Racism in Soccer in comparison to NFL, NBA, MLB, NHL....

[nawlinsjunkie]

Originally Posted by MarcMac360

Originally Posted by abovelegit1

As a whole, Europe cares much less about political correctness than America. At the end of the day there are ignorant/idiotic supporters of every team and league on Earth; European lax culture, and the fact that futbol fans are 100x more passionate in their support than other fans only serves to exacerbate the problems.

I agree with this. Its sad that this stuff is happening in soccer matches where people go to see a team game. 

And I wouldnt call monkey chants and nazi flags intended to distract players. It is what it is. If they are willing to pull that *$#$ in the stands then it shows what sort of feelings they hold towards people of the race or culture in general.

Nazi flags are a different story. I'm saying that some of the monkey chants are a result of true hate, but alot of the times the people who do it are like the people who yell out racist @#$% on Call of Duty to make someone mad/stir up trouble, yet in real life are not racist at all. Obviously the severity of both situations are completely different, I'm just trying to point out the intent based on my personal experiences. For example I have a Portuguese aunt who says racist @#$% and would probably get her @#$ kicked here in the US, yet she married  a Portuguese man of Angolan descent. Whenever she visits us my dad has to make sure to teach her how to speak here in the US

 

[jd214]

Originally Posted by nawlinsjunkie

I would say that the number of racists in Europe are the same/less than here in the USA, but over here racists have learned to be more clever about it in public.

/thread

But a lot of people that have never been out of America would never know, we definitely have more racist people here in the US.

 

[ham city]

Originally Posted by JD214

Originally Posted by nawlinsjunkie

I would say that the number of racists in Europe are the same/less than here in the USA, but over here racists have learned to be more clever about it in public.

/thread

But a lot of people that have never been out of America would never know, we definitely have more racist people here in the US.

And how exactly do you know this my friend. 

 

[o fenomeno]

the thing is, there are white people all over the world hate black people. when i was growing up i thought we were over it. but nahhhh. makes me sick.

 

[me no pass]

not only soccer..dude i hooped with a few times got beaten to death in a bar in eastern europe..im 100% sure it was a racially motivated attack :/

http://www.huffingtonpost.com/2011/10/09/chauncey-hardy-dead-dies_n_1002568.html
[h1][/h1]

[h1]Chauncey Hardy, American Basketball Player, Dies After Attack In Romania[/h1]

10/ 9/11 07:32 PM ET  

React

Inspiring
Funny
Typical
Scary
Outrageous
Amazing
Infuriating
Extreme


Follow

Chauncey Hardy Attacked, Chauncey Hardy Dead, Chauncey Hardy Dies, Chauncey Hardy Romania, Basketball Player Attacked, Romania, Sacred Heart, Sacred Heart Player Dies, Sports News

[h4]share this story[/h4]

399

62

206

Get Sports Alerts

Sign Up

Submit this story

BUCHAREST, Romania — Former Sacred Heart guard Chauncey Hardy died after being attacked in a bar in Romania.

Romanian Basketball Federation chief Carmen Tocala told GSP radio that Hardy died Sunday, suffering two heart attacks following his beating Saturday night.

"We are deeply saddened by the loss of a fine young man who had his life cut short at such a young age while he was overseas doing something he loved," Sacred Heart Athletic Director C. Donald Cook said in a statement.

Police spokeswoman Mirela Gheta said the 23-year-old Hardy had severe head injuries and was in a coma when he was admitted to the hospital.

Hardy died shortly after undergoing surgery in a Bucharest hospital.

Hardy played for CSS Giurgiu in southern Romania and was celebrating a victory over rival Dinamo Bucharest in Giurgiu when several men were reported to have attacked him.

"This is a terrible tragedy and we are saddened as a University and a basketball program," Sacred Heart men's basketball coach Dave Bike said in a statement. "This is not just about a basketball player, but the person as well. It transcends what happens on a basketball court. We feel tremendous sadness and loss for Chauncey's family and those who were close to him."

Hardy averaged 12.5 points for Sacred Heart in 2009-10.

 

[nawlinsjunkie]

Originally Posted by ME NO PASS

not only soccer..dude i hooped with a few times got beaten to death in a bar in eastern europe..im 100% sure it was a racially motivated attack :/

http://www.huffingtonpost.com/2011/10/09/chauncey-hardy-dead-dies_n_1002568.html
[h1][/h1]

[h1]Chauncey Hardy, American Basketball Player, Dies After Attack In Romania[/h1]

10/ 9/11 07:32 PM ET  

React

Inspiring
Funny
Typical
Scary
Outrageous
Amazing
Infuriating
Extreme


Follow

Chauncey Hardy Attacked, Chauncey Hardy Dead, Chauncey Hardy Dies, Chauncey Hardy Romania, Basketball Player Attacked, Romania, Sacred Heart, Sacred Heart Player Dies, Sports News

[h4]share this story[/h4]

399

62

206

Get Sports Alerts

Sign Up

Submit this story

BUCHAREST, Romania — Former Sacred Heart guard Chauncey Hardy died after being attacked in a bar in Romania.

