a game?

I understand what you mean. I think that reflects more on Tyson's former PGs more than anything though, right?

And that video above doesn't negate what I'm saying. He got those 21 assists feeding an offensive powerhouse in Amare, another good finisher in a fast-paced offense in Marion, and reliable spot-up shooters. Is he making them better? No. Is he making things easier for them? Yes. He complimenting his teammates already existing skills, and vice versa.

You missed my point. That bum Marion in there...

What has he done since leaving Nash? Or how about Q-Rich? Nothing since leaving PHX.

BTW, in the end it's your opinion. I'd rather play with Nash over some average PG. Same with Kidd or CP3. Why? They make the right decisions, in theorymaking the team better. Which makes teammates better.

 

[belle155]

Originally Posted by nnarum

figures its against cleveland

 

[paul is on tilt]

Jamaal Magloire is nothing without Baron Davis.

 

[JD617]

[Allen Iverson] How the hell can I make my teammates better by practice? [/Allen Iverson]

 

[stylishstef89]

nnarum wrote:

---

StylishStef89 wrote:

---

Originally Posted by el producto79

StylishStef89 wrote:

---

I understand what your trying to say, but I see that differently...

I see that Chris Paul finally got a teammate who he knew had the ability to make those plays and be able to finish them consistently. He can't throw them lobs without having an athletic teammate that can get up there and make the play. So I see it as two teammates taking advatange of each other's pre-existing skills/talent/athletic ability and not one all-star bringing out some unknown skill from his teammate.

True, but everybody has known that Tyson was athletic since he was 15. Now, how many PGs did he play w/ before CP that weren't able to effectively weave that pick n roll lob into the teams' offense to the tune of an easy 8-10 points a game?




I understand what you mean. I think that reflects more on Tyson's former PGs more than anything though, right?

And that video above doesn't negate what I'm saying. He got those 21 assists feeding an offensive powerhouse in Amare, another good finisher in a fast-paced offense in Marion, and reliable spot-up shooters. Is he making them better? No. Is he making things easier for them? Yes. He complimenting his teammates already existing skills, and vice versa.
You missed my point. That bum Marion in there...

What has he done since leaving Nash? Or how about Q-Rich? Nothing since leaving PHX.

BTW, in the end it's your opinion. I'd rather play with Nash over some average PG. Same with Kidd or CP3. Why? They make the right decisions, in theory making the
Ok I see what your saying....but people always seem to forget Marion and Q-Rich BEFORE Nash.

1999-00	21	PHO	NBA	51	38	24.7	4.4	9.2	.471	0.1	0.4	.182	1.4	1.7	.847	2.1	4.5	6.5	1.4	0.7	1.0	1.0	2.2	10.2
2000-01	22	PHO	NBA	79	79	36.2	7.1	14.7	.480	0.3	1.0	.256	3.0	3.7	.810	2.8	7.9	10.7	2.0	1.7	1.4	1.6	2.7	17.3
2001-02	23	PHO	NBA	81	81	38.4	8.1	17.2	.469	0.6	1.5	.393	2.4	2.8	.845	2.6	7.3	9.9	2.0	1.8	1.1	1.8	2.6	19.1
2002-03	24	PHO	NBA	81	81	41.6	8.2	18.1	.452	1.7	4.5	.387	3.1	3.6	.851	2.5	7.1	9.5	2.4	2.3	1.2	1.9	2.6	21.2
2003-04	25	PHO	NBA	79	79	40.7	7.5	17.0	.440	1.1	3.4	.340	2.9	3.4	.851	2.7	6.6	9.3	2.7	2.1	1.3	2.0	2.6	19.0

Shawn Marion was putting in work before Nash arrived. So can we really sit here and say Marion being separated from Nash is the sole reason as to why his gamehas slipped? It seems as if people are giving Nash more credit for Marion's success, as if he wasn't already a quality SF before SSOL was implementedwith the Suns. If you ask me, it appears Marion is just falling off period, regardless of whether he'd still be playing with Nash or not.

2000-01	20	LAC	NBA	76	28	17.9	3.1	6.9	.442	0.7	2.0	.331	1.3	2.1	.627	1.4	2.0	3.4	0.8	0.6	0.1	0.8	1.3	8.1
2001-02	21	LAC	NBA	81	0	26.6	4.9	11.4	.432	1.6	4.3	.381	1.8	2.3	.765	1.4	2.7	4.1	1.6	1.0	0.3	1.3	1.8	13.3
2002-03	22	LAC	NBA	59	14	23.2	3.4	9.3	.372	1.0	3.4	.308	1.4	2.1	.685	1.7	3.1	4.8	0.9	0.6	0.2	1.1	1.6	9.4
2003-04	23	LAC	NBA	65	64	36.0	6.5	16.4	.398	1.8	5.2	.352	2.3	3.1	.740	2.2	4.1	6.4	2.1	1.0	0.3	2.2	2.0	17.2
2004-05	24	PHO	NBA	79	78	35.9	5.2	13.2	.389	2.9	8.0	.358	1.7	2.3	.739	1.2	4.9	6.1	2.0	1.2	0.3	1.3	2.5	14.9

Q-Rich's last year with the Clippers and his single season with the Suns are pretty indentical. Q-Rich fell off because he gained quite a bit of weightafter his trade to the Knicks, in addition to injuries. Nash definately made the game easier for his teammates....but making them better is what I can'treally co-sign.

