Jobs Report: No jobs created in August.

[feedtheego1982]

I guess I'm just an optimist. I see everything everyone is saying. I'm not saying that I think things will be perfect. I know there will be difficult decisions to be made. But really, I take these stories with a grain of salt. If you look at all of these statistics, they are all flawed. I guess I look at history. People were saying the same thing about japan as they are now saying about china at one point. What I hope for is that with all of the difficulty, we could rise through this hardship stronger at the risk of sounding like a Disney special.

real talk, my moms fell ill a year ago. I sat there and immediately felt the worst was coming. Sometimes, through the darkness you can't see the rays of light. You don't count on people's resilience and will to emerge stronger from situations. It's easy to always assume it's the end and give in so to speak instead of looking for ways to grow. When my mom got a clear bill of health about two months ago, my life and outlook changed in a profound way. We are all powerful beyond measure. We will push through this. Politics is a joke. Like a huge episode of jersey shore. I hope no one here has been completely devastated by this turmoil. If you have, you have my prayers.

 

[feedtheego1982]

Lazyj respect man. Goldman Sach was who I had in mind when I posted that. The execs are certainly not feeling this pain like you or I do, nor carry the anxieties. But they are paying in other ways.

 

[essential1]

The problem is one party is full of vaginas ..

And the other party thinks being an intellectual is bad...


And I'm not advocating for more than a 2 party system because the multiple party system has seemingly destroyed the political climate in Europe country by country...


We're screwed until we stop worrying about short term deficits problems and actually invest in our middle class instead of de-investing in the middle class and give everything to the Elite Money Makers praying that they will save us.. Because THEY NEVER HAVE and have no interest to..

No need to wage Class Warfare because it has already been implemented against the middle class..

 

[lazyj10]

There shouldn't be a "party" system anymore anyway. They're so far removed from their ideologies anyway.

 

[teamjordan79]

Originally Posted by Essential1

The problem is one party is full of vaginas ..

And the other party thinks being an intellectual is bad...

partially agree - this is the type of perception that govt wants to give the general public, serving as the catalyst towards accepting a new and "efficient" unelectable "super congress."

No need to wage Class Warfare because it has already been implemented against the middle class..

the middle class has been used as a tool of the upper classes (the polyarchy) to wage war against the lower classes. Once there is no more need for this instrument, the middle class numbers will inevitably be curtailed in result of govt socio-economic policies. we are witnessing this now. War has been an effective tool in achieving this goal by squandering human and natural resources. 

 

[lorenander]

Originally Posted by acidicality

Originally Posted by proper english

Solyndra.. LOLOLOL

 

And the government gave them that big fat loan

.

Always drove by their really sweet office buildings off of 880 thinking I could work there someday.

so many hours lost due to applying for jobs over there 

 

[al audi]

Originally Posted by finnns2003

I don't need to say anything... this is all one big joke. Pretty soon there will be 30% unemployment, continued outsourcing, higher taxes, worsening infrastructure, and worthless dollars. Get ready for developing countries to catch up big time in the next 20 years.

C'mon finnns, kinda extreme with that one.......better hope it doesn't get that bad here. I mean I'd literally walk around with a gun at all times if it gets that bad.

 

[mecks]

boeing just got a 1 billion dollar air force contract.
if youre willing to move to california, here is your chance.

i myself am applying for an entry level position, if im in, im quitting school.

40 hour weeks, monday-friday working one of three shifts 3am-11am , 11am-7pm , or 7pm-3am
with, full dental & health + stock options

you get in, you have it made.


id put the link but i dont want to put it out there like that, i have 3 family members that work at boeing.

 

[mytoasterspeak]

Who are these numbers really on though? Is it on the republicans who say, NO! don't raise the taxes on the rich or they won't create jobs. Obama says ok, fine, they will remain at Bush era levels. No jobs created

There is something else going on besides taxing, jobs, NAFTA, imports, Obama, Republicans, and Democrats.

