**LA LAKERS THREAD** Sitting on 17! 2023-2024 offseason begins

[sohi 23]

Nah he’s saying he values Dennis at 10 mil but he’ll probably get double that.

 

[Hank Scorpio]

Nah he’s saying he values Dennis at 10 mil but he’ll probably get double that.

In today's NBA, DS is valued around $15-20m, easily.

 

[grittyman]

Good old Hollinger…

Dennis is worth $10 million but Caruso’s value is the full MLE.

Gotta be trolling

 

[Brosizzlew30.23]

Fk it.

I say Lakers do not win chip this year.

You say we go back 2 back like '88.

$50. Payable thru Venmo.

Bet

BIG LEEMELONE

Just a reminder sir

 

[ill steelo]

Spoiler

Hollinger: Lakers must upgrade LeBron and Anthony Davis’ supporting cast, but offseason options are few

In with a bang, out with a whimper.

It’s easy to forget now, but the Los Angeles Lakers started the year 22-7 and spent half a season looking exactly like a defending champion with the maybe-GOAT on their side should look. Some of us old-timers fondly recall those halcyon days of late February, when a Laker repeat seemed borderline inevitable.

Instead, the defending champs were run off the floor in their own building in the first round. Which brings us to the big question: How’d we get here again?

The Lakers’ recent misfortune can be ascribed to two shortcomings in roughly equal measure, one of which was unavoidable and one of which was perhaps preventable.

The unavoidable, part, of course, was that their two best players got hurt. It’s easy to forget how important the simple fact of health is to any championship run, and the Lakers certainly saw the flip side of this during their relatively charmed ride to the title in 2020.

Once LeBron James hurt his ankle in March, the Lakers were never the same, going 18-21 the rest of the way and barely beating a middling Warriors team in the play-in game to make it to the postseason. Even when James came back, he lacked the same burst and acceleration, something that became painfully obvious the longer the Phoenix series wore on.

The groin injury to Anthony Davis in Game 4 against Phoenix was the final blow, with the Lakers outscored by 42 points over the final two games. (In an embarrassing coda for the organization’s entire chain of command, Davis was allowed to “play,” if it can be called that, for a few minutes in Game 6 before mercifully being removed).

But just blaming injuries is perhaps too easy. The Lakers had two elite stars, but they also had the league’s most yawning gap between their second and third-best players. The Phoenix series underscored how overmatched the Lakers were at roster spots three through nine against a good opponent; even with Chris Paul not at full strength, L.A. was riddled by the likes of Deandre Ayton and Cameron Payne and had no similar secondary weapons coming to their own rescue. Aside from the two marquee stars, it’s hard to name a single Laker who would start for more than a third of the league’s teams.

Remember, it wasn’t supposed to be this way, especially at the offensive end. The Lakers ‘ 2020 offseason was designed with the specific purpose of surrounding James and Davis with more talent, in hopes of fortifying an attack that was pretty anemic whenever James checked out in 2019-20. Such a team would also be better able to withstand an absence from one of the stars.

They used their full non-taxpayer midlevel exception on Montrezl Harrell, who hardly played in the postseason. They traded the perennially underrated Danny Green to get a better offensive creator in Dennis Schröder, surrendering their first-round pick to do it. Hemmed in against the apron by the Harrell signing, they gave up two second-round picks to turn JaVale McGee into Marc Gasol. They used their biannual exception on Wes Matthews and brought back Markieff Morris on a minimum deal. Still unsatisfied, they brought in Andre Drummond on a buyout deal this spring; installed as a starter upon arrival, he was so impressive that they DNP’d him in the final game.

All told, the Lakers got fairly minimal contributions from all those players except Schröder, and even he underwhelmed relative to his 2019-20 career year in Oklahoma City. In 20-20 hindsight, some might say the Lakers’ unwillingness to include young win Talen Horton-Tucker in a trade for Kyle Lowry was a fatal error, as Lowry’s two-way contribution from the guard spot is exactly the thing L.A. was missing.

