If you don't have a top 10 QB, give up

[holdupstop23]

Originally Posted by DeadsetAce

tebow is great in the 4th quarter if his team is still in it too....just sayin'


and no, not saying tebow is great or on eli's level

And if Tebow keeps winning games in the 4th quarter during the rest of his career, does it in the playoffs, and wins a Superbowl, then there's no way you can say he's not elite. 
Eli's mostly been in a running offense. The year he has absolutely no running game, he throws for 5000 yds and has the best season of his career. Mind you, this is with a rookie WR, a rookie TE, a POS offensive line, and a POS defense(for most of the year). If that's not elite then you're just dumb.

Unless you're good in those first 3 quarters ala Brady, Peyton, Rodgers. Moreover, Romo puts up huge numbers in the  4th to prove no point
But you're  an   idiot if  you dare contend this.

Tom Brady has 34 game winning drives, Peyton has 46, Eli has 23, and Romo has 14. 

You're an idiot.

 

[mez 0ne]

Eli won games for his team when they were depleted, they were pretty much losing every 4th quarter and won games with some big plays, kept their season alive.

Has played excellent this post season run as well.

LOL @ Romo and Tebow mentions, never ceases to amaze me.

 

[DeadsetAce]

Originally Posted by holdupstop23

Originally Posted by DeadsetAce

tebow is great in the 4th quarter if his team is still in it too....just sayin'


and no, not saying tebow is great or on eli's level

And if Tebow keeps winning games in the 4th quarter during the rest of his career, does it in the playoffs, and wins a Superbowl, then there's no way you can say he's not elite. 
Eli's mostly been in a running offense. The year he has absolutely no running game, he throws for 5000 yds and has the best season of his career. Mind you, this is with a rookie WR, a rookie TE, a POS offensive line, and a POS defense(for most of the year). If that's not elite then you're just dumb.

he needs to do it more than just once. again, consistency. he's played at an extremely high level this year, no doubt. he's gotta keep it up. and simplifying it down to 4th quarter comebacks is not a smart way to look at it. that punishes QBs who consistently blow teams out of the water. show me winning percentage on a CONSISTENT basis.

brees, peyton, brady, and rodgers been doing it consistently for years.

 

[holdupstop23]

I don't even want to hate on Romo. He's a GREAT Quarterback. But he hasn't had the same success as Eli when it matters the most.

And that's what differentiates them.

 

[DeadsetAce]

Originally Posted by Mez 0ne

LOL @ Tebow mentions, never ceases to amaze me.

it was a joke

 

[mez 0ne]

I know sir.

.....as for Romo, you already know the deal with him, checks down a lot which inflates his completion percentage esp YAC but his issue was never his "stats" per say, its about winning the big game and making the plays to win when it matters most.

 

[fade on you]

Originally Posted by DubA169

Is flacco top 10? he was one dropped pass from the SB

Smith was one fumble away from a SB

Top 10 choke artist maybe

 

[calibeebee]

basically there were no stud running backs this season. Did anybody rush for over 100 in the playoffs??

 

[holdupstop23]

Originally Posted by DeadsetAce

Originally Posted by holdupstop23

Originally Posted by DeadsetAce

tebow is great in the 4th quarter if his team is still in it too....just sayin'


and no, not saying tebow is great or on eli's level

And if Tebow keeps winning games in the 4th quarter during the rest of his career, does it in the playoffs, and wins a Superbowl, then there's no way you can say he's not elite. 
Eli's mostly been in a running offense. The year he has absolutely no running game, he throws for 5000 yds and has the best season of his career. Mind you, this is with a rookie WR, a rookie TE, a POS offensive line, and a POS defense(for most of the year). If that's not elite then you're just dumb.

he needs to do it more than just once. again, consistency. he's played at an extremely high level this year, no doubt. he's gotta keep it up. and simplifying it down to 4th quarter comebacks is not a smart way to look at it. that punishes QBs who consistently blow teams out of the water. show me winning percentage on a CONSISTENT basis.

brees, peyton, brady, and rodgers been doing it consistently for years.