The evil of money/wealth, and what we as a world society have done to ourselves in regards to how we value money and what money really means. Because if you look at it, the whole world is going through money problems. Everybody wanna keep worrying about those things I listed above, and its none of that. The real problem is US, the human being. Greed/money/wealth/being rich has brought down many societies, empires, kingdoms, and people. It's gonna be a tough go, keep your head above water

 

[finnns2003]

Originally Posted by Al Audi

Originally Posted by finnns2003

I don't need to say anything... this is all one big joke. Pretty soon there will be 30% unemployment, continued outsourcing, higher taxes, worsening infrastructure, and worthless dollars. Get ready for developing countries to catch up big time in the next 20 years.

C'mon finnns, kinda extreme with that one.......better hope it doesn't get that bad here. I mean I'd literally walk around with a gun at all times if it gets that bad.

Extreme? Explain why

 

[Betonblck]

Originally Posted by LazyJ10

Originally Posted by cguy610



We are talking income and savings rates, not necessarily the "stimulus" checks.  First, the stimulus checks are too small to make a significant impact.  $400?  If mortgages were auto refinanced at no-cost with no equity requirements, some people would save $400 every single month of the year ($4,800 a year).  Which has a different psychological effect than a one time $400 check.

You are arguing against fact.  Americans have a very low savings rate.  Additional income means additional spending.  Comparing one-time tiny stimulus checks to actual long term real increases in personal income are like comparing apples to oranges. 

I understand what you're saying, but the fact that in recent times (i.e - right as the recession was getting rougher) people immediately reversed the course of historical savings rates.  We have a low savings rate because, for one, the cost of basic needs like much of everything else, has grown at a faster pace than we can keep up with.  What your numerical data doesn't point out is, the reason.  If someone takes home $1,500 a month, of which most goes to rent/home, food, what's left?  Not a whole lot.  So what COULD they be saving.  The fact that such a minimal amount was given to them and a quarter of the recipients felt compelled to SAVE it (yeah, that $400) should be really telling.

People need to spend on a necessities, which have been very difficult to do with the recent recession.  Saving $4,800, which would be taxed yet, would more than likely, be spent on basic goods/services for which no new jobs would be created because they're already trying to claw out of the deep hole they're in.

I don't like realtors, mortgage people, but even I can't rock with the notion of refinancing w/ no equity and no costs associated.  Whose going to absorb that?  You do realize that no equity (i.e- minimal to no down payments) is a huge contributing factor as to why we're in the situation we're in.  I hate to say but, not everyone needs/should/deserves to OWN a home.  I am by no way saying that people shouldn't or don't deserve a roof over their head, but ownership isn't the only answer.

Very true Lazy J.  I would more likely blame it on the psychological impact of each item.  When the recession hit, people were so highly leveraged and had so little savings that a small check like that was more likely to be saved.  That's why they went with a "payroll tax holiday" recently instead of a "stimulus check". 

How can you say that a person that had an extra $400 to spend per month for the next 30 years would only spend it on basic necessities that would not create any jobs?  Just the psychological impact of knowing that would cause them to spend more.  We are a nation of spenders and have been for a long time. 

Also, why can't you rock with a no-cost, no-equity refinance?  We rocked with a trillion dollar bailout for banks so why can't we actually help our fellow Americans.  This is what we should have been done a long time ago when the bailouts were announced.  The banks/federal government would absorb the cost of the refinancing.  If it's an automatic refinance, there really shouldn't be high costs anyways if there is no appraisal and all the other crap that you have to go through for a regular refinance. 

 

[lucky42190]

Guess we should all go back to school in the mean time

 

[keithsweatsjordans]

Originally Posted by Al Audi

Originally Posted by finnns2003

I don't need to say anything... this is all one big joke. Pretty soon there will be 30% unemployment, continued outsourcing, higher taxes, worsening infrastructure, and worthless dollars. Get ready for developing countries to catch up big time in the next 20 years.