Romanian Basketball Federation chief Carmen Tocala told GSP radio that Hardy died Sunday, suffering two heart attacks following his beating Saturday night.

"We are deeply saddened by the loss of a fine young man who had his life cut short at such a young age while he was overseas doing something he loved," Sacred Heart Athletic Director C. Donald Cook said in a statement.

Police spokeswoman Mirela Gheta said the 23-year-old Hardy had severe head injuries and was in a coma when he was admitted to the hospital.

Hardy died shortly after undergoing surgery in a Bucharest hospital.

Hardy played for CSS Giurgiu in southern Romania and was celebrating a victory over rival Dinamo Bucharest in Giurgiu when several men were reported to have attacked him.

"This is a terrible tragedy and we are saddened as a University and a basketball program," Sacred Heart men's basketball coach Dave Bike said in a statement. "This is not just about a basketball player, but the person as well. It transcends what happens on a basketball court. We feel tremendous sadness and loss for Chauncey's family and those who were close to him."

Hardy averaged 12.5 points for Sacred Heart in 2009-10.

Dude who killed him was a minority himself (Gypsy). Not saying that Gypsies can't be racist but saying it was a racism related attack is just a huge assumption. He was trying to get at some dude's wife and got attacked as a result.

 

[nawlinsjunkie]

Also, I can understand if you're black and afraid to visit European countries because of the stories that you hear, but countries like Portugal, UK, and France have ALOT of black people who are well accepted by their respective societies. I've never seen as many black and white couples in the US as I did in Paris and London

You especially don't need to worry if you're American.

 

[dmxfury]

Some ugly videos. Often I take it as a compliment when Americans aren't "passionate enough".

 

[shogun]

Originally Posted by Mr Marcus

at least they don't conceal it like the scary %#%#%!$@*$@!! in america......but i'd rather be around open racism then concealed racism

Nah, i'd rather have them keep it away from sporting events.  I don't want to see that crap when i'm trying to enjoy a game on tv.
And why are some of you trying to compare the number of racists in the U.S. to those in all of Europe?  

I don't get it.  There are prejudice people everywhere.  Plus our country's population is huge.  America's culture is more of a melting pot and diverse than countries in Europe.

 

[eddiehouse5]

Throwing a banana doesn't make you a passionate fan, it makes you a passionate racist. As long as these fans exist, it will forever be a blemish on our sport. These people need to be condemned, not have excuses made for them.

 

[me no pass]

ooo gotcha..thanks for clearing that up....i heard how rough it is out there in eastern europe so i just assumed

 

[nawlinsjunkie]

Originally Posted by shogun


And why are some of you trying to compare the number of racists in the U.S. to those in all of Europe?  

I don't get it.  There are prejudice people everywhere.  Plus our country's population is huge.  America's culture is more of a melting pot and diverse than countries in Europe.

I brought up the number of racists because people are making it seem like Europeans are the most hateful and racist people on earth, while widespread racism is still a major problem in the U.S. It's just cleverly hidden here. Just look at how many people supported legal racist behavior in Arizona or were furious over a mosque being built in one of the most progressive cities in the US. Even in California, the most diverse state in the US, we have COLLEGE EDUCATED ADULTS promoting BLATANT racism through Compton Cookouts, drawing Swastikas on Jewish students' homes, launching online tirades against Asians, videotaping and humiliating Asian students, etc. When 9/11 happened, innocent Indians/Arabs/Persians were getting attacked all over the country and even murdered. At my middle school, Indian kids were getting rocks thrown at them and beaten up despite Indians having NOTHING to do with 9/11. Your point about America's culture is what I personally try to follow, but unfortunately many people in the U.S. do NOT promote diversity. We can't call out Europeans when disgusting @#$% happens here all the time

 

[persiafly]

Originally Posted by nawlinsjunkie

Originally Posted by shabooyah1124

Originally Posted by nawlinsjunkie

I would say that the number of racists in Europe are the same/less than here in the USA, but over here racists have learned to be more clever about it in public.

