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Who ends up sitting on the Iron Throne?

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Found this on Yahoo via Reddit about Varys still pulling strings 
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“I was rewatching the trial of Tyrion after Joffrey’s assassination, and I recalled a confused feeling I had not remembered since seeing the episode. Before the trial, and after the battle of Blackwater, Varys visited Tyrion and congratulated him. They actually spend a good deal of time developing their friendship. But when Varys is called to the stand to testify, what happens? He testifies against Tyrion. He gives a damning analysis of Tyrion. And I wondered why he did that, since I heard it. I thought he was somehow doing this to protect himself, the way Bronn later refuses Tyrion’s request to be his champion. I was somewhat content with that logic. But as I watched it last night I found new logic that served that scene greater purpose. He wanted Tyrion to be found guilty. And why? He wanted to give him to Daenerys. He conspired with Jaime to free him. He organized his passage to Daenerys. And he got abducted by whom? Jorah Mormont. A person who conspired with Varys from the very beginning. Deliberate or no? Definitely convenient. I don’t think anything accidentally happens to Varys. It’s all part of the Spider’s web.”
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The dude that plays the Night King is the same actor that was stabbed by Leaf in Bran's flashback about how the Children of the Forest created the White Walkers. So the NK is the original White Walker.

Also, I realized a couple weeks ago that the actor that played the High Septon (Jonathan Pryce) was Bond villian Elliot Carver in the Tomorrow Never Dies :lol:
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Hope they do IMAX again...

would be dope to see Battle of the Bastards and the Finale on the big screen 8)
 
Not sure if posted before, but here is GRRM original 3-page outline of the series.

Dear Ralph,

Here are the first thirteen chapters (170 pages) of the high fantasy novel I promised you, which I'm calling 'A Game of Thrones.' When completed, this will be the first volume in what I see as an epic trilogy with the overall title, 'A Song of Ice and Fire.'

As you know, I don't outline my novels. I find that if I know exactly where a book is going, I lose all interest in writing it. I do, however, have some strong notions as to the overall structure of the story I'm telling, and the eventual fate of many of the principle characters in the drama. Roughly speaking, there are three major conflicts set in motion in the chapters enclosed. These will form the major plot threads of the trilogy, [unclear] each other in what should be a complex but exciting (I hope [unclear] tapestry. Each of the [unclear] presents a major threat [unclear] of my imaginary realm, the Seven Kingdoms, and to the live [unclear] principal characters.

The first threat grows from the emnity between the great houses of Lannister and Stark as it plays out in a cycle of plot, counterplot, ambition, murder, and revenge, with the iron throne of the Seven Kingdoms as the ultimate prize. This will form the backbone of the first volume of the trilogy, A Game of Thrones.

While the lion of Lannister and the direwolf of Stark snarl and scrap, however, a second and greater threat takes shape across the narrow sea, where the Dothraki horselords mass their barbarian hordes for a great invasion of the Seven Kingdoms, led by the fierce and beautiful Daenerys Stormborn, the last of the Targaryen dragonlords. The Dothraki invasion will be the central story of my second volume, A Dance with Dragons.

The greatest danger of all, however, comes from the north, from the icy wastes beyond the Wall, where half-forgotten demons out of legend, the inhuman others, raise cold legions of the undead and the neverborn and prepare to ride down on the winds of winter to extinguish everything that we would call "life." The only thing that stands between the Seven Kingdoms and an endless night is the Wall, and a handful of men in black called the Night's Watch. Their story will be [sic] heart of my third volume, The Winds of Winter. The final battle will also draw together characters and plot threads left from the first two books and resolve all in one huge climax.

The thirteen chapters on hand should give you a notion as to my narrative strategy. All three books will feature a complex mosaic of intercutting points-of-view among various of my large and diverse cast of players. The cast will not always remain the same. Old characters will die, and new ones will be introduced. Some of the fatalities will include sympathetic viewpoint characters. I want the reader to feel that no one is ever completely safe, not even the characters who seem to be the heroes. The suspense always ratchets up a notch when you know that any character can die at any time.

