..:Official 2008 NL Central Thread:..Congratulations Chicago Cubs...:

[stringer bell 32]

For those that might be interested

Sean Gallagher debut against the Angel

7.0 IP

2 H

2 R

2 ER

3 BB

7 Ks

Harden has his work cut out for him

 

[tylerdub]

^^^
I am not surprised by those numbers. I think Gallagher will be a good pitcher (most likely a 3 or 4 guy) who will have lots of quality starts and occasionallyhave brilliant outings.
EDIT: Harden on the other hand is a legit 1 or 2 pitcher who is an almost guaranteed quality start every time and will consistently give above average starts.Barring injury i think he is a potential Cy Young award winner. Gallagher is not.
Since the Cubs are making a push at the World Series trading away young talent for talent that can help now was absolutely the right move.

Look at Marquis for instance, he is in no way an ace but he gave the Cubs a great outing yesterday.

 

[tylerdub]

Harden is not disappointing so far.

Thowing a lot of strikes and he never loses when he has a 3 run lead. I am getting very excited about things.

 

[stringer bell 32]

Harden on the other hand is a legit 1 or 2 pitcher
He ain't even the number 1 or 2 starter in his current rotation

Barring injury i think he is a potential Cy Young award winner.
How does that Kool Aid taste?

 

[pusha x vinsanity]

Marmol...

 

[tylerdub]

Marmol is killing me...and the Kool Aid is Delicious and grapey.

 

[stringer bell 32]

Originally Posted by PUSHA x Vinsanity

Marmol...

How long have I been saying this
I changed the channel to the Tigers / Twins game because I thought the game was in the bag....I flip back and I'm like what the hell happened

EDIT -

We got to the 11th

EDIT -
Very suspect celebration at home plate between DeRosa and Theroit

 

[truthmain]

Originally Posted by Stringer Bell 32

Originally Posted by PUSHA x Vinsanity

Marmol...

How long have I been saying this
I changed the channel to the Tigers / Twins game because I thought the game was in the bag....I flip back and I'm like what the hell happened

EDIT -

We got to the 11th

EDIT -
Very suspect celebration at home plate between DeRosa and Theroit

Dude's struggling, it happens. He was lights out until what, maybe the past three weeks? Still one of the best set-up men in the game, todaynotwithstanding.

And I think Harden one-upped both Sabathia and Gallagher today, he was downright filthy.

And we still got the W...

 

[kgdakid21]

I walked into a bar with the cubs up 7-2...finished 3 brews looked back up and it's 7-7....Marmol really needs this ASG break to come...he's beenlimping into the break.

From the highlights, Harden looked solid...Cubs will be fine, I see them taking the division by 5 games or more

 

[wildkycat]

another win vs. the Brewers...Volquez was great...Dunn with two bombs.

 

[arog27]

Cubs Blow Big Lead, Comeback to Win in Extras
Cubs Beat Giants 8-7

CHICAGO -- Rich Harden won over Cubs fans, but Carlos Marmol may have lost a few in what Lou Piniella hopes was a good learning experience.
Harden struck out 10 over 5 1/3 shutout innings in his Cubs debut, and was in line for the win Saturday but did not get a decision, as Reed Johnson hit awalk-off RBI single with one out in the 11th inning to give Chicago an 8-7 victory over the San Francisco Giants.

The Cubs had opened a 7-0 lead, more than enough for Harden, acquired Tuesday from the Oakland Athletics. The right-hander notched his third careerdouble-digit strikeout game, and second this year, and the crowd of 41,555 appreciated the effort, giving him a standing ovation as he exited after 5 1/3scoreless innings.

The Giants closed to 7-2 in the eighth, but the Cubs were still confident.

"When you've got a five-run lead, the thought pretty much with the players and everyone in the stands, is the game is over," Johnson said."Any time you lose one like that, it makes it good that you end up winning the ballgame. But at the same time, you want to get Harden the win. He pitchedgreat in his Cubs debut. I'm sure that won't be the last great outing he has."

The Cubs need to get Marmol back to his "great" status. The Giants batted around in the ninth against Marmol, collecting five runs on five hits,one walk and a hit batter in the inning.