And I'm definitely not excusing the behavior, but most of the time the racist chants are meant to infuriate/distract the opposing players as much as possible. Like the Zaragoza vs Barca match where Zaragoza fans were making monkey calls towards Eto'o, while their own team had black players that they cheered for. Again, I'm not excusing it, I'm just saying that it's more insensitivity and stupidity than actual racism. Of course, it doesn't apply to the skinheads who show up with Nazi flags and @#$%. I would never play in Russia if I were black

So insensitivity and stupidity doesn't play a major role in racism?

It does, and I already said I'm not excusing it,condoning it,supporting it, etc. I'm just saying that the way some of those fans think is more of "I'm gonna yell out the worst things possible to distract/anger that player" rather than "I hate black people, so I'm gonna racially insult him" without realizing the consequences and history behind what they're saying. It's different from the fans who have true hatred/disgust for people of different races. I'm only bringing this up because people are making comments about how all of Spain, Italy, etc are hotbeds of hatred. I have many European relatives and the way some of them talk/act sounds bad to us, but to them making fun of someone's race is on the same level as calling him or her a fat @$#, an idiot, etc. They just don't get it.

And that sign from Switzerland against Islam is disturbing, but nowhere as despicable as the mass protests against the mosque in NYC. As an American I value diversity and acceptance, and that whole ordeal was the complete opposite of everything we stand for. People saying @#$% like "I'm not discriminating, I just think it's insensitive" @#$% outta here with that undercover hate @#$%

Sorry, this is nonsensical. So racism is only really racism if you "mean it"? What does that mean exactly? So it's somehow less problematic that Roberto Carlos gets a banana thrown at him because the fans just want to rattle him and don't really hate him deep down? Tell that to Roberto Carlos.
As others have mentioned, most of these countries don't have sizable black populations and haven't had to deal with race issues and civil rights issues. Being racist is still OK in many countries throughout the world. It is not a taboo subject and making fun of people based on their ethnicity is not considered beyond the pale. Just like homophobia was acceptable in our society up until this decade or so. 

In short, many societies are not as civilized as our society when it comes to racial harmony. Black people are still considered inferior in many societies. This is the truth of the matter, and to try to put a pleasant spin on it by saying BS like "they don't really mean it" is just ignorant. 

 

[nawlinsjunkie]

Originally Posted by PersiaFly

Originally Posted by nawlinsjunkie

Originally Posted by shabooyah1124



So insensitivity and stupidity doesn't play a major role in racism?

It does, and I already said I'm not excusing it,condoning it,supporting it, etc. I'm just saying that the way some of those fans think is more of "I'm gonna yell out the worst things possible to distract/anger that player" rather than "I hate black people, so I'm gonna racially insult him" without realizing the consequences and history behind what they're saying. It's different from the fans who have true hatred/disgust for people of different races. I'm only bringing this up because people are making comments about how all of Spain, Italy, etc are hotbeds of hatred. I have many European relatives and the way some of them talk/act sounds bad to us, but to them making fun of someone's race is on the same level as calling him or her a fat @$#, an idiot, etc. They just don't get it.

And that sign from Switzerland against Islam is disturbing, but nowhere as despicable as the mass protests against the mosque in NYC. As an American I value diversity and acceptance, and that whole ordeal was the complete opposite of everything we stand for. People saying @#$% like "I'm not discriminating, I just think it's insensitive" @#$% outta here with that undercover hate @#$%

Sorry, this is nonsensical. So racism is only really racism if you "mean it"? What does that mean exactly? So it's somehow less problematic that Roberto Carlos gets a banana thrown at him because the fans just want to rattle him and don't really hate him deep down? Tell that to Roberto Carlos.
As others have mentioned, most of these countries don't have sizable black populations and haven't had to deal with race issues and civil rights issues. Being racist is still OK in many countries throughout the world. It is not a taboo subject and making fun of people based on their ethnicity is not considered beyond the pale. Just like homophobia was acceptable in our society up until this decade or so. 

In short, many societies are not as civilized as our society when it comes to racial harmony. Black people are still considered inferior in many societies. This is the truth of the matter, and to try to put a pleasant spin on it by saying BS like "they don't really mean it" is just ignorant. 

? I didn't say it was less problematic. It IS just as problematic. I only explained the intent behind it because people are making ignorant comments, calling entire countries "hotbeds of hatred". AGAIN, I'm not justifying/condoning/supporting/excusing ANYTHING. Obviously the consequences of the words regardless of intent are the same. Explaining the reasoning behind something from personal experience =/= putting a pleasant spin on it.
Are there racists in those countries? Of course! But to say that racism is acceptable there because of how some idiots act is completely false. You're even admitting that making fun of people based on their ethnicity is not considered taboo by some people; like I said, to some people that's all it is, making fun. They are ignorant and stupid, not hateful. For example both my Portuguese and Indian families have people who make fun of other races yet at the end of the day view them as equals. It's even prevalent in Indian society where different types of Indian ethnicities insult  each other based on physiques, intelligence, skin color etc but at the end of the day they all get along.