--

Five central characters will make it through all three volumes, however, growing from children to adults and changing the world and themselves in the process. In a sense, my trilogy is almost a generational saga, telling the life stories of these five characters, three men and two women. The five key players are Tyrion Lannister, Daenerys Targaryen, and three of the children of Winterfell, Arya, Bran, and the bastard Jon Snow. All of them are introduced at some length in the chapters you have to hand.

This is going to be (I hope) quite an epic. Epic in its scale, epic in its action, and epic in its length. I see all three volumes as big books, running about 700 to 800 manuscript pages, so things are just barely getting underway in the thirteen chapters I've sent you.

I have quite a clear notion of how the story is going to unfold in the first volume, A Game of Thrones. Things will get a lot worse for the poor Starks before they get better, I'm afraid. Lord Eddard Stark and his wife Catelyn Tully are both doomed, and will perish at the hands of their enemies. Ned will discover what happened to his friend Jon Arryn, [unclear] can act on his knowledge [unclear] will have an unfortunate accident, and the throne will [unclear] to [unclear] and brutal [unclear] Joffrey [unclear] still a minor. Joffrey will not be sympathetic and Ned [what appears to say] will be accused of treason, but before he is taken he will help his wife and his daughter Arya escape back to Winterfell.

Each of the contending families will learn it has a member of dubious loyalty in its midst. Sansa Stark, wed to Joffrey Baratheon, will bear him a son, the heir to the throne, and when the crunch comes she will choose her husband and child over her parents and siblings, a choice she will later bitterly rue. Tyrion Lannister, meanwhile, will befriend both Sansa and her sister Arya, while growing more and more disenchanted with his own family.

Young Bran will come out of his coma, after a strange prophetic dream, only to discover that he will never walk again. He will turn to magic, at first in the hope of restoring his legs, but later for its own sake. When his father Eddard Stark is executed, Bran will see the shape of doom descending on all of them, but nothing he can say will stop his brother Robb from calling the banners in rebellion. All the north will be inflamed by war. Robb will win several splendid victories, and maim Joffrey Baratheon on the battlefield, but in the end he will not be able to stand against Jaime and Tyrion Lannister and their allies. Robb Stark will die in battle, and Tyrion Lannister will besiege and burn Winterfell.

Jon Snow, the bastard, will remain in the far north. He will mature into a ranger of great daring, and ultimately will succeed his uncle as the commander of the Night's Watch. When Winterfell burns, Catelyn Stark will be forced to flee north with her son Bran and her daughter Arya. Wounded by Lannister riders, they will seek refuge at the Wall, but the men of the Night's Watch give up their families when they take the black, and Jon and Ben jen will not be able to help, to Jon's anguish. It will lead to a bitter estrangement between Jon and Bran. Arya will be more forgiving ... until she realizes, with terror, that she has fallen in love with Jon, who is not only her half-brother but a man of the Night's Watch, sworn to celibacy. Their passion will continue to torment Jon and Arya throughout the trilogy, until the secret of Jon's true parentage is finally revealed in the last book.

--

Abandoned by the Night's Watch, Catelyn and her children will find their only hope of safety lies even further north, beyond the Wall, where they fall into the hands of Mance Rayder, the King-beyond-the-Wall, and get a dreadful glimpse of the inhuman others as they attack the wilding encampment. Bran's magic, Arya's sword Needle, and the savagery of their direwolves will help them survive, but their mother Catelyn will die at the hands of the others.

