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I hate Aaron Rodgers. 
NFL Quarterbacks Discussion thread: 2013 Edition
- Thread in 'Sports & Training' Thread starter Started by 651akathepaul,
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Some of y'all have way too much time on your hands
perk of working in corporate america
God Bless America
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I hate Aaron Rodgers.
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So, according to all of those percentages and stats...
Quarterback Rating:
Tony Romo > Joe Montana, Dan Marino, Kurt Warner and Brett Favre.
Career pass completion %'s:
Chad Pennington > every QB in the history of the NFL
Interception % crap:
Neil O'Donnell = Tom Brady,
Donovan McNabb and Jeff Garcia > Dan Marino, Joe Montana, and every other QB that matters from before 2000.
Touchdown % crap:
Old dudes > everyone else. This stat is relevant.
Career yards-per-attempt:
Once again, Tony Romo > Johnny U and every QB from before 2000
Aaron Rodgers has five seasons of work. He's a great QB and may end up as a great, but please... wait.
Quarterback Rating:
Tony Romo > Joe Montana, Dan Marino, Kurt Warner and Brett Favre.
Career pass completion %'s:
Chad Pennington > every QB in the history of the NFL
Interception % crap:
Neil O'Donnell = Tom Brady,
Donovan McNabb and Jeff Garcia > Dan Marino, Joe Montana, and every other QB that matters from before 2000.
Touchdown % crap:
Old dudes > everyone else. This stat is relevant.
Career yards-per-attempt:
Once again, Tony Romo > Johnny U and every QB from before 2000
Aaron Rodgers has five seasons of work. He's a great QB and may end up as a great, but please... wait.
DeadsetAce
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I'm not even 30 yet and starting to see how CP feels... these modern day QB stats really don't do it for me. Yeah, they're fun to see, but when everyone (including my QB, Matt Schaub) is going for over 4000 yards, it kind of loses its luster.
Not taking away anything from the studs of today -- they're handling business -- but everyone is doing work.
Not taking away anything from the studs of today -- they're handling business -- but everyone is doing work.
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I mentioned something like that last night. It was fun to witness and all, but it's hard for me to discern whether he does something like that even just 10 years ago. It's like...Awesome! Then you think about it and wonder how much the new NFL is influencing these inflated stats.
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Just out of curiosity, how much of that comment stems from their actual individual performance on the field versus some underlying personal disappointment in the manner which Favre left your team??
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Well umm... Yea, Romo > Joe in QB Rating... Problem?
Its not the stats individually, as I said, comparisons sake... the stats by themselves don't make anyone the GOAT. If that was the argument I was making I'd say Rodgers is the GOAT, wouldn't I?
Why we gotta wait anyways? Tom was getting GOAT talk when he was in his 5th year starting (2006) after he won some chips...
Favre was a 2-3 time MVP by his 5th year starting... What did he do after 1997 other than breaking records that helped his case for being an all time great?
Favre has like 2,000 more pass attempts than anyone else in history.
Like I said you tell in what way was Favre better than Rodgers aside from "pizazz" and maybe arm strength...
Last thing: How are INT % and TD % not relevant?????
DeadsetAce
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That comment was mostly in jest of me being paged to jump into this conversation. But IMHO with the retirement nonsense aside, Rodgers right now is just a better QB than Brett was. Hes makes better decisions, throws the ball more accurately, moves in and out of the pocket better and protects the football better than Favre did.
Don't get me wrong, Favre was ICON status when I was growing up. I didn't go out and burn my #4 Jersey... It'll be hanging in my basement next to Rodgers soon. (I need a basement first.)
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Fair enough, thanks for the reply. Just wanted to ask.
Funny you mention that, because I saw your Schaub joke last night and remember, he threw for 5 in a game last year as well, and has multiple 4,000 yard seasons. Matt freaking Schaub. He's good, but in 1990 4,000 yards was ELITE QB's. Hell, Elway and Favre didn't even get there all that much. Now we have top 15ish QB's doin that, along with rookies postin 4,300 yards.
Ok, for Favre, first let me say, I absolutely loved watchin the guy play. Please get that. Just because I make a few points about Peyton and now Brett, I LOVED watching them both play. But i don't have to take every stat or number as bible. There are other factors.
Here's one, Brett plays almost two decades, is extremely good, easily a top 10 all timer, I'd probably slot him in the 6-7 range, had about 13-14 really, really good years. Guess when his BEST season was? At age 40, playing his first year with a new team, his third team in three years, he posts a 107.2 rating. 4,200 yards, 33 TD's, 7 INT's. Best year of his life, right in the middle of this ridiculous passing era.
In his prime he never put up those numbers, in his prime. With, btw, a bunch of players he played years with.
Talent level. Brett was never lonely. From Sterling, to Brooks, to Levens, to Chumura, to Freeman, to Keith Jackson, to Franks, to Driver, to Ahman Green, to Javon Walker, to Greg Jennings, he ALWAYS had talent to play with. He always had a couple pieces to run the offense with and in this respect, when people bring up Brady having Bill for a coach as a negative, try this......