C'mon finnns, kinda extreme with that one.......better hope it doesn't get that bad here. I mean I'd literally walk around with a gun at all times if it gets that bad.

Dude is fear mongering worse than the media, at least they get financial gain from it. And how is this prediction anymore accurate than the cyclical return one dude posted earlier? At least thats based on historical evidence.

 

[lazyj10]

The reason I don't believe $400 would lead to job creation is because with income disparity and high costs, that money would be simply spent on basics. Rent, groceries, school/supplies, etc. Basically, no big ticket items. Rent isn't going to lead to job growth/creation, nor is grocery stores unless a grocery store enters a market they would not normally be in. But even at that, it's just shifting where the money goes versus being spent or not.

My underlying point is, just because we're a nation of spenders and ultimately going to spend, doesn't equate to that spending being significant enough to create jobs based on the direction our nation is/has been headed in terms of manufacturing, etc. When you have a growing population of people getting by, and barely getting by, additional money is going to old bills, absolute needs, with little is/may be left being put into savings/under the mattress until the next set of bills comes due. That's why, though such a small amount in terms of monetary value the individual stimulus was, it is a huge red flag of the course we're on.

In regards to the re-financing, of course there's going to be an appraisal (which is utter BS, anyway) because otherwise, what are you marking to market? Arbitrary numbers? Of course not. Part of the reason I'm not totally down with it is, real estate markets fluctuate. You mark to fair value today because your neighbors maintained their house but yours is a dump because you have no money, you still may not recoup your NEW principal.

Look if people were fraudulently lied to and predatory lending happened, then those people should in fact get breaks. However, again, not everyone needs/should OWN. It's not just mortgage + prop. tax + ins in home ownership. Cost of repair, upkeep and general maintenance adds up. I should know. Every time I feel like I'm getting ahead, my AC goes out, my furnace needs something, or something else in my house goes haywire. If people can no longer afford their house and the lender won't work with them, that sucks. That truly does. But our nation got way too goddamn complacent on lending standards, leverage, and buy now pay later attitudes. This of course is not everyone, but it surely affects a lot of people. Stop looking at your primary residence as a goddamn investment. It's a shelter.

 

[flacobey]

Originally Posted by FeedTheEgo1982

Do you guys that "corrected" me even know the history of economics. We went through a similar "end of America" "end of the world" scenario in the 70s and in the 80s. It's called a business cycle for a reason. The reasons may be different, but it's all the same. Nothing can be expected to make record profits and expand business infinitely. Just doesn't work that way. We are experiencing a massive correction of our inflated lifestyles and a correction of a faulty system of policies. You can keep letting the media use these catch phrases to scare you into paralysis while brokers get rich off of these cheap stocks that will eventually regain steam.

sorry if my views go against the doom and gloom trend of the general forum. Things will get better... When we actually address the real problems that are at play in this scenario.

 

[finnns2003]

Originally Posted by keithsweatsjordans

Originally Posted by Al Audi

Originally Posted by finnns2003

I don't need to say anything... this is all one big joke. Pretty soon there will be 30% unemployment, continued outsourcing, higher taxes, worsening infrastructure, and worthless dollars. Get ready for developing countries to catch up big time in the next 20 years.

C'mon finnns, kinda extreme with that one.......better hope it doesn't get that bad here. I mean I'd literally walk around with a gun at all times if it gets that bad.

Dude is fear mongering worse than the media, at least they get financial gain from it. And how is this prediction anymore accurate than the cyclical return one dude posted earlier? At least thats based on historical evidence.

Worse than? It would not benefit them if Americans truly knew what was going on. Wake the hell up. Businesses are not going to hire. 

 

[newera202]

Life sucks! 