Well, look at career game winning drives and comebacks. The elites at the QB position are all up there. It's all about how you finish. There is no team that consistently blows teams on a regular basis, except for maybe the Packers this year and the Pats in '07. What is consistent is what QB's actually show up when it counts in the 4th quarter. 
And Aaron Rodgers? He's been in the league for 4 years and has been in the one of the best passing systems in the league. And before this year, it was debatable if he was elite.

But anyway I'm done. It's ridiculous to even argue with people on "Niketalk".

 

[S4L]

.....as for Romo, you already know the deal with him, checks down a lot which inflates his completion percentage esp YAC
LOL. You always come up with new ways to hate on that man...

 

[dmxfury]

I would not have witnessed two SB titles and 3 trips without Ben. Put him in your lists wherever you want. Guy is great and perfectly fits that team. Keep on rolling along and racking up wins

 

[mez 0ne]

Its what the Cowboys plays are based on.

Nobody said he can't throw it down the field esp to Dez or Miles, but their play calling revolves around screen plays a majority of the time and short passing game and that helps with completion percentage, which is why that stat is over-rated.

But I won't even talk about Romo right now, cause I could give a fat turd.
But anyways, this top 5 %#!% in reality is just dumb. Give me a QB who wins and makes big plays when it matters most with good pocket precense, its what a quarterback is judged on.

 

[1d]

This thread is kind of  like saying winners, win.

 Ingenious

 

[Air273]

forget elite status, the question each fan/GM should ask would my team cut our starting QB for peyton manning.....if you have to think about it than you dont have a franchise QB

I love how no one gives Eli credit, he is not trent dilfer!!!!!!!! ugh!!!!  TWICE Eli has thrown for 8 TDs in the playoffs....can brady say that, not yet.....peyton???? nope!  Dan Marino? NO! Bradshaw?? NO!!!!......Montana?? NO!!....Aaron Rodgers?? NO!!!! Ben Roethlisberger??? NOT ONCE !!! Brees??? NO! Steve Young?? NO!!! Aikman??? NO!!! John Elway?? NOT ONCE!! you want to talk about winning with running game and defense look at JOHN ELWAY dude won a playoff game going 13-34......and the one time that peyton threw for 8 TDs he didnt make it to the super bowl......

please do me a favor find me the QB who has thrown for 8 TDs or more in the playoffs twice.....thx in advance.....you can't use Eli Manning because that should be common knowledge......

Johnny U more ints than TDs in his playoff career.....

back to eli.....
Since week 17 of the 07 season Eli's QB rating i'm pretty sure is over 90, only brady peyton have more come from behind wins......maybe ben has more also......bottom line Eli Manning is the giants MVP he was for the playoff run 4 years ago and is now.....8 Tds 1 int 4 years ago no QB had better playoff number 4 years ago and 8 TDs 1 int this year no playoff QB beats that.........but i guess some people dont include what a player does in the playoffs........also if plaxico doesnt shoot himself in the leg in 08 who knows where that 1 seed giants team could have gone......i dont want to hear about defense or his running game.....he is the teams MVP and he steps up his game come playoff time.........Rodgers is the MVP of the NFL, first time Super Bowl MVPs faced each other in the playoffs and Eli goes there and out plays him.....sure the giants defense is better than the pac and they did have a bunch of drops......you're 15-1 MVP of the NFL home defending NFL champions you shouldnt lose period 
Eli i'm very confident will finish top 5 in MVP voting......once in his career he lead his team to a one seed, he does it again and improves on his stats he could be MVP of the league....this season was Eli worst far as play action passing goes......thats because of the run game being the WORST in the NFL, next year expect improvement from Eli and the running game....in that interview that Eli said he was in the elite class the key words from Eli were that he knows his 2nd half of his career will be better than his first......i agree....you will see...

are you aware when peyton won his ONE ring he had 3 TDs 7 ints that playoff.....

 

[finnns2003]

Originally Posted by 1D


This thread is kind of  like saying winners, win.

 Ingenious

And you've added nothing to the discussion. Have a seat.
People saying Eli isn't elite. LOL.

 

[DeadsetAce]

Originally Posted by finnns2003

Originally Posted by 1D


This thread is kind of  like saying winners, win.