Ivan Ochoa doubled to lead off, and one out later, Jose Castillo hit a chopper toward the pitcher who booted the ball, and the Giants had runners at firstand third. Marmol then served up a pair of RBI singles, walked a batter, and gave up a run-scoring fielder's choice. Marmol hit the next batter, andshortstop Ryan Theriot fielded pinch-hitter Eliezer Alfonzo's RBI single, and then threw it wildly for an error, allowing a run to score.

Suddenly, the game was tied at 7.

"One thing led to another and, all of a sudden, we had three men on," Cubs catcher Geovany Soto said. "Everything got away from us. It was abad day. [Marmol's] back was a little stiff out there. Everybody goes out there trying to do well, and unfortunately, it wasn't his day."

Piniella didn't have Kerry Wood available. He's bothered by a blister that will prevent him from pitching in the All-Star Game Tuesday.

"We felt with the right-hand hitters coming up, [Marmol] could make one pitch to get out of it," Piniella said. "He's done it in thepast. Today, it just didn't happen. I'm not going to lose confidence in the guy -- he's done too well here. I think this rest at the break will dowell."

Marmol chose not to speak to reporters.

"Let me tell you what I hope he learned from today," Piniella said. "He had a little chopper [by Castillo], and in trying to avoid a runscoring from third base, he boots the ball instead of just making a nice, easy play. Let them get a run in, get the second out, and toss the ball to DerrekLee. That was the inning as far as I was concerned.

"Forget the run -- you've got a five-run lead, all you want are outs in the eighth and ninth innings. You don't need spectacular things, allyou need are outs. He tried to prevent a run from scoring, and five scored."

The Cubs did score in the 11th. Sean Marshall (2-2) singled to lead off, and advanced when Mark DeRosa walked but was forced at third on Mike Fontenot'sfielder's choice. Johnson drove a pitch from Brian Wilson (0-2) to right and DeRosa slid home just ahead of the throw for the game-winning run.

"My first couple at-bats, I didn't feel that great, and was just feeling for it," Johnson said. "The last at-bat, I got the good part ofthe bat on the ball and it ended up working out."

The Cubs opened their early lead thanks to Jim Edmonds, who drove in four runs, hitting a two-run homer with two outs in the third, his 10th, and a two-rundouble in the fourth.

"There's 24 other guys wishing we were going to win that game just to make Marmol feel better," Johnson said. "He's been unbelievablefor us. We wouldn't be where we are if we didn't have him."

Yes, Carlos Marmol is struggling mighty. Yes, Alfonso Soriano is still not playing. Yes, the Brewers added C.C. Sabathia,and they have a great lineup. Yes, the damn Cardinals haven't gone away. But here we are on July 12th, and once again the Cubs are 20 games over .500 withthe best record in baseball. This doesn't guarantee anything, it is what it is, but damn it feels good to be up 5.5 and 6 games respectively.

Pirates Come Out of Nowhere, Shock Cardinals
PITTSBURGH - On the 11th anniversary of Francisco Cordova and Ricardo Rincon'scombined no-hitter against the Astros, the Pirates pulled off another miracle.
Jason Michael's two-run homer in the 10th inning finished off an unlikely comeback and lifted the Pirates over the Cardinals, 12-11, at PNC ParkSaturday night.

The Pirates tied the game with Nate McLouth's three-run homer and Jason Bay's fifth RBI of the game in the ninth. They came back from a 10-4 deficitheading into the eighth.

The unlikely turn of events made many forget about Yoslan Herrera's rough Major League debut. Herrera finished with a line of six runs, 11 hits, fourstrikeouts and four walks, while the Cardinals offense pounded out a season-high 22 hits.

Jason Bay gave the Pirates an early 2-0 lead in the first on a home run to right-center field. Bay's blast, his 18th of the season, tied him with AlOliver for 10th place on the Pirates' all-time home run list. Bay passed Oliver in the eighth with his 19th tater.

Adam LaRoche made the score 5-3 in the fourth with his 11th home run of the year. Jose Bautista then drove in the Pirates' fourth run with an RBI singlein the seventh.