 

[essential1]

Originally Posted by FlacoBey

Originally Posted by FeedTheEgo1982

Do you guys that "corrected" me even know the history of economics. We went through a similar "end of America" "end of the world" scenario in the 70s and in the 80s. It's called a business cycle for a reason. The reasons may be different, but it's all the same. Nothing can be expected to make record profits and expand business infinitely. Just doesn't work that way. We are experiencing a massive correction of our inflated lifestyles and a correction of a faulty system of policies. You can keep letting the media use these catch phrases to scare you into paralysis while brokers get rich off of these cheap stocks that will eventually regain steam.

sorry if my views go against the doom and gloom trend of the general forum. Things will get better... When we actually address the real problems that are at play in this scenario.

CEO pay for companies in the S&P 500 up 27.8%.

25 of top 100 highest paid CEO's made more than their corporation paid in taxes.. (The average profit of those corporations $1.9billion)

Record profits for corporations and banks during a recession...

Working Class wages have been stagnant for over a decade and in some studies decreased..

So it is not a correction of our "inflated lifestyle" because there really wasn't one to begin with. Corporations corrected what they perceived as a "inflated lifestyle" of the middle class and inflated their lifestyle.

And you are correct the policies of the government over the last 30 years (Democrats & Republicans) have become extremely lax. And moved more wealth from 98% to 2%. That's the real redistribution of wealth in this country.

And the only solution given is to cut taxes even more because even though taxes for individuals and corporations are at an all time low.. We must cut more because then they will hire people.

That's the difference between the 1970's, and for the most part 1980's.

 

[gambit215]

Originally Posted by mYToAsterspeak

Who are these numbers really on though? Is it on the republicans who say, NO! don't raise the taxes on the rich or they won't create jobs. Obama says ok, fine, they will remain at Bush era levels. No jobs created

There is something else going on besides taxing, jobs, NAFTA, imports, Obama, Republicans, and Democrats.

The evil of money/wealth, and what we as a world society have done to ourselves in regards to how we value money and what money really means. Because if you look at it, the whole world is going through money problems. Everybody wanna keep worrying about those things I listed above, and its none of that. The real problem is US, the human being. Greed/money/wealth/being rich has brought down many societies, empires, kingdoms, and people. It's gonna be a tough go, keep your head above water

Had to comb through a LOT OF CRAP, to find this one..................

Best Post............

People think on such a small scale..............It all comes to down to ego, pride, greed, things you cant really "measure"

 

[finnns2003]

Originally Posted by Essential1

Originally Posted by FlacoBey

Originally Posted by FeedTheEgo1982

Do you guys that "corrected" me even know the history of economics. We went through a similar "end of America" "end of the world" scenario in the 70s and in the 80s. It's called a business cycle for a reason. The reasons may be different, but it's all the same. Nothing can be expected to make record profits and expand business infinitely. Just doesn't work that way. We are experiencing a massive correction of our inflated lifestyles and a correction of a faulty system of policies. You can keep letting the media use these catch phrases to scare you into paralysis while brokers get rich off of these cheap stocks that will eventually regain steam.

sorry if my views go against the doom and gloom trend of the general forum. Things will get better... When we actually address the real problems that are at play in this scenario.

CEO pay for companies in the S&P 500 up 27.8%.

25 of top 100 highest paid CEO's made more than their corporation paid in taxes.. (The average profit of those corporations $1.9billion)

Record profits for corporations and banks during a recession...

Working Class wages have been stagnant for over a decade and in some studies decreased..

So it is not a correction of our "inflated lifestyle" because there really wasn't one to begin with. Corporations corrected what they perceived as a "inflated lifestyle" of the middle class and inflated their lifestyle.

And you are correct the policies of the government over the last 30 years (Democrats & Republicans) have become extremely lax. And moved more wealth from 98% to 2%. That's the real redistribution of wealth in this country.

And the only solution given is to cut taxes even more because even though taxes for individuals and corporations are at an all time low.. We must cut more because then they will hire people.

That's the difference between the 1970's, and for the most part 1980's.

The CEO pay is getting ridiculous. Did anyone see what Tim Cook got at Apple for becoming CEO? Absurd! How about some dividends on your stock?? 