Mike Holmgren, Steve Marriuchi, John Gruden, Andy Reid, Mike Shurman, Marty Morrnihweg, Jim Zorn, Brett was SURROUNDED by coaches. I didn't even list the defensive coaches that kept a solid defense around Brett most of his career. No one, NO ONE had the coaching around him and his teammates that Brett did.
Now, in his prime, I look at it like this. Brett has what I call the Dream resume. The Hakeem Olajuwon "Dream" 2 year window. As you all know, Dream got his work in while MJ whiffed curveballs. Brett, came into the league as Joe, Dan, John, and Jim were aging and leaving. Aikman was running the NFL only Jimmy left, Drew was too young, Warner, Peyton and Brady didn't come for a few more years. Brett was slotted right in the middle of the downest QB era I can remember.
Right in the middle of his prime, the QB's runnin the show were Mark Brunell, Vinny Testerverde, Jeff Blake, Gus Ferotte, Scott Mitchell, Brad Johnson, Stan Humphries, Jeff Hostetler, Bobby Herbert Tony Banks, and as I stated, the aging Marino, Young, Elway, Kelly and the kid, Bledsoe.
Come on. By the time Brett reached his back to back SB's, Aikman and Young were getting concussed out of the league. Elway had his career revived by Davis (as we all know, but at least John went to three Super Bowls on his own, in the era that FEATURED Montana, Marino, Kelly, Simms, etc.) So to me, Elway was already great before he won his SB against Brett.
Add all that up, you have a really great QB who played with a lot of talent, a lot of coaching help, in a watered down QB era and he thrived. Soon as he hit 28-29, he was merely a stats guy and no longer a threat to win anything. His gunslinger ways were too much. Always good records, not as many 1 and dones as Peyton, but no more SB runs up until he almost got there again at 40. (and we all know what happened, but hey, he was 40 at the time, so I can't fault him I guess)
He was really fun to watch. Played EVERY week. Played the game the right way, loved it, had fun, jawed back and forth with the other team, gave you a show. I don't take that away from him, but in terms of him being on his way to GOAT, that was and is hyperbole. No way. He was really really good, but he had a window, struck in it, and got his title. Good for him. He certainly deserves one. But he was not going to be one of the top 5 beating up on that list of QB's I mentioned.
One last piece, ya know how Flacco went 11 TD's 0 INT's last year in the playoffs? And Eli went 9 TD 1 INT in 2011. The year Rodgers won he went 8-2 TD-INT. Big runs, historic QB runs to win the SB, or at least get there, etc.
Favre, in ALL his years, always in the playoffs, etc, had ONE, ONE season with more than 5 TD's in the postseason. That was an 8-2 year in 95, the year before he won his SB. That year, the year he won it all, he did happen to have three games with a rating of 107, which is impressive, especially when he won the first game with 79 yards passing. He played well in that SB, but was only 14-27 passing, but with 2 long TD's and a rushing TD himself.
The game was 27-21 tho before Desmond won the game with his 99 yarder.
All the talent, always in the playoffs, never a real historic run. Most playoff INT's in history. 13-11 postseason record. And in a watered down era for QB's.
To me, all that, I don't go top 5 for Brett, nor do I say he was "on his way" to GOAT. He was just really, really, great for a 3 year stretch and solid the other 13. Alot like Hakeem Olajuwon.
Matt freaking Schaub. He's good, but in 1990 4,000 yards was ELITE QB's. Hell, Elway and Favre didn't even get there all that much. Now we have top 15ish QB's doin that, along with rookies postin 4,300 yards. Ok, for Favre, first let me say, I absolutely loved watchin the guy play. Please get that. Just because I make a few points about Peyton and now Brett, I LOVED watching them both play. But i don't have to take every stat or number as bible. There are other factors.
Here's one, Brett plays almost two decades, is extremely good, easily a top 10 all timer, I'd probably slot him in the 6-7 range, had about 13-14 really, really good years. Guess when his BEST season was? At age 40, playing his first year with a new team, his third team in three years, he posts a 107.2 rating. 4,200 yards, 33 TD's, 7 INT's. Best year of his life, right in the middle of this ridiculous passing era.
In his prime he never put up those numbers, in his prime.
With, btw, a bunch of players he played years with. Talent level. Brett was never lonely. From Sterling, to Brooks, to Levens, to Chumura, to Freeman, to Keith Jackson, to Franks, to Driver, to Ahman Green, to Javon Walker, to Greg Jennings, he ALWAYS had talent to play with. He always had a couple pieces to run the offense with and in this respect, when people bring up Brady having Bill for a coach as a negative, try this......
Mike Holmgren, Steve Marriuchi, John Gruden, Andy Reid, Mike Shurman, Marty Morrnihweg, Jim Zorn, Brett was SURROUNDED by coaches. I didn't even list the defensive coaches that kept a solid defense around Brett most of his career. No one, NO ONE had the coaching around him and his teammates that Brett did.