Dunn Goes Deep 2x, Volquez Fans 10, Brewers Lose

MILWAUKEE -- Reds pitcher Edinson Volquez's next appearance will likely be under the brightest lights on one of the biggest stages.
The All-Star Game. New York. Yankee Stadium.

Before he could have fun in the big city, Volquez had business to attend to in Milwaukee. The right-hander pitched like the All-Star he is during theReds' 8-2 win over the Brewers on Saturday night at Miller Park. His line: two runs -- one earned -- over seven innings, allowing six hits and two walkswhile fanning 10.

"I felt great tonight," said Volquez, the Reds' lone 2008 All-Star. "I told Edwin [Encarnacion] I'm going to have a great nighttonight because I felt good."

This was another big win for the Reds (46-49), who have improved to 3-2 on their six-game road trip, with Sunday's first-half finale remaining againstnew Brewers ace CC Sabathia.

Now 12-3 with a 2.29 ERA, Volquez temporarily holds leads in two-thirds of the National League pitching Triple Crown. While second in wins behind BrandonWebb, he's the NL ERA leader and tied with Tim Lincecum for the strikeouts lead with 126. (Lincecum should regain the strikeout lead when he starts for theGiants on Sunday.)

"Anytime he's on the mound, we feel great -- we have a great opportunity to win the ballgame," said shortstop Jerry Hairston Jr., who was4-for-4 with a walk and two doubles. "It doesn't matter who we're playing. That's a great feeling."

Adam Dunn's three-run home run in the first inning -- his first of two in the game -- gave the Reds an early 3-0 lead. Cincinnati was otherwise stymiedby Brewers starter Seth McClung (5-5), who gave up just one single to Hairston for the rest of his 6 1/3-inning night.

Still, Volquez had enough room to do his thing. The 25-year-old retired nine of the first 11 batters he faced, five via strikeouts. In a 1-2-3 secondinning, he tossed just eight pitches.

"You know with Volkie, you're not going to need to score too many runs," said Dunn after his first multi-homer night of this season."Anytime we get a lead early with him on the mound, we'll feel pretty confident."

In the Brewers' fourth, Hairston flubbed a routine grounder from leadoff batter Ryan Braun for an error. The next batter, Prince Fielder, smoked a 1-0Volquez fastball into the left-field bullpen and made it 3-2.

Volquez retired the rest of the side in order in the fourth and worked out of a bases-loaded, two-out jam in the fifth. With runners on first and second,Encarnacion made a superb diving stop towards the third-base line on Braun's sharp grounder. Braun had to settle for an infield single.

"What saved the game really was that play Edwin made down there," Reds manager Dusty Baker said. "That was a tremendous play, because if theyhad scored more runs, we'd have to make some decisions."

Volquez then saved himself. Facing Fielder again, he threw three straight changeups -- including one with a 2-0 count -- and got an inning-ending grounderto second base.

"I think it was one of the great nights for me tonight," Volquez said. "All my pitches were there tonight. I made good pitches, especiallywhen I got the bases loaded. I threw the right pitch. I was behind in the count, 2-0, and that's when the changeup came."

On his second-to-last pitch of the game in the seventh (No. 113), Volquez reached 97 mph on the radar gun.

After Volquez departed, the Reds blew the game open. Hairston collected his third hit on a one-out double to left field in the eighth, scoring on KenGriffey Jr.'s rolling two-out single through the right side. In a four-run ninth, Dunn led off with his 26th homer of the season, another shot to rightfield. Encarnacion made it back-to-back long balls with a homer to left field.

Of Volquez's 19 starts this season, a team-leading 14 have been quality outings and only four have seen more than two earned runs scored. He had twosubpar outings at the end of June and beginning of July, but Volquez is heading into the break with back-to-back strong performances.

All that's left to learn is Volquez's assignment at the All-Star Game. He is a potential candidate to start the game, especially with Webb andLincecum both scheduled to pitch on Sunday.

"I wanted him to go there on a high, on a positive," Baker said. "He's going there with quite a few pitches. [NL manager] Clint Hurdlecalled me today, but I didn't get a chance to speak with him. He wanted to know how much he could ask of [Volquez]. On two days' rest, it's notvery long. We'll see after I talk to Clint."