 

[travisjmu]

Wide Receivers

• 80 Troy Brown PR
• 87 Reche Caldwell
• 13 Bam Childress
• 10 Jabar Gaffney
• 17 Chad Jackson [sup]R[/sup]
• 19 Kelvin Kight

Brady threw for 3,529 yards and 24 touchdowns

07:
Wes Welker

2007	New England Patriots	16	13	112	1,175	10.5	42	8	4	34	8.5	27	0	3	0
2006	Miami Dolphins	16	2	67	687	10.3	38	1	--	--	--	--	--	3	1
2005	Miami Dolphins	16	1	29	434	15.0	47	0	1	5	5.0	5	0	5

Moss:

2007	New England Patriots	16	16	98	1,493	15.2	65T	23	--	--	--	--	--	--	--
2006	Oakland Raiders	13	13	42	553	13.2	51	3	--	--	--	--	--	--	--
2005	Oakland Raiders	16	15	60	1,005	16.8	79	8	--	--	--	--	--	--	--
2004	Minnesota Vikings	13	13	49	767	15.7	82T	13	--	--	--	--	--	1	1
2003	Minnesota Vikings	16	16	111	1,632	14.7	72	17

 

[i nasmatic i]

"He makes it easier for his team mates to do well" would be a better term.

 

[xblker47]

Originally Posted by vcshoxj6

two words: jason kidd. steve nash

/end thread.

fixed

 

[friscostylez]

Originally Posted by I NaSmatic I

"He makes it easier for his team mates to do well" would be a better term.

on point. Someone like Chris Paul doesn't make his teammates better, he just makes the game easier for them. He gets them wide open 3s andeasy lay ups and dunk opportunities. He doesn't influenced whether they catch the ball and/or make the shot. CP3 can't make someone that can'tshoot 3s be able to hit 3s.

 

[xtapolapacetl]

Originally Posted by friscostylez

Originally Posted by I NaSmatic I

"He makes it easier for his team mates to do well" would be a better term.

on point. Someone like Chris Paul doesn't make his teammates better, he just makes the game easier for them. He gets them wide open 3s and easy lay ups and dunk opportunities. He doesn't influenced whether they catch the ball and/or make the shot. CP3 can't make someone that can't shoot 3s be able to hit 3s.

In many, probably most case yes. But there are instances where players have become better basketball players while playing with a certain teammate. Thishappens over a longer period though. I think that Jordan and Pippen have made each other better basketball players, at least in some areas, as did Stockton andMalone.

Anyway, if there was no truth to this statement whatsoever, then all players in the league would essentially be equally good/bad at making their teammatesbetter. And I don't believe that that is the case.

 

[eight2one]

i believe some players do.....basketball has a lot to do with chemistry.

 

[JD617]

Chauncey is staying in Vegas with JR Smith and training with him over the next 3 weeks and trying to instill some maturity and discipline in him. That'smaking your teammates better, isn't it?

 

[friscostylez]

Originally Posted by JD617

Chauncey is staying in Vegas with JR Smith and training with him over the next 3 weeks and trying to instill some maturity and discipline in him. That's making your teammates better, isn't it?

I agree with you but people don't use that term in that way. After a good pass to an open teammate, an announcer or whatever will say "hemakes his teammates better" and in that case it is false.

 

[mayhemmonkey000]

Originally Posted by StylishStef89

Originally Posted by el producto79

Originally Posted by StylishStef89

I understand what your trying to say, but I see that differently...

I see that Chris Paul finally got a teammate who he knew had the ability to make those plays and be able to finish them consistently. He can't throw them lobs without having an athletic teammate that can get up there and make the play. So I see it as two teammates taking advatange of each other's pre-existing skills/talent/athletic ability and not one all-star bringing out some unknown skill from his teammate.

True, but everybody has known that Tyson was athletic since he was 15. Now, how many PGs did he play w/ before CP that weren't able to effectively weave that pick n roll lob into the teams' offense to the tune of an easy 8-10 points a game?

I understand what you mean. I think that reflects more on Tyson's former PGs more than anything though, right?

And that video above doesn't negate what I'm saying. He got those 21 assists feeding an offensive powerhouse in Amare, another good finisher in a fast-paced offense in Marion, and reliable spot-up shooters. Is he making them better? No. Is he making things easier for them? Yes. He complimenting his teammates already existing skills, and vice versa.

Naw man, that just shows how much of a bum Tyson is that his only offensive moves are alley's and put backs.

But I see what you're getting at. I think there are players that do make they're teammates better like CP3 and Kidd. It's thrown around toloosley.