On the other hand, not so fast. The flip side of the argument is that without Davis their fate was sealed anyway, and turning Schroder, Kentavious Caldwell-Pope and Horton-Tucker into Lowry wouldn’t have changed the outcome but certainly would have harmed their future.

Either way, that future is now a rather interesting debate. James will be 37 years old next year. Davis is 28, but his injury history is starting to becoming concerning; he’s played 56, 62 and 32 games the past three seasons, and has never played more than 75.

The Lakers need to bring in some help for these guys, but this is where the NBA’s salary cap and luxury tax rules are having their desired effect in at least somewhat leveling the playing field. Yes, even for the Lakers, it’s going to be tough to bring in quality starters with the assets and cap resources at their disposal. In this case, the issue isn’t whether to push their chips in, it’s finding the chips.

L.A. goes into the offseason just $10 million from the luxury tax line (factoring in a salary for their first-round pick, 22nd overall) and having seven empty roster spots to fill. Schroder, Morris, Drummond, Matthews, Horton-Tucker, Alex Caruso, Jared Dudley and Ben McLemore are free agents, while the non-guaranteed Alfonzo McKinnie presumably isn’t returning either. That empty roster count goes to eight if Gasol decides to retire to his vegetable garden in Spain.

Even if the Lakers wanted to run it back with the same group, their tax situation makes it virtually impossible. Schröder turned down a contract extension because he’s looking for a deal in excess of $20 million a year, according to reports (that may have been a blessing in disguise, actually; my BORD$ formula pegs his future value around $10 million). Caruso made only $2.5 million last year and is due for a major raise; one suspects he will have offers around the midlevel exception. Ditto for the 21-year-old Horton-Tucker, who is likely to draw offer sheets in the same range from teams who question whether the Lakers can stomach a large luxury tax hit for a developmental player.

Just paying those three players their market value would put the Lakers about $30 million into the tax; adding a player with the taxpayer mid-level exception and three minimum contracts on top of that would push them more than $40 million over. The concomitant penalty for that tax breach is $140 million, a check even this deep-pocketed franchise wouldn’t stomach writing … especially to bring back a team that finished in seventh and lost in the first round.

No, the Lakers are going to need to get a whole lot more creative this time around. The first step is figuring out what to do with Harrell. Surely they can’t bring him back and have a $9.7 million salary slot occupied by somebody they won’t use in a playoff game.

He could give them an out by declining his $9.7 million player option for next season, but the Lakers cratered his market value enough that he may prefer to opt-in and wait for a trade. The silver lining is that he gives the Lakers a matching salary to put in a trade, and they are very short on the type of middle-class contracts in the $10-15 million range that are the grease for so many deals. Kyle Kuzma is the only other Laker salary in this class, and it’s fair to ask if it makes sense to have him making $13 million a year when that money could go toward upgrades in the backcourt. Even in the playoffs, with L.A. desperate for secondary scoring, they were unable to get him going.

Another factor for L.A. is that the lure of Hollywood won’t help them much with expensive free agents, because the Lakers are basically blocked from the sign-and-trade market by the luxury tax apron. Even if they wanted to execute a sign-and-trade for somebody like Lowry, and came up with the matching contracts, they’ll have a very hard time filling out the rest of the roster with something more than minimum contracts while staying below the apron. With James and Davis making $76 million between them, there just isn’t a lot of wiggle room left over.

When Brooklyn and Milwaukee were in a somewhat similar position, they nabbed their third star by trading all their draft assets and cobbling together just enough matching salary to make it work. The problem for the Lakers is that they already did that in the Davis trade, and now don’t have enough left over to swing a trade for an A-List talent. (The other little fly in the ointment is that an A-List talent needs to actually come available, of course). The Lakers can trade their pick on draft night, but it’s only 22nd, and they don’t have another first-rounder to put in a trade until 2027 because of the Stepien rule.