Over across the narrow sea, Daenerys Targaryen will discover that her new husband, the Dothraki Khal Drogo, has little interest in invading the Seven Kingdoms, much to her brother's frustration. When Viserys presses his claims past the point of tact or wisdom, Khal Drogo will finally grow annoyed and kill him out of hand, eliminating the Targaryen pretender and leaving Daenerys as the last of her line. Danerys [sic] will bide her time, but she will not forget. When the moment is right, she will kill her husband to avenge her brother, and then flee with a trusted friend into the wilderness beyond Vaes Dothrak. There, hunted by [unclear] of her life, she stumbles on a [something about dragon eggs] a young dragon will give Daenerys [unclear] bend [unclear] to her will. Then she begins to plan for her invasion of the Seven Kingdoms.

Tyrion Lannister will continue to travel, to plot, and to play the game of thrones, finally removing his nephew Joffrey in disgust at the boy king's brutality. Jaime Lannister will follow Joffrey on the throne of the Seven Kingdoms, by the simple expedient of killing everyone ahead of him in the line of succession and blaming his brother Tyrion for the murders. Exiled, Tyrion will change sides, making common cause with the surviving Starks to bring his brother down, and falling helplessly in love with Arya Stark while he's at it. His passion is, alas, unreciprocated, but no less intense for that, and it will lead to a deadly rivalry between Tyrion and Jon Snow.

[The next graph is blocked out.]

But that's the second book ...

I hope you will find some editors who are as excited about all of this as I am. Feel free to share this letter with anyone who wants to know how the story will go.

All best,

George R.R. Martin
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http://www.businessinsider.com/game-of-thrones-what-was-the-original-story-2016-7
 
shogun said:
Not wanting to live or accept help isn't honorable.
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The help was to lie, take the power of the throne which rightfully didn't belong to him, never intending to make Joffrey king for obvious reasons and rule with LF; unhonorable.

The other was to seize all the power, tell everyone the truth, put those children's lives in danger and make Renly king; unhonorable.

Also Ned didn't want to die. He was prepared to die. Its a shame he didn't get an option from Varys before he did what he did. Cuz when he does take Varys advice in the prison to spare his daughters, it's too late cuz an insane sadistic product of incest was king.

MasagiPatron said:
As ****** up as Cersei is, she didn't want Ned to die. She knew that was going to cause problems. She just underestimated how much of a demented **** Joffrey was.

Ned just caught a bad deal. He was chilling at Winterfell, then Robert's fat *** comes around begging for him to become Hand. LF orchestrates the whole thing having Lysa poison Jon Arryn. Puts Ned in a position where he needs his help and when Ned refuses out of honor, LF has him arrested.
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Yeah, you look at that ep 9 ending and the whole small council and Cersi rushed to Joffrey and are telling him to reverse his order. Varys is at his feet. Even LF is like chill.

Nobody wanted Ned to die :lol: Joffrey was just playing to the crowd cuz he and they wanted blood.

It's no surprise Tywin and Tyrion were so posses with Cersi. It's why Robert said until Joffrey came of age and told Ned to raise him right.
 
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Damn what is with George and his incest? Jon and Arya? :x c'mon

Then Tyrion falls in love with Arya too? :lol: How is dudes lusting for those yambs? GRRM must've had her more beautiful and aged up in his original plans.

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I'm not saying she would have had him executed then. Ned knew a secret that could get her killed, her kids killed, and bring dishonor to her house. She would have had him killed one way or another. Like have him take the black and on the kings road, have someone assassinate him or something that way it doesn't look like it was her fault. [/CONTENTEMBED]
[thread="526952"] [/thread]
[CONTENTEMBED=/t/526952/official-game-of-thrones-thread-season-6-done-season-7-in-2017/27900#post_26137886 layout=inline]They did need him to trade for Jaime, but Cersie doesn't think like Tyrion or Tywin when it comes to war, so I can see her making that mistake. 
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Yeah but then Stannis told everybody anyway and she just denies it and still is in power. The secret isn't damaging enough without all the evidence; Baratheon's all dark of hair like Robert's first child that died, John Aaryn looking up all of Robert's bastards so he can find a rightful heir, Bran being pushed out the window by Jamie cuz he saw him with Cersi, etc.
 