 

[duba169]

I don't understand how people eat up that nonsense about these CEO's being the only people that could do their job, that's why they are paid like crazy

 

[lazyj10]

Originally Posted by finnns2003

Originally Posted by Essential1

Originally Posted by FlacoBey

CEO pay for companies in the S&P 500 up 27.8%.

25 of top 100 highest paid CEO's made more than their corporation paid in taxes.. (The average profit of those corporations $1.9billion)

Record profits for corporations and banks during a recession...

Working Class wages have been stagnant for over a decade and in some studies decreased..

So it is not a correction of our "inflated lifestyle" because there really wasn't one to begin with. Corporations corrected what they perceived as a "inflated lifestyle" of the middle class and inflated their lifestyle.

And you are correct the policies of the government over the last 30 years (Democrats & Republicans) have become extremely lax. And moved more wealth from 98% to 2%. That's the real redistribution of wealth in this country.

And the only solution given is to cut taxes even more because even though taxes for individuals and corporations are at an all time low.. We must cut more because then they will hire people.

That's the difference between the 1970's, and for the most part 1980's.

The CEO pay is getting ridiculous. Did anyone see what Tim Cook got at Apple for becoming CEO? Absurd! How about some dividends on your stock?? 

Restricted stock options? Seriously, that's your beef? The FULL thing doesn't vest for 10 years, which in CEO time, is a hell of a long time.  It's a small price to pay for stability.  It was also based on current stock prices....which, today does not guarantee tomorrow.

 

[essential1]

Originally Posted by LazyJ10

Originally Posted by finnns2003

Originally Posted by Essential1


CEO pay for companies in the S&P 500 up 27.8%.

25 of top 100 highest paid CEO's made more than their corporation paid in taxes.. (The average profit of those corporations $1.9billion)

Record profits for corporations and banks during a recession...

Working Class wages have been stagnant for over a decade and in some studies decreased..

So it is not a correction of our "inflated lifestyle" because there really wasn't one to begin with. Corporations corrected what they perceived as a "inflated lifestyle" of the middle class and inflated their lifestyle.

And you are correct the policies of the government over the last 30 years (Democrats & Republicans) have become extremely lax. And moved more wealth from 98% to 2%. That's the real redistribution of wealth in this country.

And the only solution given is to cut taxes even more because even though taxes for individuals and corporations are at an all time low.. We must cut more because then they will hire people.

That's the difference between the 1970's, and for the most part 1980's.

The CEO pay is getting ridiculous. Did anyone see what Tim Cook got at Apple for becoming CEO? Absurd! How about some dividends on your stock?? 

Restricted stock options? Seriously, that's your beef? The FULL thing doesn't vest for 10 years, which in CEO time, is a hell of a long time.  It's a small price to pay for stability.  It was also based on current stock prices....which, today does not guarantee tomorrow.

Their stock options doesn't make a difference to me... But many CEO's still have a multi-million dollar Golden Parachute if they run the business into the ground or not.... So tomorrow makes 0 difference to them. Shareholders be damned..

"Fiorina received $21 million in severance pay when she was fired as CEO of Hewlett Packard in 2005. She received an additional $21 million when Hewlett Packard's board bought out her company stock options and pension benefits. Her compensation package sparked a lawsuit from shareholders."

"But she did get a $45 million dollar golden parachute after being fired while 20,000 of her employees were laid off."


That is just 1 example... She got fired for the piss poor job she was doing, 20,000 people were laid off... And she got $45 million total there was more than the two $21 million dollar compensations.

"Henry McKinnell did as CEO of pharmaceutical giant Pfizer, taking a 72% pay increase in 2005 as its company struggled to reduce costs in light of projected earnings losses. When McKinnell left Pfizer in 2006, the stock's price had declined by 46%; he still managed to take home an $83 million pension anyway."

They privatize wins, and publicize loses. When they win they get the money from the wins.. When they lose they get the money anyway from the shareholders or taxpayers..