The other route would be to trade for a merely “pretty good” player on a not-great contract, somebody like Al Horford or Andrew Wiggins. Even this pathway is fraught, however, as the Lakers would probably have to give up some combination of Kuzma, Harrell and draft equity, and/or sign-and-trade Horton-Tucker…. all to get somebody who doesn’t really move the needle that much, and still jacks up the payroll.

If it sounds like this going to be challenging, that’s kind of my point. L.A. only has two clear means of bringing in talent: using its taxpayer midlevel exception to sign a free agent in the $5 million range, and using its first-round pick and an existing salary (likely Kuzma or, if he opts in, Harrell) to trade for an upgrade with a contract in the $10-15 million range.

Last season they were in a similar situation, albeit with a bit more salary wiggle room, and ended up with Schröder and Harrell. That ended up looking a lot better in November than it did in May. This offseason they’re going to need to do much, much, better, or the supporting cast will again be found wanting.

The good news here is that as long as James and Davis can play at their peak, the Lakers will always have a chance. Even in this series, they had the Suns on the ropes until Davis went down in Game 4. But age and injuries mean asking those two to carry the team on their backs every night is no longer reasonable, especially if chasing banners is still the end game. Unfortunately, the Lakers don’t seem to have great alternatives at the moment, and that state of affairs could doom them to a similar fate again next spring.

Surprised to hear that from Hollinger. They have quite a bit better than just a “chance” with Bron & AD. You have two elite shot makers and an elite defense, no other team has both.

The team last year does not win a title if AD goes down either.

They don’t “need” to do anything.

 

[tay1]

Surprised to hear that from Hollinger. They have quite a bit better than just a “chance” with Bron & AD. You have two elite shot makers and an elite defense, no other team has both.

The team last year does not win a title if AD goes down either.

They don’t “need” to do anything.

We do “need” upgrades. A Lebron team without any shooters just won’t cut it. We need a 3rd scorer and someone we can count on .

 

[had pants]

 

[pmatic]

Surprised to hear that from Hollinger. They have quite a bit better than just a “chance” with Bron & AD. You have two elite shot makers and an elite defense, no other team has both.

The team last year does not win a title if AD goes down either.

They don’t “need” to do anything.

He didn't like the moves made in the moment, so he's just patting himself on the back.

 

[had pants]

 

[had pants]

 

[tupac003]

BIG LEEMELONE

Just a reminder sir

He 250 in the hole.

Ain't gonna lie...wish he didn't have to pay up.

I would have been perfectly fine dropping 200 for the title....

 

[aepps20]

When I became a Lakers fan, I was in it for the long haul. Our squad won last year but got cheated by the NBA with the fast restart. I'M STILL VERY PROUD OF THIS TEAM AND each of you.

 

[drewsone]

whoever third star they got hes gotta be a respectable 3pt shooter and decent pass

you know how disgusting jr was to see Bron fight in the post for position begging for the ball bad no one not be able to throw an entry pass lol

or himcutting or rolling on the pnr and no one able to hit the pass lmao

go get dame
Go get malcom Brogdan
Idk lol
**** speaking of Indy Myles Turner would be interesting
Bradley??

lots of FAs too
Lowry
Powell
Mike Conley?? Reddick? Lol

 

[ill 949]

Naw **** that, the Sharks too good for Kuzma. Trade him for a 3rd round pick.

 

[Lizakers]

Not expecting many big changes this off-season

no team ever wants to help us or be perceived as making us stronger

but somehow the Nets level up with Harden and Blake

 

[drewsone]

And yeah I know teams always try to tax us

somehow some wy tho I hope they get a good 3rd guy

 

[had pants]

 

[MVP]

And yeah I know teams always try to tax us

somehow some wy tho I hope they get a good 3rd guy

Bron need to stay off of IG with the proclamations. Hasn't worked once since he's been here. 'Playoff mode activated' and 'a storm is coming' just couldn't have been anything more than hot air.

 

[drewsone]

Bron need to stay off of IG with the proclamations. Hasn't worked once since he's been here. 'Playoff mode activated' and 'a storm is coming' just couldn't have been anything more than hot air.