 

[lukewarm skywalker]

The overt racism in Europe towards minority groups stems largely from the fact that there was never a "civil rights movement" to the tune of that which occurred in the States.

Additionally, one needs to take into consideration the fact that Europe is a continent, while the U.S is a country. The implied point of emphasis here is that, it would be easier to mobilize marginalized populations in a concerted effort to achieve equal rights under the law in a single nation, like the U.S, than it would be on a continent consisting of heterogenous minority populations occupying various countries that are inherently governed differently (Europe).


...

 

[03silverbullet]

dude sure is doing a lot of defending of this small group of people, since he claims he isn't "justifying/condoning/supporting/excusing anything" for them.

i try to make it a point not to generalize people, but if you claim you aren't racist, but you participate in racial chants and acts such as throwing a bananas at someone of color, well then, i'm going to paint you and the people you do that with, as racists and racially insensitive idiots. those few in the group, don't get a pass because their motives wasn't as malicious as those of the skinheads standing next to them. i'm supposed to believe they just went along with it because they wasn't clever enough to insult the black players with anything other then racial taunts?

 

[doublejs07]

Originally Posted by engoi

Originally Posted by DoubleJs07

I was just reading about the problems the FIFA prez had w. his comments about what should be done about racist remarks in their games...he was real non-chalant about it and folks got upset.  That being said, I can think of a few incidents off-hand in the NHL and MLB....but why is this such a problem in Europe compared to other sports here in the US?  Isn't it so bad in Europe, that they have an anti-racism campaign w. soccer? 

Europe ? You'll find racism in every league and country but it isn't a remarkable problem everywere.Racism sucks always, not to be misunderstood.
I guess the difference is the audience.You find every social group at a football game and people use football as a plug for frustration and emotions.

Why are you questioning when I mentioned Europe?  It's so bad that soccer needed an anti-racism campaign....I assume you knew this though. 

 

[nawlinsjunkie]

Originally Posted by 03silverbullet

dude sure is doing a lot of defending of this small group of people, since he claims he isn't "justifying/condoning/supporting/excusing anything" for them.

i try to make it a point not to generalize people, but if you claim you aren't racist, but you participate in racial chants and acts such as throwing a bananas at someone of color, well then, i'm going to paint you and the people you do that with, as racists and racially insensitive idiots. those few in the group, don't get a pass because their motives wasn't as malicious as those of the skinheads standing next to them. i'm supposed to believe they just went along with it because they wasn't clever enough to insult the black players with anything other then racial taunts?

How am I defending a small group of people (yet alone anyone at all)? Spain, Italy, Portugal, France=small group of people?

Trying to explain that you can't call entire countries/an entire continent  supporters of racism and hatred because of a few idiots means I'm giving people a pass for saying racist @#$@? If what you get out of what I wrote is that I'm giving anyone a pass for saying racist @#$%,  that's on you not me.

If you  have European family/have spent alot of time in European countries, you would know that sometimes Europeans are not politically correct AT ALL. They will say anything/everything to insult you if you're not on their side in a soccer game, no matter how nasty and inappropriate it is. Just look at why Man United hates Derby County, why Celtic hates Rangers, etc.

 

[03silverbullet]

Originally Posted by nawlinsjunkie

Originally Posted by 03silverbullet

dude sure is doing a lot of defending of this small group of people, since he claims he isn't "justifying/condoning/supporting/excusing anything" for them.

i try to make it a point not to generalize people, but if you claim you aren't racist, but you participate in racial chants and acts such as throwing a bananas at someone of color, well then, i'm going to paint you and the people you do that with, as racists and racially insensitive idiots. those few in the group, don't get a pass because their motives wasn't as malicious as those of the skinheads standing next to them. i'm supposed to believe they just went along with it because they wasn't clever enough to insult the black players with anything other then racial taunts?

How am I defending a small group of people (yet alone anyone at all)? Spain, Italy, Portugal, France=small group of people?

Trying to explain that you can't call entire countries/an entire continent  supporters of racism and hatred because of a few idiots means I'm giving people a pass for saying racist @#$@? If what you get out of what I wrote is that I'm giving anyone a pass for saying racist @#$%,  that's on you not me.