 

[truthmain]

I guess it was a battle of whose bullpen is worse today...I mean dang

 

[pacmagic2002]

I think that game is what starts the sinking of the cardinals ship.........unless a trade is completed for some bullpen pitching that is reliable.

 

[tylerdub]

Yes, Carlos Marmol is struggling mighty. Yes, Alfonso Soriano is still not playing. Yes, the Brewers added C.C. Sabathia, and they have a great lineup. Yes, the damn Cardinals haven't gone away. But here we are on July 12th, and once again the Cubs are 20 games over .500 with the best record in baseball. This doesn't guarantee anything, it is what it is, but damn it feels good to be up 5.5 and 6 games respectively.

PREACH!!!!

 

[wildkycat]

great.

Hairston appears to have just torn his hamstring.

 

[wildkycat]

god dammit...big CC just went yard.

 

[wisconsin 4 life]

CC 9 innings pitched, 9ks, W, HR. BEAST

 

[wildkycat]

we shouldn't have lost that game.

but after the start to the season, i ain't too disappointed with where we're at at the break.

 

[joe billionaire]

marmol replaced wood as an allstar...

he should just sit it out and take a break imo.

 

[CP1708]

Originally Posted by Joe Billionaire

marmol replaced wood as an allstar...

he should just sit it out and take a break imo.

Agreed. Hopefully he doesn't pitch in the game. We need him fresh for the finish.

 

[wisconsin 4 life]

Reports say Sheets is going to start the all-star game. First Brewer to ever start one.

 

[stringer bell 32]

No worries for Harden, but plenty for Marmol

July 13, 2008
BY JAY MARIOTTI Sun-Times Columnist

Like foie gras, 10 Cane rum and the Bugatti Veyron sports car, Rich Harden is a delicacy best consumed in moderation. You build him a large lead. You yank him after 5 1/3 scoreless innings and 96 pitches. You slap him on the rump and thank him, as Lou Piniella did Saturday, and then you lock him in a hermetically sealed cocoon so his blowtorch right arm doesn't go limp before his next start.


But the Cubs, right now, have a bigger issue than the Harden Health Watch. Would someone mind telling me what the hell happened to Carlos Marmol and why his once-unhittable pitches have turned to marmalade? The grand plan of letting the bullpen preserve Harden's would-be first victory was sabotaged by Marmol, who completely blew a 7-2 lead in the ninth and returned a familiar sound effect to what has been a summer of love at Wrigley Field.

``BOOOOOOOOOOO!!!''

``Sorry I'm late, but I had to have a nice, cold beer before coming down here,'' Piniella said after the Cubs salvaged an 8-7 win over the Giants in 11 innings.

If not for an overtime rescue mission by Sean Marshall, whose two perfect innings set up Reed Johnson's game-winning single, Cubdom would be in one of its devastated, curse-the-goat funks today. Not that the questions won't persist about Marmol, whose dominance has turned into a high-risk, control-challenged adventure the last month. Is his arm burning out from overuse? Don't his 49 appearances rank among the most in the major leagues? Where did his nasty slider go? These are fair concerns to raise about a reliever who used to be lights-out but now has flipped on the switch, allowing us to see his warts. Since June 19, when he led the majors with 20 holds and owned a 2.09 ERA, he has lost two decisions, blown two saves and let his ERA soar to a disturbing 4.13. In that span, he has given up at least one earned run in six of his 12 appearances, including blowups in which he yielded four runs to Tampa Bay, three to the Giants and, in his latest debacle, five more against a San Francisco club that struggles to score.

This is the guy, I admit, who was my endorsed choice to be the closer in spring training. Fess up -- a lot of you thought the same way. Thank goodness for the splendid first half of closer Kerry Wood, who wasn't available Saturday and won't pitch today or in the All-Star Game because of -- calm down, please -- a blister on his pitching hand. Who knew that Wood would be the rock, ex ceeding all expectations and maintaining his arm health, while Marmol would falter? We can't expect perfection, but we should expect him to retire batters with some consistency, right?

All you need to know about Marmol is that Piniella, when asked if he was concerned, let one of his pregnant, five-second pauses hang in the air before voicing support. ``There's no concern,'' he said. ``We'll give him a nice rest at the break and see what happens in the second half. I'm not gonna lose confidence in the guy. He's done too well. We'll continue to pitch him.''