Only time that spicy talk worked was when he posted him in the hyperbolic time chamber from dbz lmao

we got lucky they were both able to stay healthy it seems
But f**k solomon hill lol

for what it’s worth Bron look terrible and washed after the groin too but the next season after recovery looked much better
Hoping for the same this time around.
y’all think this high ankle sprain a worse injury than the torn groin?

 

[MVP]

Only time that spicy talk worked was when he posted him in the hyperbolic time chamber from dbz lmao

we got lucky they were both able to stay healthy it seems
But f**k solomon hill lol

for what it’s worth Bron look terrible and washed after the groin too but the next season after recovery looked much better
Hoping for the same this time around.
y’all think this high ankle sprain a worse injury than the torn groin?

While this year was a freak injury, it's also showing that even for as much as Bron takes care of his body and all the maintenance he does, father time is still undefeated. His body is going to continue to take longer to recover from things that maybe even 4 years ago he'd bounce back from and be the same. It's not a coincidence that he's had the 2 most significant injuries of his career in 2 outta the last 3 seasons.

I'm sure he'll be on his #washedking steez in short order but he'll also be 37 next season.

 

[Lizakers]

Just happy we got a chip and tied Boston

On to next year

 

[sohi 23]

Nets had LaVert and Allen to offer in a Harden trade.
Lakers don’t have near those assets.

It would take Dame forcing a trade and saying I’m not signing anywhere other than the Lakers and I don’t think he has it in him. Blazers management would probably do him a solid tho he’s given his heart to that team and they’ve got eliminated in the 1st round for 4 of the past 5 years.

Like why wouldn’t Portland just trade him to Philly or Miami?

 

[drewsone]

While this year was a freak injury, it's also showing that even for as much as Bron takes care of his body and all the maintenance he does, father time is still undefeated. His body is going to continue to take longer to recover from things that maybe even 4 years ago he'd bounce back from and be the same. It's not a coincidence that he's had the 2 most significant injuries of his career in 2 outta the last 3 seasons.

Bro I remember this dude used to sprain an ankle and just tie it up and bounce back or at most miss 1 game lol

although those were all never high ankle sprains
The groin one was tough tho that was the one for me where I was like yup it’s that phase of his career He bounced back pretty well tho

I still don’t think solomon hill made a play on the ball tho but wellnever know lol I been seeing some clips of solo from this season and dude is dirty lmao

 

[drewsone]

Nets had LaVert and Allen to offer in a Harden trade.
Lakers don’t have near those assets.

It would take Dame forcing a trade and saying I’m not signing anywhere other than the Lakers and I don’t think he has it in him. Blazers management would probably do him a solid tho he’s given his heart to that team and they’ve got eliminated in the 1st round for 4 of the past 5 years.

Like why wouldn’t Portland just trade him to Philly or Miami?

Hoping he signs with Rich Paul this July and shakes **** up LOL

caris a baller but he didn’t even end up in HOU but they did get Dipo lol
A trade for Dame does work tho but it would cost
Trezz
Dennis
Tht
Prob KCP lol. And we would have to take on some contracts

 

[atlsfinest]

Bro I remember this dude used to sprain an ankle and just tie it up and bounce back or at most miss 1 game lol

although those were all never high ankle sprains
The groin one was tough tho that was the one for me where I was like yup it’s that phase of his career He bounced back pretty well tho

I still don’t think solomon hill made a play on the ball tho but wellnever know lol I been seeing some clips of solo from this season and dude is dirty lmao

There were times last season when LeBron rolled his ankle, retired his shoes and was catching alley-oops 5 minutes later. The high ankle sprain is serious. I still don't think that father time has caught up with LeBron. He won finals MVP 7 months ago and was the leading MVP candidate 3 months ago, He didn't instantly become washed, he's just nursing a freak injury. High ankle sprains have 22 year olds out for months too.

I fully expect LeBron to be his MVP self next season