Originally Posted by nawlinsjunkie

And I'm definitely not excusing the behavior, but most of the time the racist chants are meant to infuriate/distract the opposing players as much as possible. Like the Zaragoza vs Barca match where Zaragoza fans were making monkey calls towards Eto'o, while their own team had black players that they cheered for. Again, I'm not excusing it, I'm just saying that it's more insensitivity and stupidity than actual racism. Of course, it doesn't apply to the skinheads who show up with Nazi flags and @#$%. I would never play in Russia if I were black

 

[noskey]

Originally Posted by nawlinsjunkie

Just look at why ... Celtic hates Rangers, etc.

That's not racially motivated, that's religious. Coke vs. Pepsi, bro.

edit: Meant to say, that's not just politically incorrectness, that's religiously motivated.

 

[nawlinsjunkie]

Originally Posted by 03silverbullet

Originally Posted by nawlinsjunkie

Originally Posted by 03silverbullet

dude sure is doing a lot of defending of this small group of people, since he claims he isn't "justifying/condoning/supporting/excusing anything" for them.

i try to make it a point not to generalize people, but if you claim you aren't racist, but you participate in racial chants and acts such as throwing a bananas at someone of color, well then, i'm going to paint you and the people you do that with, as racists and racially insensitive idiots. those few in the group, don't get a pass because their motives wasn't as malicious as those of the skinheads standing next to them. i'm supposed to believe they just went along with it because they wasn't clever enough to insult the black players with anything other then racial taunts?

How am I defending a small group of people (yet alone anyone at all)? Spain, Italy, Portugal, France=small group of people?

Trying to explain that you can't call entire countries/an entire continent  supporters of racism and hatred because of a few idiots means I'm giving people a pass for saying racist @#$@? If what you get out of what I wrote is that I'm giving anyone a pass for saying racist @#$%,  that's on you not me.

Originally Posted by nawlinsjunkie

And I'm definitely not excusing the behavior, but most of the time the racist chants are meant to infuriate/distract the opposing players as much as possible. Like the Zaragoza vs Barca match where Zaragoza fans were making monkey calls towards Eto'o, while their own team had black players that they cheered for. Again, I'm not excusing it, I'm just saying that it's more insensitivity and stupidity than actual racism. Of course, it doesn't apply to the skinheads who show up with Nazi flags and @#$%. I would never play in Russia if I were black

That's giving them a pass for saying racist @#$% ??????????????? Whatever you say

 

[nawlinsjunkie]

Originally Posted by Noskey

Originally Posted by nawlinsjunkie

Just look at why ... Celtic hates Rangers, etc.

That's not racially motivated, that's religious. Coke vs. Pepsi, bro.

edit: Meant to say, that's not just politically incorrectness, that's religiously motivated.

http://www.guardian.co.uk...ctarianism-research-data

Take a look at that article. It points out the huge difference between sectarianism during a game and daily life in the country

"Most Scots are not football fans; most fans do not support Rangers or Celtic; most Rangers and Celtic fans are not religious bigots. That some Rangers and Celtic fans wind each other up by falsely claiming to have strong religio-ethnic identities which are offended by the equally false religio-ethnic identities of the other side is not a reason for the rest of us to take such ritual posturing as the basis for judging the polity, society and culture of an entire country."

Point is that fans can resort to anything, even disgusting and hateful chants, to show their hatred for the other team even if they wouldn't behave that way outside of the stadium.

 

[ham city]

nawlins the problem is you keep trying to justify it opposed to recognizing this $!*% for what it is. you were talking the same stuff the last time we had this discussion. very few people are going to see eye to eye with you on this and many of the people who do are likely going to be racists themselves. not a good association.

 

[nawlinsjunkie]

Whether you believe it or not, I fully support the banning of fans from stadiums for racial taunts, like when Juventus went at Balotelli. However, as someone of European descent I just take it personally when people say that Europeans accept racism, promote hatred, etc. Don't you think it's bad to make an assumption about an entire society based on what fans do at a soccer game? That's all I'm trying to say, my apologies if I'm coming off as apologetic or w/e.

 

[persiafly]

Originally Posted by HAM CITY

nawlins the problem is you keep trying to justify it opposed to recognizing this $!*% for what it is. you were talking the same stuff the last time we had this discussion. very few people are going to see eye to eye with you on this and many of the people who do are likely going to be racists themselves. not a good association.

This.
You're trying to make a point that doesn't belong in this conversation. 

Again, I'm not excusing it, I'm just saying that it's more insensitivity and stupidity than actual racism.

No, it's racism. It's also insensitive and stupid, but it is unmistakably racism, and no matter how many times you've been to Europe or how many aunts you have from Europe, your attempts to make it seem like it's something less than racism just make you seem sort of ignorant to the matter. 

And no one is saying everyone in Europe is racist. The convo was and is about the people making these chants.