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Arya will be more forgiving ... until she realizes, with terror, that she has fallen in love with Jon, who is not only her half-brother but a man of the Night's Watch, sworn to celibacy. Their passion will continue to torment Jon and Arya throughout the trilogy, until the secret of Jon's true parentage is finally revealed in the last book.
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Tyrion will change sides, making common cause with the surviving Starks to bring his brother down, and falling helplessly in love with Arya Stark while he's at it. His passion is, alas, unreciprocated, but no less intense for that, and it will lead to a deadly rivalry between Tyrion and Jon Snow.
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:wow:

if someone posted those as fan theories everyone here would laugh them off as too stupid.

poor salsa though
 
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Cersi is a great villain but I like the idea of Jamie being a cutthroat traitorous bastard, killing everybody ahead of him in line of succession and framing Tyrion to take the throne.

Arya's story in the books/show is much better than that outline.
 
Master Zik said:
Yeah but then Stannis told everybody anyway and she just denies it and still is in power. The secret isn't damaging enough without all the evidence; Baratheon's all dark of hair like Robert's first child that died, John Aaryn looking up all of Robert's bastards so he can find a rightful heir, Bran being pushed out the window by Jamie cuz he saw him with Cersi, etc.
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But it seems like after Stannis sent out the letter, a lot of people believed it but didn't do anything about it, and I think it's because nobody likes Stannis 
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. Renly mentions it to Ned when he tries to get him on his side. "Nobody loves Stannis".

I think if Ned were allowed to go north with that info(sentenced to take the black or whatever) he could have met his son with his Northern host and join Stannis and his army to put the rightful heir on the throne. Rob got the letter, but instead of joining forces with Stannis he was declared King In The North and tried to win their independence. 
 
:lol: Okay I can see that. Maybe more ppl, specifically lords of main houses would believe and follow Ned Stark making these claims than Stannis.

Also there is something to saying Ned will take the black and then sending him North especially with Robb's army marching South.

I imagine they'd force Robb to KL to get his dad and Sansa. Make Ned take the NW oath in KL and make Robb pledge fealty to Joffrey. But I get it nothing is stopping Ned and co. revolting anyway.

Stannis was dumb for not looking past Robb being declared king and calling him a theif like the rest.

I still do t get Renly. Son has no legit claim, formed an army and got got. He's be better off if he teamed up with Stannis and then backstabbed Stannis.

I'm still wondering why Melisanbae thought Stannis was the Prince that was promised.
 
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Master Zik said:
Cersi is a great villain but I like the idea of Jamie being a cutthroat traitorous bastard, killing everybody ahead of him in line of succession and framing Tyrion to take the throne.

Arya's story in the books/show is much better than that outline.
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I imagine GRRM was picturing casting some porn star to play Arya.

Although isn't she even younger in the books? I wonder if in the original formulation she was in her mid-to-late teens.

I'm still wondering why Melisanbae thought Stannis was the Prince that was promised.
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I guess she knew someone was promised and Stan fit the bill at the time.
 
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Well he totally sucked.

And yeah that outline was before final drafts of the book so he had to have had different stuff in mind. Her role is basically that of Meera Fred's just with an added incest love story.

Forgot to say even though obviously a lot has changed I get the feeling from reading the beginning of that outline that Sansa does before this is over.
 
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^I thought that too about Sansa but then on the flip side maybe he just didn't plan on making her a main character that he wanted to follow throughout the entire story. I mean her story is pretty damn boring when you compare it to the other 5 that were mentioned.
 
I'm so used to "Salsa" now that i honestly was getting confused as to who this "Sansa" you keep referring to is.
 
Gonna go ahead and rewatch battle of bastard again , that episode was too intense .
Tell me if I'm wrong but I feel like Tyrion might be a Tagaryen also .
 
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