Now, in his prime, I look at it like this. Brett has what I call the Dream resume. The Hakeem Olajuwon "Dream" 2 year window. As you all know, Dream got his work in while MJ whiffed curveballs. Brett, came into the league as Joe, Dan, John, and Jim were aging and leaving. Aikman was running the NFL only Jimmy left, Drew was too young, Warner, Peyton and Brady didn't come for a few more years. Brett was slotted right in the middle of the downest QB era I can remember.
Right in the middle of his prime, the QB's runnin the show were Mark Brunell, Vinny Testerverde, Jeff Blake, Gus Ferotte, Scott Mitchell, Brad Johnson, Stan Humphries, Jeff Hostetler, Bobby Herbert Tony Banks, and as I stated, the aging Marino, Young, Elway, Kelly and the kid, Bledsoe.
Come on. By the time Brett reached his back to back SB's, Aikman and Young were getting concussed out of the league. Elway had his career revived by Davis (as we all know, but at least John went to three Super Bowls on his own, in the era that FEATURED Montana, Marino, Kelly, Simms, etc.) So to me, Elway was already great before he won his SB against Brett.
Add all that up, you have a really great QB who played with a lot of talent, a lot of coaching help, in a watered down QB era and he thrived. Soon as he hit 28-29, he was merely a stats guy and no longer a threat to win anything. His gunslinger ways were too much. Always good records, not as many 1 and dones as Peyton, but no more SB runs up until he almost got there again at 40. (and we all know what happened, but hey, he was 40 at the time, so I can't fault him I guess)
He was really fun to watch. Played EVERY week. Played the game the right way, loved it, had fun, jawed back and forth with the other team, gave you a show. I don't take that away from him, but in terms of him being on his way to GOAT, that was and is hyperbole. No way. He was really really good, but he had a window, struck in it, and got his title. Good for him. He certainly deserves one. But he was not going to be one of the top 5 beating up on that list of QB's I mentioned.
One last piece, ya know how Flacco went 11 TD's 0 INT's last year in the playoffs? And Eli went 9 TD 1 INT in 2011. The year Rodgers won he went 8-2 TD-INT. Big runs, historic QB runs to win the SB, or at least get there, etc.
Favre, in ALL his years, always in the playoffs, etc, had ONE, ONE season with more than 5 TD's in the postseason. That was an 8-2 year in 95, the year before he won his SB. That year, the year he won it all, he did happen to have three games with a rating of 107, which is impressive, especially when he won the first game with 79 yards passing.
He played well in that SB, but was only 14-27 passing, but with 2 long TD's and a rushing TD himself. The game was 27-21 tho before Desmond won the game with his 99 yarder.
All the talent, always in the playoffs, never a real historic run. Most playoff INT's in history. 13-11 postseason record. And in a watered down era for QB's.
To me, all that, I don't go top 5 for Brett, nor do I say he was "on his way" to GOAT. He was just really, really, great for a 3 year stretch and solid the other 13. Alot like Hakeem Olajuwon.
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I like your posts CP.
It lets me stare at Jessica Alba's backside for 10 minutes at a time and when my wife see's she doesn't ask any questions cause she thinks I'm reading.
I'm just playin, I agree with a lot of what you said. I had a friend (Giants fan) that used to go to bat for Favre as top 5 and approaching GOAT status back around 2002ish ... I could never really make the argument over dudes like Dan/Joe/Young.
It lets me stare at Jessica Alba's backside for 10 minutes at a time and when my wife see's she doesn't ask any questions cause she thinks I'm reading.
I'm just playin, I agree with a lot of what you said. I had a friend (Giants fan) that used to go to bat for Favre as top 5 and approaching GOAT status back around 2002ish ... I could never really make the argument over dudes like Dan/Joe/Young.
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Great post. 
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DeadsetAce
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5K is the new standard for big time QB passing yard numbers
and Dan...**** you for hitting the mark 30 years ago :x
and Dan...**** you for hitting the mark 30 years ago :x
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Great post.
I agree. Well-prepared and insightful. Hard to argue against and I don't disagree either.
I grit my teeth though because like many attest, he was so fun to watch and he became my favorite of all-time, so you kinda wish his career ended a different way, but then I guess that wouldn't be Brett's style.
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I'll be the first to say it.... he was like a kid out there...
I'll always look at Brett as one of the best of our generation growing up watching him. I loved watching him play. But I completely agree with everything CP said.
Come to think of it, I can't really pinpoint who my favorite of all time to watch would be. From the early 90's to now, it'd be hard to narrow it down to 1 or 2.
Come to think of it, I can't really pinpoint who my favorite of all time to watch would be. From the early 90's to now, it'd be hard to narrow it down to 1 or 2.
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Something from the stats above I wanted to mention...
Pennington always gets a lot of flack because of his arm strength, but his accuracy actually was impeccable. He was also one of the better playaction quarterbacks I ever saw. Probably helped him with a few completions here and there.
Pennington always gets a lot of flack because of his arm strength, but his accuracy actually was impeccable. He was also one of the better playaction quarterbacks I ever saw. Probably helped him with a few completions here and there.
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Ha. And?