 

[finnns2003]

Originally Posted by LazyJ10

Originally Posted by finnns2003

Originally Posted by Essential1


CEO pay for companies in the S&P 500 up 27.8%.

25 of top 100 highest paid CEO's made more than their corporation paid in taxes.. (The average profit of those corporations $1.9billion)

Record profits for corporations and banks during a recession...

Working Class wages have been stagnant for over a decade and in some studies decreased..

So it is not a correction of our "inflated lifestyle" because there really wasn't one to begin with. Corporations corrected what they perceived as a "inflated lifestyle" of the middle class and inflated their lifestyle.

And you are correct the policies of the government over the last 30 years (Democrats & Republicans) have become extremely lax. And moved more wealth from 98% to 2%. That's the real redistribution of wealth in this country.

And the only solution given is to cut taxes even more because even though taxes for individuals and corporations are at an all time low.. We must cut more because then they will hire people.

That's the difference between the 1970's, and for the most part 1980's.

The CEO pay is getting ridiculous. Did anyone see what Tim Cook got at Apple for becoming CEO? Absurd! How about some dividends on your stock?? 

Restricted stock options? Seriously, that's your beef? The FULL thing doesn't vest for 10 years, which in CEO time, is a hell of a long time.  It's a small price to pay for stability.  It was also based on current stock prices....which, today does not guarantee tomorrow.

Like I said, they can do that but can't pay dividends on their stock or share buybacks. Is Cook worth that kind of cooking?

 

[Betonblck]

Originally Posted by LazyJ10

The reason I don't believe $400 would lead to job creation is because with income disparity and high costs, that money would be simply spent on basics. Rent, groceries, school/supplies, etc. Basically, no big ticket items. Rent isn't going to lead to job growth/creation, nor is grocery stores unless a grocery store enters a market they would not normally be in. But even at that, it's just shifting where the money goes versus being spent or not.

My underlying point is, just because we're a nation of spenders and ultimately going to spend, doesn't equate to that spending being significant enough to create jobs based on the direction our nation is/has been headed in terms of manufacturing, etc. When you have a growing population of people getting by, and barely getting by, additional money is going to old bills, absolute needs, with little is/may be left being put into savings/under the mattress until the next set of bills comes due. That's why, though such a small amount in terms of monetary value the individual stimulus was, it is a huge red flag of the course we're on.

In regards to the re-financing, of course there's going to be an appraisal (which is utter BS, anyway) because otherwise, what are you marking to market? Arbitrary numbers? Of course not. Part of the reason I'm not totally down with it is, real estate markets fluctuate. You mark to fair value today because your neighbors maintained their house but yours is a dump because you have no money, you still may not recoup your NEW principal.

Look if people were fraudulently lied to and predatory lending happened, then those people should in fact get breaks. However, again, not everyone needs/should OWN. It's not just mortgage + prop. tax + ins in home ownership. Cost of repair, upkeep and general maintenance adds up. I should know. Every time I feel like I'm getting ahead, my AC goes out, my furnace needs something, or something else in my house goes haywire. If people can no longer afford their house and the lender won't work with them, that sucks. That truly does. But our nation got way too goddamn complacent on lending standards, leverage, and buy now pay later attitudes. This of course is not everyone, but it surely affects a lot of people. Stop looking at your primary residence as a goddamn investment. It's a shelter.

Income disparity is an issue and rather than government contribute to the problem, it should take steps to mitigate the problem.  Lower incomes for workers also means lower tax revenue on the wages/salaries are taxed, and lower tax revenue because these people also have less money to spend. 

My refinance example was just one example, but my main premise is that if money is put into the hands of the middle/lower classes, it will get spent.  And either way, it will most likely end up in the hands of the top 2% when it gets spent anyways. 

Corporations hoard cash while people spend.  For example, Apple has $76 billion in cash.  Income tax breaks for the largest corporations like Apple are not going to create more jobs.