Might it be time for a managerial pep talk? ``I don't have to talk to him about confidence,'' Piniella said. ``Know what confidence is? When I call down there and put him in the ballgame. That's confidence.''

Even with the best record in the National League, even with the highest run differential in the majors, the Cubs always are going to have issues. Harden, for all his talent, will be an ongoing mystery as general manager Jim Hendry dares to embrace another health conundrum. Having endured the agony of Mark Prior and previous heartbreak of Wood, he's taking another blind plunge into Risk/Reward Roulette while praying that Harden avoids DL Hell. Making his Cubs debut, he was as crackling as advertised amid an adoring Wrigley scene, whiffing 10 and leaving to a rousing standing ovation. He wasn't Zambrano-dominant, allowing five hits and three walks, but a double-digit strikeout performance in a relatively short opening start should quiet talk in baseball circles that he has a dead arm.

For now, anyway.

We have absolutely no idea, of course, how Hendry's gamble will turn out in the wash. It was a necessary risk, an urgent response after the little ballclub in Wisconsin acquired C.C. Sabathia to team with Ben Sheets in a supercharged pitching tandem. But if Harden isn't healthy in October, if he only adds to a disabled-list itinerary that has included six stops in four years, what will the regular season matter? The start was only his 27th over the last three years. While it also was his 12th consecutive start since returning in May from his latest DL trip, don't you get a creepy feeling that a clock is ticking, that he's an MRI waiting to happen? What if I told you the last time Harden pitched 13 straight starts, without interruption, was in 2004?

The intention isn't to jinx him. Wrigley, as we know, is haunted by too many curses as it is. I'm simply pointing out to Cubdom that Harden should be analyzed on a start-by-start basis, with no promises or strings attached. If he stays healthy, keeps bringing his heater in the mid-90s, keeps dropping that sick changeup and helps lead this team to the World Series, it will be an all-time deal for the Cubs, a Rick Sutcliffe trade for the new millennium. And if he breaks down? Hey, at least Hendry tried, though he might be w ise to stay in the market for Greg Maddux as late-season/postseason insurance.

``I had a lot of people tell me this was going to be a good experience. It was,'' Harden said of his Wrigley love-in. ``It was a pretty cool feeling. I've never had anything like that, pitching in Oakland. It's easier to pitch here with the crowd into every pitch. It's exciting, and I'll use it as motivation to give me a push. From what I hear, it's like that every game. It's pretty impressive.''

And his arm's not dead?

``Some people were concerned. I tried telling people it's not an issue,'' said Harden, who pushed the radar gun to readings of 98 and 96 mph after recent bouts with reduced velocity. ``You're gonna have games where you're up or down. As long as I'm throwing strikes, I'm not worried.''

All eyes are on the Cubs to see if they can keep Harden off the DL. The trials of Prior and Wood, both doomed by mechanical issues, are putting intense pressure on Hendry, pitching coach Larry Rothschild and the team's medical staff in regard to Harden. In Oakland, he leaves behind a trusted guru in A's bullpen coach Ron Romanick, who set up a regimen between starts that has kept him injury-free since May. But keep this in mind: The only reason Harden is a Cub is because the A's didn't believe in his long-term health. ``Let's not be naive," Hendry said. ``If he hadn't spent a lot of time on th e DL the last few years, he's not in Chicago today. He'd be an untouchable.''

For now, Harden has an 0.00 ERA as a Cub. If life and baseball were fair, he'd also have a 1-0 record. Carlos Marmol owes him one.

 

[tylerdub]

It will be good for Marmol to hang out at the All Star game and experience some positive things about baseball. I am sure he was very excited about being namedas a replacement for Wood, and it probably does some good for his mental health.

 

[am 1 fiend]

Originally Posted by tylerdub

It will be good for Marmol to hang out at the All Star game and experience some positive things about baseball. I am sure he was very excited about being named as a replacement for Wood, and it probably does some good for his mental health.

Imagine if he gives up the game winner to the A.L.?

 

[tylerdub]

I am personally hoping no Cubs pitcher even plays. I would also like to limit the PT for all position players.