 Ingenious

And you've added nothing to the discussion. Have a seat.
People saying Eli isn't elite. LOL.

finnns...let's be real, any QB is gonna look elite compared to what you're used to watching on sundays



i kid, i kid

 

[rolaholic]

Originally Posted by DeadsetAce

Originally Posted by finnns2003

Originally Posted by 1D


This thread is kind of  like saying winners, win.

 Ingenious

And you've added nothing to the discussion. Have a seat.
People saying Eli isn't elite. LOL.

finnns...let's be real, any QB is gonna look elite compared to what you're used to watching on sundays



i kid, i kid

zing! 

 

[ldj]

Originally Posted by JPZx

Pretty much true, most important component to success and the most difficult to acquire.

The only year the Vikings have been close lately is when Favre went out of his mind and had the best statistical year of his career.

You better be hoping for Peyton Manning, finns. Not that you guys have the other pieces yet, but you don't turn down what could be the lynchpin to success because the rest of the personnel is

. The pieces you put around that player are so much easier to bring in.


  

interesting you mention him... was listening to a sports radio show and as good as he is... i never really thought about it... he is a loser when it comes to big games and playoffs. out of all the so called elite qb's he is the only one on the losing end when it comes to wins in big games and playoffs. Matter fact outside of his playoff run to the superbowl he hasnt been good in playoffs and big games his entire career.

Another interesting fact is that despite so many ppl who say peyton is better then eli... actually the stats show he isnt.. I think in 20 playoff and big games eli is 13 or 14 of 20. And his brother i believe is 12 for 30. So basically peyton is a killer and is good basically in unimportant games, and drops off significant in big games and playoffs as a whole when reviewing his career.

Plus add the fact he is getting older and potentially comming from a career ending injury i doubt it would equal winning for any team to get a guy a yr and a half removed from the game, who is heading on the downhill of his career, comming from a serious injury who track record for winning big games and playoffs is somewhere around the high 30 low 40%.

 

[westcoastsfinest]

I guess defense doesn't win championships anymore. 

 

[dmxfury]

Peyton is a four time MVP. I like Ei and he has had more success in the playoffs but Peyton is a better QB. An all time great really

 

[finnns2003]

Originally Posted by DeadsetAce

Originally Posted by finnns2003

Originally Posted by 1D


This thread is kind of  like saying winners, win.

 Ingenious

And you've added nothing to the discussion. Have a seat.
People saying Eli isn't elite. LOL.

finnns...let's be real, any QB is gonna look elite compared to what you're used to watching on sundays



i kid, i kid

I'm going to take a sledgehammer to Thomas Brady.

 

[ldj]

Originally Posted by dmxfury

Peyton is a four time MVP. I like Ei and he has had more success in the playoffs but Peyton is a better QB. An all time great really

i guess but give me a guy who may have 2 superbowl rings and a 60 or so % winning rate in playoffs and big games versus a 1 ring guy with several individual records who is older, gameplay is declining, and at his best he gives you a 30% chance at winning big games and playoffs. Sure he will set some passing records etc... but the goal i want for my qb is to win big games and playoffs and chips. And out of all the elite qb's he is the worst at this, and the only one who career wise is on the losing end of this.

One may say or suggest it isnt peyton but his team, but i disagree. He has had great offensive weapons and at times good defenses. Its just many of the big games and playoffs he iuno just doesnt have "IT" and his amazing skills just become decent at best, or he make countless foolish mistakes.

I honestly can say a team with peyton would be a 10 or so games winning season year end and out. and those losses would be in games of importance such as home field, controllead of conference. and then falling short year in and year out in big playoff games. Sure hed be smashing records and setting new ones. But they would all be in unimportant games against inferior teams. And his name would fill seats. But they be pretty much the knicks of the nfl... well the knicks with a better record. All hype, dreams of being contenders, but falling short, but having individuals who are setting records and having amazing stats in games against teams in games which really dont matter.

 

[dmxfury]

You sound like a Ben fan, I like it

 

[DeadsetAce]

well as long as anyone calling for eli to be in that elite class admits big ben is in that same class, i can see the argument...directionally it's consistent.

 

[antidope]

Originally Posted by StillIn729

Antidope wrote:

---

Big Ben Elite?

But yeah its a passing league now, blame the rules and casual fans who want to see both teams drop 30+ instead of playing hardnosed defensive games that end 14-10

All of it though? Thats cold